Hi, all, I occasionally get a note from somebody or other asking where I've been and when I'll be updating, so I thought to come and do make a formal announcement:
I will not be updating this blog for the foreseeable future
This is bittersweet for me. This blog was instrumental in getting me through the pandemic; in helping me learn all these wonderful things about BTS and ARMY and vmin; and in helping me connect with ARMY for the first time—and now, I'm proud to count many ARMY among my true, irl friends. But I think it's time.
As you know, my posts were sporadic all throughout 2022. There were a lot of reasons for that: primarily job/time, but also a feeling that I had basically said what I wanted to say about vmin and was just repeating myself, a sadness that as the blog grew every other ask was something I had already answered or somebody trolling to get a reaction, and the sense that I was not getting the same analytical/creative fulfillment from it that I had in the past.
BTS is onto its Chapter 2, and I want to be on my Chapter 2 as well. I recently quit my job (yes, that racist one) and am hard at work trying to find a new one, while the tech sector's imploding around me. I want to spend more time with my irl friend rather than hours upon hours (upon hours) arguing online with people who'll never change their mind. I want to finish writing my novel. I want to write about BTS and their music and their bond and their inspirational effect on ARMY to OT7 people and even GP audiences (I really, really want to write an in-depth analysis of Indigo, which has my whole heart). To spread the gospel of BTS far and wide, I suppose, haha.
This isn't goodbye. Really. I am still very very much an ARMY, and a Vminnie. Maybe one day you'll read an article and it'll be by me, haha. Or we'll come across each other's content on Reddit or Tumblr or Twitter or ao3. I'll be around! This blog will stay up as an archive. And honestly, I won't cross off the possibility of a return either, down the line (maybe in 2025? Haha).
As a final parting gift, I'll leave you with some of my half-written Q&A, old Asks Roundup style. They also, quite happily, say most of what I want to say in the end about the nature of this blog, about shipping and fandom, and about BTS / Jimin / Tae. If you enjoy these asks, or if I've just given you joy and entertainment or the past year or two, please do consider tipping through Tumblr. As I said, I'm going through a job change / life transition, and it'd mean a lot.
-Drift
Ask: Did you rage quit? [Drift: No]
Ask: Order of future releases & behavior of ARMY to other ARMY? [Drift: I was right! And it's atrocious, it's my biggest complaint in fandom]
Ask: Can you stop saying Jimin is insecure? It's not true! [Drift: Do you even read his interviews and what's shared about his struggles? Please stop taking out your pet peeves - Jimin will be super successful and conquer any challenge through his own innate talent and determination as well as the support of all those around him. Jimin forever!!]
Ask: So little Vmin lately 🥺 [Drift: But Vmin seems fine! And yes, slowing content some, but it's the healthier thing]
Anon: Did you rage quit the blog because Tae was/is in a relationship with a woman lol?
*looks at my explanation up top*
Oh, love, It's honestly really sad that you think anyone's life could revolve around something so inconsequential—even if it were true in the first place (which is a big if, as based on my very basic visual analysis and other's more expert opinion, it's highly likely the "proof" were edits). That's the first reason that came into your mind about why someone might just stop posting on a free blog comprise of literally hundreds of thousands of words that took as much as a part time job to keep up? The entitlement.
Sure, let's say Tae or Jimin is dating someone. Possibly a man (distinctly in the realm of possibility after Jimin's folio, from the colors to the symbol of Apollo to Artemis to his outfits and staging). But maybe even a woman, le gasp! Which is definitely not outside the realm of possibility, we don't believe in bi-erasure here.
....How many times must I say I don't care?
I'm a Vminnie who has always said platonic or romantic doesn't matter to me - what matters is their bond, in the present and past. And that will always endure, no matter what happens from this point forward.
Thank you, however, for telling on yourself that you don't even read my blog (since I've said this again and again, and first said it in 2021). And for being a prime example of the worst parts of being here. Whatever I say or have said, people like you (other toxic shippers, other toxic Vminnies, solos, etc) will always want drama just to get yourself that little bit of interaction, will always want to believe in some conspiracy to give yourself something to care about.
But here's the thing: you need me to give you content to react to. But I don't need you for anything. I admired and had fun with Vmin's bond here because it was fulfilling, and now that it's less so, I can just switch back to doing it all myself—with the content HYBE puts out, and with the company of IRLs and a select few Vminnies when I want to squee with others.
Hope that answers your inquiry! I wish you the most joy in loving BTS.
From anon: Hi! I just read your post on the predictions of how they will enlist and release their solo albums. You said that Jin enlists, then rapline releases an album, then enlist, then maknae line releases, then enlists. My issue though is that didn't they say Hobi would release first, then Yoongi and then JK? So that doesn't fit the predictions. Also, how do you feel about I ARMY attacking K ARMY for not (in their words) "supporting BTS enough" so they don't deserve things and attacking translators trying to explain?
[Drift from the future update: I was right that RM goes after Hobi, it turns out! But it seems Jimin's making great progress and is expected to be after RM, not Yoongi. I also think it's quite smart, because it breaks up the rap-heavy releases. Fingers crossed we'll see it in Feb/March! ]
I watched the vid several times to see if I missed the order you're talking about - and I think the difference is your assumption that Yoongi follow Hobi. What we actually heard is just this: 1) Hobi is first, and 2) JK will follow Yoongi (we also hear RM's album is quite far along in progress, as he said the album flow is a little random, so he must have enough to sketch out a tracklist; that Jimin just started but thinks he'll finish before Tae who keeps noodling; and that Jin's will be last).
So the most likely order for me is Hobi > RM > Yoongi > JK > Jimin > Tae > Jin - So rapline first ;)
Your list isn't wrong and I think possible too! I just think my top prediction is more likely because of enlistment, but both are just predictions xD And you can disagree with me and think the 2nd scenario is more likely, that's fine.
The second part of your comment is about translator Sel I presume, whom mandakko actually backed up at the time. I saw it happen in real time... I think I have a few screenshots actually. But since Sel deleted quite a few of her tweets, out of respect I won't share those or go into too much detail. If you would like to support her, I've sent her KoFis to express my support.
I will just share the rant I wrote about to get my feelings out at the time about Sel:
And now fandom busybodies are going after Sel! Sel! Of all translators. For having the misfortune of following the 'wrong people' (whom she probably followed years ago and never see on her tl. I can't find that Twitter thread about "judging" people by who they follow - as if we all do an online excavation of the hundreds of people we follow and also pay attention to / agree with everything they've ever done - is dumb as bricks, but I fully concur with the sentiment). For telling i-Army not to generalize a whole swath of fandom they can't even understand. For telling them their habit of shady quote-retweeting is counterproductive and clout-chasing (k-army screenshot, report directly to platform or BH, then report, as I have always advised people to do here on my blog as well).
I wonder if in T-3 months, this incident is going into somebody's "report" / "cancel" thread that's going to go viral - "Sel is racist against i-army, a secret manti, and tolerant of hate aimed at the boys," the thread will claim, with select screenshots that cut out context and willfully misunderstands what she says. Evidence will 'pile up' as people repeat each other, and before we know it, another translator has "been revealed."
We've seen this dance before, again and again, and I hate it here. It's just so damn pointless and petty. Why are we cannibalizing our own? Why do people love wagon-banding so much? And when their wagon-banding turns out to be wrong, they never freaking apologize. And sometimes they chase off great translators, who contribute over a day more than these busybodies have in their entire existence to the fandom. I'm happy and proud that Sel and other translators have the strength and passion for BTS to carry on despite experiencing this toxicity throughout their fan careers.
As for KARMY: As an immigrant, my blood also boiled to see insults being slung around on a language and a platform K-ARMY don't even use. You know what that makes you? An entitled mean girl. Even if I hated my colleagues - and I don't hate my ARMY colleagues, I love them all - I would not talk behind their back like this. And if you think K-ARMY, who literally do streaming test-runs on Melon with old songs to figure out best methods and rule changes pre-comeback, are somehow not "doing enough"—get yourself on the Korean streaming platforms and go do it yourself. And you damn well better have streamed every hour of every day and bought all digital versions of Yet To Come with 3 different emails and also as many physical copies of Proof as you could in the weeks it's been out.
Else sit down.
[Future Drift: I still mean every single word of this. Please, keep our best ARMY with us]
From anon: Can you stop shoving the 'Jimin is insecure and has low self-esteem' agenda? I know you won't answer this and you're entitled to your opinion, but it's frustrating to see fandom attach everything to this narrative. Go read his Weverse interview, the man is ready to take on the mental challenge of his solo work - two things can be true, that he's attached to his members, and that's he's ready for his solo work.
[Drift from the future: I stand by the answer to this too, especially immediately post FESTA announcement! Jimin's actually talked more about it in his recent W Magazine interview - feeling a bit lost in 2022, worried about his solo music, etc. But he's been successful and will soon be sharing his wonderful music and soul with us! Exactly as I said he would be in June 2022! Wow, I'm a prophet!]
This is also a reconstructed ask. Indeed, I wasn't going to answer this, because I'm (again) trying hard to be less easy to bait. But then I remembered I never got the chance to talk about Jimin's Weverse interview in my Vmin write-up (since it wasn't out yet, btw, as I stated in the piece), so thanks for giving me an opportunity to talk about it, I guess, anon, haha.
First. Let me just talk directly to the insecurity/self-esteem point. I stand by what it, but also think anon is twisting my words based on their own "pet peeve" and responding to what they think I said and not what I actually said.
As I mentioned, meeting his own expectations is something Jimin's struggled with in the past.
Jimin said in recent years that one of the key things he's learned is to love himself. But he still occasionally expresses being unsatisfied with himself, especially in regard to his work—and as I explicitly mention in my post, that's a double-edged sword. It makes him perfectionist and hold himself to a high standard, which is obviously useful in his field of work (just look at how meticulously 3J dissected their Butter remix dance break performance, and it was just thrown on the internet, not even for an award ceremony or anything). But it also means he puts himself under a lot of pressure, which if not checked can be bad for his mental health (remember that Game Caterers episode when Jimin criticized himself for being too sharp towards others, then Tae interjected that he is very kind, and that Jimin was too harsh on himself?).
It is also still something he seems to struggle with. I want to ask if anon read the Weverse article, because in my opinion, his statements reaffirmed exactly what I said:
Jimin: I’m really grateful for everything ARMY says, but I'm not entirely satisfied with myself yet. Nothing would make me happier than having this much self-satisfaction, but I don’t, and I struggle with that. I guess that’s why, even though I really want to be better, I was avoiding the fact that to change in that way I would have to be more consistent in what I do—but I forced myself to bury those thoughts by telling myself maybe I was already good enough. But now, I want to be even better. I want to be better, and cooler. I changed.
Jimin: I want to show off everything I’m capable of at the highest possible proficiency. For example, whether I’m showing that dark but sexy vibe that only “Black Swan” has, the high energy of “IDOL” or “FIRE,” or how cute I can be, I want to do it all with the highest proficiency. I always look forward to the audience erupting into cheers whenever all my proficiencies come together. I think that’s one of the reasons I used to criticize myself so much whenever I made a mistake or did something wrong.
Jimin: After that first day of the LA concert, I felt like I had been wronging the fans this whole time somehow since our concerts kept getting canceled.
[Drift: I just want to note, as a former high-achieving perfectionist, so much of what he talks about - the joy of reaching the greatest heights with things you love; the pressure to perform, always; the guilt over things that aren't even your fault - resonate So. Much. Jimin will always, always, have my heart]
The insecurity point was just one supporting point within my main argument:
Jimin seems most reluctant to go solo, seeing his identity as wrapped up in BTS (and needs to do the work to figure out his solo identity). And that main argument is something I stand by, because it literally came out of his mouth: "I'm not a solo artist, I'm a member of BTS", even though he later on states that he "understands now" that they're making solo albums, all of which indicate he wouldn't have pursued one if this wasn't the plan for the next little while. And this is by and large something the fandom seems to agree with, if the conversations I've had with many ARMY are anything to go by.
I do think he has some growth as an artist to do in the next bit. In fact, he says that himself in the Weverse article ("I’m looking forward to knowing who I’ll become and how much better I’m going to be able to perform."). He's looking forward to it. I'm looking forward it. I'm sure it won't be without pain, because what personal growth is without pain? But ultimately, I'm not worried Jimin will not come out a stronger person and artist in the end. Again, as I literally said in the original post, I'm sure Tae and the rest of BTS are behind him, and I'm also sure that his music will be a cathartic avenue by which he can process emotions and propel his growth. Indeed, Jimin literally said that himself in the Weverse article: that when he felt lost, the other members suggested he put that into his song and he's going to try that; and that when he's struggling, the members help him return to his true self.
In case you were confused: I am positive Jimin's solo career will be successful. He's a born idol and crazy talented and even beyond that, heartbreakingly hardworking. He's shown where he can grow too, with his ear for melody, lyrics, and song concepts generally. And regardless of what success markers he achieves, objectively or in relation to the other members, I will be 100% behind him. Always.
Finally, here's a personal piece of advice to you: if you have some general pet peeve, maybe talk about it on your own blog? Please don't come onto mine with your own agenda.
