An Archive of Our Own, a project of the Organization for Transformative Works
‘I thought you wouldn’t come back,’ Will whispered. ‘Today. From the burn op. When we heard those roars over the radio, the flames, I thought…’ Will turned his face into the pillow. ‘I’m a mess, Mike. I can’t even think straight. I feel as if he’s… he’s crawling right inside my… my…’
Will’s voice cracked into a sob. He’d always been ashamed of what Henry had done; the memories had long danced at the edges of his mind, but now, knowing exactly who it was… and ever since he’d seen his old backpack hanging from the branch of that tree…
Fall, 1987.
Will has been living at the Wheeler house for over a year, but as the anniversary of his kidnapping approaches and the party's burn operation goes terribly wrong, tensions between him and Mike are at an all-time high. Things come to a head in the middle of one of their missions together, when they find themselves seeking shelter from danger in a familiar cabin down by Lover's Lake...
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This is a completed work that I'll be releasing in the run up to s5! First 6 chapters here...
sometimes art manages to collapse the space between seeing and feeling, so that everything hits you all at once without you even understanding why. i might come back to why this is so beautiful later (skyscapes are always irresistible), but for now, it made me tear up, and that is enough.
An Archive of Our Own, a project of the Organization for Transformative Works
Will didn’t know what was wrong. He’d drawn Mike before. Hundreds of times.
But now, he couldn’t seem to grip the pencil properly, let alone apply delicate layers of paint. The furthest he’d gotten was Mike’s torso and an outline of his head, but when he tried to draw the rest of his body, Will ended up feeling so dizzy that he had to sit down.
He flopped face down on to his bed with a whine. How was he going to be a brilliant artist if he couldn’t even draw a figure?! It was just Mike! It was just legs! Will wouldn’t actually have to draw his… his crotch…
As Valentine’s Day sweeps across Lenora Hills High, Will finds himself struggling to finish a very special painting. Searching for answers in the library, he comes across something that shakes him to his core, changing the way he looks at Mike Wheeler forever…
Part 3 of 4 of my series 'It Was Coming All Along'
this is absolutely stunning. there is such romanticism here, in the murky colours, the postures, the position from which we view the scene. we cannot see the landscape they can see; that view is for them alone. likewise, will cannot see us, making him vulnerable, but it's as though mike is protecting him from everything including us, totally embodying the paladin and protector.
i love the solid, grounding balcony stone at the bottom, leading up to will's cape that itself blends with the stars of the night sky, like he's a magical being that has fallen to earth. mike's sword is visible: symbolic, but it's also caught on this side of the balustrade, while the mildly ominous spikes in the landscape lurk with a watchful eye in the distance (evil tower? unusual rock formation?), with nothing between them and the lovers.
if we look closer the shape of the stars seem to echo the scar over mike's eye. healed by will's magic? or just a birthmark? there's hurt in mike's eyes as well, and steely determination, like he considers will something delicate who needs caring for. meanwhile will's posture is safe and at peace perhaps, his robes swooping all over the balustrade as he looks sweetly up at mike.
sepia tones! i love the washy felt tip pen effect. it's somewhat jarring to see mike's s4 style now that we have the s5 looks, but part of the pleasure is going back through all the transformations of these characters, all the versions they've been. Will sitting on countertops is always in character, and the kiss is beautifully done too - it's hard to get a kiss right, but you can feel everything here. I especially love Mike's blissful expression with a hint of disbelief in the blush, and the dynamic change with Will 'taller' than him for once. Lovely.
Love how Noah really felt the quiet beauty of this film. The note about lying being self-protective, I'm sure he knows this so so well, and I can't help but think of Mike's monologue and ofc Will's painting speech too!
I also love that Noah quoted the love/attention line, it's my favourite from the movie and something I used when making byler analysis posts a long time ago. I feel like it could easily apply to Noah and Finn too, little moments like how they can do good impressions of each other and pay good attention whenever they speak in press etc. Respect and love.
I wonder if he spoke to Finn about the film's music, because the composer is Jon Brion who Finn spoke highly of this year in interviews about his favourite musicians.
