Hitler V.S. Stalin (and why the argument fails)
It’s not uncommon for people to cite examples and ad hominem when having a discussion, especially in religious debates. It almost requires as much in the context of religion when you think about it, because there really are no verifiable instances that can prove their premise to be true or even reasonable (cheap shot). One of the appeals often made on both sides when it comes to theists V.S. atheist are the examples of Joseph Stalin, and Adolf Hitler. Truth be told, the arguments used citing these two as examples have become so rhetorical to me, I put them on the same level as “The fine tuned universe” or even “Pascal’s wager” (citation) While not as many people use Stalin, they almost without fail will divert to Hitler when trying to paint the other persons stance in the realm of evil.
Firstly, in the eyes of history and the events these two men were responsible for, there’s no doubt they were among the most evil and sadistic people to ever walk the planet, and my discussion hence forth in no way serves as a justification for their actions and their outcomes. More so I wish to paint a grey scale as a more accurate representation of their existence, and why using them as a reference in common debate is an allusion to peoples general ignorance on the subject.
There’s no doubt or denying that Stalin lived and died as an atheist. Before entering into the Bolshevik party he was raised Greek Orthodox by his mother, and even entered into training for the priesthood as a teenager, but recanted as an atheist soon after. As part of the Bolsheviks he ascended in the ranks of political power even amongst the midst of Russian civil war during WWI. In 1922 with the quelling of the civil war and passing of political party members he rose to the position of General Secretary in 1922, from whence he consolidated his political party and became the primary leader in 1924. Stalin was a proponent of Marxism, and advocate of a Russian Socialist Union. His aim was to use the vast territory and resources under his power in order to make Russia the sole world power. Initially his plans were a success and he was able to modify the nation and bring it into the modern era of industry, but his long term goals were too far fetched given the short sighted nature of his decisions.
To build up Russia as a world power he relied heavily on forced labor of the public who were forcibly imprisoned into the work force. This left a shortage in agricultural areas of the nation which lead to a great famine in the 1930s. To resolve the nation’s food shortage Stalin imprisoned even more of the population and held mass executions. The death toll of Russian citizens during this time has no precise number, but the count is presumed in the millions. A major advocate against the rise of Hitler to power, Stalin did sign a non aggression pact with Germany in 1939 paving the way for an invasion of Poland that year. Hitler would later violate their treaty and invade Russia two years later as the next leg of his eastern campaign. After the second World War Stalin would continue to lead his nation for 7 more years, continuing to mold the nation into a fiercely communistic society, while simultaneously building tension with the western nations. His example served as a catalyst for western ire towards communism and socialism leading into the “Cold War” in which the west would become fixated on stopping the spread of communist ideology in the world and a mutual arms race of nuclear arms.
Adolf Hitler on the other hand, cannot be pegged as an atheist in any sense of the word. Adolf was born in Austria, but grew up with a deep sense of national pride for Germany. He was raised a Roman Catholic and never rescinded his baptism or renounced his faith publicly or in any of his records. Hitler served as a crewman on a German U boat during the first World War, and became a political activist after Germany’s surrender in 1919. The first World War brought about a realization in terms of the destructive capacity developed nations now had when it came to waging war on one another. Feeling that continuing on that path would lead to world anarchy the victors and the defeated came together to form the “Geneva Convention” and discuss a standardized method for the practice of warfare. Aside from Geneva, Germany’s formal surrender to the allied nations came to be documented as “The Treaty of Versailles” This document was the source of much contention amongst Germany and their allies. It demanded the German nation accept personal responsibility for the damage and destruction caused during the war, while imposing strict regulations on the nation in terms of allotted military power such as standing army size, and the amount of vehicles and weaponry such as tanks, planes, and artillery.
A solder himself Hitler didn’t agree with the Treaty of Versailles, and felt no patriot of Germany should stand for it. His activism earned him a short prison sentence in which he formulated his ideology into the book “Mein Kampf” In his book he potted out point by point his reasoning and belief structure in the German people being the descendants of the Aryan people. A lost civilization of what he regarded as perfect beings defined by a Norse heritage and Scandinavian descent. He believed that these people were chosen to inherit the earth above all other races as the master race. The most ideal examples of these being people with blonde hair and blue eyes. While not strictly Christian in the traditional sense, he made reference to God often, and Nordic mythology. He is also often accompanied with rumors of Occult ritual and practice, though these are not confirmed. Upon his release from prison he joined into the National Socialist Party in Germany. Through many political maneuvers and subterfuge he became the elected leader of Germany in 1934.
