Sherri said to go to you. So here I am. lol. What promo is coming up and who's going to be there? Thanks.
[Anonymous #2 asked] : So are both S & C going to the Outlander Con / Premiere in Savannah?
Hello Anons! And thanks for the shout-out, @sherrigamblin!
So far this is what I’ve seen for upcoming promo:
October 28th Savannah, Georgia premiere / Q+A panel @ the Lucas Theater for the Arts (x)
Cast + crew (specifics yet to be confirmed, but it’s likely Caitriona Balfe, Sam Heughan, Sophie Skelton, Rik Rankin, Maril Davis, and maybe Ron D. Moore / Diana Gabaldon)
Costume display at the SCAD Museum of Art (runs thru December 2nd, x)
Will be livestreamed on the Outlander Facebook page, 7pm EST
October 31st AM to DM with Saeed Jones (x)
Sam Heughan, Sophie Skelton, + Rik Rankin
Will be livestreamed on Twitter, 10am EST
October 31st BUILD Series NYC panel @ the NYC BUILD Studio (x)
Sam Heughan, Sophie Skelton, + Rik Rankin
Will be livestreamed on the BUILD Series website
November 1st Live with Kelly + Ryan
Sam Heughan
There’s also more pre-filmed videos from the Season 4 set coming up with Kristin Dos Santos, Leanne Aguilera. And hopefully there’s other interviews / promo coming up with both Caitriona + Sam that we just don’t know about yet.
I’ll try and post links as they come out / as we learn about more events + interviews. Lots of goodies coming up!
A “MIDDLE WAY” PERSPECTIVE: Let’s Consider What It Would Look Like If BOTH Sides FULLY Stayed in Their Lanes, Respected Others’ Beliefs, Agreed to Disagree, and Stopped Judging Others Within & Related to the Outlander Community
I have tried to reach out to two of the major ES. In fairness, they responded to my overtures but our conversations did not go very far. One did accept my apology and she apologized herself and that was a good thing. I wish our dialogues had been more successful but they had pretty strong ideas of what they wanted to end the fan feud. It seems to me that the position of both of them is we need to agree to disagree, to respect everyone’s right to believe what they want regarding Sam and Cait, to stop judging others, and to just “stay in our lanes.”
So I took some time to really think through their proposal. I think this could work but it is a little more complicated than what I think either of these ES leaders have considered.
A DEFINITION
This is how the Urban Dictionary defines “stay in your lane”:
To simplify things, at times I’m going to use “stay in your lane” to also incorporate the ideas of letting others believe what they want about S & C, agreeing to disagree, and not judging each other.
FIRST, IN TERMS OF THE OUTLANDER COMMUNITY, “STAYING IN OUR OWN LANES” SHOULD APPLY TO MORE THAN JUST OUR TWO GROUPS.
Now I think there are some good principles here but I would hope that we could all agree that if we value these principles, they should apply to ALL people who are a part of or who are related to the Outlander community. So I think that if extreme shippers (ES) are serious about non-shippers/ truthers (NSTs) and ES staying in their own lanes, it also has to mean that they (and NSTs) won’t take their agendas and veer into the lanes of anyone else related to our community, including Sam’s and Cait’s “lanes,” the “lanes” of Sam’s and Cait’s possible significant others (PSO’s--a coin termed by Gina Hubbell), the “lanes” of general fans who don’t want to be involved in the feud, and the “lanes” of anyone who is perceived as geting in the way of the ship.
So what would this look like? This is what I think it would look like:
1. EVERYONE should civilly AGREE TO DISAGREE, without name calling, labeling, using mental health idioms against each other, or spreading unsubstantiated rumors about each other. If this principle is agreed to, both ES and NSTs would stop putting each other down on their blogs and timelines. (Although we could certainly swear and curse about each other in private DM’s or locked groups--after all we’re only human. 😉) That doesn’t mean we couldn’t agree to disagree on something on our blogs. For instance, if one group says that a certain S & C gif means that S & C are a couple, the other group should be free to be able to say, no, we don’t think that is what it means, as long as they do so in a respectful and civil manner.