So much magic in the warm tones! I like the central framing, and this reminds me of picture book style illustration. The graffiti shading, the clouds creating a perfect surround, the costume styling being just grunge enough to let this lean into the 90s but also stay in its own alternate universe, out of time. Another artist has given Will Byers yellow chucks before and I love it! As well as the rust coloured fair isle. Will in autumn sweaters will always be perfect. A blustery fall day at college, yapping during a break. I wonder if Will was sitting alone originally, about to play a game of 'he loves me, he loves me not' with his daisy, then Mike plopped himself down and started talking about music or something cool from his class. Or maybe he gave Will the flower and is rambling to cover up how bashful he feels, while Will just let's that bashfulness flow out everywhere.
Wow. This has the magic of 90s sitcoms or children's picture books. The detail and flat perspective is so wonderful to see compared to modern trends, and it really captures the era when these boys could be at college! The old tiling, the open shelf unit, the warm light and wooden cabinets. My favourite background detail is the little teabags, one dropped on the counter, and it tells a whole story, as if mike swept will into his arms before he could even make them tea. I imagine the tea kettle on the stove was whistling away and they didn't even notice for a while, and that a radio is playing music just out of frame. And of course, the photographs and lights, which are somehow well-placed yet haphazard, as if both mike and will were stringing them up and so will's artistic touch became entangled with mike's more scattered decorative tendencies. Imagine mike towering over Will to pin the highest ones, and will pulling up a chair so he can then tower over mike again in turn. mike smirking away, then immediately offering to help will down from the chair and it's will's turn to smirk.
as for them, the expressions are perfection. they're smitten and it's right there in the way their legs entwine and hands grip and their eyes, it's always all in the eyes. extra love for will's trousers, a baggy style swamps him and is so adorable and timely! then the bright yellow chucks and open shirt as well, he's branching out and getting more confident, really coming into his own... and then mike, in his grandad tank and brown trousers, who is perhaps mellowing just a touch into a 90s softness.
this work does what all great art does which is take an idea and spark a whole story, making you want to stare at it and see it move. (Who is the milk and chocolate for? Do they already have it and forgot to take down the note? Or are they going to eat it tonight?) Just beautiful.
Some notes on Finn and Noah at the Paris con 2025. Long post - this is me at my most pedantic and attentive! Credit to @castlebyersafterdark for the classic phrase in this context!
The noticeable energy in these videos is a mix of relaxed/comfortable AND nervous from both boys. Neither purely anxiety or purely nervousness. The words I think of when I see them are giddiness and complicity. Or, seeing as that means involved in crime together, maybe conspiratorial is better? Either way, it’s a sense of them sharing a world that no one else is part of.
Notes up front: Finn’s absolute joy at seeing Noah. It's that kind of smile where you have a little squint-frown cos it's just bursting off your face.
Of course their connection gives us clues towards what might happen with byler, so it’s just so special for us to see this intimacy.
It’s a full hug, diagonal cross body, Noah on tippy toes to lean up and full torsos pressed together. You might even call it an embrace. We can see a hint of what byler height difference will look like! If you look closely there is also closed eyes from Finn. Closing the eyes shuts off vision and heightens focus on other senses, like feel and smell. In a hug this can leave space to revel in the feel of someone’s body and the scent of them, their physical presence overall. It’s still quite a quick hug, though, so this combination is interesting.
Peer past Gaten and see how Finn ducks his head into the crook of Noah’s shoulder. Face full of Noah’s sweater, close to his neck, then he looks up and pulls back, seemingly to say ‘Aww’.
I think Noah said something like ‘I missed you so much’ in his ear, to warrant this ‘Aww’ reaction. Finn keeps his eyes closed, and pulls back, his hair ruffling along Noah’s, perhaps ears pressed together, cheek to cheek. But sorry Finn, Noah is not letting you go yet, he holds on a bit longer so Finn is pulled back into the fray. He doesnt seem to mind, his eyes are still closed.
Something I also noticed was that Finn’s hands are flat on Noah’s back. It looks like a very cosy sweater, we can see why he would want to feel it with the sensitive flat of his palm 🤭 In this hug, it's beautiful to witness their bond and the intimacy they share is clear, even if we don't know exactly what caused it.