If there's some fandom tendency you don't like, the more productive thing to do is collate across sources, make a cogent argument as to why the fandom tendency is inaccurate (complete with sources and logic)—and post about it so that it's out there as a resource to change people's mind. I've done this in the past, from my entire Say No to Shipperverse Bad Habits to my post about why the fandom painting Jimin as some giant flirt is utterly inaccurate (and you might notice - probably because it's never been true in the first place - that tendency and depiction have receded dramatically in the past 2 years).
Imagining arguments I never made and ranting about your pet peeve in my ask box - without engaging with a single data point I cited, mind you - is honestly just spamming me.
[Also: Let it be known I read the Weverse interview 1 minute after it dropped at 11pm EST quickly, then one additional careful read, and now just another one as I wrote this xD I also watch his vlives, interviews, etc, religiously. In fact, I will literally sometimes rewatch vlives because I like observing the careful way he phrases things (I swear someone can test me on what he said in his Oct 2020 vlive). How dare you doubt how obsessive I am about Jimin, lol].
From anon: Hi drift, idk if u noticed it too, but it feels like Tae is also becoming more private when it comes to Jimin. It's also expected that we'll see less and less from VMin especially with the different approach on their career this time. TT
[Drift from the future: I really am Nostradamus lol. As I predicted, member interactions have become scarcer, like, I don't think we've seem Jimin interact with Namjoon since the fall. But they all seem fine still! Especially Vmin—don't forget Tae immediately posted Vibe to his IG story upon its release, almost like he was waiting for it to drop with us. And that Jimin really randomly posted a throwback pic with Tae (from ITS2 filming?) a bit awhile, when a quick glance across his IG will tell you he basically only posts promo stuff or things happening in real time. My Vmin heart is, as always, full 🥺]
Well, let's remind ourselves "I like you most" was... last year? And in the past six months, we've gotten these moments - some from Tae - that directly show that they remain close, that they still hang out. Heck, in FESTA 2022, filmed just late May (shortly before they went to see Biden), Jimin went on about how he'd gotten a look (seemingly by himself, not with all the members) of Tae's album and hyped Tae's solo works way more than his own. In fact, see related asks that put that more articulately.
So it's not like we've gotten nothing.
But funnily enough, I saw some Vminnies on my twt timeline recently talking about how they don't 'show evidence' they hang out anymore. No vmin selfies, basically. Think about Hobi + maknae line hanging out in LA & LV - we never saw the two of them in one photo and they did not post photos of each other either. Think about these two photos, which has the same framing and filter, heavily implying they took them for each other using the same phone - posted separately on their respective IGs.
And whether that's 'deliberate' or 'not deliberate ' - who knows? But it's worth pointing out Jimin's relationship to social media has changed significantly. He posted on Weverse (?) relatively recently about feeling guilty he doesnt post more and promising to do so more often (though honestly, he should NOT feel guilty about it)... but it's a steep decline from pre-2016 where he posted all the time. Indeed, every member's relationship to social media has changed (reflect: Hobi really blossoming on IG; Jin also going kind of silent except for his hilarious comments - we've heard most about him from the middle-age chefs he hangs out with hahahaha - their group Twitter being a whole deadzone). It likely will continue to change a lot, with their solo activities and individual IGs in the mix. So yeah, as I stated in Part 2 & repeated again Part 3, expect to see a decline of visible interactions across the group, and particular Vmin, who already has a streak of being private.
Am I sad about it? Kind of. But as I've said many times, I'm not a particular insecure Vminnie. Whether or not I get to see it, their relationship - whatever form it takes - will persist. They've made it clear they intend to take it to the very end.
But even if some catastrophe occurs where they break apart? It's not like me seeing a selfie or report of them hanging out foretells that sort of thing happening or not happening, right?
Honestly, think about how shallow that form of communication is, anyway. What's you'd learn? That they look good together in a photo? That they spend time in the same space? (You don't even get to know how long they spent time together, or what they were doing together).
Personally, I'm looking forward instead to their interviews, their acknowledgments, their solo albums - where you might see their artistic collaborations, or hear what they mean to each other as personal and artistic supports. That's much more meaningful. We're also much more likely to get that than photos etc, at this stage in their career.
And honestly? I think it's a good move all around. It's healthy for them and their various relationships. And it'll allow narratives to re-focus around their artistry.
I understand shipping is a hobby, but it'll be good for all shippers to be reminded their ships are not a tv show. You can't expect to 'tune into' every couple of days (especially outside of group comebacks, when we always a glut of content between members) and expect to see something new.
It's important to separate Vmin and their real life relationship from this Vmin fandom. Depending on the real people to keep you entertained and the overall shipping fandom going isn't healthy. If you want "ship content," go follow some fanworks creators. The art & fic are spectacular. Admire the real boys from firmly behind the 4th wall.
[Drift-from-the-future: Quadruple underscored here!! If you're bored, go leave some kudos and comments on fanfic and fanart!!!]
I’ve actually been prepping this post for awhile, but there’s been some interesting discussions about Vmin being different, quiet, etc—to be honest, I’m just not sure I have the right context to have a real opinion, without knowing what’s in the pipeline for 2021 for BTS as a whole, or Tae & Jimin specifically. This seems like a 2017 situation, where we’ll only know (kind of, not all the details, but some) in hindsight. All I’m sure of is that their relationship itself is still solid (Tae looks happy, Jimin looks happy, there can’t have been a great rupture if they’re still complimenting each other on Run/BB/social media, and of course, soulmates & 95z=love is a forever sort-of promise).
Instead, I thought it’d be helpful to take the long-view, and consider what’s really at stake here, if Vmin were real, and how it might shape our current thinking about them.
This is inspired by two asks:
From @archishalovesvmin—I hope you are good. you know, where i stay, i can’t even tell my mom about vmin being my ship! Just becuz they are both boys :( So, IF. IF vmin (or any other bts ship?) turns out to be real, and it’s public, then what would happen?? bts would get 100% more hate becuz of stupid homophobes :( the world is still so cruel towards LGBTQ+, idk. I am just really scared abt it. Sorry it’s a really depressing Q, but i had to get it outta my head. I love your posts<3
From anon: I’m a closeted bisexual woman, and I have mixed feelings about the idea of vmin being romantic and us talking about the possibility because what gives me and them (if real) freedom is hiding behind heteronormativity. By challenging it, we’re doing something morally right for societal progress, but potentially harmful to individuals who hide behind the shield of heteronormativity even if they hate it. But I think it’s so important to not bro-zone them either because we don’t know. I’m conflicted!
I actually have a pretty distinct vision of how things would go if any ships were real within BTS, and it shapes how I feel about the potential “safety” of heteronormative lens. I’m going to imagine if it were VMin here, because 1) I find them by far the most likely of all the ships to be real; and 2) there are certain aspects of this that are personality-dependent, and it’s easier to discuss in specifics. But broadly speaking the “strategy” would be the same, regardless of who the couple is.
To frame this discussion, first, this is fully in “delulu land”. I’m starting with the assumption vmin is real, in order to see where it takes us and what logical strategy emerges. And second, I’m not in the K-media industry or PR/media broadly, though I sometimes work with cultural companies. So professionals might have a different (more accurate probably haha) view of things - this is just based on what I surmise about how things work.
1. Pre- & during military enlistment: personal matters will be kept on strict lockdown. No one will be “outed” or “come out.”
2. Post-military enlistment: there may be more experimentation and pushing of boundaries around relationships & sexuality, both in terms of music/art and in terms of their personal behavior. We inch ever closer to the idea of a glass closet.
3. Long-term: Depending on the state of Korea and the rest of the world, as well as the couple’s personalities, there may eventually be a “coming out.” For VMin, I think that’d probably be the case.
I hope that all makes you feel less anxious? Because if any ship is real, or - more likely - at least one member is queer, I think ultimately it’ll be okay. Yes, the heteronormative protection sucks and is uncomfortable, but in some ways convenient. And it wouldn’t be forever, or something that can’t be negotiated around. I know this might sound blase (and of course it’s much easier for me to speak when I’m not the one at risk)—But a lot can change in 7-10 years, there are already tides of change in the industry, the boys have world-class teams around them, and they themselves are both resilient and not alone. As has been the case for the past 7.5 years, I truly believe they will make it through with each other, their brothers, and ARMY by their side.
Can you guys not remember me only with something that is 1) a rumor, 2) likely fake, if you have any visual analysis skills and can look at shadows and proportions, and 3) whatever is actually happening, is someone's private life and therefore not up for public discussion?
We know, from their own mouths, Vmin is real, always, whether their bond is platonic or romantic, so I don't really care if they are "just" best friends or not. The rest of their private lives is not up for discussion on this blog. Send an ask about it and it's an automatic block, I don't want your toxicity near me.
From anon: hi :) i'm a new army (3 months) and i wanted to ask you about bts and dating rumors. i'm not a fan of seeing rumors and i don't like seeing it everyday on my tl. i wanted to ask, how long do these rumors usually last?
Some weeks it's more intense, some less, but to be honest, it's pretty constant. I'd recommend you block liberally and your tl should clean itself up. Sometimes if it upsets the boys enough or gets enough hubbub a statement will be made, otherwise HYBE and BTS will ignore until it goes away. (I mean this for all the boys and all rumors by the by, not any specific pairing. Hobi and Jimin had recent, crazed rumors while in Chicago as well).
Anyway. I recommend this be your tack for all this noise as well. Thinking logically, for gorgeous rich men in their late 20s, it's likely many if not most or all of the boys are in relationships - and I hope as I do with my own family members that they are happy in them. In fact, I'm sure they have a whole constellation of important relationships, most of whom I don't know: romantic partner(s), family, friends.
Whether or not I know who it is, I know it exists, so paying attention to rumors that doesn't change that fact is a waste of my time and also feed into voyeuristic tendencies in an unhealthy way.
What are your dream collabs for this era? I was thinking RM x Hwa Sa would be so cool! And Jimin x Taemin of course, because that was brilliant before. But Jimin shines so brightly alone on the stage I actually want to watch him alone more
Wishlist Collabs for BTS
Ahhh this ask makes me so happy 😭 Thanks for asking!!
And today's a good day for it, with news of the Benny Blanco, vocal line, & Snoop collab, complete with a comeback map and everything (😂 I'm going to assume BTS's team helped him put it together)
Not going to lie, I was expecting Hobi's album to have lots of collab, and am vaguely sad by it. But as he mentioned in multiple interviews for the press circuit for this JITB (but particularly the Bangtan TV one), he wanted it to be his "calling card" - something people can point to and say that this was him - and so the choice to keep it to just him makes a lot of sense.
But we can continue to dream about the others, haha. And I don't rule out that Hobi might bring a guest out to perform with him at Hobipalooza.
I will caveat that I'm not exactly an expert in music, whether in Korea or the US. This is purely everybody my basic heart knows that I think in a collab would enhance or bring out different artistic sides to BTS. Something else I thought about is that BTS very clearly prefers to collab with folks they like (we don't think about Sia) as people, so I didn't put anyone that I think fits well but I don't really want within 20 feet of them (say, Kanye West).
DREAM COLLAB LIST
RM: Epik High, HER
Jin: Taylor Swift, Ed Sheeran
Suga: Moon-byul, Kendrick Lamar
Hobi: Chance the Rapper, Cardi B
Jimin: Lee Suhyun (AKMU); IU
Taehyung: Lady Gaga, Jon Batiste + Bonus Lizzo
[I assume I can't just say Vmin subunit]
Jungkook: Ariane Grande, Harry Styles
Thoughts on your suggestions and why I made my own below the cut!
Your two suggestions, I would literally throw so much money at.
Hwasa and RM's vibe and personal stories into fame have some similarities. And since RM is a rapper, a collab with such a powerful vocalist (who can also carry off rap verses) make a lot of sense. Also selfishly, I think she's got an indescribable attractiveness like RM,I'd literally combust seeing them on stage together.
Also, Taemin & Jimin? Probably highly unlikely since it's both different companies and also SM, esp if we're hoping for performance promotions... but if only 😭 Besides being fantastic friends (Padding Squad unite!), Taemin is one of the few I think gives Jimin a run for his money as a dancer and born idol (remember their special collab stage? It really brought out, in my opinion, Jimin's classically trained fluidity and expressiveness vs Taemin's looser self-taught dance style). Their music tastes are quite compatible, with Taemin's body of solo works honestly trending the vibe I think Jimin will explore in at least one song - dark, sensual, personal, heavily performance based. Taemin's smoky lower voice would compliment Jimin's higher range & stronger voice a lot too. Ugh, honestly I'm making myself feel deprived by saying all this xD
For my own?
RM - I'd love to see him partner with Epik High. Suga's produced for them, but we dont have a real collab song yet. And Tablo's producing + RM's songwriter = 👌🏼 On the vocalist side, HER would amazing. RM clearly judges her highly, calling her along with Lady Gaga "true artists" dedicated to their craft in his recent Proof Weverse interview. And I'd love to hear the combination of RM's lyrical rap and HER's modern R&B together.
Jin - He's hard, because I don't listen to ballads at all and I'm sure there are great Korean ballad singers he'd do phenomenally with ;_; But I know he's a big fan of mainstream pop, and for songs along that vein, I'd go with Taylor Swift & Ed Sheeran. They're both accomplished singer-songwriters that I think would write good songs for their collab. And can't you hear Jin being brilliant on some of their songs, like say, Exile?
