Truly sweet and truly tender. It was both an honor and a pleasure to have the opportunity to meet up with Jose Maldonado, the Mexican Morrissey, and have a chat re: Moz at his practice space in L.A.
Hi, I’m Jose Maldonado, lead singer of the Sweet and Tender Hooligans.
Age: mid 40’s
Where do you live? Pasadena, CA
What was your first introduction to Morrissey?
J: Growing up here in LA there was a great radio station - there still is a great radio station - called KROQ. To research KROQ’s history, they were the greatest new rock radio station… in the world. They earned themselves this reputation of being called “The World Famous KROQ” because they were one of the first US radio stations to break in bands like, Van Halen, U2, Duran Duran, the Smiths, Joy Division, New Order, [etc]… I was fortunate enough to grow up here in L.A. and have that radio station [to listen to] when the Smiths came to be.
That was like nothing else: The same hysteria that followed Depeche Mode, here in L.A., was due largely in part to KROQ (http://kroq.cbslocal.com/). I’d say the defining moment for me in terms of what I always refer to as ‘the point of no return’ when it came to Morrissey and the Smiths was being in a record store and hearing the song Cemetery Gates for the first time. They were playing the album “The Queen is Dead” over the intercom in the record store and what followed after that was Big Mouth Strikes Again, and the one that followed after that was The Boy With The Thorn In His Side; Those three songs back to back to back. I remember being in that record store and standing underneath that speaker because I wanted to hear more. I wanted to hear the next song and each song after that became more and more compelling, and more beautiful to me. This person’s unique voice with these unique lyrics that I had never ever heard, jumped into my life in that moment. It was at that moment that I went to the counter, asked, “What album is this?”
“The Queen is Dead” is that pivotal moment in my music consciousness about the Smiths and Morrissey.
Subsequently, after that, I bought every single album that preceded that [one], and every album after that. And it wasn’t just enough to own that. I then had to go out and buy 12” singles which I had never done before. That was something unique to UK artists: in addition to doing their albums they did 12” singles as well. So, I would find these 12” singles and find the B sides, too… And this was long before the internet and long before you could just research on your home computer or phone. It meant going to the library and finding every magazine article and every interview that had ever been done with this amazing person named Morrissey. Morrissey, (who just goes by his last name) [who] has very outspoken and unique views about a lot of things. And it wasn’t just enough to read every one of those interviews. I now had to find out who his literary and musical influences were. There really was quite a pull. It was beyond the songs that affected me, now it was this intriguing person named ‘Morrissey’.
C: Did anyone that you knew at that time also listen to him? Or, were you kind of alone in that venture?
J: Being in L.A., and because KROQ was in our consciousness and in our existence here, the good thing about it was, that it wasn’t as difficult to find another person into the Smiths. I do hear about people growing up outside of California [saying], “No, this was something I discovered on my own and I had to find people online,” or “I had to find friends through going to concerts,” that kind of thing. It wasn’t as difficult for me to find others into it but it was still really unusual to be into that music while Paula Abdul, MC Hammer, and Vanilla Ice were the big thing. But I remember thinking back then, “No one is gonna give a crap about them.”
C: (laughs)
J: Twenty years down the road people will still be caring about the Smiths and Morrissey. I remember thinking that, and it’s very satisfying to be right (laughs).
C: So, you’re originally from Los Angeles?
J: Born and raised. Not far from here, actually.
C: That’s amazing.
J: Well, you say it’s amazing because you don’t meet too many people who are actually native.
C: Exactly (laughs). What was the Smiths/ Morrissey scene like at that time in Los Angeles? I can’t imagine it being as big as it is now, so, when did that start?
J: That pivotal moment was, ironically, just as the Smiths had broken up. Because it was when the Smiths broke up that I think even more attention was drawn to this band that ‘is no longer.’ Fortunately for us, however, Morrissey did continue as a solo artist, and fortunately for us [he] surpassed what he did with the Smiths. In fact, when you read his Autobiography and read everything that happened right around that time it was very, very important and crucial for Morrissey’s career that his first solo album, and the first singles that came from that solo album be enormous, huge, and bigger and better than anything that he had done prior with the Smiths. And he answered with an atomic bomb with, Suedehead and Everyday Is Like Sunday, and the subsequent B sides that came with it. So, in terms of the L.A. consciousness about Morrissey, that is really when it happened.
