Seeing how determined the show to hide Misha and not post about him any behind the scenes pics or vids makes me wonder if Misha also wont be in the upcoming last day on set goodbye video this week, only J2. I REALLY hope they arent that stupid. Misha fans would rightfully drag their disrespectful asses for it. This stopped being funny a long time ago.
Yeah, I’m also worried about that. I hope there’s a good explanation for all this secrecy and it is better revealed soon. Because this Misha erasure starts to look like a petty revenge. It’s not a secret that Misha is not treated really well by TPTB. I mean if they can get away with humiliating Misha on SDCC stage after s12 finale, who knows what they say to him when there are no thousands of fans watching?
I am not on Twitter and I have no idea when the last day on set is being filmed, feel free to drop by and tell me more. And yea, Misha’s fans better get ready to be mocked by TPTB, the crew and other fans again. Nothing new, business as usual.
I’ve finally caught up with latest twitter drama llama and my only surprise is that it’s already happening - the discussion about what is enough and where we draw the line. The attacks on people who want more solid confirmation of destiel. I mean, I expected such flame wars after the show’s finale, but there’s still 9 episodes left. Surely there will be more text about destiel if the show really wants it? Why hurry now? Why not sip some tea and tell all nonbelievers to wait and see?/s
The hiatus has barely started and already some folks are dead set to splinter the fandom even more. If anyone is curious, see this twitter thread and check out the video link there. These people were attacking Cas girls for years and called us too emotional, too Cas centric, too illiterate to understand precious subtext and what not. Now, when they have successfully driven many Cas girls out of fandom for good, they are turning against each other. Go figure.
JFC it’s the year 2k19 for crying out loud, Gordon Walker on Supernatural has been dead since 3x07, that’s November 2007. Gordon never even met Cas; there’s so many more white evil dudes who threatened and tortured and maimed Cas on this whiter than white tv show. then why Gordon Walker is still used in some destiel fics as the only possible choice for a rude, homophobic, abusive sexual aggressor?
1/5 Hi, ignore this if you’re not interested in commentary (sorry if it’s rude to send it, new to not just lurking and am trying to figure out when it’s appropriate to say things or whether it’s polite to be on anon or not be on anon, etc. and am actually bad at that kind of thing IRL, too, so yeah, sorry if this is just unacceptable or something), but thanks for the post about Gordon. I’ve seen that in fic and been uncomfortable and then not sure if I’m being oversensitive, because
2/5 he is one of the more interesting/ memorable characters in SPN so I can see why he might be the first villain some people think of, and there’s a sort of caricature-method of writing villains I see in fic which means they become kind of two-dimensional plot devices for convenience. By the same token, though I don’t post fic, I do write it and I have also used him to populate bully groups on a couple of occasions, and given that I have been uncomfortable/ragey, both with this and with
3/5 SPN’s bullshit vis-a-vis POC/women/queer people/etc in general, maybe I should not have done that. Something for me to think about. So. Yeah. Sorry if I offend at all, or if you just wanted to let out spleen in peace, but thank you for making the post. I saw your tag “(and I’m such a chicken shit)” and I appreciate that you posted anyway. Your tag commentary is also always very gratifying to read and I was relieved in the spring when you made that post clearly identifying the fandom policing
4/5 happening to diminuel as exactly what it was, since I didn’t understand how it could be happening in the first place (A+ on your tags then as well). Which isn’t to say you should post things if you’re uncomfortable, because this place is terrifying, but. I appreciated it now as well as then, so thanks for doing it! Sorry for rambling, I don’t expect you to respond, and again, sorry if I should not have commented. And have a very nice day!
5/5 (P.S. thanks for mentioning Bartholomew! I don’t understand why I don’t see him the most. I know it’s just how they wrote/styled him but whenever I see him in gifs or episodes I suddenly feel like I should watch my drink, even though I’m at home in my pajamas)
First of all, thanks for your message! My inbox is open, so it means I welcome asks and any kind of venting, anons included. When it will get too much I will close the box, that’s all.
under cut this goes since it is so long
So, my post about Gordon Walker. This is actually a very old pet peeve of mine - the way how evil and one dimensional Gordon is in destiel fics. I love Gordon as a character and it hurts me to see him reduced to a homophobic sexual aggressor. Which he was not on the show! (Alistair is the one who did unspeakable things to Dean) I could kinda understand when older (canon) fics posted around s4/5 used Gordon as theor go to villain, since he was still fresh in the memory. But now, 12 years after his death on the show to have Gordon as the cartoonish villain in an AU destiel fic is really a questionable choice. SPN is such a white show, there’s plenty of one episode white evil dudes to chose from. There’s plenty of reoccurring white villains like Lucifer, Michael, Metatron, Bartholomew, heck, Crowley is a villain. And I’ve seen them used as villains in fics, so, the choices are abundant.