Suga - he loves his vocalists, hahaha. And he picks good ones. But my wish would be for him to join forces with a female rapper. All of Mamamoo wouldn't be bad choices for him, but I'm very partial to him joining forces with Moon Byul (see: her solo album Dark Side of the Moon & Shutdown, which is more personal and also very queer, lol). Also obviously Kendrick Lamar. I don't know how that would work because they both are such lyrical-inclined rappers but in different languages... but if it ever happened, I think Yoongi would fangirl harder than us, lol.
Hobi - I know he already released his album but xD Everyone and their mother hopes for Doja Cat, but I'm actually going to suggest Chance the Rapper, whose hopelessly optimistic style and bouncy beats similarly to Hobi hides more introspective lyrics. Also Cardi B, whom I know the internet loves as a meme (and good for her for getting the internet so well) but makes fantastic music. Her awards aren't for being funny. Look at some of her bsides - her lyrics are underrated and shows a similarly underdog story to fame (Get Up 10), loves incorporating different genres in a way that Hobi would really dig I think (I Like It), and has she has a fun and optimistic underbelly too (Best Life, coincidentally with Chance the Rapper, and honestly, the best example of why she and Chance would both do so well with Hobi). We even know there was a collab in the works that fell through.
Jimin - Can I actually just steal Taemin xD 2Min are actually my ideal collab. But on the side of vocalists, maybe for a slower song, I'd want someone whose voice would complement his angelic voice. Lee Suhyun (one half of AKMU) fits the bill perfectly. Her voice is absolutely gorgeous - clear, but never thin. Check out her cover of Reflection or her own song, slightly faster, Alien. And if we can get her brother Lee Chan-hyuk (the other half of AKMU) to make them a song? Ugh. He's absolutely brilliant (like, dude just wrote a bestselling book in Korea for fun or something), super thoughtful and clever as a producer and songwriter, in a way that reminds me of RM and that I think Jimin would really dig. Along the same vein vocally is IU, who is also a very accomplished writer and is as famous as Jimin in Korea, so they'd be evenly matched there. If I get any of this, I'd literally have to lie down.
Tae - I don't think we even need to pick for Tae? He's already told us, and he's picked pretty well for himself xD Lady Gaga, Jon Batiste, Silk Sonic. He likes jazz, retro funk, and he carries them off well, too, so I'm into it. Personally, I most like the idea of him with Gaga, she's a consummate performer. One idea I'd throw out there myself is Lizzo - and no, not because she's a fellow Vminnie. Her songs are kind of quirky, in a way that I think Tae would really dig, and it might give him space to do some of that rapping he clearly wants to try in a friendlier context than say, a collab with Snoop Dog.
Jungkook - JK's another hard one, just because I can imagine his solo sound taking a lot of different directions. But assuming he stays within the bounds of mainstream pop, I'd go with Ariana Grande and Harry Styles, whom we all know JK loves. Remember when we all thought a collab was coming with Ariana xD She can absolutely keep up with him as a singer and performer, and I actually think a duet between them would be pretty incredible. I'm also weirdly curious about Harry Styles and Jungkook. I think it might be a little too much for the internet, honestly, but hopefully our two fandoms can behave ourselves and we'd get the sort of pop superstar collab we don't really see much anymore.
Feel free to share your picks! I'm very curious to hear other thoughts. What is nice about thinking about this re: BTS is that they are so big now that the sky's the limit - in fact, you have to think a little bit about who's too small that the chances of a collab actually shrinks, but then because they center music first, I don't think anything (including say, underground rappers) is outside the realm of possibility for them.
Make sure you watch the MV and stream JITB at your favorite streaming platforms like Spotify!! (And do what Hobi suggests and listen to it in order, like you would read a book)
Afterwards: Buy the digital singles!! Also, if you can, buy the Weverse albums to make sure he does well on the Korean charts!
As you listen to his album, you may also want to watch his explanation of each song, and read this fantastic interview the Rolling Stones just did for the album drop (props to the writer for some fantastic questions, she really did her homework)
J-Hope goes inside the process for Jack in the Box, getting support from his fellow BTS members, and showing off his darker side
I'm going to do something slightly experimental and post my current quick (almost live) takes on each song - hopefully it makes your own listening experience more fun. Keep in mind that it's first impressions and we don't have the lyrics yet - I fully expect when I wake up tomorrow our beloved translators will have gone through and I can do some more thoughts :D But I'm curious how the lyrics will alter my opinions on the songs, so let this be a historical record of my original thoughts, haha.
Let's get it!
As always, the caveat: I am actually very dumb and basic it comes to music - particularly with regards to a song's production or sound. The only thing I'm confident about is lyrics, which we don't have yet. So keep that in mind xD If I'm wrong about technical terms or whatever, it's not a professional music critic's review, it's my unabashed fangirl's opinion, haha.
Also! I recommend you listen to the album in real time as you read each song discussion!!! You'll get more from it.
Intro
Hobi obviously positions this as both a hip hop album & a BTS album by following the traditional structure of hip hop albums that they've used for most of their albums - intro, an interlude, and outro. This one's in English so the meaning's pretty obvious: he's setting up the scene. This album is Hope (himself) leaving the box. The backing sound is very beautiful and ethereal, fairytale... which distorts at the very end, to showcase that this Hope is darker, the will to carry on is darker—but perhaps just as cathartic.
Pandora's Box
Indeed, to emphasize the message of what I said just above, you can hear the backing sound of the Intro re-used at the beginning of Pandora's Box—but with a more sinister beat.
This song I can't wait to get the lyrics on, as it's very obviously Hope introducing himself and his journey.
The emo-rock vibes seems... softer here? It might be Hobi's rapping, which moves from steady, low rap to more of shouts. His flow is absolutely sick.
More
We've talked about More so I won't repeat myself much. My opinion hasn't really changed, except that 1) I appreciate his verses more after reading up on them; and 2) in the natural flow of the album, it fits super well. Its sound is a louder, more repressed version of Pandora's Box - just before Hope was released from the box into the world, I suppose. Still not really for me, but I appreciate it.
Stop
My. Jam. It's just.... so sexy and cool and chill. Maybe I'm just basic lol. It's probably not a coincidence that his rapping here is closest to the type of rapping you may have noticed I have an obvious preference for - a lot of changes to the flow and tone over a relatively steady beat. Syncopation followed by crisp and fast flows (I'm pretty sure this is some version of "triplet flow"??? xD Tell me if I'm wrong). Hobi said this song contains his reflections on human nature, which I assume is actually quite dark, given the background sounds of (violent) traffic stops (-Get it? xD) and news in the background.
= (Equal Sign)
I wasn't sure at first but now I loveeeeeee. This sounds quite hopeful? Hobi's rap-singing is so nice. There's something both poppy and choir-like about the chorus. It's probably as close Hobi gets to his sound in Hope World on this album. I don't know, it's just easy listening.
Music Box: Reflection
This interlude is so freaking creepy. Good way to go from that peak of optimism to deep and dark and angsty again xD
(Also, I genuinely hate the real Jack in the Boxes. Nightmare vibes)
What If...
The Rolling Stones article says that apparently Hobi sampled his inspirations in this? I'm definitely not cultured enough to get that. I just don't like the shouty, hoarse kind of refrain (and he repeats "What If? What if?" in that voice... for a really long time). I'm sure it expresses exactly what he wants though, which is a lot of doubt - the steady, discordant piano in the background the entire time really gives that vibe.
The swear at the very end is very sexy though.
Safety Zone
I'm pretty sure this is going to be the favorite b-side, it's a crowd pleaser. The backing vocals are really lovely (I don't who it is? It's not a collab and they're not credited??? I think we might have to wait until we get the full credits as written in the album to know); and this feels kind of old-school, r&b infused hip hop? Also, as may be clear by now, I prefer Hobi's less aggressive delivery. He delivers sadness with a hint of nostalgia (regret?) really beautifully.
Future
I'm pretty sure there's a play on weddings at the beginning, between the I Do and what I swear is a melody meant to invoke the wedding march. This one isn't my favorite but is the fast fave of real-life friends I really respect. Also Hobi sings again!
Arson
I. Love. Arson. Its sound is clearly the sister to More, but I just like a lot more. I don't really know what technically Hobi's doing, but his flow is absolutely insane. And since we have the MV, we have the lyrics already so I can talk about it. I absolutely love that this is the outro—he's released out of his box, he's reflecting on his path so far (achieving success, money, fame) and how his ambition -from More - has burned everything to the ground ("Let's burn" "Let's burn" transitioning into "It's done" "It's done"). So. As this is the outro, and the lyrics say what it says, we can understand the act of Arson is essentially the album JITB itself... And that everything has burned down, consuming what he's built and himself (note how in the MV he's surrounded by burned structures, including what looks suspiciously like the stairs from HYYH; and that he's fully burned up himself, with all those face burns), forcing him to move deep into himself, quite literally in the MV... what's next, for Hobi?
We don't know. The song fades out with finality. The MV has him lying down in a field with things still burning around him - it ends, essentially, on a lull, an open question.
And I freaking love that. So fitting for this stage of BTS's / Hobi's career.
Closing thoughts
The production is impeccable—even for someone who can't really hear these things usually. Hobi's meticulousness comes through. Every single verse is so tight, every sound so complex. There's no fat to this album at all. It's clearly his entire heart and bones.
Speaking of no fat though - Why is every song so short xD I know it's a trend so it's easy to make songs go viral and stream, but pleaseeeee give me back by 3:30-4:00 min songs so I can hear songs develop over their duration.
I just want to say I actually really like the rollout out of this album. People have Thoughts on the Weverse album (which I'll address later, but generally I think the criticism is overblown - but anyway, today is for the celebration) but let's look at everything else, yeah? Hobi - and HYBE, since the costs obviously came out of their pockets and they had to be onboard in executing the rollout plan- clearly spared no expense. Two title songs (a pre-single of MORE, and the main single of Arson, you can think of it I suppose like Black Swan and ON) + two extremely complex MVs. Freaking KAWS to do the cover art (can you imagine how expensive this must've been, even if KAWS cut him a "new friend" discount?). Not sure how the Hobipalooza headlining offer came through, but that's a whole massive production to invest in (100k people are expected to show). Pretty top-tier communications push, both in Korea and the US - besides the interviews I have above, Hobi's had spots for Spotify, Apple Music, etc, he's even been placed on a Spotify playlist that is not kpop but just hiphop (and that change is a big deal and so gratifying, it shows that they're succeeding in ensuring BTS is not pigeon-holed). A freaking wild listening launch party with every cool and attractive people there, spanning the entire music industry - producers, idols, indie & upcoming rappers, solo mainstream artist, even his old street dancer role model??? Fabulous.
Speaking of JITB's position, this obviously is just a straight hip hop album, not "kpop" - no choreo, for one, and the sound is just... not really pop at all. Which is why everyone but especially the anon who slid into my dms annoyed/wondering why he doesn't have schedules on music shows should reflect on what that means. Of course, Hobi could perform on Music Bank etc (are they going to say no to him? Obviously not) - and I'm not ruling out he'll make a surprise appearance to see ARMY - but can you not see it's not the right forum for his album? Those music shows are idol-centric in Korea, they don't really have mainstream or indie artists like solo rappers (which Hobi is for the moment) on there. Instead, he's headlining Lollapalooza. Do you know what that signifies? It signifies, as I mentioned in my More post, that Hobi is clearly positioning himself very differently to how BTS does, which is pretty firmly still an idol group. And that's aligned with what they told us about Chapter 2. And I'm just... having so much fun??? We were getting into a comfortable rhythm of a comeback and all its predictable steps. This is all fresh new strategy for them.
Final thought - this really intrigues me for what Hobipalooza's set list will look like. He did say he will show Hobi colors, and I can't think of Hobi without thinking dance, and we haven't seen any dancing from him yet. So that's my big prediction for the festival. And none of these songs strike me as easy to choreo (or freestyle?!) on top of, so I'm expecting interesting things for the set!!! And honestly, I do love kpop, and the essence of that is visual, staging, dancing, and I super hope they fuse that sensibility with the actual music here, which is not very kpoppy at all.... The result I truly think will be another example of BTS paving the way, haha. But I'm trying not to get my hopes up too much xD We'll see!!
Have my fave Hobi photo from that launch party to close <3 Let's have our own listening to celebrate his album this week everyone!!!!
[And don't forget to tune into Hobi's album launch vlive tomorrow morning!! 9am EST!!!]
What part of Focus on J-Hope today do you all not understand?
Any additional asks I get today about Vmin will be deleted.
Any "insecure asks" that sound anything like "Wahhhh console me Drift I'm so sad we didn't get a photo or see them lately" or "They're not half of what we thought and we must now accept it 😔😔😔" will be blocked.
Why people don’t get that spending 24/7 is not healthy? And that hashtags #vmindivorce is just pushing guys into doing something they don’t want? Do we really wanna ruin their relations with a constant demand to PROVE IT and to do something because they MUST?
I have a much longer post for this later today but I agree. Knock it the hell off.
If you're bored because there's no "new content" you get to see on a real relationship - one that's lasted for 10 years, one they've themselves said they intend on making last for the rest of their lives - go find something else to do with your abundantly free time.
Like. Say. Oh, I don't know - streaming and supporting Hobi's new solo album???? One being treated seriously and gaining traction in the Western mainstream, in a way I would've not thought possible before?