Finn also does the classic slide around the body where the touch is allowed to linger a little longer, it's actually Noah who lifts cleanly away and steps back, and Finn even follows him around in a little swivel, leaning more into Noah's space as Noah lifts down off his tiptoes. It's almost like a little dance. Perhaps Noah had to keep his balance? Despite this it all happens so quickly, subconsciously, naturally.
Noah looks first to gaten before he is even out of the hug, which to me screams of self-awareness and makes me wonder if Noah's eyes, too, were closed during the hug. Finn still has his arms on him, giving him a pat on the shoulder and grinning away. He's stepped forward too (basically in front of Gaten now), and both are blushing with red ears and cheeks and eyes alight.
They then share a lingering look, and can you watch this moment without smiling along with them? I am smiling for so long my teeth are dry. These expressions are real and true. The smiles extend to the eyes - for Finn he’s smiling so much that his eyes are practically closed.
These videos are full of tiny micro moments of body language. Noah's small nod of the head here while looking at gaten could well be directed at Finn, a little ending to their extended hug greeting, maybe even a yes to Finn's 'Aww', as in 'Of course I missed you.'
They remain glowing red in the face - perhaps it was hot in there. But Finn is wearing a lightweight shirt. And it’s February in Paris, France, in some giant, possibly unheated space hosting a con. Just the day before, in Germany, Noah said he was a little cold during his con despite wearing a jacket.
But we just can't know for sure, can we.
Finn is smiling away and turns to face nobody, which is when he catches sight of the camera and his smile slips, and his hand seems to curl up gripping his pant leg, a nervous gesture that does this time look more like your classic anxiety or tick.
Noah looks chuffed having a little chat with gaten, fiddling with his sweater, fidgeting about not standing still. Giddy. The foot placements are fascinating.
We can’t know if Noah gave Gaten a proper hug already, as the video began with him diving into Finn’s arms. But judging by the way Gaten waits right there like a puppy throughout their hug, and that Noah does indeed extend a tiny hug to him after, can we suggest he hasn’t been greeted yet?
If so, that means Finn was Noah’s first port of call.
Then Noah slinks immediately over to Finn after his tiny hug with Gaten. His posture is low but directional; his chin is jutted forwards, shoulders low and forward and un-defensive. He’s keen and intentional, but timid. He’s sidling up to Finn.
Finn swoops his hair from his face as Noah approaches. Could be a nervous tick or sign of self-awareness, as his fringe isn’t very long, so I doubt it was covering his eyes, and we don’t often see him play with his hair in other videos from the day as if it was annoying him. We do later see him sweep his hair back during the solo panel when discussing Mike's relationship with Hopper, and his answer features Eleven (below left). Here, Finn is fiddling with his hair and holding his neck as his eyes shift and his knee bobs rapidly, giving off a very different kind of energy. He's obviously trying to withhold information about s5, and there's a seriousness there, as though he's remembering parts of s5 that are not necessarily lighthearted. Compare the total lack of smile during that segment to when byler is mentioned (below right). It's not a subtle smirk - he's again withholding, but also seems bursting with something when byler is mentioned - but what?!
(This was also the first time I had ever heard Finn say 'byler' which felt more exciting than it should have lol)
Back at the first meet, Finn immediately welcomes Noah with a touch that appears very natural after their hug. It seems instinctual, as they are talking all the while. Casual touch is a sign of wanting to connect and communicate physically, and is usually subconscious. It’s interesting to see how Finn is not necessarily touchy with the other boys in comparison. Below he gives Caleb a side hug on stage with lots of space left between them. We did not see Finn meet Caleb here on video, though, so who knows what their initial greeting was like? But bodies remain angled away. Perhaps we can blame the coffee table.
I wonder if perhaps Finn's casual touches for Noah are an age difference or instinctual thing leftover from childhood - those dynamics don’t ever really go away if you first meet someone so young, and they did share storylines where Mike was protective of Will. Noah mentioned as much at a previous con with Cara in 2024: 'Mike was always super protective of Will, and Will always leaned on him.' Finn has also noted he still feels the same ways about his ST friends as he did when they were younger in his wrap instagram post, which suggests that these dynamics will remain foundational parts of their relationships.
