#s186

[thewertsearch]

TG: but you believe in stuff TG: probbly because the more crazy fake shit you believe in the more open the world gets and the more chance there is for adventures being real right GT: Right o! If a man believes hard enough in imaginary things then i dare say that makes them slightly less fake!

Yeah, but you're calling them imaginary, which I'm sure makes Roxy feel really good about confiding in you. You don't actually sound like you believe her at all - except in a 'blind faith' kind of way, which doesn't really mean anything.

If your belief is this indiscriminate - if you'd 'believe' anything that Roxy tells you, and she knows it - then she's not going to feel heard.

TG: its one of those things jane likes about u so much […] GT: You mean how um… […] GT: Jane is prone to looking upon me with what i fathom to be more than just friendly affection?

Oh, well here's something new.

Just like John, Jake's a bit of a goof - but he's not stupid. He's fully aware that Jane's got a bit of a crush, and I take it they've been dancing around the elephant in this room for quite a while.

Does he also know about Roxy's crush on him? Or, for that matter, the Auto-Responder's? I have to assume so - neither are very subtle - which means that Jake's in an awkward position where no matter what he does, he's going to hurt at least two of his friends' feelings, and he knows it.

GT: Its a tricky issue. And you know i adore jane and please dont think i havent given some thought to... GT: Well that angle on our relationship i guess.

You've thought about it, but you haven't acted on those feelings, even though you know they'd be reciprocated, so I don't think you're exactly seeing sparks. I reread their earlier conversation, and I really don't get a romantic vibe between them. (Hell, I get a stronger romantic vibe between Jane and Roxy, but I'm a little biased.)

This line, at least, makes a lot more sense now - and in retrospect, it reads as more than a little uncomfortable. Jake doesn't seem to want to bring the issue up at all...

...but the fact that he keeps vaguely drawing attention to it makes me think he wants her to bring it up. He wants to resolve it, but he's too awkward to initiate the conversation himself.

I think our boy is simply a rather poor communicator - which is unfortunate, because that trait does not pair well with his position as the kid everyone's got a crush on.

[thewertsearch]

GT: Are you sure? GG: Yes, I saw your body lying in a sort of coffin, on a bed of flowers. You were dead as a doornail.

Whoever killed Jake, I'm pretty sure I can take a guess at their motivation, and it ties back to a Murderstuck development that came completely out of left field.

This.

Eridan's wand was absurdly powerful, able to overpower Sollux's building-vaporizing psionics with little effort. We don't really know what the Hope aspect does, but it clearly translates into raw destructive power.

If Jake's abilities are in any way comparable to Eridan's, then someone's just locked the team's main damage-dealer out of the God Tier, and I have no doubt that they destroyed his Quest Slab as well. Any hope (lmao) of using Eridan's overpowered lasers for good has just evaporated before our eyes.

We don't really know what Hope is for - and now, we never will.

Harley Mansion ain't doing so well, this time around. Did Grandma Jade perish in some sort of pumpkin eruption?

Jokes aside, I've been wondering a lot about how Jade died. It can't have been a Tavros potshot, this time around - although I guess it's possible that the pre-Scratch Summoner is responsible for her death, instead.

When you first discovered the TRANSMATERIALIZER, you started messing around with it haphazardly. You kept appearifying pumpkins from somewhere. It was just pumpkin after pumpkin, until one time a copy of the bunny you inherited from grandma showed up, much less old and tattered of course.

Well, I guess that explains Jade's disappearing pumpkins. Jake's Transmaterializer is locked to the pre-Scratch Harley Mansion, so his experiments kept grabbing random objects from her house.

Come to think of it, this is probably how they became pen-pals in the first place - he accidentally stole her bunny, and then returned it later, once he'd figured...

...wait, is that what happened to Jaspers? He was accidentally stolen by adult Rose or Roxy, using a Lalonde Transmaterializer which is locked to Rose's childhood?

Yeah, I think this makes sense. I think this makes a lot of sense, actually. We've just been given an explanation for the mysterious disappearance of Jade's pumpkins - and here's another mysterious disappearance, which took place in another Player's childhood home. Jaspers was teleported through the Scratch.

[thewertsearch]

Hell, I was oblivious to that thing in the background. I thought it was just a weird branch, or something.

I'm actually pretty sure that's a Crab lusus - which is extra interesting, because those don't occur naturally. I understand why the Condesce would be cultivating a new population of lusi for her subjects, but this lusus has no interest in any troll on the Hemospectrum.

