Fated Rantings: Of Gods and Men
Hey, how ya doin? It's been a while
I haven't made a proper Fate post in a while. I've had smaller things here and there but nothing grand because I simply haven't seen anything new in a while.
I'm waiting on the Fate Extra remake that seems forgotten and I've yet to see Strange Fake because I don't want to spoil it with manga nor do I wish to pay Crunchyroll money.
I'm in a fated dry spell with only random videos and FGO tide me over. u_u....BUT NOT TODAY! Because I'm gonna ramble about my favorite topic in Fate, the gods. (ok second favorite)
Before I do that I must once again (like every post) remind you of Fate's multiversal nature. It began as a light novel with multiple routes and endings. Each of those routes and endings have been animated in some way over the years.
You've even seen original anime stories like Apocrypha and things that are referenced in the novels but depict a different chain of events like Fate Zero. The 4th Grail War Saber mentions in Fate Stay Night and the 4th Grail war you see in Zero are not the same thing.
Just like the Waver Velvet you see in Lord El Melloi isn't the same one you saw in Strange Fake even though both lived through a 4th grail war.
So when you're diving into the Fate Series do keep these things in mind since what I'm about to tell you may not apply to every single Fate timeline.
However, what I'm about to tell you does apply to most of them if not all until something comes along to contradict me.
When discussing the fascinating (and silly) nature of the gods in Fate you can not skip over earths origins since many of them shaped the planet just as the planet gave birth to them for that function.
This beginning was called the "Age of Gods" which lasted an untold amount of time and ended when Gilgamesh turned on the gods when their age and influence was weakest.
Yes, love him or hate him, Gilgamesh's Uruk was the foundation for modern human civilization and history. His arrogance isn't without validity.
Of course, there are other factors to mention as well such as dragons, THE God, the planets will itself, and even aliens. All of these things do actually exist.
The Abrahamic God does exist in Fate although the series never states which of the religions based on him is the "real one". Which is a smart call and one they should always maintain.
I'm also bringing him up here a bit randomly since that's all I know of him in Fate's context. Even the voice Jeanne 'D Arc heard was potentially the counter-force though I don't think anyone likes that statement and I've never seen it brought up again.
BTW: It is also true that the Demiurge also exists within Fate since, like the pagan gods, human faith made it so. It's mentioned rarely so I don't know much beyond seeing it referenced in FGO and in videos.
So with that said I can only make assumptions for you. We know the "center" of the Type-Moon multiverse is "The Root" the source of all that is but whether the root "is" God or its simply the point from which God made creation is just presumptions and theories on my part.
What's relevant to our fun dive into the gods is what comes after the old man upstairs and the root, earth. In a very metaphysical sense earth is the center of creation.
It's not in the literal center of the universe or anything like that but it is at the center of everything in a way. The beings that shape reality live there and even beings of alien origin eventually wind up there.
And that planet has a will of its own. The mages of the modern era refer to it as "Gaia". And what is unique about Gaia isn't that it has a will, technically every planet in the solar system does (that's a headache for later), it's that it's will is divided.
Of course, that is later. In the early days Gaia was in charge and many of the beings that would be labeled gods by humanity were born from it.
Usually with some sort of role or purpose in mind.
One of the earliest beings we know of was actually Ea himself. One of the names (or versions rather) of the creator god in Mesopotamian mythology. The very "sword" Gilgamesh wields (seen in the gif above) was forged and used by Ea to shape the planet.
He was an elemental, perhaps the earliest, and that was his job. Give the earth shape. The nature of earth back then is unknown to anyone but it must've been a fascinating contrast because the materials Ea's sword is forged from no longer exist.
The whole reason Shirou can't trace and copy the sword Ea with his Unlimited Blade Works is because it's made from things his mind can't comprehend. Which is a big statement because both Shirou and Archer can replicate Excalibur, the mightiest weapon on earth...I mean it'll kill them if they do it but they CAN replicate it.
(hell, the whole reason the sword Ea is cylindrical is because the concept of a "sword" didn't exist yet)
But they can't replicate (sword) Ea. That's the type of world earth was when (god) Ea roamed it.
We know not how long Ea did his work but we do know that science and mythology actually align in Fate which is wild to fit together. Ea may have worked millions of years but either way he disappeared when his job was done.