2. EVERYONE’S beliefs about Sam and Cait need to be respected. Both ES and NSTs would need to respect not only the beliefs of each other but the beliefs of anyone in or related to the Outlander community. Now, this not only means that ES or anyone else should be free to state their belief that Sam and Cait are a couple without being ridiculed or called names, it also means NSTs or anyone else should be free to state that they know or believe that Sam and Cait are not a couple (including Sam and Cait themselves) without fear of being attacked.
3. Respecting each other’s right to believe things also means we don’t aggressively intrude into other people’s “lanes” with our beliefs. Both ES and NSTs should not send hateful anons to each other about their beliefs nor should they reblog a post from the other side and add a hateful comment on it (or add a hateful comment in the “reply” section of the post). I think civil, legitimate questions or comments could be sent to each other via anon but certainly not anything abusive.
I know that ES like to send shippery tweets to Sam and Cait and that is part of their “fun.” Doing so once in a while, however, is different than spamming them frequently with such tweets. Since Sam and Cait have stated their “belief” that they are not a couple, ES are not showing that they respect S & C’s “belief” when they choose to spam them with pleas to get married and have babies, or with shippery tweets trying to get them to provide “breadcrumbs” to contradict their stated “belief” that they are not a couple. When they spam S & C, they are also indirectly spamming other fans with their beliefs who visit S’s & C’s social media or look at live tweets to them. Those fans have a right not to have those beliefs imposed on them by being forced to wade through large numbers of tweets to find something that isn’t shippery.
Similarly, ES putting comments on a PSOs IG that suggest that she could not in any way be in a relationship with Sam because he is involved with Cait would be imposing their beliefs on the PSO and other fans who might be looking at the post.
Similarly, NSTs (or more specifically the small number of Samzie shippers who are also NSTs) putting comments on a PSOs IG congratulating her for dating Sam or stating what a cute couple they are is also imposing their beliefs on the PSO and other fans.
4. If people don’t want to be “judged” they need to stop judging everyone else. Yes, both NSTs and ES need to stop judging each other, especially about the small stuff or about our beliefs regarding S & C. However, there are times to speak out when something really awful happens (like when fans leave nasty messages on a PSO’s IG). When people speak out, however, it would be helpful if they try to do so in a manner that doesn’t further inflame the situation but rather describes behavior (instead of people’s characters), and by firmly asking the behavior to stop, and/ or by reporting those behaviors to the appropriate social media authorities.
But again, I think this is an area that ES might have a harder time in following when it comes to other people related to the Outlander community. They are quick to say, “what right do you have to judge us?” but they think nothing of publicly judging Sam or one of Sam’s or Cait’s PSOs, journalists, and anyone else who gets in the way of the ship. In particular, they seem to think they have a right to judge what a PSO like Mac puts on her IG or how Tony behaves around Cait or how Sam uses social media. If they don’t want others “judging” them then perhaps they should stop publicly “judging” PSOs and others on their public blogs. They really can’t have it both ways.
If ES need to share those kinds of thoughts they can do so in private locked groups or DMs. That doesn’t mean that we are asking ES to go “underground” and “hide” their shipping. We don’t mind if they want to talk about Sam and Cait being together on their public blogs. However, what we don’t think there is any good excuse for is making hateful judgements of PSOs and others on their public blogs.
5. The worst way of “veering into someone’s lane” is by invading their privacy. Both ES and NSTs should absolutely never dox each other or otherwise invade each other’s privacy. There is no excuse for that. If they know of anyone on their “side” who is doing those things they should call them out on that behavior. If they refuse to change, they should block them and/ or report them.