I really appreciate you saying that even when you like Gordon as a character, you also have depicted him as a bully in your fics. I truly believe that most fic writers who write evil Gordon never intended it to be a racist statement (despite using all angry black male tropes on him). I remember reading a fic with a leery Gordon that was written by a POC author. That’s how pervasive this is. That’s why it is important to name the problem - fandom racism - and then let people to think about it. Feel free to share my post, my goal was to get people thinking.
And let me be clear, evil Gordon trope is racist not because the author used Gordon as a character or even as a villain. It is racist because usually Gordon is the only POC character in the fic and his only role is to be a one dimensional sexual aggressor. I’m stoked when destiel fics have well developed canon POC characters (as few as they are) or even make up their own. There are fics with surly neutral Gordon as well, so, it is possible to have representation without indulging in racist stereotypes. We can’t change the show and their unfortunate tendency to cast non white actors as one episode villains to be killed by white leads. But we can try to make destiel fic more friendly for non white destiel shippers.
The reason why it took me so long to make this post is that I can’t really talk about evil Gordon in destiel fic without drawing attention to said fics. I don’t want to put fic writers in a tough spot because I believe that they didn’t mean harm. But, that’s how everyday racism happens - unintentionally. Last year I read two new fics with evil Gordon and one with evil Victor Heinriksen. I’m sure there’s been more since then. And I don’t know how to draw attention to this problem without starting fandom wank. I made a decision to not to rec such fics on @destielfanfic, but since our reccing has declined in general, this is not a big deal. It’s too little too late. I’ve recced fics with evil Gordon before, they are still on the blog, I’m truly sorry about that. So, I made a post to yell in a void! Thank you for your message, it means I’m not alone ;)
The destiel meta writers are becoming worse than bibros. First they went after destielette and now they are going after Jess (thinking an anon in their inbox is her, just like another one of them thought anon was destielette). They are hell bent on driving away all Cas fans and anyone who do not bow to them. I thought no one would be as caustic and acidic as bibros and here metas are behaving worse. Bibros - Bully every while chnating (AKF), destiel metas - Bully while chanting we are positive.
Oh, nonnie, there’s a lot to unpack here but first things first - Not all destiel meta writers. Writing destiel meta and discussing it with your friends on your blog is a lovely fandom activity and doesn’t make a fan into a bully. The actions are important. I think we all know that you mean a certain group of people who are destiel meta writers and fandom bullies. You can recognize them by their attacks on other fan accounts here and on twitter, you can recognize them by the vitriol and rude language they use in their posts when talking about other parts of destiel fandom. I guess destiel fandom has been dealing with bibros’ attacks for so long that some of their tactics have rubbed off and now this group, this fandom positivity police, is using the same tactics. I gotta say that this was not the usual state of destiel fandom tho. I think it was hiatus after 12x23 when some people in destiel fandom really decided to go after Cas fans. This is also time when pan fandom antis were getting more and more active and you can see the same tactics used by our own positivity police - aggressive language, the need to correct different opinions by going to ppl blogs, attacks on content creators they don’t like (the recent fanartist thing), labeling parts of fandom so it’s easier to vilify and attack them (remember when they were looking for dark Cas stan blogs? before deciding to call us “rabid”). The absolute inability to see different, critical opinions without jumping on them. All this combined with the classic anti behavior of elevating themselves above the rest of fans. The only difference is that in other fandoms antis claim to ship the most pure ship, while in destiel fandom they claim to be “proper” fans because they support the show and Team Free Will, unlike those yucky one character stans. Which, lol, is exactly what bibros used to say to Cas fans. So, this brand of aggressiveness is nothing new to Cas fans. And yes, it is driving folks away. I think we all have noticed that spn/destiel fandom on tumblr is shrinking. There are other reasons to leave fandom than just positivity police, but they certainly can give that final push to Cas fans to walk away. I’ve already lost several mutuals, Cas fans, who left tumblr after dealing with them.
The attack they waged on @destielette1 was absolutely despicable. They were itching for a fight so much that they pretended not to know how anon messages work or that copy/paste exists. Like I said, if you don’t want to see someone’s opinion, scroll by, block, ignore. But if you decide to attack people, then that’s on you, then you are a bully and an anti. The new low these bullies have sunk to is their attacks on ESL fans for grammar mistakes. Like, this is so, so low, I’ve no words. And here’s a kicker. From what I see on my dash, a lot of Cas fans share at least one of these markers - not US american, not white, not native English speaker, and/or live outside of the first world countries. We are already outsiders in some sense in this very us-american fandom. So, when you have these US/UK native English white fans attacking Cas fans for liking Cas and expressing it in sometimes incorrect English, this is beyond pale. And it also shows that they are unable to win any discussion without reverting to personal attacks. And yes, they do it all in the name of positivity and defending the “virtue” of white male SPN writers, which is double ironic. I get such a “I’m not like other girls” please senpai notice me vibe from their posts. As if being “morally superior” and silencing different opinions in fandom spaces somehow will guarantee their desired outcome on SPN.