[I remember] Morrissey came to KROQ to be an ‘in studio’ guest with Richard Blade (http://www.richardblade.com/) and there was easily 500 to 1,000 of us outside of that building in Burbank (where I grew up) waiting to just catch a glimpse of Morrissey coming out of that limousine to get into the studio. And we mobbed him. I was there and it was [like] living through that Elvis hysteria and Beatle mania that the previous generation had lived through. That’s the defining, very first moment that I can think of, as far as L.A. goes, when we went crazy for Morrissey.
Not long after that, he eventually put a band together, came out on the road here, and appeared for the very first time [on American television] on the Tonight Show. With the way that the Tonight Show was set up in Burbank [at that time], you had to line up prior to the taping because they didn’t sell tickets. It was ‘first come first serve’ and we were there 36 hours before you could actually get a ticket. There were thousands of people outside of NBC studios trying to get a ticket that [the studio] only had 200 of. But there we were outside, in a line, just waiting. Overnight, camped out, bleary eyed and not sleeping because we wanted the chance to be able to be on television to watch Morrissey on the Tonight Show (https://youtu.be/53YpKH4DMf0). With the magic of YouTube, you can see it. You can see just how amazed Johnny Carson and Bill Cosby were at how much attention was given to this British person they had never heard of before. Johnny could not get a word in because any time he would even utter the word ‘Morrissey’ [there would be] cheering and applause.
C: Oh, wow.
J: I mean, it really was like Elvis on the Ed Sullivan Show. In answer to the question “When did the L.A. hysteria come along?” That was it, right there.
C: What is the first song you fell in love with?
J: I have to take a moment to think. I know it sounds like sappy romantic BS, but they’re really all my favorite. But I’d say, early on a song like The Boy With The Thorn In His Side really jumped out at me, not just because of Morrissey’s lyrics and his voice, but because every instrument and every note on that particular song is the right note and is the right moment in that song. I remember falling very much in love with that song first. But I can speak to many songs where every note is the right note and every moment is the right moment, and every lyric is the right lyric, for the emotion that is being captured for that particular song in that particular moment in music time.
C: I find myself re-falling in love with songs that I’ve already fallen in love with. None of them ever get old. Ever.
J: Because the Smiths had such a limited run, and because their moment in history is sealed off forever and it’s just in that one particular moment, you can look at all 72 or 73 of their songs and can’t find a bad moment there.
C: None.
J: You really can’t I think the Smiths are fortunate to be sealed off forever [in that way], in that time, as what they did in that moment. I think the only song that comes across as ‘not their best’ is Golden Lights. And for all the criticism that song gets (it is a cover version), I don’t share the criticism. They’ve got these 72-73 songs and it’s sealed off forever, and I don’t know that you can say that about the Beatles, necessarily, because I think even Beatles fans and Beatles historians will tell you that there might be 1, 2 or 5 songs that are not so great. Not so with the Smiths (laughs).
C: I agree (laughs). I’m finding this question to be a hard one, but do you have a favorite lyric or quote?
J: I don’t know why but this one lyric does jump out at me a lot. “Vauxhall and I” came out at a time when a lot of people who were fans of Morrissey (and friends of mine) were starting to drop off and move onto something else. But I stayed with Morrissey. I thought, “Was I just staying with Morrissey because I have to? Because I’ve invested so much time, emotionally, into it?” “Vauxhall and I” was that defining moment saying, “No, I’m going to be here forever.”
So, the very last line in the song Speedway is: “In my own sick way, I’ll always stay true to you.” I sign off every radio show I do for that very reason.
C: Out of the six times you’ve met him, do you have a favorite? Or is there one that stands out to you the most?
