rhotten replied to your post “Can someone explain to me why I love Steve Rogers but not Jon Snow?”
Maybe it's the whole secret prince magical destiny thing?
veliseraptor replied to your post “Can someone explain to me why I love Steve Rogers but not Jon Snow?”
I agree with above - for me at least, it's because there's no aspect of prophecy or destiny. Steve becomes Captain America because he's a good person at the core; Jon's narrative about being a Targaryen makes it seem like he was born special.
I try to analyse my feelings towards Jon Snow by two general prongs: my reaction to Jon Snow the Good Person, and my reaction to Jon Snow the Special Snowflake. And I definitely agree that the Special Snowflake part is key, because the first time I ever rolled my eyes at him was in AGOT Bran I when GRRM kept going on and on about how he was so Different Than The Rest. Quick instead of fast! Slender instead of muscular! Goth instead of jock! And of course he was the only one who could see Theon for the asshole he was. It only got worse as the description of the north’s uniqueness (and Jon’s true northernness) got so heavy-handed.
But then, I wasn’t even thinking along the lines of secret prince or magical destiny at that time, I didn’t catch R+L=J until I read about it online after . I almost feel like having the explanation that he is a secret prince with a magical destiny made me feel better? Like, at least there’s a reason that GRRM is making him so special -- because he is! In my case, Dany doesn’t bother me nearly as much or the same way as Jon because her specialness is overtly there right from the beginning. It’s almost like it’s more honest.
For me, it’s almost like the journey to discovering that Jon is a secret prince with a magical destiny is more annoying than the actual fact of it..???! Maybe that’s key in my case, because I definitely have more time for Jon Snow as the series goes on and his chapters get down to business.
As for his goodness, to me Jon seems like a good person at the core too, and he should get credit for every just and fair-minded thing he says and does, but I’m just largely uninterested in it all. And it’s just interesting to me how uninterested I am, because I love Steve Rogers’ goodness, yet all Jon’s goodness can’t begin to counterbalance his special snowflake quality in my eyes (in my feels? in my feels’ eyes?). In fact it almost makes his goodness more obnoxious to me :-/ I don’t want it to, but it seems to. For example, when Jon uniquely realizes that all the men at the Wall are like links in a chain, all needed in their own way, I don’t cheer. I just roll my eyes. I know that GRRM is trying to indicate that being an outsider, an outcast, of a minority and/or oppressed status, etc., gives you empathy and understanding. But I think he plays it too heavy-handedly. I feel like Jon would be better served as a character to have a few more pseudo-medieval attitudes and feel just a tiny bit native to his setting (which he doesn’t much at all to me beyond his skills).
I mean, clearly, his goodness and his specialness are related. But isn’t King Arthur’s, also? And yet I can find interest in the goodness of Arthur, a special prince raised as a nobody, giving him a unique perspective on justice and goodness etc etc. But then, maybe that has partly to do with the fact that Arthur has been written and re-interpreted so many times and the source texts are so old as to be from another culture with which I have limited baggage, while Jon Snow is defined solely by one individual. I just think GRRM would have been better served if he hadn’t written Jon’s special goodness so heavy-handedly.
nottron replied to your post “Can someone explain to me why I love Steve Rogers but not Jon Snow?”
better writing, ascent to greatness feels earned and not accidental?
Well I must admit, a serum helped Steve along, I’m not sure how “earned” that is. But then again, Steve chose it, it wasn’t something forced upon him reluctantly. Reluctantly Awesome Jon is possibly my least favorite Jon.
And on first thought, it’s hard for me to assess writing since both the Marvel comics and the MCU movies have been written by a few different folks and we have medium differences and so forth. But whatever else, within the context of ASOIAF, Jon’s goodness feels hopelessly superior to others’. Within the context of MCU, Steve’s goodness feels rare, but not unattainable. To the extent that Jon’s goodness inspires goodness in others, it all feels like a way to further aggrandize Jon Snow. Whereas with Steve Rogers, his goodness is -- shared? within all of us? perhaps lying dormant but still belonging to everyone?
????!!!?!?!?!??!! Is this bullshit I’m blowing up everyone’s asses or...!?!?!?!??!?!?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!??
bidonica replied to your post “Can someone explain to me why I love Steve Rogers but not Jon Snow?”
what the others have said, also in the context of the MCU Chris Evans lends him a particularly endearing charisma imo
It is hard to compete with this:
