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@annarcho-nicolesmith
Look at this warehouse full of books.
Somewhere between half a million and two million books here. It's not a free library for the community. It's not a donation scheme for undeserved children. It's not even a stockroom for an online bookseller.
It's where Anthropic got their training data for their "AI" chat bot. And these books are all gone. Anthropic tore up these books to scan them better and then threw them away afterwards.
All for a service no one needs and fewer people want. All so that your boss can send you even lengthier, more meandering emails. So companies can generate more even copy, infesting our world with even more advertising. So that customer service workers can get fired and replaced by a chat bot that will never remove a fee the way a human could.
2 million books in the trash so that a tech company could sell the skill of reading and writing back to a subliterate population.
They don't like that you can read, that you can write, that you can form your own ideas, that you can synthesize different pieces of information. They would burn every last book to make you dependent on chat-gpt or "claude." And when I encounter the person who defends their support of these services as "helpful" or "efficient" I just have to laugh because they really have no conception of what they're underwriting. Perhaps the scale of 2 million pulped books can represent it.
âOpenAI fired the starting gun that led to the rampant piracy by AI companies and the strip-mining of all of humanityâs expression,â
said Justin A. Nelson, an attorney at Susman Godfrey LLP who is representing book authors in both the OpenAI and Anthropic cases.
Look at this warehouse full of books.
Somewhere between half a million and two million books here. It's not a free library for the community. It's not a donation scheme for undeserved children. It's not even a stockroom for an online bookseller.
It's where Anthropic got their training data for their "AI" chat bot. And these books are all gone. Anthropic tore up these books to scan them better and then threw them away afterwards.
All for a service no one needs and fewer people want. All so that your boss can send you even lengthier, more meandering emails. So companies can generate more even copy, infesting our world with even more advertising. So that customer service workers can get fired and replaced by a chat bot that will never remove a fee the way a human could.
2 million books in the trash so that a tech company could sell the skill of reading and writing back to a subliterate population.
They don't like that you can read, that you can write, that you can form your own ideas, that you can synthesize different pieces of information. They would burn every last book to make you dependent on chat-gpt or "claude." And when I encounter the person who defends their support of these services as "helpful" or "efficient" I just have to laugh because they really have no conception of what they're underwriting. Perhaps the scale of 2 million pulped books can represent it.
Let's take a look at that "neutrality"
reading shit from people who live in cities and take designer brands seriously makes my head implode. u live in a fortress of privilege where you can apparently get by, nay, succeed on being totally vapid and the rest of the world toils to prop up your entire existence, all so you can signal that you have only the best taste in the most useless of things
actual vampires bro
I h8 the dumb old "tech ain't bad it's a tool it's how it's used and who is using it". It's not only not true but is also just TIRED
These systems have power dynamics based in them and their application and growth are beyond anyone's control. I'm sure whenever the phone was invented no one was immediately like "damn the surveillence nightmare this gon be".
The thing I always look at (as a very tech-informed, formerly pro-tech person) is that even if you want to claim that tech is "neutral" in application, its dependencies are not neutral. The mining of rare earth minerals is not neutral in its affect on the ecosystem (obviously including the humans involved, for those who want to excessively emphasize that). The fossil fuels that go into the construction of tech is not neutral. The global distribution network required is not neutral. The irreversible sand shortage we are facing as a result of all this is not neutral. These are just some examples.
And yes, we can "do it better". I'm not just looking at the worst case scenario, because everyone knows that's bad and thinks we can do better. We can mine a little better, or use "greener" energy. But if you look at the best case scenario, all of the above issues are still incredibly relevant. There is no "green" mining or energy, it's a scam. The best case scenario still leads to ecocide. The best case scenario for keeping tech alive still relies on deadly exploitation. Doing technological civilization "better" is like putting a bandage on someone who was shot instead of simply not shooting in the first place.
Technology, as it applies to our current industrial framework and its dependencies, is very far from neutral.
Very funny to me that DSA / jacobin / verso book brigade and various other toothless mainstream leftists are trying to "sound the alarm" on mineral extraction, an issue anarchists, specifically green / anticiv / anprim / nihilist anarchist have been writing about for years for free on anarchist library dot org.
