#netflixvania thoughts

[beevean]

I dare you to say one good thing about the animated Castlevania.

Okay :)

Some lines are legit fire, and no, not those that became memetic like "your work makes Him puke" lol. "Kill, for the endless time of hate before me", "We're all slaves to our family's wishes", "If you love something you act to keep it with you for as long as you can". This is good writing that does wonders to encapsulate their respective characters without the need to go into long pointless filibusters (hi Isaac), and in particular the first one is an excellent way to summarize Dracula's tragedy as a villain: his grief is never going to end, no matter how hard he lashes out. Except that it did end in S4, but they didn't know about the bad writing yet, shh. Carmilla's creed is also a fantastic way to explain abusive love, and oh, if only they had been brave enough to expand on this concept with the Styria plot instead of implying that abusers should be forgiven if they're cute enough. it may have inspired some of my hecula thoughts 👉👈

Graham McTavish deserves all the credit for the way he voiced Dracula in the infamous "I'm killing my boy" scene. He still gives me goosebumps, even after realizing how emotionally hollow that scene is. He just sells Dracula's despair and human vulnerability so well. Plus, the reveal that he stitched Alucard's toys is beyond adorable and makes me only angrier that S2 wasted so much time with Alucard being a cunt over properly building up the tragedy of the Tepes family.

Hector killing his own parents is a legit improvement over the manga's scene of the demons setting the church on fire for him. Kind of. I think game Hector would have benefited from this backstory, as it fits his personality of being willing to kill if the person "deserves" it (he chased Isaac through the whole country, but never thought to attack the mob that killed Rosaly: this implies to me he believes in violent but proper justice), and besides I like the idea of Hector actually doing fucked up shit: he's an anti hero, commit! Show Hector, on the other hand, doesn't display the behavior of someone willing to set his parents on fire, what with his naiveté and tendency to fawn and cling to those who do nothing but spit him in the face. Well, I have my theory of what was likely planned. But nevertheless, I decided to include it in my headcanons because I think it adds more to the character.

Speaking of which, Hector in S2 is the most complex, interesting character in the story. He's not banally evil like Isaac: he's almost completely devoid of empathy and morals, and that makes him scarier. The concept of a man so starved for love, yet ignorant of what it is, that he defies death for the sake of pets, is eerie. He breaks the natural cycle of life for his own childish needs, and he doesn't even think he's doing anything wrong, because he discovered the power to cheat death at an age too young to understand, and no one taught him right from wrong. He still dislikes "paddling in the blood of children", but that's the only moral standing between him and the idea that humans should be culled like any other animal: he has no connection with his own humanity. People flanderize him as being the "doggo lover", but no, he doesn't love animals, he loves dead animals that he can turn into an extension of himself! He thinks that the only way he can be loved is if he chains mindless creatures to him! It's sick! I love it! What an interesting twist on the character! What a cool idea that got pissed away in the wind when Hector became a husk of a character to be filled with a fetish!

I like Trevor's arc in S1. Short, but he grows exponentially from a crude asshole to a proper leader who can act on his unique knowledge. I like show Trevor as a character, because while he may be cliché and born out of a complete unwillingness to engage with the games seriously, it happens to be a cliché I'm soft for, and he's overall the nicest of the gang which helps with likeability. It's nice when he's allowed to be the protagonist, he should have been one more often :)

In a sea of designs that go from bland to wasted to personally offensive (S4 Alucard disgusting bane of my existence), Lenore stands out for being exceptionally well thought out. I broke it down here. She still suffers from a lack of cohesive themes, and the story being wholly uninterested in what she was meant to be beyond masturbation fuel, but Katie Silva did an exemplary job conveying so much character and nuance. I'm going to save you Lenore, I'm going to turn you into a proper villain, just you wait D:

Lenore again has the only worthwhile original track in the show. Her theme is simply lovely, and reminds me of Mirror Gem in cadence and Distant Traces of Beauty in how context greatly impacts it, from being mildly unnerving when you're first witnessing her abusing Hector to this tune to tragic and somber once you allegedly got a better look to her alleged hidden sorrow. Her death scene is completely carried solely by this powerful remix, which is just the cheapest way to force Feelings out of you when the writing is lacking at best and insulting at worst. Stop giving me shivers, it's all an instinctive response to the good music, not because the bastard deserves my tears. But yeah. Genuinely magnificent leitmotif that only convinces me more of the theory that Lenore got completely gutted and ruined conceptually when Ellis smeared his penis all over the script, because this track screams "tragic princess forced to keep a smile on her face" to me.

I like the implication that different kinds of magic have different scents. Doesn't go anywhere, but it's an unique worldbuilding tidbit.

Sypha's reddish short hair is super cute and I wish more girls in CV broke free of the "blonde haired blue eyed" mold. That's it. No caveat :P

[beevean]

I have seen some netflixvania fans interept the scene where Alucard draws in the sand in the first episode of the second season as a scene that ‘deepens’ and ‘showcases’ alucard’s relationship with his mother and father and I wanted to know your thoughts on this

Alucard, they called me. The opposite of you. Mother never liked that. Did you know that? She hated the idea that I might define myself by you. Even in opposition to you. She loved us both. Enough that she wanted us to be our own people. Living our own lives. Making our own choices. And so here I am. Choosing to honor my mother by killing my father. No longer Adrian Tepes. Choosing to be Alucard of Wallachia, the name of my mother's people. I'm sorry, Mother.

I have already talked about this monologue in relation to the fans insisting on deadnaming Alucard when he himself says that he chose to change name, but let's talk about it in terms of writing.

This is actually a pretty good monologue in terms of what it wants to convey. It touches on the sad truth that "Alucard" isn't just an epic war name, but Adrian accepting that his life will now be in relation to his father. He is Dracula's opposite and enemy. But then, without Dracula, who is he? It's surprisingly poignant from this aspect. One of the few lines I like from the show is Alucard in S1E4 saying that "we are all, in the end… slaves to our families' wishes." They managed to summarize the whole point of Alucard vs. Richter in SoTN. You can tell S1 was supervised by IGA.