Finn’s touch lingers until he clocks either 1) the camera or 2) Gaten, and pulls his arm away into his body in a cross-arms position that is immediately very different to the open extension towards Noah.
Finn removes his hand - perhaps he was getting ready to welcome Gaten into the chat and removing his touch with Noah would create a more equal vibe for Gaten to join. But soon enough Gaten says ‘nah’ and turns away. Finn crosses his arms over his body, but his demeanour is still cheery and his feet and entire body remain pointed towards Noah as they chat away. Complicit. They swing together, unfazed by the proximity... unlike two certain individuals.
Sorry, what is a byler pic doing in here?? 🤭
But these poses look so similar don’t you think? The shot of byler is awash with intimacy and complicity as they lean together and look outwards in the same direction, but not quite on the same page just yet. And Mike is simply unable to hold Will’s gaze for more than 0.0000000007 seconds in this scene. Two very different stages of friendship going on here it seems. You’d almost think that Finn and Noah are a little more… comfortable with each other.
They continue to sway back and forth, but the smiles make this look relaxed instead of anxious in front of the cameras as the TikTok commenters insist. It could be true they are in fact nervous, despite their literal job and wealth of experience on camera. This is not scripted after all. But they’ve had plenty of interviews on camera over the years, and this energy is far different from that previous uncomfortable I’m-on-camera energy we’ve had from Finn before. There's ease here. And Noah has never shown such anxiety as far as I can tell from interviews throughout the years. He’s a natural in front of any camera. So why is he swinging and swaying like a wind chime in the breeze?
So eventually (aka 0.5 seconds after he decided to bounce) Gaten turns back to grab Finn’s attention, perhaps to tell him he’s going somewhere. Noah has noticed, multitasking self-awareness with chatting with Finn, but Finn hasn’t, he’s lost in the conversation, and Gaten has to do a little curly double hand wavy thing like he’s a mom at the school gate telling Brenda that she’ll see her outside aerobics class that evening.
Finn had been about to swing his foot right across and turn totally towards Noah, but OOP! Gaten is there, and he’s definitely not telling him to meet beneath the Arc de Triomphe for night yoga at 7pm. Is he? Either way I like to think Gaten made a subtle quip here, something damning that Noah wouldn’t pick up on, because Noah is unfazed but Finn looks shocked and read to filth
Then gaten departs feeling very pleased with himself.
Seriously though, Finn’s expression screams ‘caught in the act’. Raised eyebrows as if he is drawn out of the flow of engrossing conversation (engrossing? Really? They were probably chatting about the 5 plates of smoked salmon Noah accidentally ordered for breakfast.). Finn’s arms are still crossed, and notice his feet pointing to Noah despite listening to Gaten at something of an awkward angle.
What’s funny about the classic sign of attraction of pointing feet at the person of interest is that it sounds silly without context. You cant possibly point your feet at someone without looking insane! Well, observe: here they are doing it in a way that feels natural at times but also not. Finn keeps a foot pointing towards Noah even as his whole body is turned contrapposto towards a departing gaten, making him seem as though he’s in two places at once - balancing gaten and keeping hold of Noah. But why? Is Noah going anywhere? Who’s on the other side of the screen to draw his attention? (But notice how his feet, too, remained pointed towards Finn.)
In this moment I also like Finn’s dropped hip, because its reminiscent of Mr William Byers himself, and by extension, Noah, because this body language seems to be something that Noah gave Will unconsciously since he was young. We see Noah’s dropped hip time and again, both in the show as Will, and even at this con.
Whatever Gaten truly said, Finn turns back and suddenly there’s an awkwardness in the air, a moment of silence that neither fill. Noah is now also suddenly giving awkward unsure energy, self-aware and looking down at the floor, sweater paws fiddling with his admittedly very soft-looking jumper. Hunched shoulders, bashful expression, and dropped hip in action! (I feel Noah would be very good at Latin dance. He has the hips and feet for it).