Ten years ago we were getting called "crazy" "anti-worker" "anti-progress" by these same people for critiquing extractivism, for opposing mining, for opposing "green energy." Now they're cashing in on climate anxiety and frankly, gentrifying anarchist positions against extraction by repositioning these critiques from a democratic socialist perspective, removing the radical anti-civ roots from which these ideas were born.
I have to say a book that is questioning the logic of electric cars in 2025 is too little, too late. I think that if in 2015 you were too caught up in Bernieism to understand that we're not going to techno-solutionism our way out of a toxic planet I really dont give a fuck about what you have to say in 2025.
Look, while youâre correct that mineral extraction is problematic (itâs a finite resource, it is an incentive for war and for exploiting poorer countries, the extraction process often involves slavery or other unethical practices, it generates pollution), youâre always going to be dismissed if you argue from anticivilization or anarchoprimitivist ideology. These ideologies romanticize an imaginary time before civilization where everything was supposedly better and everyone was supposedly happier (without running water or plumbing, without refrigeration, when the child mortality rate was about 50%, without modern medicine, without contraception, when it was common to die in childbirth). These ideologies are also inherently eugenicist, which should be enough to denounce anticiv and anprim on its own.
Most people are not suicidal and do not have so much antipathy for the human race that they advocate for our destruction for the benefit of the rest of Earthâs species. I imagine that those that do, are anprims and anticivs.
Oh wow green anarchism getting called "eugenics" what is it?, a day that ends in "y"?
As far as I'm aware the societies that actually carried out eugenics programs on a mass scale were capitalist and fascist, and not done by subset of fringe philosophers critiquing extractivism. Maybe try to keep that label historically accurate.
"Most people are not suicidal and don't advocate for the mass extinction of the human race" funny since that's the plan that every Fortune 500 CEO and G8 country currently has us on, and the only real critique of this economy isn't coming from the DSA brigade that worships at the alter at unionism, it's from the green anarchist milieu that explicitly centers the environment at the heart of its politics.
The dsa verso book industrial complex captures so much mass unrest and redirects to things, that frankly, don't mean shit on a planet where crop failure is becoming a regular occurrence. That was my point, idk why you think it's fair or accurate to accuse anyone of eugenics. Well the earth's heating up and time's running out, hope this is a good use of your time.
I canât see green anarchism as anything other than a eugenicist ideology. Eugenics is not one of its *goals*, but it will do eugenics as a side-effect, where disabled/chronically ill people are collateral damage. You canât get rid of modern medicine and sanitation without applying âsurvival of the fittestâ to people. Youâd be signing the death warrant for diabetics, asthmatics, people with severe allergies, and other common conditions. Most people with mental health conditions wonât just *get better* if capitalism were to suddenly end; if they could no longer access their medications, theyâd likely self-medicate with alcohol or drugs, or kill themselves, or at least be miserable. Youâd also be harming people with non-lethal disabilities, like being deaf/HoH or low vision/visually impaired, because hearing aids and eyeglasses donât grow on trees. Many of these disabilities are genetic/inherited.
Getting rid of modern medicine and sanitation will genetically select for people who can/are more likely to survive without them, thatâs why itâs eugenics. Itâs not about *intentions*, itâs about *cause and effect*.
Also, I never said that capitalists had our best interests at heart. What theyâre doing is also eugenics, both because they are making the world less habitable (especially in places that *just happen* to be populated with black and brown people) and because the elimination of social programs/safety nets harms and kills disabled people.
Also, historically, capitalists and fascists have been the ones to carry out eugenics programs because capitalists and fascists (influenced by capitalist and fascist âphilosophersâ) were in power at the time. If green anarchists had the same amount of power, they would be doing the eugenics.
We donât need to have capitalism to keep disabled people alive. In fact, capitalism often harms disabled people. It prices people out of treatment/cures (especially since disabled people tend to be poorer), especially in poorer countries. It treats disabled people who need caregivers, especially the elderly, as cash cows. It makes âdeath with dignityâ/elective euthanasia for hospice patients impossible to be ethical, because depending on how expensive you are to keep alive, you will be pressured to choose euthanasia if your needs are expensive and hospice care if the hospice can make more money off of you.