And, of course, it makes sense that Lisa would want both her husband and her son to live their best lives. It could eve lead to a sad conversation about the trappings of vampirism, you know, the fear that you are a beast so might as well give up any pretense to do any better. Alucard never grapples with his vampiric side, oh far from it, but Lisa did try to turn Dracula from vampire to man in a way, so in this sense it fits. I can see Lisa trying to convince Dracula that he's more than a vampire lord, that he's Vlad Tepes, and Alucard that he's more than a dhampir, he's her Adrian. Conceptually, it even reminds me of Lisa urging Alucard to not harm humans while she's dying in SoTN, as if she feared that he would give in to his vampiric instincts and tried to appeal to his good heart...

But as usual, the shoddy writing surrounding this speech makes it crumble like a sand castle.

"Mother never liked that" that what? The name Alucard? That is impossible. Alucard picked up the name after Lisa died and Dracula waged war on mankind.

The other implication is that Alucard has always opposed his father. But here we come to one of my biggest gripes of S2: we never see a flashback of the Tepes family. I don't know what kind of father Dracula was. I don't know what kind of son Alucard was. I don't know how much they loved each other. Besides, if Lisa was "taming" Dracula when she was alive, by making him travel and all, why would Alucard oppose his father? He wasn't doing anything wrong as far as we know.

The other meaning is that Alucard was a daddy's boy, and saw himself as "Dracula's son". This would have been a very interesting concept to explore, especially when it comes to Alucard's relationship with his own hybrid nature. Have you seen Alucard ever pondering on his nature? Me neither. Again, this is the same guy who called vampires "my people" because he was pissy that the Belmonts hunted vampires. Also, Alucard had the entirety of S3 to ponder who he is without Dracula. The writing didn't allow him to. He was just there to suffer prettily.

And, of course, the clincher. I don't care that Alucard tells us that Lisa wanted him to be his own person, when Lisa never once mentions his name on screen. Lisa doesn't spare a thought about him as she's dying, she only urges Dracula to be better than the stupid humans. When brought back to life, Lisa decides that "their poor boy" doesn't deserve seeing his parents again, so screw him, he can grieve them for the rest of his immortal life, she will spend her last decades of her life on a honeymoon with hubby :)

So yeah. One of the many, many scene of the show that have excellent vibes and ideas, but don't hold up to scrutiny because the general writing is falling apart at the seams. Still, the idea that Lisa wanted Dracula and Alucard to be their own people and not fall victims to their nature, and she probably tried to raise Alucard as a normal boy, is very good.

[beevean]

no, because game hector trying to interact with a woman who went under all sorts of abuse at the hands of her vampiric lord / sire hits. he's so kind, especially towards women :( seeing a woman going through a situation that feels like at least some sort of mirror of his own would be— god. he would be so empathetic. i grew to absolutely hate the mentality of “putting carmilla down like a rabid dog”, especially when it got extended to this. of course hector would defend himself, but the thought that he'd just beat her up after hearing her speak doesn't really suit well to me...

i do like to think hector doesn't trust vampires easily, because. well. he grew up surrounded by them. he knows they're selfish, likely grotesque and sadistic individuals. but in the end, they are still very much people — corrupted, sick and some irredeemable, but people. in my perspective, he won't hesitate to kill if needed, but he wouldn't just slaughter a vampire just for being one. (shepherd's dog moment!)

ughhhh you dont know how i went 360 after my eyes read the “fucked his nemesis' sister”. i was happy someone liked him enough to understand his original characterization and its value, but then i read that and wanted to hit my face against the nearest wall. im sooooooo mad when people reduce julia to hector’s love interest (even if the own game treats her like that...)

waaaaaaggh sorry to dump this on your inbox but your reblog made me think of it!! man. i feel sorry for carmilla. i do like her voice, and some of her lines (‘and the determination to find out if you can die twice’), but her writing and presence ruined so much of the plot about and surrounding her. :(( you were right to call her a misogynistic slur in that regard. i don't love canon enough to try fix-it fics, but. so little thought got put into her by the crew and it shows. love, nana

See, that's the kind of conversation I wish the subreddit had, instead of the cliché "haha Hector would just demolish her because his cock is that big"

No. Think about it. While game Hector would not be swayed easily with flattery like show Hector, as he's already the lord's favorite and has no more need for shallow validation, he would totally understand where Carmilla is coming from with her arguments that Dracula's plan is insane and harmful. I don't think he'd passively go along just because Carmilla promises to keep him safe: I think he'd cautiously team up with her of his own volition, even if part of him understood that she has no love or care for humanity and she speaks from a vampire's perspective. Some sort of "the enemy of my enemy is my ally" situation maybe. Admittedly, if Carmilla tried to enslave him or even pull that whole "you're just a puppy" stunt, I don't think things would go well lol. But until then, the two could get to know each other very tentatively as untrusting allies.

Now I imagine him being horrified at Carmilla calling Lisa a pet and even breeder, and that being the catalyst of her revealing her backstory in tandem with my favorite line of hers about love meaning keeping something close to you, so that he understands how deeply Carmilla has been scarred by abuse. Instead of Godbrand lol. Hector would totally get it, being raised by a vampire who "loves" him very much :)

I said that Carmilla, with her backstory of being hurt by her sire to the point of ravenously craving power, reminds me of Joachim. Joachim himself is basically evil (or at least neutral) Hector. A friend of mine compared her with game Isaac, in how her bitterness consumed her. I totally see the potential in a hypothetical relationship between the two in terms of parallels of how they reacted to their abuse and their thirst for power and how Hector saved himself through love while Carmilla was abandoned by everyone.