It was at that point that you had newer beings show up such as Tiamat and her husband Abzu. We don't really know what form both took initially but we know their names mean salt water and fresh/rain water respectively so they both likely came to be when the earth began to cool and the gases shift into liquid.
I should also clarify that I do not know how many "primordial gods" appeared nor who came before the other. Thanks to FGO we know there was Ea then Tiamat but it is entirely possible that Ea had other "siblings" of a sort also shaping the planet.
Just like Tiamat may have been just one of several mother goddesses. I'm only listing them in this fashion because we know that Ea preceded Tiamat and that the Mesopotamian myths are the oldest on any record. Both IRL and in-story.
To get back on topic, Tiamat's role was actually to seed life. She considers herself mother to all things roaming the earth and she's not entirely wrong to think it. Her appearance in FGO actually shows us what her authority was, the primordial mud.
Ya know, that dark gunky stuff that comes out of the grail? Tiamat is that personified. She's also so early in the timeline that she predates a concept of "death".
The whole reason I said Ea "disappeared" is because death wasn't a thing back then like it would be fore modern man. I actually have no idea what became of Ea but I presume that, like Tiamat, he was thrown into the Zero Space once he job was done.
And no, just like my FGO post, I’m not explaining Imaginary Number Space. It's a complex as hell thing to even word because it's a plane of existence that doesn't exist. I'd be trying to quantify "nothing" to you.
And you're likely wondering why I'm putting Tiamat and Ea on a pedestal after just recapping earth's history. It's quite simple reader, I'm doing this because I want you to grasp something.
What I just explained to you, these are the things that the "gods" done before they were "gods".
I'm not rambling for the sake of talking, I'm setting up a key factor in what makes a god a "god" in Fate. Because everything in Type-Moon is based on something that was once real.
You see this most in the heroic spirits/servants but this actually applies to even gods. The gods were creatures of another sort before they became gods. They did things only a "god" could do from a humans understanding.
They also roamed the earth for millions of years doing these tasks. The whole reason Quetzalcoatl can summon Pterosaur's is because they were still alive when she first arrived on earth.
While not "gods" these entities were exceedingly old forces of nature born of the planet. They were extensions of Gaia's will.
So what makes these entities gods? Simple, humanity does. Although it's hard to say when, eventually humans do appear on the planet.
And I say "hard to say" because the metaphysical and physical were the same in the Age of Gods. Meaning both mythology and science were based on a long forgotten truth.
That's also why I cut the Tiamat recap short. We know she was put into Zero Space after her role but the whole mythology of her, her husband Abzu, and Marduk killing her was made by humans. Whether they wished to understand the world around them or simply to enjoy a good story.
I can't remember if Tiamat actually killed her husband in Fate but her death was at least false. For one, she can't die and second she was too powerful for anything other than the earth itself to put her away.
Of course, you do see Marduk's axe in FGO so it's possible he "killed" her in the sense that she was sent to the Zero Space but you get the idea. The truth of that past and the mythology humans made around it can differ.
Everything in Fate is based on a real thing but not every story surrounding said thing is true.
Back to mankind, the belief in something can elevate it. What makes something a god in Type-Moon is the faith placed into it. It really is that simple.
Humanity believed Ea was a creator god so he took on a divine nature. Humanity believed Tiamat was a mother goddess who gave birth to other gods and so she was and so too did her children become divine.
Humans also believed Tiamat was or could turn into a dragon and so she did when revived as a beast of humanity in FGO.
It doesn't end there either. Men who gained godly status, elementals, spirits, every fairies, all of these things were made into gods because of humanity.
It's not a quick change nor is it an easy one. It takes thousands of years of religious growth and cultural evolution but eventually the object of their worship will become divine.
And more often than not the gods born of that religion are bound to the mythology humans painted for them.
A facet of human collective consciousness I touched on when talking about how myths alter Heroic Spirits/Servants. (linked here)
The biggest underlying and overt theme of anything Type-Moon is humanity. That's why you usually see an average man or a human with a unique power overcoming some monstrous enemy. It's all about the strength of humanity.
But that too is a topic for another day. What's important here is that you fully grasp just how much this opens up on the Fate universe.
So many things exist just because humans believe in it and the impact it has on the object they've focusing on can vary wildly.
Such as Medusa and her siblings. She was originally just a minor earth goddess of beauty but was shaped into her older self because humans crafted an idol of ultimate beauty and then the myth of the gorgons warped her into a serpent.