What we need is a system that preserves our modern practice of medicine (or improves it!) without being exploitative of people or the environment. Capitalism is not the answer, and neither is anarchism. Most people would suggest socialism or communism. Most medical innovations are already publicly funded/subsidized anyway.
In any case, even if green anarchism was the best answer and even if eugenics against disabled people was okay, nobody is going to choose that because everybody knows somebody who would die almost immediately under green anarchism, and many more who would suffer greatly. For me, my diabetic uncle and cousin would die, my cousinâs daughter would die the next time she gets stung by a bee, my grandpa would die from kidney failure, my dad would be nearly deaf, my mother and I would slowly go blind from the progression of astigmatism (which progresses more rapidly if you donât wear glasses or if your prescription is too weak), my aunt would die once her current pacemaker runs out of batteries, and my other uncle would suffer and potentially die without his seizure medication. And so, so many women I know would die in childbirth.
We donât throw disabled people under the bus.
I for real don't know what you're talking about. You've written an elaborate fantasy where some anticiv anarchist is going to take your glasses.
Most anticiv thinkers acknowledge that industrial and agricultural collapse is going to happen anyway because we've over extended the earth's capacity (it's already happened, depending where you live.) They generally advocate some kind of degrowth - a gradual return to pre-industrial life. There's also a lot of effort spent protecting and rewilding nature. I would say many anticiv critiques come from wanting to avoid the mass death that's going to happen once this planet's water runs dry.
Small point, but you can't just appeal to all the "benefits" of civilization without acknowledging the bad. In the civilized world people die from heart disease, cancer and neurological disorers caused by pollution, chronic high blood pressure and inflammation, suicide from despair; these are virtually unheard of mortality causes among primitive people (not to mention how much more spiritually fulfilled primitive people are!) Considering the how colonized people are "civilized" by their oppressors, I'd say it's chauvinism to assume civilized life is inherently superior to primitive life ways.
Idk if you've looked around, but not only does civilization disable people on the regular (car and mechanical accidents, chemical pollutants, plagues) it's also not doing a great job of caring for disabled people either. I would suggest looking into the history of the asylum on that one.
With respect, you're just not aware of what you're arguing against. I understand there's some big tumblr blogs that get their follower count up by dunking on anarchists, and I really have no interest in furthering that kind of exchange. You can always check out "anticiv" on the anarchist library if you want.
A genuine question: Why do you believe that âprimitiveâ people are happier or âmore spiritualâ? Because it sounds like youâre just invoking the âNoble Savageâ stereotype.
Iâd say that people in the âcivilizedâ (I do take issue with the âprimitiveâ/âcivilizedâ dichotomy, but Iâm using your terms for clarity) world have more cancer and heart disease because they live long enough for those diseases to be a problem, though pollutants and diet do exacerbate any predisposition towards all the diseases you mentioned. Itâs the survivorship bias problem.
And I know the history of asylums. We still have them. Involuntary incarceration for being sick or just unusual is terrible. Modern society is ableist. So was ancient society (it varies, sometimes people who were mentally different were religious leaders and sometimes they were called âchangelingsâ or âdemonsâ or something else and killed). At least in modern society, youâre much more likely to die of old age.
(At this point, I donât think Iâll convince you, or youâll convince me, I just want to understand *why* you think this way. For the record, I am anti-capitalist, for many reasons including environmental, but I think humanityâs best days are ahead of us, not behind us.
You can only ask these questions if you have a complete and total ignorance of all the primitive peoples who have been violently forced to assimilate into civilization.
Why do the Sami people oppose new railroads? Why do Aboriginal people protest new mining projects? Why do indigenous Brazilians try to stop hydro electric dams? Why do Hawaiians oppose tourism and having telescopes on their mountains? What about the entire history of Indian schools in the Americas?
Do you really just never take the time to listen to all the people pushing back against the civilized world, fighting for their land and their ways of life? There's people who see civilization, how empty and violent it is, and want nothing to do with it. And you have the audacity to call the struggle of real, living people "the myth of the noble savage."
It's actually not relevant because longevity is not an indicator of a high quality of life but plenty of hunter gathers such as the Hadza make it to 70.
Why don't you humble yourself and try learning about the world around you instead of radiating smug ignorance whilst expecting to be spoon-fed information after calling a philosophy you know nothing about "eugenics". Big fucking whoop you're anti-capitalist, so is anyone with half a brain.
HOW is this real like HOW does this goateed dork making automated weapons have this Philip K Dick ass name. like an almost identical name to a character who's a billionaire industrialist with metal teeth and eyes who helps an alien race take over earth by getting everyone addicted to super-LSD. how is this real. are we all living in PKD's drug induced coma?
Very funny to me that DSA / jacobin / verso book brigade and various other toothless mainstream leftists are trying to "sound the alarm" on mineral extraction, an issue anarchists, specifically green / anticiv / anprim / nihilist anarchist have been writing about for years for free on anarchist library dot org.
Ten years ago we were getting called "crazy" "anti-worker" "anti-progress" by these same people for critiquing extractivism, for opposing mining, for opposing "green energy." Now they're cashing in on climate anxiety and frankly, gentrifying anarchist positions against extraction by repositioning these critiques from a democratic socialist perspective, removing the radical anti-civ roots from which these ideas were born.
I have to say a book that is questioning the logic of electric cars in 2025 is too little, too late. I think that if in 2015 you were too caught up in Bernieism to understand that we're not going to techno-solutionism our way out of a toxic planet I really dont give a fuck about what you have to say in 2025.
Look, while youâre correct that mineral extraction is problematic (itâs a finite resource, it is an incentive for war and for exploiting poorer countries, the extraction process often involves slavery or other unethical practices, it generates pollution), youâre always going to be dismissed if you argue from anticivilization or anarchoprimitivist ideology. These ideologies romanticize an imaginary time before civilization where everything was supposedly better and everyone was supposedly happier (without running water or plumbing, without refrigeration, when the child mortality rate was about 50%, without modern medicine, without contraception, when it was common to die in childbirth). These ideologies are also inherently eugenicist, which should be enough to denounce anticiv and anprim on its own.
Most people are not suicidal and do not have so much antipathy for the human race that they advocate for our destruction for the benefit of the rest of Earthâs species. I imagine that those that do, are anprims and anticivs.
Oh wow green anarchism getting called "eugenics" what is it?, a day that ends in "y"?
As far as I'm aware the societies that actually carried out eugenics programs on a mass scale were capitalist and fascist, and not done by subset of fringe philosophers critiquing extractivism. Maybe try to keep that label historically accurate.
"Most people are not suicidal and don't advocate for the mass extinction of the human race" funny since that's the plan that every Fortune 500 CEO and G8 country currently has us on, and the only real critique of this economy isn't coming from the DSA brigade that worships at the alter at unionism, it's from the green anarchist milieu that explicitly centers the environment at the heart of its politics.
The dsa verso book industrial complex captures so much mass unrest and redirects to things, that frankly, don't mean shit on a planet where crop failure is becoming a regular occurrence. That was my point, idk why you think it's fair or accurate to accuse anyone of eugenics. Well the earth's heating up and time's running out, hope this is a good use of your time.
I canât see green anarchism as anything other than a eugenicist ideology. Eugenics is not one of its *goals*, but it will do eugenics as a side-effect, where disabled/chronically ill people are collateral damage. You canât get rid of modern medicine and sanitation without applying âsurvival of the fittestâ to people. Youâd be signing the death warrant for diabetics, asthmatics, people with severe allergies, and other common conditions. Most people with mental health conditions wonât just *get better* if capitalism were to suddenly end; if they could no longer access their medications, theyâd likely self-medicate with alcohol or drugs, or kill themselves, or at least be miserable. Youâd also be harming people with non-lethal disabilities, like being deaf/HoH or low vision/visually impaired, because hearing aids and eyeglasses donât grow on trees. Many of these disabilities are genetic/inherited.