... In fact, I lowkey ship Hectilla in a context where Lenore doesn't exist:

Post by @beevean

💬 0  🔁 2  ❤️ 15 · I remembered a post I stumbled upon a while ago. It was a gifset of that moment in NFCV where Carmilla strokes Hector's ha

Reblog by @beevean · 1 image

💬 0  🔁 5  ❤️ 26 · I'm eating these thoughts! But I wanted also to offer my perspective. I can't really associate Carmilla with Isaac. Sure,

And it might even work with game Hector, if we imagine Carmilla as his nemesis and foil lol

You just need to see Carmilla like a real person and not an obnoxious caricature of feminists. Ah, the writing could have been so good if only it was good. I don't even like her that much and I still think she shouldn't exist in the show, but she really had potential as an awful, unredeemed but tragic female villain, and the show did her so dirty by how it pushed her to the side and unfairly demonized her because it was Lenore time.

As for Julia, yeah, the joke that Hector violated bro code is funny, but it is shallow and diminishes Julia's agency, which she has. Yes, cynically, you can see her as the "prize" Hector won for being such a good boy (you are definitely meant to be happy for him in the ending, trauma for both of them whomst), but she's also her own character and instrumental to the plot. She's more than a sister and more than a "conquest". Maybe one day the fandom will start interacting with the story and not dismiss it as the garnish of the game/power fantasy.

[beevean]

if humans are seen as same as livestock/animals in nfcv... would that make dracula a furry?

(THIS IS A J OKE PLEASE DONT HATE ME

Jokes about Lenore being into bestiality because she fucked her "dog" have been made since S3 dropped, you can check any video on YT :P

You got precisely the wrong vampire, funnily enough. Dracula explicitly doesn't see humans as livestock.

Did you hear Godbrand down there? "Livestock," he said. So many of my kindred are the same. They can no longer conceive of humans as thinking beings. Just livestock. It's the privilege of our condition, I suppose. You can't hate livestock. They are simply what they are. Grazing animals to be slaughtered. But you two are different. You are human. You are not looking at the scouring of humanity from the earth as an opportunity to get the livestock under control and to fill stables, and abattoirs, and pantries. You hate your species. You hate humans. You have a focus and clarity that the others lack. You understand that humans think, and scheme, and betray. You understand why they all must die.

It's implied that this is how Dracula feels too. He can no longer see humans as mere beasts to feed on. He feels pure, visceral hatred for them - for everyone, maybe, since he's well aware that his mass slaughter will also lead vampirekind to starvation and he's okay with it.

(of course, in the show, this idea that Dracula is fueled with a spite that others vampires, content with living in mediocrity, lack, goes out of the window for the sake of making him passive enough for Carmilla to be cool)

And Carmilla herself is convinced Dracula can't have loved Lisa, because he didn't turn her - because he didn't make her his pet. That's how vampires love humans, after all. It's how the old man loved Carmilla. It's how Lenore will love Hector. But not Dracula. He saw Lisa as his equal. He loved like a... severely unhinged human, but a human nonetheless. And that to Carmilla is more devaluing than turning someone or making sure she wouldn't leave him.

Carmilla: Dracula has failed his own people. He believes that he fell in love with a human woman. He took a pet. You see that, don't you? Hector: I believe he loved her. He is capable of love. That's the source of his conviction. Carmilla: If you love something, you act to keep it with you for as long as you can. Instead, he allowed her to be killed by other humans. He wasn't there. Hector: He wasn't, no. Carmilla: He was traveling, like a human, at her whim. Not once did he move to protect her. Not once did he consider making her a vampire and bringing her into our community. You are loyal to Dracula and the night world, aren't you? You would have protected her. Hector: Of course I would have. Carmilla: Of course you would. But, on some level, he considers us less important than the brief life of a mistreated pet. Does that sound sane to you?

(which makes me wonder why in the fuck Lisa calls him "worse than Satan" when she's arrested girl what did he do to you)

I know I'm being extremely pedantic for the sake of a joke, and I'm aware I'm very annoying. But I want to be precise. I want to point out the good ideas the show had, so that I can show how badly it squandered them. I am so, so disappointed in how S2 reduced Dracula to a stupid depressed old man, when he could have been both that and a force to be reckoned with in his infinite, pointless hatred. And the theme of what love means to a vampire would have been so cool! The way vampires cannot conceptualize loving humans as anything more than keeping in a cage - and yet, somehow, Dracula broke through that mentality, and for reasons not privy to us he did see Lisa as a fellow woman to have a child with... and he paid for it. Like there is something good here! But no screw it Carmilla is just Evil the Radfem, Lenore was Good and Loving all Along because cages are love after all, and Dracula was just stupid!

[beevean]

I feel in a very generous mood, and after I talked about how much Lenore fails as a character, I wanted to for once praise the few times when she was pretty well written for who she was meant to be, a professional abuser, liar and manipulator with excellent strategies to make Hector lower his guard. All of these scenes happen in S3E6, for some reason: before and after, she's actually rather sloppy and in your face, and only succeeds because Hector was lobotomized by the writer lol. But this episde is what I mean when I say she had potential.

First, the part where Lenore "offers" the leash:

Lenore: Now then, would you like to go for a walk? Bit of fresh air in the starlight? Hector: I think I would, yes. Lenore: Good. Sadly, there's a condition. *shows leash* Hector: Oh. Lenore: Not my idea. Striga insisted. It should be quite comfortable. She just wanted a little extra security. Hector: You're ten times stronger than I am, Lenore. Lenore: Striga pointed out that you're a magician. And you do want to go for a walk, so… would you mind?

So.

Lenore kickstarts the episode with some fresh humiliation, because she has no time to waste. She jokes that Hector is now walking "on his hind legs" and looks "almost human", jokes again that she dressed up Hector so that his dick won't be stolen by birds, and asks him to smile in the face of his embarrassment like a creepy old man harassing a waitress.