And seriously: Today? His release date, of all things?
I'm actually so offended. Take off your ARMY nametag and go.
EDIT
From anon: Assuming this is people being disappointed about not getting a vmin party pic or something? People (fans) weren't even sure Seokjin was at the party at all for most of the night... which goes to show, just because there aren't pictures or videos of some members hanging out together (or those pics or vids don't immediately emerge), doesn't mean that they weren't hanging out at the party at all or, certainly, that they therefore aren't truly close. The members are almost constantly together so being at a big party was a chance for them to all socialise in their different ways, to meet new people, or hang out with friends they might not get to see as often in some cases... which means some mingling here and there, some trips to the dance floor, some time having conversations with cool people, some sitting on a corner of the stage sipping a drink quietly... you know different ways of enjoying a party, like normal people... or just leaving when one's social battery is depleted (lol Seokjin). I'm actually really glad their 'Chapter 2' means we're now able to see them having fun at a party with other friends (including those of the opposite sex) without people freaking out so much about it. They deserve the chance to just enjoy themselves without being analysed... people just need to chill and let them breathe without questioning every little thing they do.
Got it in one.
Yup - It's not like we saw Jin talking to the other members either, but do you think they just ignored him or something all night?
And yupppp, I'll just note that Jessi mentioned she talked with Jimin for nearly 40 minutes and he's such a good kid, but we didn't see any of that in the what, 10 mins total of clips we saw?
In fact, I'll add a little bit more context: she got a little mad at so called fans in her recent live asking for selfies with BTS actually (I saw this live in real time, I'm a Jessi fan haha), jokingly not jokingly snapping at one point they had been there to talk to people and listen to Hobi's album, not take selfies. "That's so cringe, guys." (I remember vividly because I was howling with laughter - she said this in English too) (she's Korean-American so does lives 75% in English). She even stated she's pretty sure she talked to 120+ people before leaving because it was so hot in there.
Of course in this type of venue they need to do a roulette of photos with all combos of BTS, or they hate each other now, right? *eyeroll* I can't believe minimoni & 94z are divorced now!
Anyway, to anon's last point, I also love that they are (again) showing that they are in fact adults, not 14 year olds scared of strangers or cooties or whatever. That they do not need to be attached at the hip to have meaningful relationships with each other. And I'll remind you it's a privilege to see/get this type of content, because I'm sure they did this (eg attend industry events, which obviously are packed with attractive men & women) all the time in chp 1, we just see it now.
Have my 2 fave Tae & Jimin photos posted yesterday!
Make sure you watch the MV and stream JITB at your favorite streaming platforms like Spotify!! (And do what Hobi suggests and listen to it in order, like you would read a book)
Afterwards: Buy the digital singles!! Also, if you can, buy the Weverse albums to make sure he does well on the Korean charts!
As you listen to his album, you may also want to watch his explanation of each song, and read this fantastic interview the Rolling Stones just did for the album drop (props to the writer for some fantastic questions, she really did her homework)
J-Hope goes inside the process for Jack in the Box, getting support from his fellow BTS members, and showing off his darker side
I'm going to do something slightly experimental and post my current quick (almost live) takes on each song - hopefully it makes your own listening experience more fun. Keep in mind that it's first impressions and we don't have the lyrics yet - I fully expect when I wake up tomorrow our beloved translators will have gone through and I can do some more thoughts :D But I'm curious how the lyrics will alter my opinions on the songs, so let this be a historical record of my original thoughts, haha.
Let's get it!
As always, the caveat: I am actually very dumb and basic it comes to music - particularly with regards to a song's production or sound. The only thing I'm confident about is lyrics, which we don't have yet. So keep that in mind xD If I'm wrong about technical terms or whatever, it's not a professional music critic's review, it's my unabashed fangirl's opinion, haha.
Also! I recommend you listen to the album in real time as you read each song discussion!!! You'll get more from it.
Intro
Hobi obviously positions this as both a hip hop album & a BTS album by following the traditional structure of hip hop albums that they've used for most of their albums - intro, an interlude, and outro. This one's in English so the meaning's pretty obvious: he's setting up the scene. This album is Hope (himself) leaving the box. The backing sound is very beautiful and ethereal, fairytale... which distorts at the very end, to showcase that this Hope is darker, the will to carry on is darker—but perhaps just as cathartic.
Pandora's Box
Indeed, to emphasize the message of what I said just above, you can hear the backing sound of the Intro re-used at the beginning of Pandora's Box—but with a more sinister beat.
This song I can't wait to get the lyrics on, as it's very obviously Hope introducing himself and his journey.
The emo-rock vibes seems... softer here? It might be Hobi's rapping, which moves from steady, low rap to more of shouts. His flow is absolutely sick.
More
We've talked about More so I won't repeat myself much. My opinion hasn't really changed, except that 1) I appreciate his verses more after reading up on them; and 2) in the natural flow of the album, it fits super well. Its sound is a louder, more repressed version of Pandora's Box - just before Hope was released from the box into the world, I suppose. Still not really for me, but I appreciate it.
Stop
My. Jam. It's just.... so sexy and cool and chill. Maybe I'm just basic lol. It's probably not a coincidence that his rapping here is closest to the type of rapping you may have noticed I have an obvious preference for - a lot of changes to the flow and tone over a relatively steady beat. Syncopation followed by crisp and fast flows (I'm pretty sure this is some version of "triplet flow"??? xD Tell me if I'm wrong). Hobi said this song contains his reflections on human nature, which I assume is actually quite dark, given the background sounds of (violent) traffic stops (-Get it? xD) and news in the background.
= (Equal Sign)
I wasn't sure at first but now I loveeeeeee. This sounds quite hopeful? Hobi's rap-singing is so nice. There's something both poppy and choir-like about the chorus. It's probably as close Hobi gets to his sound in Hope World on this album. I don't know, it's just easy listening.
Music Box: Reflection
This interlude is so freaking creepy. Good way to go from that peak of optimism to deep and dark and angsty again xD
(Also, I genuinely hate the real Jack in the Boxes. Nightmare vibes)
What If...
The Rolling Stones article says that apparently Hobi sampled his inspirations in this? I'm definitely not cultured enough to get that. I just don't like the shouty, hoarse kind of refrain (and he repeats "What If? What if?" in that voice... for a really long time). I'm sure it expresses exactly what he wants though, which is a lot of doubt - the steady, discordant piano in the background the entire time really gives that vibe.
The swear at the very end is very sexy though.
Safety Zone
I'm pretty sure this is going to be the favorite b-side, it's a crowd pleaser. The backing vocals are really lovely (I don't who it is? It's not a collab and they're not credited??? I think we might have to wait until we get the full credits as written in the album to know); and this feels kind of old-school, r&b infused hip hop? Also, as may be clear by now, I prefer Hobi's less aggressive delivery. He delivers sadness with a hint of nostalgia (regret?) really beautifully.
Future
I'm pretty sure there's a play on weddings at the beginning, between the I Do and what I swear is a melody meant to invoke the wedding march. This one isn't my favorite but is the fast fave of real-life friends I really respect. Also Hobi sings again!
Arson
I. Love. Arson. Its sound is clearly the sister to More, but I just like a lot more. I don't really know what technically Hobi's doing, but his flow is absolutely insane. And since we have the MV, we have the lyrics already so I can talk about it. I absolutely love that this is the outro—he's released out of his box, he's reflecting on his path so far (achieving success, money, fame) and how his ambition -from More - has burned everything to the ground ("Let's burn" "Let's burn" transitioning into "It's done" "It's done"). So. As this is the outro, and the lyrics say what it says, we can understand the act of Arson is essentially the album JITB itself... And that everything has burned down, consuming what he's built and himself (note how in the MV he's surrounded by burned structures, including what looks suspiciously like the stairs from HYYH; and that he's fully burned up himself, with all those face burns), forcing him to move deep into himself, quite literally in the MV... what's next, for Hobi?
We don't know. The song fades out with finality. The MV has him lying down in a field with things still burning around him - it ends, essentially, on a lull, an open question.
And I freaking love that. So fitting for this stage of BTS's / Hobi's career.
Closing thoughts
The production is impeccable—even for someone who can't really hear these things usually. Hobi's meticulousness comes through. Every single verse is so tight, every sound so complex. There's no fat to this album at all. It's clearly his entire heart and bones.
Speaking of no fat though - Why is every song so short xD I know it's a trend so it's easy to make songs go viral and stream, but pleaseeeee give me back by 3:30-4:00 min songs so I can hear songs develop over their duration.
I just want to say I actually really like the rollout out of this album. People have Thoughts on the Weverse album (which I'll address later, but generally I think the criticism is overblown - but anyway, today is for the celebration) but let's look at everything else, yeah? Hobi - and HYBE, since the costs obviously came out of their pockets and they had to be onboard in executing the rollout plan- clearly spared no expense. Two title songs (a pre-single of MORE, and the main single of Arson, you can think of it I suppose like Black Swan and ON) + two extremely complex MVs. Freaking KAWS to do the cover art (can you imagine how expensive this must've been, even if KAWS cut him a "new friend" discount?). Not sure how the Hobipalooza headlining offer came through, but that's a whole massive production to invest in (100k people are expected to show). Pretty top-tier communications push, both in Korea and the US - besides the interviews I have above, Hobi's had spots for Spotify, Apple Music, etc, he's even been placed on a Spotify playlist that is not kpop but just hiphop (and that change is a big deal and so gratifying, it shows that they're succeeding in ensuring BTS is not pigeon-holed). A freaking wild listening launch party with every cool and attractive people there, spanning the entire music industry - producers, idols, indie & upcoming rappers, solo mainstream artist, even his old street dancer role model??? Fabulous.
Speaking of JITB's position, this obviously is just a straight hip hop album, not "kpop" - no choreo, for one, and the sound is just... not really pop at all. Which is why everyone but especially the anon who slid into my dms annoyed/wondering why he doesn't have schedules on music shows should reflect on what that means. Of course, Hobi could perform on Music Bank etc (are they going to say no to him? Obviously not) - and I'm not ruling out he'll make a surprise appearance to see ARMY - but can you not see it's not the right forum for his album? Those music shows are idol-centric in Korea, they don't really have mainstream or indie artists like solo rappers (which Hobi is for the moment) on there. Instead, he's headlining Lollapalooza. Do you know what that signifies? It signifies, as I mentioned in my More post, that Hobi is clearly positioning himself very differently to how BTS does, which is pretty firmly still an idol group. And that's aligned with what they told us about Chapter 2. And I'm just... having so much fun??? We were getting into a comfortable rhythm of a comeback and all its predictable steps. This is all fresh new strategy for them.
Final thought - this really intrigues me for what Hobipalooza's set list will look like. He did say he will show Hobi colors, and I can't think of Hobi without thinking dance, and we haven't seen any dancing from him yet. So that's my big prediction for the festival. And none of these songs strike me as easy to choreo (or freestyle?!) on top of, so I'm expecting interesting things for the set!!! And honestly, I do love kpop, and the essence of that is visual, staging, dancing, and I super hope they fuse that sensibility with the actual music here, which is not very kpoppy at all.... The result I truly think will be another example of BTS paving the way, haha. But I'm trying not to get my hopes up too much xD We'll see!!
Have my fave Hobi photo from that launch party to close <3 Let's have our own listening to celebrate his album this week everyone!!!!
[And don't forget to tune into Hobi's album launch vlive tomorrow morning!! 9am EST!!!]
Compositionally, this is a really interesting, experimental song - as always, I caveat I'm not a music critic, but you can just hear it. His signature 90s hip hop is blended with screamer rock (the snares, guitar, chorus). Not at all hook-led, really. Packaged together with the visuals, which is much darker than anythimg Hobi's done, it is not just a departure for a Hobi, but a real risk - and I really respect the courage Hobi had to do something so atypical and personal instead of something "safe", as the first one out of the gate. It makes me really excited for the rest of Hobi's album and the rest of the members, because they truly seem to be prioritizing (new) musical colors of themselves we've never seen.
Relatedly to the first bullet: Part of Chp 2 seems to be a... not disdain, but disinterest in the massive numbers they used to pull? Just musical authenticity? Not that I think more commercially minded songs like Butter or PTD don't express them as musical artists at all, but I think it's clear those songs valued commercial success and were then injected with their personal messages and sincerity. But More? This is, frankly put, simply not a song that would be a radio hit; it's not "stream-friendly" either, lacking an aggressive pop hook and the approachable vibes of Chicken Noodle Soup; and not "viral-friendly," as it doesn't come with a dance for TikTok challenges to be built around. That this was Hobi's choice (in consultation of HYBE I'm sure) as the pre-release song sort of sets expectations for what theirs (and perhaps our) goals for Chp 2 are. Of course, we as a fandom should work hard to make their songs a success, but More suggests their work this period will be geared towards self-expression and not general public popularity or recognition. Honestly, this is something Hobi sort of discusses in song - he says he still wants the stadiums filled with fans, but for "the awards and grammys", he's just sweeping them in his bag and "fame and money don't mean everything." And I have a lot of respect for that. And I sure hope the people who complained endlessly about the English trilogy (and pretend BE doesn't exist) pay damn close attention and support hard.