While Finn is very fidgety too, the gap between them widens as they presumably respond to advice of where to stand later for pics. Finn is moving from foot to foot and sucking in a breath, holding his crossed arms tensely and tightly now (check that right hand!), and looking to the camera filming this a few times. He looks very self-conscious, and it's such an interesting comparison to how he appears with Gaten and even Caleb. There is an energy as if he and Noah have never met before or are still getting to know each other - but how is this possible when they've spent so much time working together? What is the cause of the tension in the air that is not resolving? Of course, the two are waiting around at the moment, so a little awkwardness is inevitable, but there would have been lots of 'waiting around' on a film set, too. Did this nervous energy pervade the entire year? Or is it simply the lack of privacy, the fact it's a public appearance with fans that's ticking the nerves?
Next we have Finn looking down AGAIN to the camera filming them, and Noah looking off into the middle distance with blushing giddiness on his face. Say the new French motto with me.
Liberté. Egalité. Complicité.
They swing and sway like it's a 1950s lindy hop (ooh I bet Noah could lindy too). I love the mirroring of this body language. Forever frustrated that we didnt get to hear these videos though! They are only momentarily together like this, but the orbiting continues, and they're obviously comfortable being so physically close to each other, which can happen when people are very good friends, are attracted to each other, or have lots of experience with physical closeness, such as performers who have worked intimately together. Yet even super close platonic friends might keep to their personal space when the option is there, but Finn and Noah are not making good use of the large space around them here at all. It's possible the room was very loud and they had to come closer to hear each other. It's possible! But it does speak of the kind of unique intimacy that performers who have gotten to know each other really well foster together.
So why that 'never met you before' nervous energy, too?!
Finn then goes on to seemingly say about how it can be awkward to take photos with people of different heights, and Noah agrees and gestures to leaning around people maybe. Finn's hands in pockets - usually a gesture of casual relaxedness - combined with his hunched shoulders, fidgeting, and fluttering eye contact, as well as leaning well into Noah's space... there is an undercurrent of nervousness here still. If you notice, it's mostly Noah who swings in and out in a wider orbit, and Finn who is angling towards him, following - but they also frequently move in tandem, as if on the same wavelength.
I have to say that they both form beautiful shapes naturally and really compliment each other visually. Maybe it's just a good camera angle, but they move in a way that feels almost choreographed. Perhaps this is reflective of the natural chemistry and energy the casting director would have looked out for at the very beginning. Perhaps it means they should perform a rumba together. Maybe this is how to defeat Vecna, who clearly has zero rhythm and is also looking for a good show
There’s continuous flow of conversation back and forth the whole time; they’re not interrupting or confusing each other, they don’t look bemused at all despite both giving off nervous signals in different ways (Finn's hand in pockets and hunched shoulders, Noah's flitting eye contact and vibrant attentiveness).
Italic Noah!
Theyre so silly :) And seriously, that lean? That core? This boy could be a ballroom pro
They seem to discuss the awkwardness of taking pictures with fans of different heights, and Finn then perhaps says how bad it is to see you have a double chin in pictures, and they both gesture to how to escape that by leaning upwards. Hilariously we see Finn putting his plan to combat this into action later on with his postures that look insane from a different angle...
This is something that professional photographers for things like weddings often recommend, which made me laugh to remember because these boys have both been photographed for years but might still be bonding over the perils of an unflattering picture. ‘Omg that’s the worst!’ says Noah? Who knows, but Finn looks especially devastated:
Either way, the yapping continueth and gaten has long since fled, probably like he did during from the group chats. Soon someone calls their attention again, and they’re drawn out of the bubble. This happens a lot at this con! We even have an video where a poor fan dressed as Chrissy seems hesitant to actually interrupt their chat as if they didnt just pay for the experience? Boys, boys, boys...
^ Whatever Finn said better have been comedy gold Noah, or else you are incriminating yourself.
( C O M P L I C I T É )
There's so many more moments from fans too, like the hand hold...
It’s a gentle cupping, very perfectly slotted together. Finn either placed his hand deliberately over Noah’s, or he was barely looking and this was complete chance and their hands slotted together so softly. Either way… yikes
(There are many more arm grabs but lord knows these posts have a picture limit that I'm already testing)
Bonus: their individual panels from Paris and Noah in Germany the day before.