This is the prelude to her downright falling into sexual abuse, which is this entire part.

The request is obviously unfair. Hector has been cooped up in his stagnant cell for what could be weeks, so it's only natural that he would enjoy some fresh air. But in order to get that basic comfort, Hector has to accept being treated like a literal dog for no good reason. And his braincell does activate for a moment, as he points out that yes, there is no good reason to force a leash on him, because Lenore sure showed him how strong and fast she is:

There is no way Hector would even attempt to run away, not when he has no tools at his disposal, he's starved and weakened, the castle is full of other vampires, and Lenore could snap his ankles in a second Annie Wilkes style.

But Lenore is undeterred. First, she says that it was Striga's idea. It's still ambiguous if she was sincere or not: Striga couldn't give less of a fuck about Hector and shows no reaction when, later in the episode, she sees the two on the balcony. That being said, the fact that she is the one complaining, in E8, that Lenore is taking Hector "on fucking walkies" implies that yes, Lenore lied and mentioned the queen who was less likely to bother Hector. As a bonus, she doesn't blame Carmilla, despite her being the first one who put Hector on a leash as he himself points out later on, therefore creating a precedent, because Hector already has beef with Carmilla, and Lenore is aiming to make him get over his resentment. Hence, the name of a vampire he does not care about. (although, logically, Morana would have been better because Striga will have to work closer to Hector once he starts to supply an army, but eh, I guess even Lenore forgot about her lol)

But whoever had the idea doesn't matter, actually. What matters is that Lenore is shifting the blame on someone else. "Oh, I'm so sorry, I wouldn't do this to you, but I'm a poor little girl and I had no choice 🥺 blame her, not me, I'm just the cute princess obeying superior orders 🥺". And since Hector doesn't know Striga at all, and she has no intention of talking to him, he can believe that. She also subtly blames Hector, because well, he wanted to go on a walk, and she's just giving him what he wanted! He should be grateful, really!

Naturally, this excuse falls flat on its face because even if Striga was the one who suggested the leash for "extra security", it's Lenore who decided to make a sexual game out of it. She is the one who has expressed multiple times her attraction to Hector, first by kissing him after beating him to a pulp, and then by playing some more "genuine" compliments during the interrogation - as genuine as they can be after she spent the entire interrogation making him realize how much of a dumbass he was. She didn't need to do any of this. She's having fun for her own amusement, lording her power over Hector.

(mhh, Lenore using sexual abuse for no reason? It's almost like it's a pattern :) it's almost like being a rapist is in her character :) )

On top of this, notice how hypocritical she's being. Lenore is often treated as inferior to the other three, like she's just a silly girl sitting among adults and not one of the important queens. She clearly resents this, to the point of, as linked above, beating Hector to a pulp when he too underestimated her. But here? She'll gladly pretend Striga is her superior and he has no other choice but to comply with her request. Now that it's convenient to her, she'll happily play the part of the powerless little princess in a den of evil queens :)

But she's not done! Because at Hector's "You're ten times stronger than I am", Lenore retorts (again blaming Striga, because she has to look blameless) that he's a magician. This is a profoundly stupid excuse because Hector is not a magician, he's a Forgemaster who can't do shit without a forging tool: if he were a "magician" like, say, Sypha or the one who brainwashed an entire village, Lenore would already be a pile of ashes. But again, logic doesn't matter: what matters is that Hector is painted like the real threat to Lenore, the one who has the power to hurt her and not the other way around. See, she's just trying to protect herself from the mean Forgemaster, poor thing! This comes into play later.

Now, were Hector a stubborn person who valued his own dignity, this would be the moment where he'd show Lenore the middle finger and resign himself to staying in the stagnant cell. But Hector is not stubborn. Hector doesn't care about his own dignity and honor: he wants to feel safe and cared for. Plus, Lenore has already beaten him at the first sign of defiance: how does he know that she wouldn't punish him again if he refused her proposal? Even just by taking away the few "gifts" she had given him. So, powerless and too weakened to put up a mental fight, he caves in, because he's willing to give away his humanity for a few minutes of comfort and pretending Lenore is taking care of him.

Before I move on, I need to point out the half-clever, half-frustrating ironic echo the "magician" line gets in S4E6 that almost redeems it:

This is what in a vacuum I would call a big dick move lol. How delightfully sassy it is for Hector, after getting his heart broken and biding his time by coddling his abuser's feelings, to throw Lenore's excuses back in her face to put her in a position of helplessness! Oh, he can't be trusted because of his powers, and that was the reason he was treated like a dog and had a slave ring brute forced onto his hand when he would have willingly agreed to becoming Lenore's pet? Well, then Lenore was a giant idiot for trusting him after raping him into slavery and believing he would be harmless and happy with her, right? :)

(it would have been better if they used the exact word again, but whatever, nitpick)

Sadly I can't be fully happy with this scene because, despite his satisfied smirk shown here, Hector isn't really getting back at Lenore for the disgusting way she treated him, but he's instead trying his best to protect her with no malice in his heart, as shown when Isaac arrives and as shown by how he apologizes before trapping her. The parallel between Lenore "protecting" Hector by ruining his life because of her selfishness and Hector returning the favor is obvious, but it's as unsatisfying as possible, because by now the story wants us to feel sorry for Lenore, and Hector's gesture is meant to be tragic, not the rightful comeuppance. Also, due to how wishy-washy the worldbuilding is, I really can't tell if Hector deliberately used the wrong word as a reference to make Lenore really feel bad for her past actions (unlikely, given how he forgave her of everything, but a girl can dream), or if he's seriously calling himself a wizard, which even in the context of the show is very wrong and would be yet another way the animated franchise has watered down the concept of Devil Forging.