J: Every time I’ve met him it’s been brief, but fortunately for me it’s been enough for me to say what I wanted to say at the time, and get that sort of acknowledgement of, “Oh, he has heard of me,” (laughs). The first time I met him was perfect and it’s been documented many times. So, I guess just being able to say what it is I wanted to say to him [would be my favorite]. I read in Rose’s interview that she didn’t know what she would say that wouldn’t just sound like, “I just love all of your songs,” but this is why I tell people to have in mind what you would say. Take time out and think, hypothetically, “If I had his ear for one brief moment in time, what would I want to say to him?” Fortunately for me, I had that moment where I could look him in the eye and tell him, “Every single day of my life is always that much better because your songs are always a part of it.” When he signed his autograph, he wrote these words: “To Jose, good luck forever. Morrissey.”
C: Oh my goodness.
J: How could I ever top that moment (laughs)?
C: Very cool.
J: So, when I had that opportunity to meet him, it was too perfect. The stars were aligned at just the right place at the right time. I didn’t intend to meet him that day. Nobody was mobbing him. Nobody in that particular establishment knew who he was, he was just some ordinary guy in a corner, drinking a Corona, and I couldn’t have asked for a better first moment to meet him. Over the years, I’ve met him briefly at in-store record signings or in-line to see concerts… I was lucky enough to be a background extra in the music video for Irish Blood, English Heart, too (https://youtu.be/KKoS5X4SMrY). All of these moments I’ve had with him have just been perfect and they’ve been just the right amount. I joke about this all the time but, I can only screw it up at this point (laughs).
C: (laughs)
J: If I never get to meet Morrissey again I’m fine with it, because every one of these moments that I’ve had have been just what I needed them to be. And if there is a situation where I know that he happens to be at this one place, I’m not going to make an effort to walk up to him and say, “Hello, again!” because I’ve said it. Everything I’ve needed to get out, I’ve gotten out. And he’s done more than just acknowledge my existence (laughs). He gave a good joke to the crowd at the Wiltern in 2004.(1) That’s good enough for me. I’m set for life.
C: And what an honor it was. Unexpected, and completely perfect.
J: Yeah. It’s still to this day the pinnacle of what it’s been to be a fan of Morrissey’s, and to be lucky enough to be the lead singer of the Sweet and Tender Hooligans. That’s the highest point right there.
C: Is it safe to say that every encounter is your favorite because it’s exactly what you needed at that time?
J: Yes, exactly.
C: I think being in a tribute band is the ultimate act of appreciation anyone can give an artist. And aside from the Sweet and Tender Hooligans, you’ve already alluded to the fact that you may have a pretty sizable Morrissey memorabilia collection. Out of that collection what is your most coveted?
J: Well, I showed it to you already. And it’s not because it’s a particularly rare CD. It’s not because it was pressed on purple vinyl. It’s because this was a moment that I shared and this is before cell phone cameras and before you could take a selfie. This was pen to paper. That is way the hell more meaningful to me than a selfie with Morrissey. It’s just that moment that I had and I don’t need a receipt for that.
C: Right.
J: I’ve collected other things and vinyl. And, I’m not going to make any friends saying this, but, this whole vinyl resurgence thing… it’s great and I’m happy for all you kids that are discovering vinyl, but we discovered very early on that it was a pain in the ass (laughs).
C: (laughs)
J: This is why CD’s happened and, subsequently, why digital downloads happened. Now, I’m not going to knock the idea that of having a large printed picture and an inner gatefold and all of that romantic stuff. You’ll get no argument from me there. It was wonderful to have all of that. But the very second I no longer had to put a needle down, and the very second I was able to take my music with me wherever I go, I abandoned vinyl forever. So, yes, vinyl is nice for when you are home but who is ever home? I want the music now, and I want this selection because my collection is enormous. And I want to always have that with me wherever I go (laughs). I’ve got plenty of pressed vinyl, plenty of collectors stuff, and I brought some of it with me.
C: Oh, cool.