Medusa had to experience this in real time as she slowly changed into a monster that ate her own sisters. And yes, Fate changes the cause of her curse which is fair since the myth of Medusa's rape by Poseidon is actually a "newer" myth. The further back you go the more that changes.
And Medusa is probably one of the more tragic examples. Some of the most wild examples are alien in origin.
You see this shit? ^^ That's Zeus.
Granted, I pulled this image from a Lostbelt from FGO. Lostbelts are alternate timelines that "went nowhere" and were pruned. Despite that, it's true for every timeline that Zeus and the 12 Olympians were originally alien space ships.
No, you didn't read that wrong, they were the AI of space shuttles. They were originally one shuttle named Chaos that came into the Fate universe from a universe of unknown origin.
The passengers they were meant to transport all died and eventually Chaos broke up into 12 others creating the precursors to the Olympians.
They eventually found their way to Earth, and somehow, formed a contract with Gaia. In this era they were the 12 machine gods of Atlantis.
They even made a type of construct to communicate with people. For instance this is lostbelt Zeus but likely what any version of Zeus originally looked like:
(You can even see the resemblance to Heracles)
What's even wilder is that these 12 eventually became the 12 central gods of Greece, the Olympians. Not only showing the resilience of their divine spirits but the resilience of humanities faith in them.
Not only was Atlantis eventually destroyed but all 12 machine gods were destroyed, as in their original ship bodies, by the white titan.
A being that too was of alien origin dropped on earth to wipe it clean of life.
This being left such a mark on the earth that it's remnants were also deified and shaped by humanity. Such as the giants who later attacked Olympus, they were remnants of this thing.
Another remnant of the titan also reincarnated as Attila the Hun and Attila, as a servant, to this very day wields the sword it stole from Ares when it killed him.
The original Atlantis Ares that is. That's why Attila's sword is more like a lightsaber than a blade.
This being was so powerful that the Earth resorted to forging Excalibur to destroy it. The first, and as far as I know, only time that Excalibur was used completely unsealed.
Funner fact, it was an unnamed human who wielded it. So Saber isn't the first wielder of the blade even if she's the most famous.
Pandora's creation by the Olympians
Again, I probably seem like I'm rambling aimlessly but I'm not. These 12 machines became gods, were destroyed by a literal planet killing, god slaying, alien giant and still reappeared later.
That is the resilience of humanities faith in their gods. It literally reconstructed Atlantian gods into the Olympians with those specific 12 being incorporated into whatever other minor gods existed in the region such as the aforementioned Medusa.
This also around the time you had other gods all over the earth. Such as Odin and the norse gods. As I learned in FGO last week, they not only existed but their authority and territory of Scandinavia encompassed 9 or more realms.
How much of these realms were actually made by Odin is a guess due to the nature of what gods are vs what humans believe but they still existed. Literal planes of existence wrapped around a specific region on earth.
You're likely wondering why Earth, as a sentient thing, would allow this. Yes, many of the oldest gods were spirits it birthed for a purpose but many more grew beyond that or fell from space.
Some are even as small as parasites. The aforementioned Quetzalcoatl was originally a parasite from space. The entire Mesoamerican pantheon was as such. They landed on earth in the age of the dinosaurs and began hopping from one host to another.
It was humanity that defied them and it's also the reason Quetzalcoatl is female as a servant but remembered as a winged serpent. That female form is quite bluntly her current host.
As for "why" earth let them be for so long, well, it's simple. It's humanities faith in them that makes them gods but the earth itself, the will Gaia, grants these gods their authority based on how many humans believe in it.
They're not only gods because humans believe it so but because the earth allows them to be. That's what "authority" is when you're watching Fate. That's the thing the earth gave them power over.
Such as Zeus and Odin commanding the skies and lightning or Tiamat the seas. All of these gods bow to the planet in a way.
But that is also why their age came to an end.
Let us circle back to Uruk and the age of man's beginning, back to this f*cker here. ^
Ya see, the gods are so reliant on the planet that they can't maintain a physical form without it's mana. Especially if the bodies they originally had are destroyed like how the Olympians lost their ship bodies.
The White Titan is actually to blame for this in part. Before the Fae forged Excalibur and gave it to it's human wielder to slay the titan it razed earth to the ground.
