#e.o asks

[rahleeyah]

i've never read a long eo fic of yours but i would like to. which do you suggest starting with?

oh this is a great question! unfortunately my answer is going to be kind of a cop out -

it really depends on what you're into! there's a lot of different flavors and perspectives in my longfics, and I don't know your personal preferences. So I'm gonna make a few recommendations. My real answer is: pick whichever one sounds most interesting to you!

Instinct - read this one first if you're into stories that use sex to explore emotional expression

Hearts on Fire - read this one first if you want domestic married EO having babies and overcoming obstacles together

Into the Great Wide Open - read this one first if you want EO reunion + minor infidelity + lots of tension and cliffhanger chapters

I'll Crawl Home to Her - read this one first if you're interested in parallel universes

[rahleeyah]

There's a post going around on the bird app of Liv and David and I realized once again how tactile Liv is. And that's something fics don't really touch on. I think Elliot's mind is gonna be blown once he and Liv are finally together because she nuzzles and snuggles and is basically a cat in human form. She's constantly going to rub up against him.

No exactly!!!! She's so cuddly. Thinking about s15, her using any and every opportunity to slide herself under Brian's arm, even in public. Kissing Tucker's hands. And she and Elliot spent so long refusing to touch each other; she's going to be so hungry for him and he is going to love it

[rahleeyah]

What are your thoughts about Elliot Stabler consistently being labelled as 'toxic' for Olivia Benson? Despite all their differences, I always have found him to be very caring and respectful towards her.

Well my first thought is who is saying this consistently? Anyone who calls Elliot - not the EO relationship, not them together, but Elliot specifically - toxic is not someone whose opinion I value, really. That's not someone who sees him, who can actually recall his on screen actions or his words. That's someone who has an idea of who he is that is separate from what we actually know about him and like. Sure that's frustrating but we can't change everybody's mind and we'll go crazy trying. So like. Let em be wrong, you know.

Yes, Elliot was good for Liv. He looked after her. Sure she didn't advance in the job, didn't have a stable long term romantic relationship while they were partners, but to pin the blame for that on Elliot is reductionist and frankly a lil immature. Liv didn't have those things bc she didn't want them; she had what she wanted already. Elliot never stopped her from going for Sergeant; she never gave any indication that she wanted to! And for all that we talk about jelliot, the only time we actually see him give any of her boyfriends shit is Porter, who he already disliked for reasons unrelated to Porter fucking Liv, and we never saw him say anything negative to Liv about the men she was with. Hell, even Kurt, he goes to see Kurt bc he wants Kurt to help Olivia, and he is not unkind or violent or loud or anything toxic during that interaction.

It's back to Huang's classic question: how does she make you do anything? Huang helps Elliot realize Liv wasn't making him do anything; Elliot was making his own choices bc he cared for her. Olivia made her own choices bc she cared for him. Not seeing that, blaming Elliot for that, is a denial of Liv's agency over her own life.

Did they fight? Sure!! But for every sharp word he ever said to her she threw her own right back; he wasn't victimizing her. They were equals!! And equally complicit!

Now if you want to call their relationship toxic, sure, I've done that myself - half joking, but only half. It's toxic in the way they shut everyone else out, lie for each other, break the law for each other. Toxic in the way that if this was real life you probably wouldn't want to be friends with them bc my God, the drama. But it is not toxic in the sense that they hurt each other.

I think it boils down to the fact that people have an idea of Elliot, an idea they don't like, and in this current media climate standard practice is to moralize our preferences. If I don't like this thing it must be morally wrong. I am good and pure and right, and anything I don't like is evil and fucked up and wrong. It removes nuance from the conversation. It's not serious commentary.

[rahleeyah]

I’m curious about how you’re feeling about OC episode 2 now that it’s three weeks out. Because there are people who are so annoyed by it after waiting 700 days for EO to reunite and that there was no movement to their relationship. That they wanted EO to have meaningful conversations or just momentum.