Only a disciple of the Signless would cultivate the Crabdad, and the Condesce would probably exterminate them on sight. Someone else brought this species to Earth, for reasons unknown.

Why are you here, Crabdad?

Who have you been bred to care for?

TG: want 2 know TG: what do you want for ur wigglin day

Wiggling Day, eh?

Roxy's been talking to some trolls, I take it.

Well, we already knew she was probably in contact with Umbra, but her casual use of their lingo implies she's been talking to a lot of trolls. The same ones breeding forbidden lusi, perhaps?

GT: I dont wager i could advise with much specificity but i can all but assure you i will find any gesture of yours to be totally capital!

Jake continues to be a funny motherfucker. It's like he's right-clicking thesaurus on every second word he types.

TG: i was only bringing it up so much in advance because TG: of the end of the world about to happen and all TG: and then TG: i wouldnt get the chance TG: unless we play this game like a bunch ofsuckers obviously […] TG: but TG: if you want 2 know what i think………. […] TG: i really dont think we should

Sollux also got cold feet near the starting line, didn't he?

I don't know what it is, but something about Sburb makes programmers flip their entire shit. Maybe the game's source code is full of gotos, or something.

Not that Roxy isn't entirely correct in her assessment, of course. This session is rigged harder than Cat Mario, and Entering it is sure to spell disaster, but we don't really have a choice. The B2 kids need this session to exist, so that the B1 kids - currently their best hope of actually salvaging the mess that is this timeline - have a metaphysical location to shoot for.

Plus, y'know - refusing to play the game will probably just doom the timeline, as per usual.

[thewertsearch]

GT: I have received reports from jade about this as well. She liked to talk about her dreams on prospits moon a lot. GG: I see. The impression I have developed is that this is supposed to be a real place, and all who dream there have shared experiences.

Damn, Jane. For someone who supposedly 'doesn't believe in Sburb', you sure are retaining a lot of its lore.

She might not be ready to accept it just yet - but her hindbrain is still taking it all in. She has understanding, without belief...

...and Jake has belief, without understanding.

GG: I explored the moon, and began to notice people gathering in the streets. GG: But they weren't human. They were funny looking, perfectly white creatures. […] GG: The more closely I observed, the more they appeared somewhat despondent. […] GG: I determined they were in mourning, actually.

Don't tell me the Queen is already dead? I guess that's not impossible, given that we've already seen multiple anti-monarchist Carapacians, but it is weird. I mean, technically, this session doesn't even exist yet.

Wait.

...she didn't actually say that Jake was sleeping, did she?

GG: "The Page is dead." GG: "Our hope is lost."

Which of these is a worse omen for Jake English?

His Dream Self died before the session even started

His Title sits at the intersection between Eridan and Tavros

Voting ended onApr 14, 2025

GG: Jake. GG: The Page was you.

A pre-session death, just like Aradia.

Aradia, far as I can tell, was down a Dream Self because her realself was murdered before she'd Entered. Jake's realself is fine, though, so I think that this time, the damage was on the Prospit end of the connection.

Who would be motivated to attack a Dream Self before the session? Who would even be able to? Derse certainly wouldn't - that has to be against the rules - and Jack shouldn't have had any reason to go off-script just yet.

In a pre-initialized Medium, the Carapacians have no war to fight, locked in an eternal stalemate as they are. The Underlings, as far as I'm aware, only spawn on Lands, and the Denizens haven't even been instantiated yet.

In a pre-initialized Medium, the only agents who could act unpredictably...

...would be the Players themselves.

[thewertsearch]

TG: do you want me to set u up w the files now GT: Ooh, these illicit hacked warez which i heartell were recently jimmied piping hot off the interclouds? TG: ahahah i love that you were barely even joking with that statement bup yeah basically GT: The silicon pickpocket strikes again!!! Whom is the wiser? Nobody.

pffffft

You know what this is? This is real, genuine charisn'tma, right out of a Discworld novel. Jake is just so bizarre, with his stilted vocabulary and 'accent' that would be anachronistic in literally any time period that you can't help but enjoy his dialogue. He's likeable, in the weirdest way possible - which sort of parallels John, a guy who's likeable in a very straightforward way.

TG: im not letting either of you run this file on your shitty brainwashy propaganda helmets or anything else u got to wear to run

I'd understand if you were saying that to Jane - but this helmet was inherited from Jade, who should be entirely trustworthy... right?