Finn in Paris:
Q: The final table read of the last episode, I wanted to know, who did cry the most, and how has it gone?
He talks about Noah crying the most. He smiles, but his demeanour is relaxed as he mentions Noah’s name several times as if his mind is stuck on the memory and finds it amusing. He had been answering this question for only 20 seconds and still had to ask what the second part of the question was as he'd forgotten it. Finn. Come on.
Hilariously, the same thing happened to Noah the day before at German con when asked a question. Guess who it was about.
Noah in Germany:
Q: I wanted to ask you what was your favourite moment with Finn on set?
Noah says 'ooh' and looks up with a smile. He says it's from s5, so he can't say... then goes on to try and pick from another season, but ends up talking about how he's realised he's spent most time on set with Finn overall during the entire series. What's interesting is that he's said this before, at a con a few months before, and so it could be a planned soundbite, except now it's considered a spoiler: he cuts himself off, telling himself he's got to remember not to spoil anything for s5. It doesn't sound planned, it sounds like his genuine giddiness to talk about this.
Then he has to ask what the question was again, because he's forgotten for some reason. The moderator raised their eyebrows, as did we all.
(Frankly, looking at all this stuff together to make this post, it's just embarrassing for them at this point)
During Noah's Paris individual panel, there's a lovely moment where he speaks on ST being his favourite experience of his life. This moment stood out to me as the most sincere Noah we have ever seen. The words are hard for him to say: the weight of the experience and its meaning for him is audible in his lower vocal register and the hesitant, bashful way he speaks. Combined with Finn’s report of Noah’s emotional outburst at the final table read, I think Noah has only recently fully accepted the full weight of what this story means to him, and will likely continue to have revelations when it actually premieres and during the press run when discussing Will's journey. Beautiful.
Conclusion:
All this points towards the prevailing theme of giddiness and complicity in creating a story together. This might no longer be a normal friendship but instead the special and unique bond of coworkers who have gone to a place of deep artistic intimacy together. Perhaps we can excuse a little awkwardness, because while yes they are professionals, they are also childhood friends in this unique situation. But the giddiness does not read as solely uncomfortable awkwardness, but instead a sense of thrill and novelty. Their behaviour is already so comparable to the way many other actors who have played out intimate physical love stories on screen act during press, such as Kate and Leo in Titanic, timothee chalamet and armie hammer during 2017 press for call me by your name (don't at me), and Jonathan Bailey and Simone Ashley from Bridgerton s2. All these duos had complicity, giggles, giddiness, and genuine warmth between them in spades during their public appearances.
But sweetest are the comparisons to Finn and Noah's younger selves from previous season press. They appear to have evened out in maturity, and the respect for each other is clear. I also think there’s a sense of comfort and safety in their energy and body language together, suggestive that they’ve filmed scenes of deep vulnerability that required trust, on dark subject matter as well as sensual. Filming such scenes, for example spending lengths of time in unsettling filming environments like the dark, cold or wet, could have been intense enough to forge a real bond of reliance and safe harbour between them on both a professional and personal level, too.
Add in the fact that s5 is still a secret, and perhaps we can explain the specific blend of vibes going on here.
I will end with an iconic Paris moment which needs no words.
Years ago as a casual fan, I remember seeing a panel interview where Finn mentioned this was his favourite scene, and I lamented that they cut it along with him. As soon as I realised that memories were being used as a device in s4, I remembered it and the possibilities it holds for the narrative.
Perhaps this is the thing Finn begged the Duffers for in s5?
This artwork is so wonderful I keep forgetting it's not based on an actual still we've seen. The expression is perfect, the looming shapeless shadows in the back as Mike whizzes home, tears literally flying, hands clenched on the handlebars, I can feel the tension and pain in his chest as he breathes cold November air through his aching throat. The dynamo bike light illuminating the night... s1 vibes on point.
It's a shame how guarded the fandom is regarding sex. First and foremost because sex, and specifically shame around sex, is heavily, heavily tied to Mike and Will's story.
If Lucas can have a 69 sign above his head while he's sleeping, why is it so hard to believe Mike and Will are having sexual dreams about each other? Especially if you ship them and acknowledge the 69 sign was obviously signaling a sexual dream?