I think there was movement to their relationship 🤷🏼‍♀️ like for real I just watched it for the second time this weekend, and I still think it was fantastic - it was entertaining, and eo were on their A game. Elliot gets hurt and Liv is there with no hesitation, jumping straight into crazy shit with him and touching his face. Just before that he's the one she calls when someone threatens Noah; he's the one who comes for her. There's a comfort, an ease, a certainty between them now that wasn't there before Ohio; that's momentum to me.

I think what you mean is people wanted there to be a kiss or some spelled out declaration of feelings or some confirmation they were fucking, which is different from conversations and momentum; it's confirmation. And I don't think we're gonna get that any time soon.

And I'm kind of ok with that.

On a character level, big emotional fraught conversations isn't who they are. We can point to a handful throughout the first 12 years. A handful, 4-5 at most (the hospital, the steps, throw in "it's too complicated" and "you do it cause you have to" if you like, etc) across twelve years. Words is not their medium. It never has been. They're action people. What they do is what matters. And what did they do? Showed up for each other, without hesitation. Without the doubt that's been keeping them apart. She's not ignoring his calls anymore; she's there. And so is he.

On a practical level. We are not gonna get the things we talk about. A Lewis convo, the bottle episode of my dreams, several seasons of them dating. The show has built itself on the possibility; I am coming to believe more and more that the possibility will only ever come at the end. Bc the possibility is what they're selling, not the reality.

And personally I'm fine with that; I'd rather keep getting episodes of them going off on adventures together than see the show handle their relationship poorly. A reveal that they've secretly been sleeping together - which is this show's MO - would be a slap in the face to me. Them being cute and soft at home would be less interesting to me personally than whatever the fuck they've got going on now.

The problem is I think we, fandom as a whole, sometimes get so excited about our ideas for what could be that we start to expect them without grounds. There was no indication that this episode was gonna be anything other than what it was - that it would touch on what EO are to each other, that's what Chris said. And it did.

The support that they are to one another, the way Elliot is going off the rails and Randall incorrectly blames that on him trying to make his father proud while Liv instinctively understands his real reasons for doing it - and shares those motivations, and helps him - speaks to the depth of their connection. The fact that they're in this now, not separate from one another but with one another, helping one another, showing up for one another, that's big.

We want it to be the EO show but it's not. Neither of em. It's the Elliot show and the Olivia (mostly) show. So Elliot's show is gonna be about him, and SVU is gonna be what it's been since s13 - Liv heavy, but still doing character work only fleetingly. Whole seasons of 1.0 passed with only one or two major EO™ moments; we remember those moments so well we sometimes forget how much time passed in between them.

The hot dog cart only sells hot dogs. It has always only sold hot dogs. How can we be mad when we go to the hot dog cart and find out we can't get a burger?

This is not to say like. No one should have hope and eo is never gonna happen; I think it will, eventually. But I think when it happens it won't look like what we expect. And I think that in the meantime, what fandom creates, the beautiful universes we draw in our heads, the conversations we have and the connections we make, are fed by episodes like this one. That give us just enough to keep us inspired, to keep the creativity flowing, to keep us dreaming. Sometimes I prefer to dream, to tell my own story. Isn't it better to dream, sometimes, than to have someone come and say no you're wrong this is how it happens? To have hundreds of versions of the story, instead of just one?

Anyway. I liked the episode a lot lol

[rahleeyah]

What are your thoughts about the "wake up, come back" speech given by Liv to Carisi in the latest episode. I could see she is worried about him but wasn't it insensitive? Is it a version of "get over it" or is she just missing her friend and it's an emotional outburst as a result of that? I always find your takes on Liv's behaviour and character motivation most refreshing, so would love to hear what you think?

I didn't watch the episode 🫣 but I did hear about this moment. It's a very insensitive thing to say but I kind of love Liv being insensitive to him. She shouldn't always say exactly the right thing - that's boring and inhuman. How exhausting to watch a character be perfect all the time. Who wants that? Not me. I want my characters messy and imperfect and interesting.

But I particularly like Liv being insensitive to him in this moment.

Liv who might be looking at him thinking he didn't even get hurt. Liv who might be looking at him thinking this fucking guy has no idea how lucky he is. Bc this guy, who has been through a trauma so like Liv in the townhouse (minus, of course, the threat of sexual violence to his own person, the slow tearing of clothing, the bloodying of his face, the physical vulnerability at the moment the shots rang out; not to turn it into a competition but if Liv did choose to make this a competition she's winning) this guy is safe, physically unharmed, and has the kind of emotional support system Liv could only dream about. He has the family she does dream about, and does not have. People are taking care of him. People are offering him aid and comfort. What did she get, post townhouse?

And what did she allow herself?

Seems to me that wake up is the kind of thing Liv would've been saying to herself a lot. Liv blames herself for Lewis, bc she froze and didn't shoot him, Liv holds herself to a higher standard, doesn't allow herself the luxury of healing the way she would a victim; what if she looks at Carisi, who was a cop just like her, who wasn't the one who got raped in that bodega, who got out of that situation physically unharmed, and thinks this guy oughta snap out of it. Thinks that he, like her, by virtue of having been a police officer, doesn't get the luxury of wallowing - I use that word bc I think that's the perspective she'd have on it, not bc I do - of wallowing in his feelings over this matter. What did she do post townhouse? She missed a lot of sleep and drank too much and stared at Noah all night long, and she also didn't let anyone see that happening until Tucker intervened on the booze. Through all her suffering she has tried to keep her suffering from rubbing off on other people. So what does she feel when she sees someone who isn't, maybe can't do that? Doesn't it make sense for her to feel the tiniest bit of contempt?

Post Lewis Liv was waspish and taking her feelings out on the victims, but she was told to pull her head in and she did, stepped back from her personal spiral and contained her emotional hurricane so that it wasn't blowing other people over anymore (even as it very much was still ripping her to shreds internally) and now she's telling that to Carisi who didn't even get drugged or burned or break a bone or anything, so I can understand her words having a little edge to them.

There is a possibility that the writers thought it was actually a useful thing to say. Maybe it is, I don't know. Spite and shame are powerful motivators; maybe saying words that could trigger either of those emotions in Carisi would help him move forward, as unkind as it feels. Probably we're thinking about this harder than they are.

But I find that if I think about this hard enough, I like it for her.

[rahleeyah]

I'm a sucker for a post-Smoked one night stand where Liv got pregnant and had a baby and Elliot only found out about it 10 years later. But can you imagine if he had to find out that she'd gotten pregnant and lost the baby?

I actually love this so much? Yes, of course, obviously, it's devastating, but I think it's an incredible setup for a deep, tender, melancholic character exploration, for both of them.

[rahleeyah]

I am so so intrigued by the alternative universe in which olivia fucks carisi. what are the vibes there (besides deeply unwell in a way that to me is deeply interesting and also hot). what's your vision?

Ah yes, the alternate universe in which Liv fucks Carisi.

So in the actual universe Amanda has picked a job that involves her traveling all the time, constantly away from home, leaving her husband alone with three children, one of whom is an infant, while he is in the midst of a full blown existential crisis about Being A Dad, where he sees danger lurking around every corner and is flipping out about protecting his kids.

All of that is actually happening, but in the alternate universe the characters acknowledge that this is happening. In the alternate universe Carisi admits his wife has abandoned their family after she promised him that she wanted to settle down and keep herself safe for their kids - he admits that he's lonesome and struggling and it's a bad thing that he isn't able to spend any time with his wife. That he spent what a decade pining for this woman and now that he's finally got her they're both miserable. But he's got these kids to take care of and really it was the kids he wanted most; he wanted to have a family he wanted to be a father and now he is and he's coping with his less than ideal circumstances but in the alternate universe he does at least admit that it's not ideal.