I'm not a mv analyzer and I'm sure you can find a lot of that on YouTube and Twitter already. I will just point out that unlike some reactors, I don't view the MV message (and the song's message) as a negative one. Hobi's clearly expressing a lot of ambition; a lot of desire to express himself more (bring himself outside the box, so to speak, note the way his shout chorus is in fact more if a stifled shout); and a dissatisfaction with what he currently shows, which showcases his well-known perfectionism ("I want more" "I'm still (not enough)"). At the end of the MV, where his alternate self is disrupting normal life in dark, whimsical ways, Hobi closes the box where all that happened, which seems sad... but if you think about the symbolism on the meta level, he HAS shown us what's in the box. So my personal interpretation of the song is that this is what he felt in Chp 1, and now in Chp 2 he's showing Jack slash that alter ego. He's opening the box. This is a prelude, scene setting. I'm curious to see where he takes the "story" through the rest of his album, because apparently he DID structure the tracks to show a narrative.
Real talk, I'm not much for this type of rock (I am kind of a basic bitch pop-rap person) so this song isn't really for me - it's a bit niche, which I'm sure Hobi knows and that deserves its own respect (see bullet 1 & 2). But I am very intrigued by the hip hop-rock mashup, and all the innovation he did on this album (Pdogg says Hobi's done things here he's never seen, and hopefully we'll get to hear him play a lot with these variations on hiphop).
Make sure to stream More by J-Hope! And buy the album, which does not have a physical disk so will not count for Billboards but will count for the Korean charts!
Hi.. so i have this topic that idk if it’s discussed in the fandom or what I’m about to share is a very unpopular opinion.. and actually it’s not mine and I don’t see it nor believe in it.. it bothers me a lot though.. and that’s why I’m seeking different opinions cuz i hope I’m not the only one..
So I’ve been following a body language expert who analyses kpop idols energy and communication skills as well as their behavior all from their body language.. their emotions while interacting with fans or their members etc..
So this expert has been focusing a lot on Tae, specifically.. negatively too.. they kept saying how much his energy changed in the past 2 years to something almost unrecognizable.. he became so cocky and arrogant.. and it’s getting worse because of the fans hyping him up.. he changed into a person who’s self centered and doesn’t care about hurting others without guilt.. he lost his gratefulness and if he showcases any it’s just to get reactions from his fans to satisfy his ego…..
The thing about this negative as hell observation is that it comes from a claimed expert who has been in the field for 9 years, allegedly, and they have their platform.. now personally i see nothing of such horrible behavior on Tae.. and I hope I’m not the only one.. and I’m just asking to know if more ppl noticed such things? I’d really like to know ur opinion about this whole topic.. analyzed deeply because i trust ur thoughts and ur points of view as well..
what do u think?
This one's easy: I don't need to know who that expert is to know that's all total trash.
Here's a history of "body language analysis", including all its limitations. You can tell certain basic things - say, when someone's uncomfortable - caveating that it requires knowledge of their cultural background and individual and idiosynchratic habits/traits. But you can't know someone's intention from body language, what nonsense. How the heck would this so-called expert differentiate between if Tae is being grateful to "feed his ego" or to maybe... just be nice? Or maybe he has no real thoughts or intentionality, he was just raised that way?
Also, I don't know this person's credentials but I'd be extremely wary. Most people can be anything on the internet, and we don't know if those 9 years means they were a former FBI analytics agent... or at home giving people pseudo-science lessons and reading books.
For context: here's a WIRED video with an actual former FBI agent with 25 years of experience. Pay attention to how limited the scope of things he can observe about a scene / person is, even when he's in person. Even he's nor able to tell a person's deep-rooted values, history, character, etc - but I'm supposed to believe this random YouTube influencer can? Also, he appears to not be as good in non-Western context - note he talks about how important and engrained for "most cultures" a handshake is... which is just not true for most East Asian cultures. And I'd 100% bet he'd not be able to understand the gradations of a bow in Korea. But, again, I'm supposed to trust random YouTube influencer can?
As they've told us to do many times, I trust what BTS says. The things they themselves tell me. Only that. Not someone's ~"implications"~ or ~"extrapolations"~. Since this a Vminnie's blog, I'll quote Jimin on Tae from the Let's BTS show (this isnt word for word, you can find that on the blog I link!): 'I thought he was just like a manhwa character, but he's the most human of us."
You can remember Tae's own words too. He's talked, over and over again, about how grateful he is for ARMY and his members for the unbelievable place they've ended up; how he didn't want to rise high but to rise right, so they can do this - be artist, be with each other and us - for a long time; how there are so many other things he wants to explore, so many sides of himself he wants to show us. What type of person thinks and does this? A good, kind person and an ambitious artist.
And I am not going to let Rando on YouTube 105 speak over Tae or the rest of BTS - and you shouldn't either.
1. Go read my post, including my reblog, which is a response to your 2nd, frankly deranged, ask.
2. My other, better anons have some words for you:
From anon: Just something that I found funny about what you mentioned. I’m from Europe myself (not France but an other country) and not that long ago before mobile phones with cameras became a thing it was very normal that women walked around on the beach topless as well, without it being a problem. Although social norms have changed since then and have become more conservative, I’m always a little surprised when I see people from other countries react scandalised about something that is not really noteworthy in my eyes 😅
From anon: to the last anon you answered: kindly fuck off and stop essentialising an entire culture (which, mind you, you apparently know nothing about) based off tired stereotypes. — a queer counterculture chinese woman who shouldn't exist by your 'conservative' standards
From anon [Drift: actually name redacted - wasn't sure if you wanted me to post this with name]: What is it with your anons lately??? Especially the last one ... I mean it's fine if you're not comfortable with being sexual or naked or whatever (you should maybe wonder why, though) but ... bts obviously is??? At least some of the guys?? So ... they can do whatever they want?????
And what's with that 'korean families are this', 'korean society is that' stupidity? Yes, that might be the case - but again: very obviously not for bts????
And I'm gonna say this now because I'm very done with all the shit I read recently: you don't have to agree with everything they do, of yourse not, I don't either. But if you're not ready to support what makes them happy, if you liking them is actually more about you wanting them to be what you expect them to be instead of who they really are, then fuck off. I don't care whether you pretend to be an ARMY since fucking 2013. Just fuck off.
Sorry for the rant, but this topic makes me really angry. You do amazing work on your blog, even if I don't always agree with everything. Thank you and please keep it up 💜
So yeah. Fuck off.
Because I honestly have zero time for you. I'm going to spend time writing for my 500+ lovely followers (I hit this milestone this week, so thank you!) and not you, a pathetic homophobic, racist loser with nothing better to do than police artists living their best lives.
EDIT: Hey, coward. Don't send me other deranged asks as anon, using new IPs to get past my block. I don't have an obligation to take up half my front page with your dumb, homophobic words? Esp when I can post one of my 100+ asks (and that's after aggressive deleting. I used to have 500? 600?), many of which are lovely but I never got time for - or whatever else I want to post here on my blog. Write your own blog. Or comment on this post, using your real tumblr user, with your full thoughts if you want - I'll let readers who care about you rip you apart and fill up your inbox. I'm going to work on other things, like writing Hobi's profile to celebrate the upcoming release of his album.
I really really like ( being sarcastic) the way you are projecting your ideologies on Taehyung while criticizing the anon who is saying that the after-party made them uncomfortable... hypocrisy at its finest!
Hey you! Where do you think Taehyung lives? How was HIS upbringing? How is HIS society? How about HIS culture? Do HIS people accept French norms or the french way of partying? Is this part of their norms ? Is this how parties go normally in South Korea? Sooo you accept other aspects of South Korean culture like skin-ship, etc. etc. when it's only convenient for your "analysis"
BUT at the end of the day he is South Korean... a conservative society from a conservative family. In South Korea many old kids 20+ still live with their families, take their parents permissions before getting married, asking for parents approval for their Significant other.... and family is number 1 something that is the complete opposite in the west. For example the amount of old people who are left in shelters and their kids never visit them( not relevant to the topic but this is one difference among thousands more between the 2 cultures)
You forgot apparently KOREAN Army... did they like the after-party or it made them uncomfortable as well? Listen I am French Canadian, however I am tired of the western world/fans projecting their ideologies and impose them on any other fan who is not on the same page as them... you know BTS have Fans from all over the world righ? : China, Japan, Indonesia, Malaysia, India, Iran, Turkey, Middle East which has more than 17 countries itself, Pakistan, and many other. Those cultures are all conservatives BTW. BTS fans are not ONLY the US and the Europe so wake-up cuz the world doesn't revolve around you. At the end of the day BTS are South Koreans and will always live in South Korea... they are happy with their culture and they "either you like it or not" will root for their Korean fans. The western world has really recently after Dynamite era started paying attention to BTS... however long before that, those " conservatives" that you don't like rooted for BTS for their meaningful songs, their swearing-less, nudity-less MVs something that the western world doesn't really care much about... look at nowadays mvs...
You who maybe started following BTS 2, 3 years ago? There are those who have been there since 2013 and they have opinions that probably more important than yours since they supported them before all of this "BTS phenomenon" happened.
Advice to you is: WAKE UP!
Now if you have the courage ...reply to this ask.
You like to talk way too much so let's see how you gonna prove me wrong 🤔
Ps. My first language is French so try to not focus too much on grammatical mistakes if not we can speak in French if you want.
1. Korea is conservative as a society, broadly speaking. What does that have to do with Tae's views? He drinks like BTS drinks. He attends parties like BTS attends parties. He has been supportive of queer people like BTS supports queer people (Namjoon literally just recced artwork by an Cuban-born gay artist). You are painting in very broad strokes who Tae and his family is based on stereotypes of Korean society. Maybe look at his behavior and what he's said?
Case in point: America is majority Christian, white, right-center politically, loves guns.
I'm me. American but none of those things.
2. If fans without boundaries have issues with BTS's behavior, due to their conservatism or for whatever reason, that's a you issue. Not an event issue. Not a management issue. Not a BTS issue.
Respecting fans and cultural difference looks like Suga not saying "naega" because it sounds too much like the n word in the US; BTS changing their stylings and covering up Jimin's gold mic in Saudia Arabia in deference to local norms; them not hugging or holding hands with a Muslim fan unless she initiates in recognition of her religion. (These are all true examples btw). It does not extend to letting you dictate how they live their life based on your prudishness, and no real fans would demand that of their artists.
I de facto want whatever BTS wants. And Tae wanted to be at that party. And loved that trip. Just as Namjoon liked going to museums and just hanging out in his room while abroad. I'm not encouraging everyone to party or whatever, I'm saying we should embrace however they choose to live their life. That's literally the definition of being socially tolerant.
3. Ah. Yes. Their swearing-less, nudity-less music 😂 Are you sure you're a fan? Your accusations about me imposing my views on them simply show you don't bother to pay any attention to their lyrics, messaging, or history. Instead, you are simply making frankly racist presumptions on what they must be like as "chaste Koreans". It's, excuse my language, that f****** Asian Purity b******* I had to fight back all my life against.
Here's your nudeless, sexless BTS at debut, in between, and now:
[By the by, because it cracks me up, RM literally shared sexually explicit songs with ARMY in 2014. And never forget his immortal song Expensive Girls, also released a decade ago - "I'm a master, baby with your bra / Take it off now girl just take it off / I can help you slide those panties off" 😂]
All throughout their career, they've made songs related to serious social topics and blazing diss songs that are sometimes filled with profanity and even one or two sexual innuendo. It's part of what makes their songs so meaningful, not divorced from it.
[The songs are, in case you don't recognize them, Go Go, Bapsae which apparently has much more rudeness and slang in Korean, No More Dream similarly too, Intro: Nevermind has some English swears if the Korean language passes you by and is extremely meaningful]
But I feel like this ask is more specifically anger at them being sexually explicit. So thanks also for giving me the oppt to talk about "Send you to Hong Kong" and my "tongue technology" (all Korean sex slangs, btw, because believe it or not, Koreans can be dirty too) on the song Agust D. Put on the English (or French) lyrics if you prefer, you're in for some fun. And since it's a song off Yoongi's very personal first mixtape, made almost end to end by him, it's not like he was scandalizing himself - is he scandalizing you? I hope so.
Listen to Do You from RM while you're at it too, especially the lyrics "Muf*ckas keep muf*ckin all day/ Follow my sh*t, my friend and I’ll pay", which is still a little less than his ""Just play with your d*ck, it'll feel good, yeah, you’re my enemy so f*ck off" on Joke.
Even our maknae's getting in on the 18+ vibes! Granted, Left & Right JK didn't write, but he apparently didn't mind collabbing on a song about the days after extremely good sex ("tangled up in my bed" "the things you did to me") - and isn't phase 2 about showing the colors they want?
Many, many of their songs had to have their lyrics changed before they could be broadcast on public TV - in fact Jungkook's whole literal hand with its tattoos has to be blurred so that he can be on public TV - if that isn't the best metaphor for how BTS is much more socially progressive than average in South Korea, I don't know what to tell you. And that shouldn't be a surprise. They've always been exceptional.
Their more all-ages era started with Dynamite, actually (maybe Boy in Love if you want to go back a bit more). So honestly, it's more likely for new Western fans to think they're PG, when older fans would likely know all that *waves*. I don't mind that PG music, there's space for BTS to create all types. But because all that explicitness and social progressivism are actually part of BTS and offends conservative sensibilities, I'd say we progressives - Korean and American and all nationalities embrace them whole. As they are and all of them. Which is all they've ever asked of us. And frankly, what actual love is.]