Getting rid of modern medicine and sanitation will genetically select for people who can/are more likely to survive without them, thatâs why itâs eugenics. Itâs not about *intentions*, itâs about *cause and effect*.
Also, I never said that capitalists had our best interests at heart. What theyâre doing is also eugenics, both because they are making the world less habitable (especially in places that *just happen* to be populated with black and brown people) and because the elimination of social programs/safety nets harms and kills disabled people.
Also, historically, capitalists and fascists have been the ones to carry out eugenics programs because capitalists and fascists (influenced by capitalist and fascist âphilosophersâ) were in power at the time. If green anarchists had the same amount of power, they would be doing the eugenics.
We donât need to have capitalism to keep disabled people alive. In fact, capitalism often harms disabled people. It prices people out of treatment/cures (especially since disabled people tend to be poorer), especially in poorer countries. It treats disabled people who need caregivers, especially the elderly, as cash cows. It makes âdeath with dignityâ/elective euthanasia for hospice patients impossible to be ethical, because depending on how expensive you are to keep alive, you will be pressured to choose euthanasia if your needs are expensive and hospice care if the hospice can make more money off of you.
What we need is a system that preserves our modern practice of medicine (or improves it!) without being exploitative of people or the environment. Capitalism is not the answer, and neither is anarchism. Most people would suggest socialism or communism. Most medical innovations are already publicly funded/subsidized anyway.
In any case, even if green anarchism was the best answer and even if eugenics against disabled people was okay, nobody is going to choose that because everybody knows somebody who would die almost immediately under green anarchism, and many more who would suffer greatly. For me, my diabetic uncle and cousin would die, my cousinâs daughter would die the next time she gets stung by a bee, my grandpa would die from kidney failure, my dad would be nearly deaf, my mother and I would slowly go blind from the progression of astigmatism (which progresses more rapidly if you donât wear glasses or if your prescription is too weak), my aunt would die once her current pacemaker runs out of batteries, and my other uncle would suffer and potentially die without his seizure medication. And so, so many women I know would die in childbirth.
We donât throw disabled people under the bus.
I for real don't know what you're talking about. You've written an elaborate fantasy where some anticiv anarchist is going to take your glasses.
Most anticiv thinkers acknowledge that industrial and agricultural collapse is going to happen anyway because we've over extended the earth's capacity (it's already happened, depending where you live.) They generally advocate some kind of degrowth - a gradual return to pre-industrial life. There's also a lot of effort spent protecting and rewilding nature. I would say many anticiv critiques come from wanting to avoid the mass death that's going to happen once this planet's water runs dry.
Small point, but you can't just appeal to all the "benefits" of civilization without acknowledging the bad. In the civilized world people die from heart disease, cancer and neurological disorers caused by pollution, chronic high blood pressure and inflammation, suicide from despair; these are virtually unheard of mortality causes among primitive people (not to mention how much more spiritually fulfilled primitive people are!) Considering the how colonized people are "civilized" by their oppressors, I'd say it's chauvinism to assume civilized life is inherently superior to primitive life ways.
Idk if you've looked around, but not only does civilization disable people on the regular (car and mechanical accidents, chemical pollutants, plagues) it's also not doing a great job of caring for disabled people either. I would suggest looking into the history of the asylum on that one.
With respect, you're just not aware of what you're arguing against. I understand there's some big tumblr blogs that get their follower count up by dunking on anarchists, and I really have no interest in furthering that kind of exchange. You can always check out "anticiv" on the anarchist library if you want.
Honestly it's astounding to be in the midst of summers that kill more and more people (in the global north no less), crop failures, a potential zoonotic plague and still be mad at green anarchism. At the beginning of the year rich beloved celebrities watched their mansions burn down due to an unstoppable fire. How much worse does it have to get for liberals and leftists to admit that we need to fundamentally reorient our relationship to the planet? I'm sorry guys idk I guess I'm "ecofash" for not just embracing nuclear energy and trying to keep capitalism on life support. How very reactionary of me for questioning the inherent supremacy of machinery.