J: My favorite photo of Morrissey is probably on November Spawned a Monster [single]. What’s meaningful about this one is, when you did have to go to record stores to buy these, you waited patiently and you wondered when it was coming out. There’d be a chalk board or dry erase board up at the indie record store and it would say, ‘Coming Soon:’ I remember reading the title that said, “Coming Soon: Morrissey - November Spawned a Monster”, and I was already hooked. I hadn’t heard a note of the song yet but that title, wow! Another title that jumps out at you like that is Last Night I Dreamt That Somebody Loved Me. Before even hearing one note, just the title, you think, “(Gasp) I’m intrigued!”
C: Yeah (laughs).
J: “Hatful of Hollow” is one of the best vinyls you can own because of the gatefold, definitely. Picture of the whole band… They’re so young.
C: And dapper.
J: Great photo. Love that one. I’m sure that a lot of these great photos of the band and Morrissey, the best ones are the ones that weren’t posed. Just captured a moment in time.
C: Definitely. What do you admire most about him?
J: What I admire most about Morrissey is that he’s been able to achieve so much as someone who never felt as though they would ever have the kind of future that he did. When I read his Autobiography, a lot of these things I already knew about what life was like for him growing up, but I never quite knew until he put pen to paper himself to tell it his story, in his own words. How much death he experienced… death of life-long friends, childhood friends, associates… throughout his life. But, I remember reading about his almost ‘Charles Dickens-like’ childhood that he grew up with in Northern England, and what impresses me the most is how he got to where he is today from that kind of humble beginning and existence. Nobody could have predicted that this one kid out of thousands and millions in Northern England, growing up during that time would grow up to be one of the most influential singer songwriters of all time; and a voice for everyone who felt “sixteen, clumsy, and shy”. I think that’s what impresses me the most: what he’s achieved and accomplished out of something like that.
C: Yeah, it’s funny the whole “sixteen, clumsy, and shy” thing: I discovered Morrissey in the mid 90’s and it’s interesting to me how many generations he crosses. He’s multi-generational. And I wonder why that is, and how someone can have that much of an influence on multiple generations.
J: You go to his concerts and it isn’t just people my age going to his concerts, it’s young people, too. People in their twenty’s that are going to enjoy listening to him as well as people my age. It’s because those emotions that we talk about are universal to every generation, and for as much attention as he gets for those particular songs that are about isolation and unrequited love, I think we unfairly place too much attention on those [ones] when there are so many other themes that go on. A lot of very humorous themes go on [in some], and some social issues that go on in other songs. It does seem to me that when people speak of Morrissey they always speak of those songs of unrequited love or isolation. But, lets not discount a great song like The More You Ignore Me, The Closer I Get which is humorous and hilarious. It’s classic Morrissey. That song is the one I always try to give to someone who is uninitiated because I think it really encompasses his sense of humor and his ability to make a catchy pop song even more fascinating because of the humor involved in it. “Try this. I think you’ll like it,” (laughs).
C: I like that (laughs). What significance does he and his music have for you?
J: It’s because of him I became a musician. It’s because of him that I started a band. It’s because of him I learned how to play guitar. It’s because of him I learned to play piano. None of that would have happened had it not been for Morrissey. I had never, ever set out to be a lead singer of a rock band. That never factored into my mind until someone approached me to be a lead singer. If that person had never approached me and if that encounter had never happened, I never would’ve been a lead singer. Sweet and Tender Hooligans began because someone I had gone to community college with recognized me from a class that we had. We had never even spoken to each other but he had asked me if, by any chance, I was a singer. To which I replied, “No.” I sang in church and community theatre but I wasn’t a singer or actively looking for a band or anything like that. He said the reason that he asked is because he was a Smiths/ Morrissey fan and hoped to start a band and have a lead singer who would also be a Smiths/ Morrissey fan. Shortly thereafter, that’s how we started the band. So, without Morrissey in that aspect of my life, none of that would have happened.
C: Sweet and Tender Hooligans might not’ve been!
J: Exactly, yes.
C: You probably get this question a lot, but what do you enjoy most about performing?