4. I don't know how Korean parties usually go, but I know decently well how the rich party in Korea, yes, actually. It's the internet, so there's no reason for you to believe me, but I went to university with literal chaebols (I went to an American Ivy League); and in my late teens early 20s spent some time partying all around Asia, including Korea, a... decent amount, let's say. I grew up poor, but got extremely, extremely lucky. You're right, I became ARMY proper only two years ago, but my first exposure to BTS was when I went to a music show in 2014 because a Korean friend whose mom was a producer on it invited us.
So I just wanted to share that anon responded in a very long-winded manner, which basically ended with them saying I'm disgusting for making it all about SEX.
Yes. Capitalized and everything. SEX.
For... factually talking about how they have plenty of swears, slang, sexual content and innuendos in their song—and are therefore not as "conservative" as anon is painting all of Korea and BTS. And originally talking about Tae partying in Paris and "pole-dancing", and by that I mean spinning around on a pole in a way that was about as sensual as a kitten meowing at you with big eyes, lol. None of which was inherently sexual.
So anyway, it's displacement again. I'm not the one sexualizing BTS, they are.
From anon: They might like a gay singer because they like their songs and the lyrics, not just because the singer is gay or queer. *Now call me homophobic lol* When I am just pointing out that liking a gay or LGBTQ+ artist is not meant necessarily to support the LGBTQ+ community, but rather to support that artist himself / herself / themselves.... just the human being the artist.
So. Anon also:
-Took issue with me implying Namjoon recommending a gay artist means he supports LGBTQ rights. He could just be "appreciating the beauty of the art or the song or the movie despite the artist's sexuality."
There's the very obvious point that Namjoon has been on the record as an LGBTQ ally (Remember when he said learning the meaning of the song Same Love, which he identified as being about homosexuality (specifically about how homosexual love and het love is equal), made it twice as good?) - so I'm not assuming anything he's not said.
There's also the very obvious point that thinking Namjoon, the dude who writes songs as sociopolitical as BTS's songs, can see art as totally divorced from its social message is literally stupid.
[You want me to talk about that art and why it's powerful? The art Namjoon viewed - though I should point out it was 2 artists in that exhibit actually, one male, one female, both gay, you can read more about it here - is powerful because some works relate to the love the artist had for his lover, who died of AIDS (like him later); and this love is one many people would consider disgusting and illegitimate. But Namjoon did not, and he shared that beautiful art, knowing folks like this anon might disagree with him. During pride month no less. And the context is integral. It's like No More Dream is universally about resistance, but also quite specifically about the Korean education system and its oppression, and can't be fully understood without taking that into account]
But I want to point out the most obvious point, which is that anon is implicitly implying that being gay is something bad. Something that you must look beyond. Which is homophobic.
[I think they actually wanted me to applaud them for seeing the humanity of queer artists "despite" their sexuality? Like, seriously, am I, a queer person, supposed to applaud you for the backhanded compliment? 🤮]
-Conflated me talking about the artist's sexuality (in 5 words) as talking about Sex. Yes. Not Identity. Not Who They Love. But SEX!!!
And this is another obvious point, but sexual orientation is not about sex to anyone but people who are grossed out by what we do in bed. People who are, you guessed it. Homophobic.
It may not surprise you that anon is also a little sexist, problematizing women showing skin but apparently taking no issue with men showing abs. Phew, double standards.
Actually, anon dared me to call them homophobic.
Let me do something better: You are Grade A, Gold-Star Homophobe in fact. Also sexist. Also sex negative. Also racist (see: previous essentialism of a whole culture, while playing into the Asian Purity nonsense).
So obviously, anon is blocked because I deal with this enough in my real life, lol. But also I do want to show my readers - who have at times wondered how a BTS "fan" could be homophobic, racist, or sexist. And well. Here you all! Somehow we found someone who is all 3!
Also, I wanted to share something hilarious.
From anon: If they are so progressive like Westerners, why do they hide their history? Why do they care? Why JK apologizes when photos with his tattoo artist got leaked? Why don't they go out explicitly with their female friends? Why if BTS uses words like 'shit' or whatever, that would be only at the US but never in Korea? And so many other things that I don't have time to name. Conclusion is: they still care about the norms of their society and their image in their country. Whatever BTS does, if they walk naked in the streets, if they hang out with girls, if they pole dance, if they get covered with tattoos, the western fans won't care, in fact they will cheer for them. However, the Korean fans won't be appreciative.
So... anon... inadvertently proved my argument? They recognized that 1) BTS has done things against conservative norms; 2) wanted to do these things, to the extent that they find workarounds like JK getting a small tattoo then larger ones, spreading out backlash over time; 3) the more conservative Korean music industry / culture is stopping them from doing what they truly want and truly being free.
But their conclusion is that I should not cheer on BTS when they resist the unfair, conservative norms of society. I should, instead, cheer on Korean society / music industry for successfully oppressing BTS???
This anon really listened to NO - which is BTS explicitly arguing for the need to stand up against an unjust society - and really said, "Nah, actually, let me side with society instead."
I am... head-palming on my desk so hard I'm literally going to hit the floor.
Am I supposed to celebrate that they had to hide their tattoos, their friendships with women, their dating history, etc etc etc? Am I supposed to think it's fine that they have to make compromises with their happiness just to protect their sanity and success? Am I supposed to join dumb fans in making life difficult for them, simply for trying to live their life as they want?
Hell no. I'm going to join the fans who support their choices and demand the rest of society let them live out those choices.
I never said BTS didn't care about society, nor do I claim that they have the same views as I do. I want them to do what they want, not what I want—and sadly, in society, sometimes we all have to compromise on our own happiness, for our safety, sanity, and success. But it shouldn't be this way.
And BTS knows, because they have always argued for resistance (Hello, No More Dream. Hello, NO. Hello, ON). And they've taken their own advice, resisting in subtle ways (for example, JK getting those tattoos, knowing the consequences and backlash that'd face him was an action of resistance). And now they're resisting in much more obvious ways.
That's literally all of Chapter 2. Them doing the things they used to have tiptoe around, regardless of what some toxic fans want (And will you stop painting whole country of fans in one stroke, you cultural essentialist, ugh 🤮 Some karmy fans have been supportive, I've seen them. And you yourself are a Western fan who do not support).
And why shouldn't BTS? They're grown now. They have their proof - their success and ARMY.
I hope Tae dances on as many poles and goes to as parties as much as he desires. I hope JK gets as many tattoos as he wants. I hope they can proudly walk with the people in their lives that make them happy. I hope they get the freedom they explicitly asked us for. In fact, I will fight anyone, including stupid anon like you, to give them that freedom they deserve. It's the least I can do for the joy they give me.
And if you have a problem with any of that? Have fun watching them in the future 😘 Yes, I will continue to cheer them on as they go on their wild adventures. And I hope you watch and seethe and mourn that they aren't "who they used to be."
I really really like ( being sarcastic) the way you are projecting your ideologies on Taehyung while criticizing the anon who is saying that the after-party made them uncomfortable... hypocrisy at its finest!
Hey you! Where do you think Taehyung lives? How was HIS upbringing? How is HIS society? How about HIS culture? Do HIS people accept French norms or the french way of partying? Is this part of their norms ? Is this how parties go normally in South Korea? Sooo you accept other aspects of South Korean culture like skin-ship, etc. etc. when it's only convenient for your "analysis"
BUT at the end of the day he is South Korean... a conservative society from a conservative family. In South Korea many old kids 20+ still live with their families, take their parents permissions before getting married, asking for parents approval for their Significant other.... and family is number 1 something that is the complete opposite in the west. For example the amount of old people who are left in shelters and their kids never visit them( not relevant to the topic but this is one difference among thousands more between the 2 cultures)
You forgot apparently KOREAN Army... did they like the after-party or it made them uncomfortable as well? Listen I am French Canadian, however I am tired of the western world/fans projecting their ideologies and impose them on any other fan who is not on the same page as them... you know BTS have Fans from all over the world righ? : China, Japan, Indonesia, Malaysia, India, Iran, Turkey, Middle East which has more than 17 countries itself, Pakistan, and many other. Those cultures are all conservatives BTW. BTS fans are not ONLY the US and the Europe so wake-up cuz the world doesn't revolve around you. At the end of the day BTS are South Koreans and will always live in South Korea... they are happy with their culture and they "either you like it or not" will root for their Korean fans. The western world has really recently after Dynamite era started paying attention to BTS... however long before that, those " conservatives" that you don't like rooted for BTS for their meaningful songs, their swearing-less, nudity-less MVs something that the western world doesn't really care much about... look at nowadays mvs...
You who maybe started following BTS 2, 3 years ago? There are those who have been there since 2013 and they have opinions that probably more important than yours since they supported them before all of this "BTS phenomenon" happened.
Advice to you is: WAKE UP!
Now if you have the courage ...reply to this ask.
You like to talk way too much so let's see how you gonna prove me wrong 🤔
Ps. My first language is French so try to not focus too much on grammatical mistakes if not we can speak in French if you want.
1. Korea is conservative as a society, broadly speaking. What does that have to do with Tae's views? He drinks like BTS drinks. He attends parties like BTS attends parties. He has been supportive of queer people like BTS supports queer people (Namjoon literally just recced artwork by an Cuban-born gay artist). You are painting in very broad strokes who Tae and his family is based on stereotypes of Korean society. Maybe look at his behavior and what he's said?
Case in point: America is majority Christian, white, right-center politically, loves guns.
I'm me. American but none of those things.
2. If fans without boundaries have issues with BTS's behavior, due to their conservatism or for whatever reason, that's a you issue. Not an event issue. Not a management issue. Not a BTS issue.
Respecting fans and cultural difference looks like Suga not saying "naega" because it sounds too much like the n word in the US; BTS changing their stylings and covering up Jimin's gold mic in Saudia Arabia in deference to local norms; them not hugging or holding hands with a Muslim fan unless she initiates in recognition of her religion. (These are all true examples btw). It does not extend to letting you dictate how they live their life based on your morals and preferences, and no real fans would demand that of their artists.
I de facto want whatever BTS wants. And Tae wanted to be at that party. And loved that trip. Just as Namjoon liked going to museums and just hanging out in his room while abroad. I'm not encouraging everyone to party or whatever, I'm saying we should embrace however they choose to live their life. That's literally the definition of being socially tolerant.
3. Ah. Yes. Their swearing-less, nudity-less music 😂 Are you sure you're a fan? Your accusations about me imposing my views on them simply show you don't bother to pay any attention to their lyrics, messaging, or history. Instead, you are simply making frankly racist presumptions on what they must be like as "chaste Koreans". It's, excuse my language, that f****** Asian Purity b******* I had to fight back all my life against.
Here's your nudeless, sexless BTS at debut, in between, and now:
[By the by, because it cracks me up, RM literally shared sexually explicit songs with ARMY in 2014. And never forget his immortal song Expensive Girls, also released a decade ago - "I'm a master, baby with your bra / Take it off now girl just take it off / I can help you slide those panties off" 😂]
All throughout their career, they've made songs related to serious social topics and blazing diss songs that are sometimes filled with profanity and even one or two sexual innuendo. It's part of what makes their songs so meaningful, not divorced from it.
[The songs are, in case you don't recognize them, Go Go, Bapsae which apparently has much more rudeness and slang in Korean, No More Dream similarly too, Intro: Nevermind has some English swears if the Korean language passes you by and is extremely meaningful]
But I feel like this ask is more specifically anger at them being sexually explicit. So thanks also for giving me the oppt to talk about "Send you to Hong Kong" and my "tongue technology" (all Korean sex slangs, btw, because believe it or not, Koreans can be dirty too) on the song Agust D. Put on the English (or French) lyrics if you prefer, you're in for some fun. And since it's a song off Yoongi's very personal first mixtape, made almost end to end by him, it's not like he was scandalizing himself - is he scandalizing you? I hope so.
Listen to Do You from RM while you're at it too, especially the lyrics "Muf*ckas keep muf*ckin all day/ Follow my sh*t, my friend and I’ll pay", which is still a little less than his ""Just play with your d*ck, it'll feel good, yeah, you’re my enemy so f*ck off" on Joke.
Even our maknae's getting in on the 18+ vibes! Granted, Left & Right JK didn't write, but he apparently didn't mind collabbing on a song about the days after extremely good sex ("tangled up in my bed" "the things you did to me") - and isn't phase 2 about showing the colors they want?
Many, many of their songs had to have their lyrics changed before they could be broadcast on public TV - in fact Jungkook's whole literal hand with its tattoos has to be blurred so that he can be on public TV - if that isn't the best metaphor for how BTS is much more socially progressive than average in South Korea, I don't know what to tell you. And that shouldn't be a surprise. They've always been exceptional.
Their more all-ages era started with Dynamite, actually (maybe Boy in Love if you want to go back a bit more). So honestly, it's more likely for new Western fans to think they're PG, when older fans would likely know all that *waves*. I don't mind that PG music, there's space for BTS to create all types. But because all that explicitness and social progressivism are actually part of BTS and offends conservative sensibilities, I'd say we progressives - Korean and American and all nationalities embrace them whole. As they are and all of them. Which is all they've ever asked of us. And frankly, what actual love is.]