Does Roxy know something about Grandma Jade that we don't? Something suspicious, perhaps?

GT: Then you have decided to play in spite of your reservations? […] TG: i have every reason to want to play it TG: im actually dying to play it ok

If Roxy's situation is anything like Rose's, then she's living in a remote mansion in upstate New York, with a mother she feels completely alienated from, and no IRL friends to speak of.

Of course she wants to play Sburb. She's desperately lonely.

TG: you believe me right TG: about the bad shit that could hapen GT: Of course i do. GT: What sort of friend would i be if not?

Belief without understanding, like I said before.

Maybe that's the deal with Hope, actually - it's all faith, and no logic. Eridan, who desperately sought out romantic partners with no understanding of why he failed, certainly seems to fit that mold. Hope, then, would be the Aspect of trust, belief, and, in Eridan's case, absolute delusion.

TG: ok well TG: dont say that to jabe TG: *n

Seems that Roxy's also aware that there's something up with Jane. Well, if anyone can undo the damage the Tiaratop has done, it's probably the girl who can look at its source code.

TG: jane never believed my crap TG: never any of my warnings about the baroness TG: didnt believe any of the stuff about my mom TG: and so on and so on and soon TG: til after awhile i just stopped even trying to convince her hard or bring up any crazy shit TG: because u know doing a lot of songs and dances to convince somebody who thinks youre jush shitting them all the time kind of wears on a friendship TG: and who even needs that

...although, Roxy's not describing Jane's repression as if it's artificial. In other words, she thinks Jane's unwillingness to face uncomfortable truths is a real facet of her personality - and perhaps she's not entirely wrong.

Now, let's not get it twisted, here - I do still think that Jane's being brainwashed to ignore any evidence that her corporation is evil, or that her grandmother is the Condesce. But she's also ignoring other uncomfortable truths - ones that are far less supernatural.

B2 Rose - although I hate to admit this - is showing all the signs of being a neglectful and irresponsible Guardian. If Roxy has tried to open up to Jane about this, and she's summarily brushed it off, I really don't think we can chalk it all up to brainwashing. Would the Condesce really brainwash Jane into ignoring all negative information, in any context, ever? How does that benefit her?

No, this feels a lot more like Jane just doesn't want to think about... bad stuff. There's certainly precedent for that, in her family, as John's always shrugging off bad shit - and as we're seeing here, that's not always a good thing. If you're shrugging off your friends' problems in lieu of supporting them, that's not on your evil tiara. It's on you.

[thewertsearch]

TG: the barnoness wants us to […] TG: i dont know why TG: everything i know about it says it should be a good game and real important and itll let us all get togehter and do somethin great and be besf friends for maybe eternity? TG: but she took all that and twisted it somehow TG: all i know is shes banking on us doing this and if she needs us to do this than its got to be to make somethin fucking hoorible happen

Well, she's working for English, who presumably wants to turn this universe into his latest dinner. So far, that's his only stated motivation, although I have reason to suspect that there's more to it than that.

If the Condesce has her own agenda, then it's probably something akin to the oft-discussed Second Alternian Empire. The woman clearly thinks very highly of herself - her name is literally the condescension - and somehow, I doubt she's content to fade into obscurity as the one-time ruler of a fallen civilization.

No, this is a woman who wants to rule. We've seen the influence she's already exerting over the Earth, and I don't think she'll be satisfied until her control is absolute.

Come to think of it, founding a new empire on Earth wouldn't even have to conflict with English's world-eating. After all, Alternia's universe was marked for destruction at his hands, and she still ruled it for millennia before the other shoe dropped. From the Earth's perspective, it could be thousands or even millions of years until the universe is destroyed - and even that doesn't need to be the end for her. English made her immortal, so there's literally nothing stopping her from starting over again, in the next universe he targets.

She could do this forever, until there are no more worlds left to subjugate. It'll just be Alternian Empires, all the way down.

TG: maybay im just like this nutty ass bitsh twirling yarn from a shitwizards nappy brown beard but i cant bring myself to trust a cake sellin genocidal alien overlard sea queen

Huh. Funnily enough, I think this is the first time it's been all-but officially stated that Betty Crocker is the Empress. I'd ask how Roxy is aware of this, but she's the daughter of a Seer, and a l33t haxxor to boot. She's probably more clued-in than even Jade was.