80% of life was lost and many of the gods who guarded the planet were slain by it. This is crucial because mana stems from life and vice versa. If you wipe away 80% of the life (including fauna) on the planet then a huge chunk of it's mana is going to disappear.
This began the downward spiral for the age of gods ending. As life slowly rebuilt the mana never reached the levels it had before. In fact, it's continually dwindling even up to the modern day in Fate.
Even the dense mana of Uruk, which was deadly for Fujimaru to even breath, was a far cry from the mana that sustained the gods.
This loss of relevance and physical presence forced humanity to begin to rely on themselves. They began to understand the world around them rather than seeing gods and mystery at every corner.
Sure, humans still believed in them but they couldn't as easily interact with humanity. By the time Gilgamesh was born the gods of that region were using human hosts.
Gilgamesh himself was specifically made to try and extend or even save the 'Age of Gods'. It was the butting heads of both parties, the spite and arrogance, that made Gilgamesh turn on them. Killing Enkidu was the last foolish thing they did.
On top of that, the very divine powers Gilgamesh was born with due to them worked against them. Gilgamesh had mystic eyes that could see the future and one of the futures he saw was humanity abandoning it's "mother" earth for the stars.
Believing in his own kind and spiting the gods he purposely did something to prevent the age of gods from reviving. He sealed their casket.
It is here that human actually begins to turn on the gods. If human faith makes them then human independence undoes them.
A fact that causes many of the gods you see in FGO or other source to have a love/hate dynamic with mankind.
They love them but they hate them for abandoning them to the ether.
And so the world split in two
Earlier I mentioned how the earth had planes or textures to be specific. A la the underworld such as Hades or the 9 realms of Norse myth. I also mentioned that the metaphysical and the physical occupied the same space.
Well all that changed. With faith in them dying and the earths mana drying up the gods and every other mythical being retreated to what's called "The Reverse Side of the World".
Essentially, the metaphysical became it's own plane of existence separated from the modern age of humanity. Even gods that died at one point now exist there as "divine spirits".
Think of Zeus, Odin, Ishtar, etc. They still exist but only as a spirit, something humans remember as a "myth" or "legend" not a "real" person.
Some of them even exist in the Throne as heroic spirits such as Heracles and Medusa.
All of this because the earth is shaping to what humans understand and believe. In fact, humans have grown to such an extent by this point that Gaia no longer rules the earth alone.
The collective mind of mankind has created Alya or as you commonly see named the "Counter-force".
The absence of the old gods has spurred along human progression and now humans are at a mid way point. They are both of the planet but also separate from it.
Does that mean the gods can never return? Actually no. The Lostbelts of FGO are 7 different histories attempting to revive it in some form and it's said that the Reverse Side is held up by "pillars".
If you take out those pillars it's entirely possible to cause the metaphysical and physical to once again collide and return the Age of Gods.
But know this, doing so in any facet means the end of the Age of man if not the potential extinction of mankind.
After all, despite all the love I've put here and all the love the gods have for man it's still a fundamental fact that humans are defined by progress while the gods eventually settled and tried to keep stagnation.
The biggest hatred Gilgamesh has for the gods is the unwillingness to change. The world would completely shift into a new status quo that the gods wouldn't let change.
Especially when the modern humans likely wouldn't survive it. If the denser mana of Uruks day was just deadly to breath then you can imagine what the return of the gods age would do to the population at large.
Though I enjoy how humans overcome monsters and events in Type-Moons stories I do have to admit I find it incredibly depressing how the fantastical world it occupies is slowly dying.
In every timeline the mana continues to dwindle, the Reverse Side grows further from the age of man, and many futures of this Earth are bleak ones.
That is a personal thing however. I hate when any story just turns a wonderful world into our own modern one. Even if I love Fate enough to tolerate that nitpick in the grand scheme.
I do hope we one day get a true look into the Age of Gods when this world was at its most interesting. Whether it's some AU event like a Lostbelt or even just a series set in a world where the age returns or never ended.
I may love our Seiba, or unlimited blades, or even some Apocrypha but I'd love even more to see them do something with the age of gods when this universe was it's most interesting and magical.
I hope you enjoyed this random lore dump of Type-Moon gods, bye~
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For my other experiences with Fate go here: https://derekscorner.tumblr.com/tagged/fated-rantings
Be warned, for some reason my links work on PC and IoS but not Android. =[