If Lucas can have a reference to dirty magazines under his bed, why is it so hard to believe Mike and Will also have dirty magazines hidden around their bedroom?
If Dustin can have a reference to masturbation, why is it so hard to believe Mike and Will are also interested in masturbation as well?
They specifically put these references in the other, ORIGINAL, party members, who are the same age as Mike and Will, while also including references for them too (that people just can't accept), signaling all these boys are starting to think about sex. The difference is, Lucas and Dustin don't have any shame surrounding who they're attracted to.
I don't know about you (however I imagine this is a common experience for many queer people) but before I accepted that I was attracted to the same sex, I'd constantly find myself watching the women in porn and consciously trying to focus on the man. I'd tell myself things like "oh - you're just interested in how your body will look when you're older" or "oh - it's normal when you watch porn" etc - basically anything to reaffirm that I wasn't gay. And this is all between ages 13-16.
This is exactly how I see Mike, specifically. Starting to notice his attraction to men but consciously repressing it, telling himself he's normal and it doesn't mean anything. And I think people forget (or maybe just feel uncomfortable talking about) this part - that the sexual attraction, the shame in the sexual attraction, is a huge, huge part of realizing you're queer and coming-of-age as a queer person.
And that's why Mike doesn't want to hug Will at the airport (or a big part of it). It feels awkward, even if he doesn't know why. It feels awkward because he feels ashamed for liking Will. I mean the first shot we get of Mike setting eyes on Will in Season 4 is of him looking at Will's chest and then quickly averting his eyes. This tells us everything we need to know - Mike is attracted to Will, feels ashamed about it and doesn't want anyone to know (or likely doesn't even fully understand it himself, but at the very least, knows it's not "right").
Point being, his shame surrounding specifically his sexual attraction to men is one of his biggest issues and failing to talk about it is a HUGE DISSERVICE to his character!
It also does a huge disservice to Will's character, too. The repercussions of this shame, a lot of the time, is Will's situation - not having your first kiss, all of your friends growing up before you, hating yourself because you have a crush on your best friend. All because he's romantically AND sexually attracted to men. This is what Will's thinking. If he wasn't such a freak, if he didn't want to kiss boys, if he wasn't starting to feel sexually attracted to men, then everything would be so much easier. He wouldn't feel like such a mistake.
This is why I think they'll absolutely have a sex scene in S5 and also why I think it will be explicit. I previously thought it'd likely be implied and that that'd be enough but I don't see it the same anymore. Now, I don't think this means it has to be racy, obviously, but just that the audience would see some of it. Quite frankly, doing an implied sex scene, while I wouldn't be dissatisfied, is a disservice to the story.
See, with Jancy, the implied sex scene works. The tension between these two characters has been building for a season and a half and we know they want to have sex. We don't have to see it, we just need to know that they do.
But with Mike and Will? That's not the case at all.
First of all, the tension has been building for 5 seasons, which is the entire series. An implied sex scene would ultimately be a tame ending to this storyline.
Second, Mike and Will specifically feel shame about this act, Jonathan and Nancy don't. We don't need to see their reaction but we need to see Mike and Will's reactions because it completes their characters. Because they have felt shame about this specific thing, not showing them feeling comfortable doing this, with each other, would be incomplete.
Third, think about Steve and Nancy's sex scene - we're shown it specifically because Nancy feels uncomfortable.
Ultimately, there's no need to show Jonathan and Nancy having sex because there's nothing left unresolved. That's what the Duffers actually get right - only showing a sex scene when it's important for the narrative and for the characters. Even Hopper and Joyce point to this, despite them being the oldest characters and the most suitable to have an explicit sex scene, opposed to Steve and Nancy. That's because there's nothing else to tell us about Joyce and Hopper through this sex scene - we know they love each other. I don't see why the Duffers would break this pattern now.
And well, even if you don't want the scene, I don't see how you could argue that the moment Mike and Will decide to have sex isn't extremely important for their characters and would tell us A LOT about how they both feel, especially Mike seeing as we don't get his perspective.