Both ES and NST’s should stop invading Sam’s and Cait’s (and their PSOs) privacy by deep data mining/ cyber stalking them or actually stalking them. Trying to figure out where Sam and Cait are all the time and looking up flight information and examining minute parts of photos to find information and following everyone under the sun who might remotely be involved with them in any way in order to get information about them is an invasion of their privacy.
As far as I know most of the NSTs are not really interested in discovering any new information about Sam and Cait and telling the fandom about it.
Major public photos on IG that are easy to find (i.e, don’t involve going to stranger’s IGs because you did a multiple hashtag search) are fine to discuss. But really, anything else is getting into data mining.
So if we are going to “stay in our lanes” we need to stop those behaviors.
6. If we are going to stop veering into each other’s “lanes” we have to stop tattling on each other. It is important in order to lower the fear and toxicity in this fandom for both ES and NST’s to stop “tattling” on each other to Starz, Sam, and Cait, etc., unless something really horrific happens. But this “tattling” should also be avoided regarding other people related to the Outlander community. Can we please just all stop reporting people to Starz or their bosses especially if those reports are intended to possibly affect someone’s livelihood. Adults discuss disagreements with each other. When it gets to the point of threatening someone’s livelihood over a disagreement that really isn’t okay--even if someone said something inappropriate or hurtful in the heat of the moment (especially if they were being mobbed by angry fans). If you don’t like what someone said or did, confront them civilly about it but please act like adults and stop the “tattling.”
7. “Mobbing” is a major invasion of someone’s lane. Both ES and NSTs need to absolutely avoid descending on one person (or even a few) related to the Outlander community (including journalists) as a “mob” on social media in order to express angry feelings towards them--however justified they think those feelings are. (See this POST that discusses “mobbing.”)
So that’s what I think it would look like if ES and NSTs really “stayed in their lanes” and allowed EVERYONE to believe what they wanted about Sam and Cait, avoided judging others, and civilly agreed to disagree on Sam and Cait.
I honestly think that most NSTs would be fine with this. I’m not so sure that ES would be fine with it but maybe I’m wrong about that.
So ES, the ball is in your court. This is what you said you wanted in order to go forward. I’m happy to talk through the fine details with you anytime you want. Let me know.
NOTE: This is just my opinion as a fan, nothing more. If you disagree, please do so respectfully. Last updated 05.21.17.
Unfortunately, Labeling Any Outlander Fan a “Troll” Is Part of the Problem--Not the Solution
A major super-shipper who wants peace in the fandom and who means well recently tweeted this:
The link to the article can be found HERE.
UNFORTUNATELY, LABELING FANS AS “TROLLS” IS COUNTERPRODUCTIVE. There is a major problem with using the above article as a way to understand what is happening in the Outlander fan feud. You see, as far as I know, none of the major non-shippers/ truthers (NST’s) or super-shippers are “trolls.”
Although I hate quoting from Wikipedia, they did have the best definition of a troll that I could find, so here it is:
In Internet slang, a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows discord on the Internet by starting arguments or upsetting people, by posting inflammatory,[1]extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community (such as a newsgroup, forum, chat room, or blog) with the deliberate intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[2] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion,[3] often for their own amusement.
Why don’t I think that the major players on either side of the feud are trolls? It’s because I don’t think any of these people (myself included) are writing things just to upset others for the “fun” of it. I think all of the major players are very sincere in their beliefs. When any of us start to behave like trolls (i.e., being more hateful in what we write) it is because we are frustrated that the other side isn’t listening to us or taking us seriously. We are often trying to communicate to the other side through blocked accounts and enormous prejudices and so sometimes we get dramatic or sarcastic in our attempts to do so. I know that some of the posts that I am least proud of came about because I felt like I was beating my head against a brick wall and I was trying to figure out some way to get through that brick wall to the other side. In reality, however, I probably accomplished the opposite of what I intended when I wrote from a place of too much anger.