In the alternate universe Olivia allows herself to feel hurt by Amanda, instead of swallowing it all down. Amanda who ran away from her - just like Liv knew she would - Amanda who made her husband lie to Liv and hide the pregnancy from her, ducked Liv's calls for no reason other than that she just didn't seem to want to deal with Liv; in the alternate universe Liv lets herself say hey this is all a little fucked up.

In the canon universe and the alternate universe both it has been too long since Liv last saw Elliot and she's got to be wondering if she blew it. Maybe it's for the best that she blew it. She doesn't think she's allowed to have nice things, anyway.

So in the alternate universe, where Carisi and Liv have both the self respect and the self awareness to acknowledge the fuckedupedness of their situation, Carisi calls Liv for help. He's so tired. The baby's barely sleeping. The girls are bored and they miss their mom. Please help, Liv. Save me, Cap.

So Liv comes. Liv helps. Noah plays with Jesse (side bar it has always irked me that the show spells her name Jesse, which is generally accepted as the masculine spelling, instead of Jessie, which is commonly used for girls. Why did they do that) and Billie and they fall asleep. Liv cleans the kitchen, helps Carisi find some balance in the chaos. Nicky (funny, that, he'll think later, how Amanda said she wanted to name their son after Sonny, but somehow managed to name the baby after Amaro, instead) falls asleep, Liv and Carisi fall into the couch with their wine glasses.

At first it's just talking. Carisi cautiously admitting he doesn't like the set up with Amanda's new job but what's he gonna do, you know? Maybe there's a couple of nights, maybe at least once every time Amanda's out of town, where they talk like this. Start getting more and more honest. Both of them admitting that having the thing they always wanted isn't really everything it's cracked up to be.

I think I made a mistake, Carisi says, wondering if maybe he'd have been better off if he walked out of SVU ten years ago and met a nice girl who actually wants to be with him, who doesn't always have one foot out the door.

I think I made a mistake, Liv says, thinking about that night in her kitchen with Elliot, wondering if that was the last chance she's ever gonna get to kiss him. Maybe she should've just done it. Maybe -

They're sad, they're lonesome, they both need something to hold on to. Liv's technically single and Carisi might as well be, he's getting so little time with his wife. They're just sad, really, all the way down to their bones, and it's about comfort, more than anything else. They both just want to hold someone; they both just want to be held. They never speak of it in the daylight. In the daylight they work as well together as they ever have, and never give anything away. At night they cling to each other, whisper secrets in the dark. They don't really want each other; they both know they're just placeholders. Waiting for the ones they love to come back to them. If they ever do.

[rahleeyah]

Do u know who gave Olivia her nickname? For a while I only had Season 6-11 available on Netflix in my country. No season 8 weirdly. Later I saw season 13-18, 22-25.

So everyone was mostly calling her Olivia till season 7. Dunno abt season 8 and then season 9, 10 onward it was a lot of 'Liv'. Season 13 onward, nobody calls her Olivia any more it seems. Dunno if I missed something in season 8 or 12 which I have not seen except bootlegged clips. Why and how did she get that nickname? Did Elliot started calling her tht or it was the name her mom used to use? Are there any theories about it in the fandom?

Elliot calls her Liv for the first time in s1, but in the beginning he doesn't use it very often. For a long time he's essentially the only one who uses it. We hear it occasionally from the rest of the team, Munch & Cragen & Fin, but that's really it. No one outside that core circle uses it in the first half of the series. And then yeah Elliot leaves but by that point he had the rest of their team using it, so as new characters like Amanda and Nick are introduced, they already know Olivia as Liv.

It absolutely looks like Elliot is the one who gave her that nickname. Me & lots of other fic writers have worked this into our stories a lot because it's really interesting; everyone calls her Olivia -> Elliot gives her a nickname -> other people pick up on it and start using it -> Elliot leaves -> it's too late literally everyone calls her Liv now and no one calls her Olivia. Every time someone calls her Liv they're doing it because Elliot did it first.