You could argue the kiss would suffice but... does it? A kiss isn't really... sexual. And Romantic, sure. But this wouldn't address the shame they specifically feel about sex. Mike starting to cry while having sex with Will tells us so much more about his character than him crying while kissing Will.
Kissing is also a thing children do. Ending a 5 season, 9 year long coming-of-age project, with two characters who have fought inter-dimensional monsters that quite literally represent their shame, simply kissing? Something we've already seen one of these characters do, multiple, multiple times?
Okay, I guess.
Anyway, I know a lot of these points have already been made, and that this was really long, but I just wanted to say them again because it upsets me so much, especially during rewatch when I see all the themes right in front of me. And I know it upsets other people, other young adults, too. Seeing this experience represented so accurately - one that you might even still feel shame about, one that you went through not too long ago - and not even being able to discuss it openly in the fandom, is sad. Being called a freak or a pedophile for simply suggesting that sex is important here and the Duffers are telling us so. Sex... the thing that literally created us all. And that almost everyone starts thinking about between the ages of 13-14.
Sigh. At least we have this blog. Thank you for that. 🫶🏼
previous tags include 'will's stealth' and 'you ain't subtle' <3
But so many people would think it is! Noah has spoken about how he loves to improv small moments and make Will his own - I believe this could be part of that. It's such an accurate portrayal of how an introvert would crush on someone else, taking any small moment they can. Will is an artist, a sensual person in love; a touch like this would be enough for him to live on for several hours or even days after a 'year' of no Mike at all.
Not to mention the importance of subtlety for a closeted teen boy when around his best friend.
I think what's most interesting is that instead of finding these moments to be rich little insights into character and acting itself, so many people dismiss them. Why not be thrilled and joyful at the level of detail in this show? Why say it means nothing, just because it might not mean anything for you? For a character like Will, these touches absolutely would mean the world. I can physically feel that touch, and the longing hidden within it. Warmth even beneath two layers of sleeves; a sense of closeness even though it's as casual as anything and they're tired out of their minds.
And if you look especially closely, you can see that Mike, too, notices, a little frown on his face before Eleven - oh, how fitting - draws his attention away once more.
As he lay on his bed, Mike’s fingers continued trailing lazily through the hair on his belly, still damp from the shower. Little shapes glimmered on the ceiling above him, and a new image floated into his mind.
It was another drawing, hand-painted and rich with detail. A tall, dark-haired knight stood on a cliff-edge, his cape billowing in the breeze, and swooning in his arms, not a woman… but another man. Wide-eyed and gentle-looking, with parted lips and soft brown hair, his undershirt torn open to the waist…
In the fall after the Byers' leave for California, Mike finds something unexpected hidden underneath the bathroom cabinet - something that terrifies and excites him, and forces him to confront feelings he’s not sure he’s ready for…
14th video (last video): for the 80s feel and vibe of the show wasn’t very intentional, they kinda just tried to let it happen naturally? Idk this one confused me bc I forgot what the question was, just a watch the whole video if you want to understand it 😭.
The question seems to have been about the evocative nature of the show, the way it’s an homage to the 80s. And Matt says that they always tried to evoke the STORYTELLING of the 80s - meaning a tribute to the way stories were told in the 80s, the tropes and archetypes - without making it a pastiche that felt gimmicky. So for them, ST is both evocative of the era itself, and the way stories were told during that era.
But they then go on to say that they love sincerity in storytelling; they appreciate irony and modern humour of that ilk, but Matt references a [filmmaker] who is looking for more earnestness in cinema - and says he agrees!
He essentially says that yes, they’ve slipped a little of the modern ironic humour into the show before, but perhaps they did it too much, and they were somewhat taken aback when that turned out to be so popular, because not only does Matt find that such humour hinders his suspension of disbelief, taking him out of an immersive viewing experience...
but that it was never the intention of the show, ‘to be honest’.
This is HUGE for the way we view certain aspects of the show - I’m looking at you, s3, I’m looking at you, Steve!
Sincerity in stories is something I would LOVE to see come back to cinema, and I think Stranger Things was always at its best when it was earnest and un-self conscious. This is possibly the most exciting development for s5 so far, and how much weight, gravitas and respect they are going to lend to Will’s story and the show itself.