That being said, I can ignore the rest of the episode and pretend Hector was being snarky against his abuser 💖 I don't care if it's OOC and it's not like Hector to be this spiteful 💖 go king 💖

After this digression, back to S3E6, before Lenore became a woobie love interest and was still a vile manipulator.

I talked about this scene here, and mostly said that it was wasted potential for Lenore's final act in S4 for multiple reasons. But, for the purpose of this post, it is another nice attempt at manipulation, even if it's a basic "look how nice this place is! You'll enjoy it every night if you'll work for us!". Symbolically, it could be seen as Lenore dragging Hector away from humanity and towards the world of vampires... which would be poignant if Hector didn't start already as someone who turned his back against mankind in favor of vampires and hasn't budged from his beliefs. But eh, I get the idea, and it can be seen as foreshadowing to Lenore allowing Hector free roam of the castle once he becomes her pet. It sure is a nice gilded cage, isn't it?

Then, we have the scene on the balcony:

Lenore: Does it hurt? Hector: No. It just reminds me of the last time someone put a collar on me. Lenore: In Braila? Hector: When Carmilla almost killed me. Lenore: Well, she does have a temper. But she would never have meant to kill you. Hector: No. Because she needs me to be her forgemaster slave. Lenore: No, because if she'd meant to kill you, you would quite simply be dead. Hector: Hmph. Lenore: And if she'd meant to torture you, you would have arrived here carrying your guts in both hands with a spike up your arse. Hector: I suppose that's true. I mean, I can see her doing it. In nightmares and such. Lenore: She does have a temper, but she's logical. She never lets it run away with her to the point of, oh, I don't know, condemning the entire human race to death? Just a recent example of what being genuinely insane with murderous rage looks like. Hector: All right. Lenore: You may not have been treated like a boy king on your way here, but you did show up alive. Hector: Might have been nice, though. Lenore: Have you considered that you're only alive because you listened to Carmilla back in Dracula's castle? Hector: I hadn't. She tricked me. Lenore: I don't think she did. I think she made complete sense to you, and you felt guilty, understandably, about how it all played out. Hector: She made me betray Dracula. Lenore: No, she didn't. She showed you the old man was insane, and she saved you from the consequences. Nobody here wants to harm you. We just don't quite trust you yet. Hector: Trust me? Lenore: You did try to hurt me, Hector.

I still don't know why I can't find a clip of this part. With how crucial it is to their development (and you know, shippers would get a kick out of seeing the peggable boy leashed by the dommy mommy having a cute bonding moment), you'd think there'd be plenty of videos.

Nevertheless, this is the only time Lenore disgusted me in an intentional way, which I appreciate. His character development on stall, Hector has no moral qualms about working for vampires who want to turn humans into livestock, but he is still angry at Carmilla for tricking, beating and imprisoning him, understandably so. She is the only reason Hector still hasn't accepted Lenore's proposal: he doesn't want to work for her out of spite. So what does Lenore do with her amazing diplomacy skills? Launch herself into some pristine abuse apologism, the likes of which are only paralleled by Lenore stans themselves, using every excuse in the book to downplay Carmilla's brutal, sadistic beatdown of Hector, because oh, she just has a temper! Oh, it was just a one time thing! Oh, she saved your life nonetheless, even if you were treated less than royally! Oh, but Dracula was even more insane, so you can't be mad at Carmilla, she was just trying to help!

She's hitting every point possible to make Hector give up his grudge, because who cares about how he was treated, he's alive now, right? He should be grateful that he was "rescued" from Dracula's insanity, shouldn't he? Which is very similar to Lenore's overall attitude, like when she lowkey implied that she was the only one in the castle willing to treat Hector nicely after brutally beating him into submission :)

And as the cherry on top, she is blaming him for that, too! Hector tried to hurt her, the meanie, so really, no wonder he's being treated like a dog! No one wants to hurt him, she swears, it's just that these four super strong vampires are scared of this human prisoner! And if Lenore beat him to a pulp the other day (not that she is directly mentioning it, of course, the accent is on how he tried to hurt her), well, it's all his fault, so he can't complain. Mhh, reminds me of another scene where Lenore downplays her disgusting actions by shaming Hector...

Goodness, but Lenore must have gotten a degree in abuse apologism with flying colors! Look at that flawless DARVO! She would be a brilliant portrayal of a self-centered piece of shit who refuses to take responsibility, if I knew it was all intentional!

I also like that, near the end, when she's rebuking Hector's protests, for once she doesn't sound insufferably smug, but like she is patiently correcting a stubborn child making him reason. This is much better than her usual tone of voice that can only be described as "I get wet at seeing you humiliated", and not just because it's less grating on the ears: she is supposed to sound trustworthy and well-meaning, emotionally comforting Hector and not making fun of him. This is the tone she should have had from day one. It also would have helped distinguishing her and not making her sound like Carmilla 2.0, BDSM patch included.

The only issue I find in this dialogue is that Lenore swearing that no one wants to harm Hector directly contradicts what she herself told him after beating him. You know, that Carmilla and Striga want to kill him and Morana wants to torture him for fun. That was a way for Lenore to put herself in the position of the only one willing to instead keep Hector alive and well, so he better be a good boy. Thankfully for her, Hector is not allowed to have a functioning braincell in this season, so no one notices the contradiction.

The rest of the sequence speaks for itself. Lenore gives Hector a bigger cell (with added symbolism of her tugging his leash to lead him to it, showing that she is forcing all these comforts on him), complete with a book about vampires that he might find interesting, and engages in yet some more sexual play by removing the collar in the most erotic way possible for the joy of the shippers and the thirsty fans. But I want to focus on two things.

One, the book.