4. I don't know how Korean parties usually go, but I know decently well how the rich party in Korea, yes, actually. It's the internet, so there's no reason for you to believe me, but I went to university with literal chaebols (I went to an American Ivy League); and in my late teens early 20s spent some time partying all around Asia, including Korea, a... decent amount, let's say. I grew up poor, but got extremely, extremely lucky. You're right, I became ARMY proper only two years ago, but my first exposure to BTS was when I went to a music show in 2014 because a Korean friend whose mom was a producer on it invited us.
(just weirdly not at the actual fashion show 😂 his outfit didn't feel too him. But every other outfit 👌🏼)
Also:
From anon: not vmin related but oh my God drift the video of tae pole dancing in paris?? the SMILE on his face??? i almost cried haha, it’s just. so so so lovely to see him so happy. he’s such a precious soul, and i’m just so happy to see him carefree and enjoying himself. just wanted to share the love with someone who i know appreciates him the same way!! 💖
It really was so freaking cute. I was like, how is he so wholesome trying to pole dance. No wonder Jimin always look at Tae with such endless fondness. I also saw the video put against when he was dancing to that jazz club for elders, and he... just approaches both situations, in fact, life in general, with the same sense of joy?
[Also guys, please don't apologize for sending me non-Vmin related content! I hope I publish enough non-Vmin things to show you guys it's all welcome here!]
[That said... you can always make a Vmin connection xD Actually, when I saw this, it made me think back to Jimin's compliment to Tae: that what Jimin values about Tae is how innocent he is, and how it's not about being naive or childish, but about keeping that capacity for wonder and joy despite how rough the world and specifically the industry they work in can be. And I think it says a lot about their connection that this is what Jimin loves most about him (and consistently, his first comments in this vein date back to LY era I believe, and the last he said this I remember some time in 2021 with the BTS the Best promos)].
From anon: I'm glad Tae participated in the Celine event but that after party was not it. Idk if it's just because I'm a younger and an Asian ARMY but that after party made me real uncomfortable for them, no offense, is that even normal in a business-related event? 😖 I wish I could unsee. Ppl on twitter are also spreading sht that they [Drift: Details of unfounded rumors redacted]
To be frank, anon: Yes, it's absolutely normal, and you should get used to it, and I'm really not the blogger for you if you were looking for a similarly prudish reaction.
I understand being young and Asian and sheltered in that way, but let's put things in context?
Taehyung is not.
He is 26 years old, and in the entertainment industry.
You shouldn't say "made me real uncomfortable for them" when you really just mean "made me real uncomfortable." Period.
More on this ask after the cut, where I probably get too personal but ah well.
You seem young, so I'll explain the party itself a bit. Granted, we didn't see all of it, but it really was nothing particularly wild or extraordinary. Even my job—which is in corporate America, a pretty conservative industry generally—throws after parties like that, or have work events that transition into informal club nights like that, where people with children and new graduates and the in-betweens like me dance and drink and have fun. It's not "a business-related event" - it's a social ritual that helps reinforce business bonds.
Also. I'm not entirely sure what horrified you so mucj that you wanted to "unsee" but I'll take some wild guesses.
First, a few performers (guests?) being topless? Europeans, particularly French people, have very different standards than Americans or most Asian countries when it comes to top nudity. Naked breasts are normalized enough they're on primetime television and billboards, not to mention countless artworks you see in the Louvre. And this? Isn't even a context where any children were around to be scandalized. If adults want to be topless at a party and other adults want to see them - totally cool. If a VIP isn't comfortable, they can certainly leave or mention and probably get that changed (it should've been pretty clear the event basically centered on Tae, Lisa, and Bo Gum) - but everything shared that night seems to show Tae having a blast and then leaving.
There being a pole? Maybe even pole dancers? Look above, he had a lot of fun.
Tae drinking and getting tipsy? It's nothing we havent seen on vlive or IG. And the dude's 26. Even America's ludicrously high (and counterproductive, if it's meant to encourage a healthy relationship with alcohol) drinking age is only 21.
Just being around and taking selfies with attractive people, male and female? He obviously gave his consent to those people - and also, as I said in Part 1 of the Festa reaction, get used to it. I sincerely doubt he didn't do this in the parties he's gone to in the past decade, we're just getting to see it now.
Whatever other rumors exist of whatever else he did in Paris? One, they're rumors so I don't even know why you're paying any attention and getting upset at what may or may not be true - people run their mouth about BTS all the time (Namjoon's married, right? 😝). Report and block for spreading unfounded rumors.
But also, I'm going to say: his decisions are his, and I trust his judgment. I know the caliber of men they are - their humility, their groundedness, the kind lovely people they surround themselves with. If wealth and fame haven't gotten to him yet, I sincerely doubt it's a Parisian trip that'll do the trick (they were at the most exclusive events in Hollywood! But honestly why even go that far? - do you even know how lavishly and hedonistically some Korean elites party?). I guarantee you Tae's not being offered anything in France he hasn't been offered before, when he was much younger and had less personal power. And even IF he takes folks up on any given offer, it's 1) his decision; and 2) he'll know to be careful, moderate, etc.
Finally, if you're "worried" - did you not see how high spirited he was all trip and as he was leaving? Granted, for a brand partnership, you have to make some number of posts, it's often contractually specified, but Tae went above and beyond. He clearly loved his Paris trip.
You shouldn't displace your sense of discomfort onto him.
In summary: Let him live his 20s. Let him have the freedom he has literally told us he wants. And trust him to make his decisions - fans aren't his parents. And even his real parents have to let go now.
Also. I realize I've never said this on the blog, and maybe I gave some folks "wrong impression" by never talking about them as sex objects.
That'd because while they do at times play with their sex appeal, the bulk of the time they spotlight their emotional connections and their artistry, so that's what I focus on. And I don't like when attraction to them veers into speculative, stereotypical sexualization, so I prefer staying away from that discourse all together here. I am actively against sexualizing their relationships, but as I've said many times, I do this because I believe only a person and their partners can know their sexual dynamics - no one else, certainly not outsiders with a very narrow frame of reference.
But. I am not in any way, shape, or form, conservative.
In fact, I am very pro sex and relationships and all the shades of human experience. Taste all parts of the rainbow. Use alcohol and other substances in moderation and avoid things that create dependencies. Do everything you want as long as it's with consensual adults and in safe conditions, I don't particular care how kinky or taboo. Use the relationship model that works best for you and your partner(s), whether it's single and not sexually active; single and super sexually active; in an exclusive, us and solely us til death type of monogamous relationship; or being monogamish or open or poly or married but with a platonic life partner etc etc.
I don't do most of these things myself - most days, I dress and act exactly like you'd think a grown-up straight-A Asian girl would. But I support the right of others to do so without social judgment.
Anyway. You get the picture.
And as a personal note to you anon: Growing up as a woman in an Asian-American household, visiting my home country quite often, there's a lot of views I had to unlearn. A lot of internalized shame etc. I think I'm a better person this way, because I'm less judgmental - and I have more fun too. So I'd suggest you give it some thought and see what the world has to offer (though if you're young, please explore responsibly and at the right age, etc)
Of course, if it's not for you, it's not for you. Namjoon, apparently, doesn't like clubbing, haha.
Just don't displace your feelings and don't judge others. At the very least you should know I don't agree with you.
[By the by, because I feel like someone will ask: BUT JIMIN HOW WILL HE FEEL??? To that I say, "happy." First, Jimin literally just told us he's doing well. But two, and more importantly, Taehyung is happy so of course he'll be happy too. Yes, they had issues re possessiveness before *cough* Hwarang *cough* but has obviously worked on it so I wouldn't speculate it's an issue now, and we don't know the contours of their relationship, and I'm not into the presumption of heteronormative jealousy dynamics. And for all the people that surround Tae in his life, Tae identified Jimin as the one "he likes most," even if he doesn't say that enough. Think on that]
Hi, concerning your last post. I believe that the person who asked this question maybe is wondering why V and Jimin never been spotted going outside anymore. No matter how much BTS are private they somehow get photographed by fans or people or anyone like we saw Jimin and J- hope photos when they went to the soccer match... Also when jimin was in paris and Tae was seen during his vacation in Hawaii and recently RM in Switzerland etc etc so it has been years we haven't seen them together outside work... most probably and the sad truth might be that they just don't meet outside work. They prefer video calls or something who knows.
And I answered the question. Which you have so kindly repeated, as if I didn't. While adding some more bad logic on top.
Read my post or get off my blog.
Also.
As privacy is not possible, are you saying JK, Tae, J-Hope, and Jimin lied about the 4 of them hanging out all the time in Las Vegas?
I mean, there had to be photos every time they hung out right? Come on, in a city crawling with ARMY? Clearly they lied, it's a publicity stunt.
And as privacy's not possible, send me these answers, please:
What was Jimin doing for the last two weeks? Who was he with?
What was Tae doing before he went to Paris? Who was he with?
Where was Jungkook camping? Who was he with?
When was the last time we "saw" Yoongi & Jin hanging out off-work? Jimin & Namjoon? Tae & Jungkook? That must mean they don't, right?
Why haven't we seen Jimin's brother or Tae's siblings with them in years - have they just been disowned?
In 7 years, why haven't we seen them dating anyone? Hell, when was the last time we got pictures of them with a female friend? They must all be aromantic and categorically refuse to befriend women, I guess.
Tiktok. I'm waiting. My inbox is wide open.
Privacy's not possible, huh?
By the by, totally unrelatedly, here's Tae golfing in DC (and what sounds a lot like Jimin saying Wowwwww in the background).
And here's a girl from the golf course in DC noting Jin, Hobi, Tae, and Jimin were there; and how someone tried to take a photo of them and the bodyguards stopped her and made her delete it immediately.
So sad the girl didn't run with her camera from the bodyguards and uploaded it on Twitter afterwards 🙃 So we get that "proof" that they hang out in their private time, you know?
Guess the sasaengs have to work harder to service "fans" 🙃 I guess that'd have save us this conversation, so who ever said people infringing on their privacy do nothing but hurt the fandom were wrong 🙃
Anyway. Here, have an anon expressing some rage I feel:
From anon: Nothing makes me more angry than these "vmin are fanservice". I never take pics with my friends and we are still super close. Also by how vmin communicate (both with and without words) it is abundantly clear they know each other through and through and have invested time and effort into learning each other's wants and needs. And they have told us so often they are close, do stuff together, soulmate, i like you the most.
I hung out with my close friend all last summer. Like every 2-5 days. I think we got one photo the entire summer, which I posted nowhere because it's my photo with my friend. We hung out at restaurants and stuff - but I imagine if we were trying to avoid fans who'd creep on us, we'd mostly hang out at each other's apartments. Especially if we believe our relationship is singularly important and worth protecting from scrutiny.
Apparently Vmin can't do what we did. For... Reasons.
From anon: Hi! I really enjoy your blog and I hope that these anons don't push you back into hiatus. For everyone anon with a stupid ask, there are other anons that appreciate your thoughts and posts and I really missed vmin bloggers a lot when they were on a break. I really hope you reconsider your decision and decide to keep posting. Thank you for all you do💜.
What a sweet message.
Sorry I got so upset yesterday in the tags and made you worried. To be fully transparent and own up to my feelings, besides the ask being silly and geared towards all my pet peeves... it was also a really bad day yesterday for human rights in America (in a week with a slate of terrible Supreme Court decisions already). So I'd gone to this blog for distraction and connection, found that ask sitting in my inbox, and just. It'll sound silly, but it was similarly like... Nothing I say or do matters? And maybe locking down and preserving your own sanity and hoarding your own happiness is all you can or should do?
But anyway. With BTS and this blog, thank you for reminding me that there are many here who I am having this conversation with, and who I want to stay connected to. Don't worry. I have one long post (asks from the FESTA dinner) I want to get out within this weekend to tide you all over, and then I might take a step back for a week or two to focus on life, but I'll be back.
[And for those affected by or are thinking about American politics right now - I just want to say, I refuse to become the sort of selfish person who only cares about me and mine—as if that really protects you, anyway. I was thinking on BTS yesterday, and how they insist on staying hopeful, and how they guide people to harness that rage. Bapsae is not apolitical, Go Go is not apolitical, and Spring Day is not apolitical. I don't think internationals remember this well, but as mentioned in BTS's songs: South Korea won its democracy through blood. And when that was threatened, its people came out in waves in 2016 and changed it. Please show up at protests, donate to your local grassroots organizations and politicians supporting abortion access; queer people but especially trans people; and criminal justice reform]
In any case, in demonstration of there being a lot of lovely anons out there, you guys sent me some lovely things about Vmin:
From anon: This is actually kinda fascinating when you think about it... why in particular do people doubt vmin's bond of friendship based on 'not getting enough evidence' of them out in public together alone, but don't doubt the other members' bonds on the same premise...?