about that other thing under the cut
So, I had to poke around to see what is happening with Jess, and yeah, they are having a field day with shredding an anon they attribute to her. But that’s where the similarities end. Jess was never a Cas girl. Until that post where she tried to defend her pro destiel clickbitey article by calling destiel shippers delusional, she was one of them. Jess has been here for a really long time and she has done her part in ridiculing Cas fans or other folks with critical opinions about SPN. She was a positivity police herself. I don’t condone any attacks on fans for their opinions, by this is more like piranhas attacking one of their own. Which, again, is a classic anti behavior - you must attack those who disobey the party line in order to keep the others in check.
Unfortunately this is the fandom state we are living in now. When big, popular blogs engage in aggressive, demeaning language and direct attacks on fans, they encourage their followers to do the same. Unless they curb their own behavior and learn to respect diversity of opinions, nothing will change. And to my fellow Cas fans, take care dears. Block them, ignore them, delete their messages. Get out if you need to. Don’t feed the trolls who are getting desperate to be fandom relevant before the show ends.
And to the trolls who snoop around my blog - I ship destiel, my ship is not less valid if it is not canon. I agree that there’s plenty of destiel (and other pairings’) subtext on the show; some of it intentional, some accidental. The subtext is there to string the fans along. I’ve no problem with destiel meta in general. I may disagree with most of it nowadays, but then I just scroll by and ignore it. I don’t got to other people blogs looking for a fight. But I do have problem with folks who attack other fans, be they bibros or positivity police. So, that is my position in all of this.
I just wanted to say thank you. I am so upset by the SPN promo of “you’re dead to me” and all I could find is how this was such a good thing and how it implies Destiel endgame that I was about to lose my mind. Then I found you and I really appreciate you seeing this for what it is. This is a horrible thing and I can’t believe that Dean would actually say this to Cas. No one is saying Dean shouldn’t have his grief. At this point I will not be watching if this is where 15 is going.
Thank you for letting me know you found my post useful! I made it because I was personally upset. I don’t make original posts often, I rather prefer to keep low profile and just enjoy fandom where I can, but well. Some things are harder to ignore than others. The only good thing that has come out of it so far is the amount of posts making fun of it. It’s good to see so many Dean and Cas fans collectively saying f*ck that, this is not Dean talking.
Since they dropped that blasted promo, I’ve been thinking about the phrase itself, the scene with Cas backed into the corner, the finger pointing, and it is hard. I’ve talked to my friends who share my feelings. We are waiting for the episode to air to have full context, but for now I will repeat - that scene was attention grab, possibly it was even written with intent to use it in promo to boost ratings. We are now on episode 18 out of 20. This is peak destiel baiting stretch. SPN does it every year before decidedly anti destiel finale - 10x20, 11x18, 12x19. And I didn’t watch s13, but 13x19 has a deancas conversation in kitchen which iirc was a big deal back then? Something about Dean and Cas actually talking to each other while alone. with only one table between them
I’ve also seen the positive spins on You are dead to me scene, and I understated the need and desire to explain it as a necessary step towards endgame destiel, the darkest point in the relationship, etc. And I just … guys, I remember the same things being said before s10, and s11, and s12, and s13 finales. Cas fans have been told to suck it up for the greater good so many times, and the promised destiel resolution never came. Guys, it’s a feature, not a bug at this point. Remember how many passve aggressive scenes folks brushed away in s13 in the name of destiel-y finale? “Cas is like a talking dog!” was explained as a foreshadowing for Dean to say Yes to Michael to save Cas. And in the end, we were left with many negative moments that were never balanced out by something positive. But god forbid if Cas fans complain about it.
About s15. Well, I actually dread summer hellatus now. There’s a very good chance that fandom will be divided and angry, given that we already have folks going around and attacking fans for not liking the promo. I don’t know what is the thinking behind such attacks tho. Do they really think that suddenly, after being mocked and attacked, upset fans will change their mind? Fall in line with positivity police and start worshiping Dabb and Co? Here’s a very good meta overview of Dabb era. I think it is ironic that OP possibly didn’t mean to make such an in depth post, but, when their episode critical comment was “corrected” with “the right way” to watch the show, they delivered an awesome spn meta.
@anon who sent me ask starting with “ Re: " Because yeah, Misha jokes about them, but he also praises them CONSTANTLY, ... “
I think you are mistaking me with my friend, because I never said that. I think it was on the post I reblogged. There’s a good chance that she has blocked you already, and that's why you are coming to me, but that’s not my problem. I’m not gonna answer it because I don’t watch convention videos, and I’m not interested in picking apart who said what about whom and providing you with links. I’m also trying to do my part in not inflating fandom wank right now. A lot of fans are on the edge as it is, there’s no need to look for additional discourse.