When it came to convincing Hector that nighttime is better than daytime, thus the vampire world is better than the human world, I said it was redundant because Hector already feels closer to the former than the latter. This, however, is a much better way to lure him in: Lenore is welcoming Hector even further in their world - or rather, her world. She is sharing their knowledge, the secret knowledge lost by humans and preserved by vampires, much like when during their walk she flaunted the castle's hypocaust that keeps the cells warm ignore that it's normally kept lit by slaves, giving us some unintentionally clever foreshadowing. In E8, Hector is genuinely fascinated by it:

Lenore's strategy of "humanizing" her race, and thus herself and the council so that Hector won't be scared, is pretty obvious but efficient. It's a shame that it's redundant because Hector has no prejudices, nor has he shown any, against vampires (because that would have created conflict between him and Lenore's plan): but hey, better be safe than sorry, right? In a way, it's a continuation of Lenore's abuse apologism, when she tried her best to paint Carmilla as a logical person "with a temper", and not as a violent beast to be scared of. "I keep telling you, we're not monsters." Because if we act like monsters, it doesn't come natural to us, the civilized species that we are, so you must have done something to provoke it :)

Most importantly, this really hits one of Hector's weakest spots: feeling appreciated for his talents. It's all but said that the reason he feels more comfortable around vampires is because they mostly value him for his Devil Forging and necromancy, unlike humans who chased him away for that. For a human being who feels no connection to mankind, being offered a peek into vampire culture must have felt a honor.

Lenore giving him that book "given his profession" shows that she's meeting him on his level, and she doesn't simply see him as a tool like Carmilla, but someone whose blasphemous knowledge is respectable and worth nurturing. She didn't need to do that: Hector is already a genius in Devil Forging, so it's not for him to study to become more efficient. But it's basically a kind gift based on his interests.

But the really brilliant line is this one:

The levels of mindfuckery here!

Lenore coerced Hector into wearing a dog collar and leash for the simple purpose of walking around, making him feel like it was his fault he had to be treated that way, and all for the purpose of gaslighting him into forgiving Carmilla for hurting him. And after that gratuituous display of power over him, she is acting like they just went on a date and she is sheepishly asking permission for another one. (There is no clip, but the tone sounds soft and honestly grateful, too, like he's really doing her a favor.)

This is the exact same strategy of blaming Striga for the leash. She's passing the responsibility onto someone else: Hector, in this case. Lenore is pretending Hector has any power over their encounters. She's just a poor girl who wants to spend quality time with him, but she would never intrude upon his space without permission 🥺 even thought she just literally did by nearly kissing him while taking away the collar before he could ever express any interest in her 🥺 no, really, she leaves the choice up to him 🥺 (so that everything that follows will be his fault, obviously)

But Lenore doesn't just delude Hector into feeling like he has control right after stripping it from him: the point is, naturally, making him feel wanted. Not just as a thing to play with, because otherwise Lenore can just visit him whenever she pleases, but as a person worthy of respect. She likes spending time with him, and she demurely asks if he too wants to see her - and after popping a boner after her little stunt being lovebombed like that, of course Hector can't say no. Not after feeling genuinely cared for as a person, his biggest weak point.

How nice, after their rough start, they're finally developing a relationship of equality and respect despite their circumstances!

This is what Lenore should have been since the beginning. Wearing the mask of the demure little girl whom others make fun of, who is completely harmless (unless the other person deserves it), really, her hands are tied but she always tries her best, look at her gifts made from her pure kindness of heart! And subtly but constantly snipering at Hector's heart, sensing the chinks in his armor and pouncing on them like only a consummate liar and inherent predator can do. Not smugness, not humiliation, not sexual molestation: the believable lie of love and affection, targeted to someone who would sell his soul to taste those crumbs.

Or worse, the other interpretation is that this isn't even malicious lying at all. Now sure, Lenore can't spend one second in S3 without that obnoxious smirk on her face because she's just enjoying so much taking advantage of the power she has over her prisoner, and sure, I have proof that the ring was a pointless act of cruelty that nullifies all her hard work... but who says every word out of her mouth is a lie meant to harm and psychologically break Hector? Maybe it's just 90% of them! Maybe she's genuine when she shows attraction to Hector, and compliments him, and is happy when gets "permission" to see her again because it also makes her feel wanted (after all, Lenore's priority is feeling good about herself). Maybe she does care about him and she was earnest when she tried to "comfort" Hector after raping him into slavery - oh, my bad, into a position of pet... problem is that she is still a vampire, who cannot conceptualize love as humans do, and sees relationships as inherently unbalanced where she is the one where she has to have all the power. And she's willing to do whatever it takes to gain it, say every lie that comes to her fangs, twist every word, shift every ounce of blame, as long as it's for her pet's own good. Because that's what vampires do.

It's a shame those are the only instances Lenore is well written as a villain, because man, the depths of the realistic, relatable horror displayed in one episode are staggering and well conveyed. And most of this behavior is still carried into S4! ... completely by accident, which ignites my fury like few things.

She could have been a great, viscerally repulsive villain and an accurate depiction of an abuser who truly thinks she's in the right, and not just mere masturbation fodder. Now, if only Hector was written with more spine than a beached jellyfish...

[beevean]

Seeing as how the nocturne s2 trailer just dropped I figured I’d ask something I’m a bit curious about

If season 3+4 of the original show ended up following the plot of curse of darkness do you think it could have done that story justice or turned out much better than what we got? With the characterization of Hector and Isaac in season 2 of the show it would have diverged anyways, but it’s interesting to think about.

I just know a lot of critics of the show point out that there was already a story to tell after the events of cv3, but if they’d gone that route would it really have been what Curse fans wanted anyways?

I think this question should be asked to the fans who were following the development of the show in real time lol, because poor things clearly had hope until S4 😂 I remember reading posts of people who were absolutely certain that Hector's story would have ended with him going on a rampage, killing Carmilla and Lenore, running away and meeting Rosaly for his happy ending.