Very funny to me that DSA / jacobin / verso book brigade and various other toothless mainstream leftists are trying to "sound the alarm" on mineral extraction, an issue anarchists, specifically green / anticiv / anprim / nihilist anarchist have been writing about for years for free on anarchist library dot org.
Ten years ago we were getting called "crazy" "anti-worker" "anti-progress" by these same people for critiquing extractivism, for opposing mining, for opposing "green energy." Now they're cashing in on climate anxiety and frankly, gentrifying anarchist positions against extraction by repositioning these critiques from a democratic socialist perspective, removing the radical anti-civ roots from which these ideas were born.
I have to say a book that is questioning the logic of electric cars in 2025 is too little, too late. I think that if in 2015 you were too caught up in Bernieism to understand that we're not going to techno-solutionism our way out of a toxic planet I really dont give a fuck about what you have to say in 2025.
Look, while youâre correct that mineral extraction is problematic (itâs a finite resource, it is an incentive for war and for exploiting poorer countries, the extraction process often involves slavery or other unethical practices, it generates pollution), youâre always going to be dismissed if you argue from anticivilization or anarchoprimitivist ideology. These ideologies romanticize an imaginary time before civilization where everything was supposedly better and everyone was supposedly happier (without running water or plumbing, without refrigeration, when the child mortality rate was about 50%, without modern medicine, without contraception, when it was common to die in childbirth). These ideologies are also inherently eugenicist, which should be enough to denounce anticiv and anprim on its own.
Most people are not suicidal and do not have so much antipathy for the human race that they advocate for our destruction for the benefit of the rest of Earthâs species. I imagine that those that do, are anprims and anticivs.
Oh wow green anarchism getting called "eugenics" what is it?, a day that ends in "y"?
As far as I'm aware the societies that actually carried out eugenics programs on a mass scale were capitalist and fascist, and not done by subset of fringe philosophers critiquing extractivism. Maybe try to keep that label historically accurate.
"Most people are not suicidal and don't advocate for the mass extinction of the human race" funny since that's the plan that every Fortune 500 CEO and G8 country currently has us on, and the only real critique of this economy isn't coming from the DSA brigade that worships at the alter at unionism, it's from the green anarchist milieu that explicitly centers the environment at the heart of its politics.
The dsa verso book industrial complex captures so much mass unrest and redirects to things, that frankly, don't mean shit on a planet where crop failure is becoming a regular occurrence. That was my point, idk why you think it's fair or accurate to accuse anyone of eugenics. Well the earth's heating up and time's running out, hope this is a good use of your time.
Silicon Valley's Fish Killing Machine
There's a tech company called "Shinkei Systems" that created an "AI powered fish killing machine" (they're using an automated machine to do ike jime, a traditional Japanese slaughter technique where a fish is killed instantly via a knife to the brain). Here's a picture of their machine:
Isn't that metal box such a great way for a living creature to die? Shinkei systems claims this automated death machine is "more humane" than error prone humans, who of course, sometimes miss the mark when severing a fish's brain from its spinal cord.
If the idea of automated animal slaughter doesn't freak you out enough, take a look at their promotional material where they promise to "eliminate 85% of the workforce" wherever their machine is used.
And just to wrap this story up in a bow, the founder is a guy named Saif Khawaja who retweets a lot about "DNA based IQ testing" and other race-science nonsense:
So yeah....a tech company run by a race obsessed skull-measurer decided the most pressing issue facing the world was not enough cheap sushi-grade salmon. The solution, of course, isn't to allow the ocean's depleted fisheries to regain their natural levels by reducing commercial fishing, it's to make a robot that can kill fish in a fancy Japanese way so people who eat industrialy farmed animals can feel less bad about it. And why not put a bunch of fishermen out of work while you're at it? The solution to our ever alienated world is clearly removing any human contact in the food supply and ceding that role to a machine. Clearly, the faster we can kill animals the better; perhaps we can kill them quickly before any concerns about the rapid destruction of the earth's aquatic ecosystems arise out of our collective haunted consciousness.
The whole world is sick and there is no financial incentive to heal it.
the future is nothing but an ideological justification for the present