TG: so what is the itinerary again GT: Intinerwhosit? TG: regarding the game TG: whosplaying in what order etc

Well, if we follow where the narrative parallels lead us, the chain should be Jane -> Roxy -> Bro -> Jake. The expectation, then, is that Jane will Enter in relative safety, and the kids' meteors will slowly grow larger, culminating in a moon-sized meteor for poor Jake.

TG: i start with jane and bring her in the session TG: then ds brings me in and you bring him in and them jane does you and closes the loop

This does indeed seem to be the order they're planning. Only time will tell if it actually holds, though, as things have gone fruity-rumpus-shaped before. The trolls thought they were two different chains.

GT: Where are you getting this intel? Did you guys make a plan or something? TG: nah dont wory about it

Like I said, Roxy's got plenty of potential sources of intel. Aside from her mother, her hacking abilities, and potential Dream Self shenanigans, the 'darkness' Umbra's seeing over her location implies she might also be in contact with the Horrorterrors.

This girl's got a lot of irons in a lot of fires. Hopefully she knows what she's doing.

[thewertsearch]

You just remembered something your alien friend said about the big old book downstairs, and trusting words written by your own hand. What the heck did she mean by that?

Is your friend suggesting that you were the one who wrote this inscription? You find that idea a bit hard to swallow. Still, your friends are always babbling about time travel... You always thought this inscription was written to your poppop by his nanna, who was your great great grandmother, founder of the corporation you'll inherit in a few years.

I don't blame Jane for being confused, as the messaging here is all over the place. The Nannalore was intended for pre-Scratch John, but she can only interpret it as a message for old Poppop, which raises questions that don't have answers.

Just like Jake, she can't arrive at anything close to a correct conclusion without knowledge of the Scratch.

That said, she should know that something fantastical is going on. One of her friends is actively pirating Sburb's source code, another lives a stone's throw away from the Frog Temple, and they've both been completely open about everything. For crying out loud, she's already dreaming on Prospit, and she's still skeptical!

I have to assume it’s that damn tiara. It's brainwashing Jane, compelling her to ignore the realities of her life. Jane might literally be incapable of recognizing that she's not a perfectly ordinary corporate heiress - and thus, she becomes vulnerable to further manipulation by English's faction.

[thewertsearch]

GG: Dad has the whole house in full fatherly lockdown mode. Talk about blowing a few measly "assassination attempts" way out of proportion!

I'm just picturing the Tiaratop whispering in the back of Jane's mind, making sure she stays asleep.

Isn't this all so normal, Jane? Don't we love how normal your life is? Your father's such a worrier, isn't he, Jane? But we know this is all so, so, normal.

GG: [...] Did you ever track down the slippery Mr. Strider? [...] GG: I'm debating whether or not to enlist his help in the matter of my current imprisonment. But I'd rather keep it as a plan of last resort.

I don’t know what kind of solution Lil' Bro would have to Jane’s Homestuck status, but I don’t think I want to see it. He'd probably try to burst her doors down with a tidal wave of Smuppets, or something.

GG: Right. Well, not to keep you too long, since we both still have our missions ahead of us, but I wanted to tell you about that dream I had. [...] GT: *Whips up bucket of freshly popped corn.* [...] GG: Ok, but, I should say that the nature of the dream was a bit worrisome.

I might not know everything about what's going on in this timeline, but I can say, with absolute certainty, that nothing in those clouds was ever going to be good news.

Let's get into it.

Unlike John's first foray into Prospit, Jane's dream self appears to be fully awake.

This was initially a little confusing to me, because the above quote from Jade seemed to imply that waking one's dream self involves acknowledging your destiny as a Player. Jane, however, is furiously looking away from that destiny - and yet, she's up and about, which is the opposite of what you'd expect.

Upon reflection, though, this actually makes a lot of sense. After all, Dream Jane isn't wearing the tiara, so her thoughts aren't being influenced the way they are on Earth. Jane might be prevented from acknowledging her destiny while awake - but, at her core, Jane does accept that she's a Player.

GG: Are you sure you haven't woken up there before? GT: Haha i WISH.

And Jake, despite being completely immersed in Sburb lore, is not awake. It's a lot harder to make this one make sense, which might be a sign that I'm wrong about how Dream Selves work.

I suppose you could argue that Jake, despite all the information he has access too, still doesn't really understand what's going on. He has a lot of data, but lacks a true understanding of his role - so he sleeps.

...nah, I don't think that fits. After all, we just watched Jane completely fail to understand the Nannalore, so by this logic, she shouldn't be awake, either. I guess we'll revisit this conundrum once we're more familiar with Jake's personality.