I don't think their characterizations back then would have been an issue. Yes, show Isaac is far calmer and more introspective, but his only personality in S2 is "Dracula simp who thinks Hector is shit under his shoe", which tracks although he's less fun about it. Yes, show Hector is more mellow and trusting, but he was still perfect material for a character arc revolving around him learning empathy for his fellow humans, and learning to think for himself and deciding what he truly wants to do in life, which is more or less his arc in the prequels.

See, the issue is that S2's finale already diverged from CoD's set up. Isaac being yeeted away while stewing in anger? Yes, that could have lead to his descent into madness: I suspect the writers reversed this arc when they realized how... unfortunate it'd look, with their new shiny Isaac. But were they less cowards, sure, I can see Isaac losing his self-important veneer and becoming increasingly unhinged. Maybe his red hair would grow to symbolize it!

But Hector ends S2 tricked, humiliated, beaten and dragged away as a prisoner. A sheer contrast to how, in canon, he ran away after claiming agency. Carmilla's very existence throws a wrench into CoD's story, because the prequels were all about Hector understanding that working for Dracula is wrong, while S2 was all about Carmilla being the only braincell in the castle and dragging Hector along like a dog to cause Dracula's downfall. Had Hector freed himself from her clutches in S3, we could have still had an interesting story maybe (I'm fond of the Hectorcard plot of him running back to the castle and bonding with Alucard over their grief lol), but I'm not sure how this Hector, a Hector who is wracked with guilt over contributing to Dracula's death, one that is so insecure and hasn't spoken with a human being in years (Isaac doesn't count), would fare with a woman who is meant to be a stand-in for Rosaly (because no way they'd write her as the Rosaly we know: we all know how much the show loves its sassy mean women). Plus, the story would be poorer because Carmilla would be just. lost. which is technically what happens in S3 already lmao Lenore snatches her place - you know what I mean

Therefore, the rewrite has to start even before S3. @chumpovodir once had a great idea about how she'd keep Hector and Isaac as the villains of the story and how the plotbeats of CoD could be shoehorned into the show. Another wonderful alternative comes from @notebookofthedead, that also tries to meet the show halfway through, and even includes a fusion of Rosaly and Julia as Hector's new ally and the spark for his character development lol.

[beevean]

Hot take: Lenector is a much more interesting, compelling ship if you see it from the optics of two fucked up people hurting each other and stuck in a toxic, codependent relationship

I was wondering why Lenore was kept in the castle as a prisoner after Isaac conquered it. She's doing nothing. Isaac, who has vanished in thin air, doesn't seem to be wanting to ask her for help when he's a young inexperienced king who only got a kingdom by stealing the throne and she is one of the former queens and highly skilled in commerce - sure, probably she would have told him to go fuck himself, but had he asked her for help it would have been a good way to show that he was serious in his intention to build a kingdom. Basically Lenore is just a depressed mouth to feed (with Hector's blood, I presume, the stash won't last forever, not that the show ever touches on the idea of her parasitically feeding on her pet as exchange for his safety). She is not a threat. She doesn't want to do anything dangerous. And had she not killed herself, she would have outlived her jailers anyway and left free to regain control of the kingdom or do anything else she wanted. So, why isn't she let go?

Because Hector wants her there. For no reason other than, well, he has nothing left in his life. He was planning to die, but Isaac took it away from him, so he was left confused and lost and clung to his only certainty in his life, the woman who abused him but also kept him safe when no one else did. Even after physically freeing himself of her and mutilating himself, he did not mentally break free. He did not gain the courage to face the world, he was kept too sheltered.

Why doesn't she try to run away? Well, she has nothing left in her life but Hector. The same man who destroyed her life for no good reason, but also the same man who was willing to listen to her no matter what and never saw her as a stupid useless girl. Maybe she resents him, but hey, it's what she deserves after what she did, right? (assuming she has enough conscience to think so; in my ideal version she has, but she's too much of a coward to acknowledge it, remember "oh shush you were having fun")

I made a post a while ago where I compared Hector keeping Lenore safe during Isaac's assault on the castle to Hector refusing to kill Isaac in PtR, leaving him to witness the castle's fall. I said that in the latter's case, it's hard to say if Hector spared Isaac out of friendship or out of superiority. And if there were ulterior motives for show Hector's cruel mercy, it could have been brilliant. Finally, we're seeing the twisted Hector who resurrects dead animals because he wants pets because he just wants to be loved.

Hector is keeping Lenore as his prisoner not out of revenge, which never seems to cross his mind, but because he wants her as company. No matter how she or Isaac feel about it. After all, she never cared how he felt, and it's not like he knows much about love, so he's just imitating her brand of vampire love, the love you show by keeping things as close to you as you can :) underneath his kind demeanor, don't forget how selfish and out-of-touch with people he is.

Hector and Lenore are nothing more than tools without drive or direction. Hector only wants safety, and Lenore only wants comfort. They found it in each other. But it's not love what ties them. Not real, healthy human love anyway. They are miserable together, but they have no one else, and they are going to sink their claws in each other out of desperation and craving of human warmth that they cannot give to each other because they keep lying to each other in an effort to precisely mimicry that companionship.

This also ties with my idea that Hector would be filled with resentment for how cruelly Lenore broke his heart, but putting up a façade of politeness, and Lenore would be aware that he's not happy, but like I said she's too much of a coward to address it, so she puts up a façade of playfulness in hopes that eventually he'll get over it. He doesn't. He never grows to love her, only to depend on her. And Lenore never learns how to love as a human, she always sees Hector as her pet, a cherished one but a pet nonetheless. Which is why the situation of imprisonment drives her mad: she should have power, damn it! But she lost it. She only has Hector now.