J: The simplest answer is the applause. I guess that’s why we all do it? Applause is a very simple form of validation, I suppose. It’s a congratulations for all the hard work that you put in. There’s also something very special about being in a room full of people that love these songs as much as I love and cherish these songs. To look out into the audience as you’re singing the lyrics to a song and catching that one moment you look at one person in the eye, and they’re singing the same lyric but you see not just them mouthing the words, but the motion behind the mouthing that particular lyric. That’s a beautiful, beautiful thing. To be on stage and to do that for people, for sure.
C: I read in the interview you sent me that you have children.
J: Yes.
C: Have they ever seen you perform?
J: They have. They’ve been to a couple of shows that have happened during the day because we usually go on well after their bedtime. Early on, I don’t think my boys realized that Morrissey and daddy were two different people. They probably didn’t really see a difference. But to this day, they still haven’t been to one of those big shows. They’ve only seen the ones that have been outside, during the day, for a festival or something like that. Before I get too old and ridiculous it would be nice for them to see a show that we do at the House of Blues. That would be great for them to see that. And now that they know most of these songs it might be more enjoyable for them to see daddy on stage singing Everyday Is Like Sunday (laughs).
C: Right (laughs). And now they can differentiate between the two of you (laughs)?
J: Yeah. But it’s always nice to hear when my 7-year-old says, “Daddy, Morrissey looks like you,” (laughs).
C: Heck yeah!
J: When it’s really the other way around… I’m trying to look like Morrissey (laughs).
C: (Laughs) And what do they make of all of this? You being in the band?
J: The thing is, my being a dad is so far removed from this dorky little hobby I have. Kids don’t go into their dad’s workshop to watch them building ships in a bottle. It’s one of those things where if they come into the workshop and they see daddy putting a ship into the bottle, that’s great. But I don’t chase after them saying, “Look! Daddy’s gonna put a ship into the bottle!” (laughs).
C: Yeah (laughs).
J: It’s so much cooler when they stumble upon it, isn’t it?
C: Definitely.
J: That’s always been my approach with my boys. It’s completely separate.
C: Your kids grew up listening to Morrissey and the Smiths. Do they love him, too?
J: Well, I don’t just expose them to Morrissey and the Smiths because nobody wants to be lame like their parents (laughs). So, it’s better for me if I just expose them to everything and then hopefully, organically, they’ll say, “This is awesome!” It’s better if that happens, right? And I’m sure that someday down the road they’ll disappoint me with something that I can’t stand and I’ll say, “I’ve failed as a father!” (laughs).
C: And hang your head in shame (laughs).
J: Right. Rock n’ roll has always been a part of their lives. It’s always been in their existence because they’re forced to listen to the music their parents listen to, and forced to listen to daddy play the guitar. It’s always nice when they walk into the room and ask, “Can we sing this song?” and “Can we play that?” I’ll take the harmony and it’s so much better to walk into the workshop than for you to drag them into the workshop by the ear.
C: I know in our correspondence you mentioned that you normally host the Moz Disco at Mal’s. How long has that been going on?
J: The Moz Disco is five years and running, I think? That’s put together by Efren Santacruz, a dear friend of mine and a dear friend of the band. Efren used to come to Sweet and Tender Hooligan shows before he was old enough to come in. We had to sneak him and his crew in through the back door when we were playing places that were 21 and over. Efren grew up to be a fan just like me, and grew up following Morrissey around throughout the world and seeing him in different countries, as with our band. He has been following us to shows in California and at shows outside of the U.S. [for a long time]. Everytime we have toured the UK, Efren has been with us. He put together the Moz Disco where we spin nothing but Morrissey and the Smiths (https://www.facebook.com/TheMozDisco).
C: Is there anything else you would like to share with us?
J: I don’t get to talk about the radio show too often. I think that the Hooligans sort of overshadow what I’ve been doing with the radio show.
Indie103.1 was a station here, out of Los Angeles, on FM radio. It was a fantastic radio station that featured Steve Jones of the Sex Pistols during the mid-day, and also had Joe Escalante of the Vandals as the morning show DJ (Joe Escalante also happens to be the bass player for the Sweet and Tender Hooligans). The radio station started talking about doing [a segment of] something like ‘Breakfast with the Beatles.’ But just about every radio station market throughout the country has a ‘Breakfast with the Beatles.’ Them, being an indie rock radio station [said], “If we were to do a ‘Breakfast with The…’ what would that band be?” Naturally, it was the Smiths.
They had approached Joe about it and Joe shook his head and said, “Are you kidding? You know who you want? You want Jose. You want this guy in my tribute band. You want him to host this thing.”
And like being a lead singer and like being a DJ, I had never, ever done [anything like] that [before], but the idea was presented to me to host two hours of nothing but Morrissey and the Smiths, and I said, “Yeah, I’ll do it! Absolutely.”
And I thought, “Yeah, this will be great. Maybe it’ll last six months and I’ll get to say, ‘I hosted a Morrissey radio show for six months.’” And here we are, six years later and I’m still doing it every week. It’s on three days a week now, as opposed to just that one day a week.
It came into existence just at the time twitter did, which was perfect for it. As ‘appointment’ radio went away, podcasts came to be the sought after medium. It was important for me to make this ‘appointment’ radio as personal as possible to listeners and since I couldn’t do live phone requests, I would do them via twitter. So, that was kind of neat how that came to be right around that same time. And we still do it that way: I take requests and now people have even gotten to be as creative as to send in their requests via twitter in the form of a picture that depicts that song title. It’s really cool that [people are] going above and beyond the usual, “Play this song.”
This whole other aspect of being a Morrissey fan, and being the person I’ve become in the world of Morrissey, this radio show every week has been yet another avenue to be in a room full of people who love and cherish these songs as much as I do. I know people will probably find this hard to believe, but, after two hours of doing a radio show, I get into my car and I drive home listening to Morrissey and the Smiths. It’s wonderful, especially when a new album comes out it’s kind of neat to be that one DJ that is going to play those songs off of that new album, that maybe you aren’t going to hear on your FM station or wherever. It’s neat to have that moment of, “Hey, let’s all experience this. Let’s arrive at this one point, this one time of day, and listen to these songs together.” It’s been fantastic.
It got me the gig at the Moz Disco. It got me the gig at Part Time Punks. Which, is another story in itself: When they approached me to do that, I think they just assumed I was a club DJ. I had never DJ’d in my damn life! But, it just happened, you know? Here I’m thinking, “Oh, they want me to go in, get on the microphone and say, ‘Hey, everybody! Morrissey!’ And then someone else will do the heavy lifting and spin the records.” That’s what I thought! I went into that gig thinking that. Thank god I had CD’s in the car. I learned how to be a club DJ within two minutes (laughs).
C: I love that when you get approached by these people to participate in a DJ night or a radio show or a band, you say, “Yes” and then figure it out. I think it’s important to seize opportunity in that way.
J: Every fantastic, wonderful, and great, terrific thing that has happened in my life kind of just fell from the sky and landed in my lap. That goes for becoming the lead singer for the Sweet and Tender Hooligans. That goes for meeting my wife. That goes for becoming an L.A. County lifeguard. That goes for the radio show. All of these fantastic wonderful things that have happened…
C: …are because you took the opportunity and ran with it.
J: Exactly.
C: Noted.
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Thanks so much for your contribution to the Viva Love Photo Project, Jose! Your participation and support are greatly appreciated. Can’t wait to see you at the next Moz Disco.
The Sweet and Tender Hooligans annual Morrissey birthday show at the House of Blues in Anaheim on May 22nd is, unfortunately, sold out! But you can still catch Jose’s show on indie 103.1: Breakfast With the Smiths, streaming live every Wednesday and Sunday mornings, 9am PST/5pm UK, and Fridays 12am PST/8am UK.
Band: http://sweetandtenderhooligans.com/
Indie 103.1: Breakfast With the Smiths
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/pages/Sweet-and-Tender-Hooligans
Instagram: @josemaldonado828
Twitter: @josemaldonado
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(1) One of the shows at the Wiltern in 2004 opened up with Morrissey announcing to the crowd, “We are the Sweet and Tender Hooligans, and I am Jose.” http://fusion.net/story/6277/jose-maldonado-is-the-mexican-morrissey/