That’s what I think has been happening on both sides of the fan feud. Oh, yes, I have occasionally seen a solitary fan who seems to be just causing trouble for the heck of it but those are few and far between--and they are not any of the major players on either side.
To help you understand why I don’t think this kind of caricaturing of any of the major players is helpful, I’m going to quote from a POST from the No Verra Sensible series that I wrote a while ago:
I-Thou relationships. A central concept of the Arbinger Institute’s approach to peace is Martin Buber’s concept of “I-Thou” relationships as opposed to “I-It” interactions. The Arbinger folks believe that when we view other people as objects to meet our needs (”a blog administrator,” “a source of information”) or two-dimensional caricatures (i.e. a “troll,” a “delusional shipper” a “narcissist,”) rather than as complex human beings, we are engaging in “I-It” interactions with those people, which can sometimes result in our taking advantage of or mistreating them.
It is only when we see others as complex human beings with the same needs and feelings as we have that we can enter into meaningful “I-Thou” relationships. That doesn’t mean that we have to have a full fledged “relationship” with every person. For instance, if we perceive a restaurant server as an “object” (i.e., someone who is just there to provide us with quick service), we may become irritated with them if they don’t immediately take our order and consequently treat them gruffly. But if we remember they are another complex “person,” we will relate to them in ways that are considerate and understanding and our interactions will be the better for it.
Self-betrayal and self-justification. When we interact with others as if they were caricatures or objects, instead of “persons” we often end up behaving in ways that go against (i.e., “betray”) our own ideals and values. The Arbinger Institute refers to this as self-betrayal. When that happens, we find ourselves motivated to justify why we behaved as we did. In the course of this self-justification, we start to view the context of the situation in which the behavior occurred in a way that vindicates our behavior and further distorts our perceptions.
This is why I have repeatedly berated both sides of the fan feud to stop pathologizing each other--to stop calling each other “crazy,” or “delusional” or “sociopaths,” or whatever.
Labeling someone as a “troll” is doing the same thing. Doing so gives us permission to view and treat the other person as an object. It allows us to say negative things about them and to ignore what they are trying to communicate to us. In the long run it further breaks down communication between sides and leads to more and more extreme behaviors by certain players in their attempts to get their points across.
SO WHERE DO WE GO FROM HERE? I’d like to throw out a few general guidelines that maybe we could discuss. These are just suggestions; feel free to disagree with them.
I believe we should stop calling each other names (including “troll”) and stop pathologizing each other. We certainly should stop engaging in character assassination. We need to agree that it is not okay to lie about any fan (or to reblog lies that someone else made up). Doxing any fan should be considered absolutely taboo.
I think people on both sides have to stop sending nasty anons to each other. No, I don’t know any NST’s who actually send abusive anons to s-shippers, although I do know some who send reasonable questions to them. Most likely the nasty anons that come from our camp come from followers, since most of the major NST’s that I have spoken to are opposed to abusive anons. (Honestly, I think that both sides should turn off their anons. It only encourages bad behavior. If people need to communicate with a blogger, they will find a way. And they can always request that any “ask” they send be posted as anon.) We also need to avoid reblogging and commenting on posts from the “other lane.” That just results in animosity and fighting in the post’s comments.
I know that super-shippers don’t like it when NST’s screencap them but honestly, we don’t like it when you paraphrase us incorrectly or just make up things that we allegedly said that aren’t true. A major reason we screencap s-shippers is to keep ourselves honest and not veer into hyperbole when paraphrasing them. However, I would encourage NST’s to white out the handles of the people they are screencapping. It is usually the words we are disagreeing with anyway. We don’t usually have to single out the person who said them.
We need to adopt civil language when we discuss each other. All the swearing doesn’t help. It would also be helpful to tone down the adjectives we use to describe each other. If there is a less hurtful way of saying something, we might want to choose that way.