They bonded through lies, deceit and betrayal, their relationship is nothing but toxic and the pretense of happiness is barely surface deep, and this would have been so cool if the writer did not spend so much time pretending she's a poor widdle girl who did nothing wrong

listen i just love relationships between two unwell people built on codependency and the primal need for each other no matter how unhealthy it is, it's why game Isaactor makes me go all 👀

(also yes in this sense Lenore killing herself makes more sense. She feels worthless, she is removing herself from the picture because she refuses to cope with her uncomfortableness and to free Hector from her toxic self. Without her, Hector is finally free to face the world. Or, since I would like Hector to have agency for once, they could just go their own separate ways, I don't want her to die, I just want Hector to grow, something he didn't do in the show.)

[beevean]

A more fleshed out idea of how I would have ended the Lenector story in the most balanced way I can think of.

Lenore is Hector's prisoner, as per canon. He still treats her as nothing happened, like a good friend, but Lenore is sulking and angry and not even bothering to keep up the façade like Hector used to do in her position. It's unfair, after she treated him as her only confidant, and she couldn't care less, that's what the traitor gets. Hector thinks he should be happy, to have reversed the roles on her... but he isn't. Unlike Lenore, power over another person doesn't satisfy him. He can't help but see her as a depressed animal in a cage... much like he used to be.

He wanted to protect her, he really did, but only now he's seeing how much hurt he caused her. Much like she said she meant to do with the ring, although to this day he doesn't know if it was a lie or the truth. There is no joy in inflicting her the same fate she inflicted upon him, even if it comes from a place of well-meaning and not selfishness. He has seen what that kind of "eye for an eye" mentality brings to the world, and he wants none of it.

So, he finally takes a decision for himself, and repays the one debt he has with her. He helps her flee from the castle. He is, for the first time, showing empathy to a person and not an animal.

(I don't even think Isaac needs to be kept in the dark. Lenore on her own is harmless, nothing like Carmilla who became a danger to the world. Hector and Lenore are dangerous tools in the wrong hands, but they lack the ambition that makes them solid threats, as they are mostly concerned with feeling safe. If Isaac truly wants to do good to everyone, he has no reason to keep Lenore as a prisoner, not even to force her to work for him. Same for Hector, since the two might have "forgiven" each other, but they have no relationship whatsoever. Perhaps him heeding Hector's request could show more how compassionate he has truly grown.)

Lenore is confused as to why, and Hector more or less explains that he couldn't bear watching her drinking herself into a stupor. Lenore snaps, and yells at him that he has no right to feeling sorry for her after what he has done, after going behind her back, after ruining her life... and is promptly shot down by Hector flashing his mutilated hand. Every ounce of ire Lenore directs at Hector is actually directed at herself, and they both know it. She is deeply regretting everything she did for the sake of people that didn't even respect her, she is just too proud to apologize. And her pride, her insecurity, her need to be the one in control, was what prevented her from truly being the good person she wanted to be. The very reason Hector wasn't happy with her despite her best efforts, and destroyed her life.

She really thought something so paltry as a slave ring would tame the human spirit. She really thought humans, like vampires, would care more about safety than freedom. For a diplomat who set herself to bridge humankind and vampirekind, she let her basic instincts get the better of her.

"Why didn't you just kill me back then?" she yells, attacks, it feels so good to blame Hector rather than herself. "At least I wouldn't have known how little I matter to you!"

(He had considered it, as his stump was bleeding all over the floor, his freedom painfully regained. That now Hector was free to hurt those who had hurt him. But what would be the point? He is so tired of needless death.)

(More selfishly, he still needed Lenore as an anchor to not feel alone or lost. Isaac may have forgiven him, but that doesn't make them friends.)

"I'm no longer that child," Hector responds. "I'm no longer the boy who believes to have the right to punish others. Besides, shouldn't you know the desire to spare someone's life no matter what?"

They had never breached that subject again, not after Lenore dismissed it in a fit of denial. It still weighs on her. He can no longer care.

"All this time," Hector says at last, "I expected an apology, but I think I don't need it anymore. As much as I don't need you anymore. I'm grateful for your efforts to protect me from your sisters' ire, so now I'll use them to live for myself. I'm sorry it had to be this way."

He holds no grudges anymore, and he has genuinely come to appreciate the real Lenore behind her masks and the way she took care of him during the previous six weeks, when the world would have chewed him and spit him out; but at the same time, he can't bear staying with her. She makes him too sad. It reminds him of how low he allowed himself to be brought for the sake of some scraps of love. She reminds him too much of a version of him he doesn't want to be. There are too many conflicting feelings in him. He can't help but think that, in another life, the two could have been genuine friends, if not more... but not this one. Too much baggage, too much shared misery. He is done with it. No more will he seek safety and love in other people, as if he wasn't strong enough. He deserves better.

Lenore doesn't know what to think anymore. She wants to die so badly, she is almost tempted to not hide herself from the sun: she can't concieve her existence as nothing more than a black hole, unworthy of living. She is nothing more than a disgusting monster doomed to spread misery to the world, she thinks, and she should die like one. She has nothing left, no allies, no home, and the one person she fell in love with is pulling away from her, and she can't bear being abandoned, and she completely understands why he's doing so. At the same time, however... Hector too has nothing left, and yet he wants to live. After everything he went through, after himself desiring death at Isaac's hand, he wants to experience real life, not survival like he has done since he was born. Lenore pretended to praise his strength when she was manipulating him, but now she has come to genuinely admire that trait. Can she, a vampire used to nothing but comfort, be as strong as a human being?

She wants to ask Hector if he thinks she's a good person. A glance at his mutilated hand answers her more than any word could. Lenore, all this time, had no idea what being "good" meant, she was only good at putting up a façade of gentleness, and she thought it was enough. All this time, she behaved like a vampire pretending to be human... so now, she will learn from the best human she has ever met. The best person. The only one who saw her as a person as well, behind her masks, behind her usefulness.

Even if Hector is now walking towards the dawn, with nothing but his resolution. For the first time, he will live for him, for himself.

They will never meet again, but in a twisted way, they gave each other what they needed to grow.