Honestly I think people that are likely to dissect the bonds between members of the maknae line simply don't think that much about the hyung line at all because, if they did, this logic would immediately become even more silly... For example, if one pays attention to the hyung line (and Seokjin is my bias so I'll speak with that bias here) they'd know that not only do Jin and Hobi like to hang out and have drinks together (which we never get photo evidence or fan accounts of) but Jin and Yoongi are very obviously close friends and know a lot about each other to the point that they often speak for each other in conversations with the rest of the group in ways that let us know they're having plenty of separate conversations / hang outs (but again no fan accounts or much 'evidence') and then there's the fact that apparently Seokjin's and Namjoon's families are pretty close and hang out together, something they've casually mentioned a few times, yet still... no "evidence" of this seems necessary to prove how close they are, or how close any of the hyung line truly are...
That's not even counting how close the maknae line are individually to all four members of the hyung line in different ways (I think, for example, that the level of friendship and intimacy between Jimin and Hobi, for example, is often extremely underestimated by a lot of 'shipper' fans). To be honest, maknae line shipper fans are a different breed to hyung line fans in general. I don't know if this is to do with the average age of those involved, but there seems to be a level of projection going on with maknae line stans that I don't see happening quite as much with fans of the older members... that is to say, these 'parasocial expectations' seem much stronger on that side.
Whenever the members do decide to reveal who they're dating in future (and I hope it's up to them when this news comes out), it seems likely at this point that it's the fans of the maknae line who will kick up the most fuss as they seem to be most invested in either having a sort of fantasy relationship with those members or imagining them in relationships with each other as, I think, a way to fill in the gap of the absence of such a relationship in their own real lives (so again, a lot of the extreme shippers and possessive stans are probably pretty young).
Anyway, this is getting way longer than I intended but basically, the reason I think people are so hellbent on disproving vmin's bond is because there are way more people fixated on all the relationships in the lives of the maknae line members in general, and vmin themselves have continuously, in a way none of the other members have, highlighted their own relationship as being particularly special and this is impossible to ignore so... if that story doesn't really fit with the narrative you're trying to construct about the members then you simply have to call vmin's words about their own bond into question and dissect every shred of 'evidence' about who they're closest to in order to maintain your narrative... even if that means denying what is simply plain and obvious and requires no dissecting; the fact that vmin are, at the very least, close friends.
Ding ding ding. Thank you for writing my post for me, haha. The only thing I would add / amend is that Vminnies who start believing these "Why don't I get to see them hang out????" narratives also show an extreme insecurity that bely the same level of projection.
I don't know the cause of that projection. Perhaps it is partially being young and immature when it comes to relationships—but I imagine some are also quite old. At heart, it's about lack of critical thinking and boundaries. This fetishization of others is unhealthy; and honestly, always makes me think of a disappointed BTS. We're meant to be a force of good. Not to get lost in obsession and infighting and celebrity culture voyeurism like a Kardashian fan. *shudders*
From anon: we literally just had jimin talk about how he's watched the entire process of taehyung working on his album over the years, that he's heard the whole thing already, and knows him well enough to know that he's so meticulous that he's going to take more time still to continue working on it, and like. you don't know all that about someone you're not very very close with. people need to pack it up and leave vmin alone already
I've thought about this a lot after the video, actually. It makes me feel warm and admiring all over, haha. That Jimin barely said three sentences about his own album—but just lit up as he hyped Tae's album and flexed his soulmate privilege and gently teased Tae, it's just all. Very loving. He loves Tae and he loves his artistry, and that means a lot, because they're both artists.
You don't even have to look that hard to see their bond is there.
From anon: ppl are so funny bcuz jimin and sungwoon made a whole ost together and they celebrated sungwoons birthday together where jimin showed up at his house late at night (as told by sungwoon himself) so they're obviously close. and they haven't been papped in recent years either? why're the think pieces only limited to vmin?
From anon: How can anyone state for certain that they haven't already [travel together]? There's so much we don't know about the guys' private lives and that's exactly how it should be. We should only find things out when they decide to let us know and vmin have stated several times that they want to go on a trip together (with no reason to lie cause... why?) so if they haven't already, I'm sure they'll make it happen and have a blast and we may never even know... and good for them if that's what they want!
Ding ding ding again to both! And here's my write-up re: Jimin's friendship with Ha Sungwon and our blind spot as related to their non-BTS relationships.
Hi, concerning your last post. I believe that the person who asked this question maybe is wondering why V and Jimin never been spotted going outside anymore. No matter how much BTS are private they somehow get photographed by fans or people or anyone like we saw Jimin and J- hope photos when they went to the soccer match... Also when jimin was in paris and Tae was seen during his vacation in Hawaii and recently RM in Switzerland etc etc so it has been years we haven't seen them together outside work... most probably and the sad truth might be that they just don't meet outside work. They prefer video calls or something who knows.
And I answered the question. Which you have so kindly repeated, as if I didn't. While adding some more bad logic on top.
Read my post or get off my blog.
Also.
As privacy is not possible, are you saying JK, Tae, J-Hope, and Jimin lied about the 4 of them hanging out all the time in Las Vegas?
I mean, there had to be photos every time they hung out right? Come on, in a city crawling with ARMY? Clearly they lied, it's a publicity stunt.
And as privacy's not possible, send me these answers, please:
What was Jimin doing for the last two weeks? Who was he with?
What was Tae doing before he went to Paris? Who was he with?
Where was Jungkook camping? Who was he with?
When was the last time we "saw" Yoongi & Jin hanging out off-work? Jimin & Namjoon? Tae & Jungkook? That must mean they don't, right?
Why haven't we seen Jimin's brother or Tae's siblings with them in years - have they just been disowned?
In 7 years, why haven't we seen them dating anyone? Hell, when was the last time we got pictures of them with a female friend? They must all be aromantic and categorically refuse to befriend women, I guess.
Tiktok. I'm waiting. My inbox is wide open.
Privacy's not possible, huh?
By the by, totally unrelatedly, here's Tae golfing in DC (and what sounds a lot like Jimin saying Wowwwww in the background).
And here's a girl from the golf course in DC noting Jin, Hobi, Tae, and Jimin were there; and how someone tried to take a photo of them and the bodyguards stopped her and made her delete it immediately.
So sad the girl didn't run with her camera from the bodyguards and uploaded it on Twitter afterwards 🙃 So we get that "proof" that they hang out in their private time, you know?
Guess the sasaengs have to work harder to service "fans" 🙃 I guess that'd have save us this conversation, so who ever said people infringing on their privacy do nothing but hurt the fandom were wrong 🙃
Anyway. Here, have an anon expressing some rage I feel:
From anon: Nothing makes me more angry than these "vmin are fanservice". I never take pics with my friends and we are still super close. Also by how vmin communicate (both with and without words) it is abundantly clear they know each other through and through and have invested time and effort into learning each other's wants and needs. And they have told us so often they are close, do stuff together, soulmate, i like you the most.
I hung out with my close friend all last summer. Like every 2-5 days. I think we got one photo the entire summer, which I posted nowhere because it's my photo with my friend. We hung out at restaurants and stuff - but I imagine if we were trying to avoid fans who'd creep on us, we'd mostly hang out at each other's apartments. Especially if we believe our relationship is singularly important and worth protecting from scrutiny.
Apparently Vmin can't do what we did. For... Reasons.
Hi, why do we get no vmin doing out of schedule activities like ever?? Like they were never been spotted being together like ever. We get no content from them, the last time someone posted a selca was jimin for taes bday and there was Hobi too. And the one before was from tae during ITS, which is a scheduled activity… they post about everyone else. Especially tae, he posts pics with everyone especially his wooga squad, he even traveled with them (to Hawaii) while jimin said multiple times he wants to travel with him but they never did. I’m starting to think it’s all really fanservice unfortunately…. They can’t possibly try to hide even hanging out together except if they didn’t in the first place.
I've talked about this.
It's the same reason we rarely see Jimin out with anybody, including his closest friends. Padding Squad or Ha Sungwon? His high school friends? His childhood friends? His family? You see them often?
You know why? Because he's private and has a private life.
Tae posts a bit more on social media, but if Jimin's not comfortable, why would he post about their time together? Are you into making people you love uncomfortable? And anyway, every relationship and every person is different. Just because Tae posts about the Wooga Squad doesn't mean Jimin has to post when he hangs out with Taemin, and just because Jimin posts a selfie with Yoongi doesn't mean he has to post one with Namjoon to show he cares about them both?
We hear it second-hand and that's good enough for me - in fact, Tae & Jimin told us just a handful of weeks ago they hung out all the time with J-Hope and Jungkook and each other in LV & LA. No, we didn't see photo / video 'proof'. Why do you need it? Is them saying they hang out with Hobi "fanservice" too? Does Tae claiming to travel with JK or Jimin saying he bikes with RM but we not seeing it for ages means that's all also lies for "fanservice"?
Let's call a spade a spade. You're accusing them of lying to ARMY. You're also asking for 'evidence' of their private lives, on their private schedules, despite their clear signal that they don't wish to share, because otherwise they'd have shared it already.
You know who does these two things? Antis and sasaeng.
So:
1) you can step off my blog. Right now.
2) Set yourself up for disappointment in this solo era, because as I said in both Part 2 and Part 3, we're going to likely see less of BTS together than ever, probably. And if you're sad or disappointed, that's a you problem, sorry. They're artists who only promised you music - not the fulfillment of your parasocial expectations.
"From anon: Hi Drift. I love your blog and appreciate your analysis. I agree with you about this new era changing what we see of BTS members, and of course their privacy and boundaries should be respected.
But about the 'parasocial' - BTS has always had a parasocial relationship with fans, and it's a big part of their appeal. i've at times felt conflicted about this - some content seemed too intimate and exploitative in their younger years. Yet especially for pandemic ARMY, the comfort of the BTS 'family' was huge. I don't feel entitled to BTS members' personal lives but I am really going to miss the sweet, kind, funny and warm interactions that cheered me up and gave me hope in a world that is not nearly as kind as BTS members seem to be.
Of course it was a crutch - but depending on one's circumstances it's not so easy to fill the gap that is left. I'm sure the members have bright futures ahead of them; I wish I shared that faith/confidence in the future more generally.
Ah, let me clarify. I totally empathize and agree with you, and my comment was not related to parasocial relationships at such (which is fine, and even a source of good, as you say) but when they devolve into parasocial expectations (which is less fine).
As I talked about in Part 1, BTS brings me a lot of comfort. And I will miss them and the ways I take joy and comfort in their interactions.
Do I / we / ARMY / BTS have a parasocial relationship with each other? Yes.
Parasocial relationships is defined as a mediated relationship from an audience to a performer / celebrity - or, as I would argue, also between a performer about an audience. It's often stated as "one-sided", but that gives the wrong impression. In fact, it's not that one side feels and the other doesn't. Rather, it's more about asymmetrical information and group/individual - I consume content from BTS but cannot (individually) connect with them back. By the same token, BTS can consume content from ARMY but do not (individually) connect with us back. It's never one-to-one: that is, I, Drift, cannot have a personal relationship and vice versa with Jimin.
But that's fine. It doesn't limit our ability to derive meaning from them; them from us; or us within each other, in all the ways you denoted and more. I, at least, have no desire to extend beyond that—if I met Jimin on the street, I'm not going to try to become his best friend and learn everything about his life? Rather, I would thank him and BTS for all they've given to me, and wish him luck and happiness and success and promise to continue supporting him on my screen.
The media speaks disparagingly of parasocial relationships, but I don't actually see anything wrong with them so long as the parties involved understand both the value they provide and their limitations. As Jimin said, "We grew up with our fans but we can't share everything, and that's the saddest and hardest thing." And it is sad. But also for good reason. Because as Namjoon says, we should be fans that hold a respectful distance as we run with them.
BTS takes comfort in us and our content, but also do not demand anything else of us, right? It's alway gratitude, never demand.
Similarly, we and those I consider ARMY take what is freely given, understand their intent, take joy from them, and accept BTS as they are. We feel happiness when we see they are a family, but (I hope) we know we are not in a position to demand they play-act such as, say, demanding they live together until they're old to further this desire.
[Of course, some people don't know better, which is how we end up with burdening BTS, making them fear disappointing us, such that they were reluctant to admit until FESTA they do indeed no longer live together and it's healthy for late 20s people to live alone. And that makes me sad.]
So why did I totally flip on that entitled anon? Not because they ship Vmin or because they have a parasocial relationship with BTS - I am both of those things. It is because they have, as I said quite carefully, parasocial expectations of BTS.
In other words, they don't recognize its limitations. They don't see that BTS needs to and have chosen to necessarily not share some things with fans/general public. They're treating Vmin/Jimin as if the relationship is one-to-one, where they have a right to be like, "bestie, show me you hanging out with your bestie." To take what is not given.
And that? Invasive, exploitative, as you say. Toxic, in other words.
I hope that clarifies! The disparagement is not towards a parasocial relationship per se, but the expectations some in one develop.
As to your last comment about you wishing you had that faith and confidence in the future generally, and not knowing how to fill the gap left? To be honest, I don't think any of us know—which is where the apprehension come from. But what we're experiencing is in some ways a softer version of what the members are experiencing—being launched out of our safe space and having to find comfort and meaning in new spaces. But that's how you grow! Embrace it.
More concrete advice: as I said in Part 1, remember you're not alone. If you are in a place that has one, I'd recommend you get involved with your local ARMY community. They're really really lovely, to a one, in my experience. Think of this as our chance to run as well. Run BTS is both "Run Bangtan" but also "Run Beautiful (A)(MI)."
We'll have such stories and experiences to share in the next 2-3 years.