I think we need to let go of all the sock accounts. I know that many people create sock accounts because of a fear of being attacked if they say things using their own handles. But it is far more likely that we will say something inappropriate when we are hiding in a sock account. It also sets up an atmosphere of suspicion. No one is sure who anyone is.
Full disclosure here: I had one twitter sock account that I used once to send a comment to Sam that I immediately thought better of and deleted. The second (and last) time I used it was to send maybe 5 tweets during a charged twitter discussion in which I was afraid to open my locked twitter account. Those tweets fell on deaf ears (maybe because no one knew who I was--the down side of a sock account) and so I learned my lesson and deleted the account.
I also have a third tumblr blog that isn’t a sock account. I’ve had that blog for nearly a year. I use it largely to reblog political posts and pretty pictures (including some Outlander pictures) and sometimes to like (but not to comment on) NST posts. I did use it three times last summer to reblog and comment on three shipper posts that I felt uncomfortable commenting on using my CO blog. However, doing so seemed counterproductive and dishonest, so I ceased doing that last summer after the third comment and I don’t intend to use that blog ever again to comment on the fandom. As we get closer to the presidential election, I will probably start posting my own essays about politics on that blog. I’m an old school liberal and so my commentary will reflect that. I’d prefer not to give out the name of that blog because I’d rather keep my politics separate from my fan commentary.
I’ve disclosed this information to make it clear that I haven’t been a complete saint when it comes to hiding my identity when making fandom comments. But I did learn my lesson and I stopped doing so (after only a few attempts). I think we all need to stop. Some major players on both sides undoubtedly use sock accounts. Doing so just adds to all the turmoil and misunderstanding in the fandom. I believe we should learn to swallow our fear and speak up as ourselves rather than hiding behind a fake account. We are more likely to be civil when we interact that way if we do.
FINAL THOUGHTS: I never finished the very last subsection of my “No Verra Sensible” series. It has been slightly over a year now since the first installment of that series was published. It seems fitting that I should write the last subsection. I’ll try to do so this month. But in the meantime, I might suggest that readers who are interested in peace read the first two subsections of Part V of the series, to get an idea of where I am headed with the last subsection. Those subsections can be found HERE and HERE.
I think we are all capable of doing better. I think we can have detente if not an actual end to all hostilities. But first we have to start seeing each other as human beings with complex thoughts, feelings, and desires, rather than perceiving each other as two-dimensional caricatures.
REACHING OUT: Of all the super-shippers @sherrigamblin has been the one who has been most interested in peace. One of the things that hampers real dialogue in our fandom is all the blocking of accounts. So Sherri, I have unblocked you on both my CO blog and my twitter account. If you want to contact me via chat, here on tumblr you can do so. I’d be happy to dialogue and to try to find a way to make peace in this fandom.
NOTE: This is just my opinion as a fan, nothing more. If you disagree, please do so respectfully. Last updated 07.06.16.
I understand that you took offense to this. But, there has been some serious criticism (both by fans, and the media) of the way this season has been really really plot heavy. What @weencounterednowildbeasts has done here is inject some levity into the situation. She isn’t asking anyone to believe it. She is having some fun with some legitimate and prevalent complaints. Do I think that this is actually what happened in the production offices? No. But, you know what? I am relaxed enough to see the humour in it and the intent with which it was posted. Don’t yuck on her yum.
And I understand that satire is taking a view and making a caricature of that. Of course nobody thinks it’s that ridiculous. But satire has one foot in beliefs. It still puts for the idea of who fundamentally thinks what if, of course, not to that extreme. That’s what I was disagreeing with. Not trying to yuck on people’s yum, I’m just saying that I think there’s been a lot of this idea of who’s responsible for the things people disagree with, and I’m saying that view could have more balance. I’m saying those views don’t really represent what we know, and often we seem to forget that as a fandom. I mean no disrespect to her or anyone, but I disagree with this view of the situation. Just because many people agree doesn’t make my perspective invalid or out of proportion.