The effects of the treaty imposed on Germany had taken their toll paving the way for the socialist movement to seize power, and it was at this point Hitler’s positioning was most opportune. The world was still in the grips of economic depression, which helped to level the playing field for Germany. Hitler rallied the German people with a banner of patriotism, citing the unfair restrictions that had been placed on the people by the rest of the world after their defeat in the first World War in the Treaty of Versailles. He imposed his ideas of German superiority and of a master race often, and used examples of people he felt inferior as being the initial downfall of German society and the world society at large. Among these were ethnic groups such as Africans, Mid Eastern peoples, and most significant the Jews. Anti Semitism had been prevalent in Europe for generations, and Hitler used it as a catalyst to forge a common enemy for the German people. Anger and animosity towards the Jewish communities in Germany escalated, erupting in Kristallnacht (The night of broken glass) In which Jewish store fronts and homes were vandalized and burned in mass by German activists. During this period Hitler openly defied the treaty imposed on Germany, building machines of war and enlisting a massive army from the patriotic population. There were many Nazi founded programs that committed heinous acts during the parties reign. Too many to list in detail here, but the most recognized event that took place under the Nazi regime were the construction and operation of concentration camps designed as centers of ethnic cleansing under the guise of work camps. These camps had their origin in the eyes of Heinrich Himmler in response to Hitler’s proposal of a “Final Solution to the Jewish problem” Himmler himself orchestrated the operation of the camps at large, but Hitler was fully aware and expressed his approval in their intent. Under the Nazi regime. From the time the camps were constructed to their closure upon Germany’s defeat in the second world war in 1945, the toll of the people who died in the camps is estimated in the tens of millions, compiled with the deaths of civilians who were publically executed or killed via indirect combat there’s really no way to tell how many people died as a result of Hitler’s xenophobia and anti Semitism. Hitler held his belief in German superiority according to sources up unto his end in 1945 where he committed suicide in his hidden bunker among the ruins of Berlin. According to witness accounts within the bunker Hitler had felt betrayed by his military command and described them as cowards for not coming to the aid of Berlin. Even in death his orders were to maintain military discipline and continue the war for German superiority. It’s likely that if the western allies had been the first to take Berlin Hitler might have survived as accounts suggest his reason for suicide was refusal to be used as a symbol of victory for the Russian army given the heated war that had taken place in the East. Shortly after his death Hitler’s staff are reported to have taken his body to the surface of the bunker, and burned it along side his wife Eva. (They’d been married for mere hours)
So why the history lesson? Well if you remember, this is all in the context of people using these two figures as ear marks in their arguments, particularly in terms of religion and non-religion. To place it bluntly, they don’t work. Often when we’re opposed to something we’re just as likely to cite negative examples to discredit it as we are to reinforce the belief in positive ideas that promote what we do agree with.
Yes, Stalin was an atheist, but what people miss, and where there argument becomes fallacious is when they take that one descriptive aspect and try to apply it to their intentions as a whole. The atheist position is one that simply does not acknowledge belief in a god. Truly, unless you simultaneously hold a belief in the existence of every god figure ever proposed throughout human history, you too are to some degree or another, an atheist. If you are a Christian, you are likely an atheist about Ra the Egyptian sun god. Hopefully that gives you some insight into how useless the word is when it comes to linking personal behavior and ideology. Additional adjectives are required to better and more accurately describe personal philosophy, and while certain traits may be generally shared by people who identify as atheists, that doesn’t mean we all hold those views, or even hold them to the same degree.
It’s a ridiculous segue to state Stalin’s atheism is true, therefore A), B), and C) are therefore automatically true. It’d also be difficult to provide any form of reasoning to justify the course of his action as a direct result of atheism, largely because nothing he did was ever done in the name of being an atheist. His ideology revolved around social constructs and labor, along with a diminished power and removal of the church. Ideas I myself don’t agree with, but still, not done in the name of atheism as an ideology. Amongst atheists we are a highly diversified bunch, that don’t often agree on much of anything beyond the word. There are intelligent atheists, and there are dumb ones. Some of us are atheists for good reasons, others bad, and a multitude of grey separates us on an individual level. It’d be hard to form a philosophy around atheism, and we likely wouldn’t have a presence at all if not for the things that we do tend to agree on such as humanism, and the pursuit of knowledge.
To the religious reading this I understand it seems I’m beating a slow path around a bush trying to separate atheism and the actions of Stalin, but the truth is I don’t need to, because there isn’t a link to begin with for me to attempt and sever, just a fallacy. Really, what I want to do is show you why YOU should recognize that fallacy, and take heed of where we atheist’s are coming from with this.
Remember the other bundle of joy in our discussion? Time and time again I head people use Hitler as a short hand method of pointing out supposed evil in another person’s position. It’s obnoxious and needs to stop, especially if the extent of your knowledge on the subject is you’ve heard of him, and you heard he did some really bad things. When it comes to Adolf in arguments on religion, both sides tend to claim him for the opposing team, which again, stop doing that. While the certainty of his affiliation as a Catholic may be tentative, he was by no means an atheist in the pure sense (remembering of course if you don’t hold unified belief in all gods at the same time you do still count as an atheist.) His ideas towards Nordic mythology and the Aryan race are more than enough to disprove the notion he was a secularists. He often cited God and divinity when it came to his public speeches and rallies addressing the public, so at the very least he appealed to the sentiment of his mostly Roman Catholic citizens for his own benefit.
So to the religious I say, if this is how you plan to conduct your arguments, you should be aware of how easily it can be turned in reverse towards you, and why it’s utterly pointless to try and rationalize a persons entire philosophy based on a couple of words that do not always form complete ideas, or may even be deceptive in your understanding of them.
While we atheists must acknowledge Stalin as one of ours, the theists of the world must recognize Hitler as one of their own. If you want to set the standard by which ideas are measured, and weigh these things between good and bad, they’ll both end up in the red, which would dictate that the belief in god(s) was a non factor. Likewise if you weigh them in the affirmative on the other end with people who have done good things, they’ll both offset in the positive, which again, places god in the irrelevant box. It should be glaringly obvious to that effect, that peoples ability to do good or evil is not dependant on a belief in god. People who have good intentions seek to fulfill that intent. The ideology they form is the lens they see through in helping them determine how to go about those good intentions. It’s the rigidity of the lens and it’s ability to focus clearly which ends up either being successful or failing in those endeavors, which is where the majority of our disagreements take place.
We all have a lens tempered and shaped throughout our entire lives, and some see much more clearly than others, but all have the potential to get better or worse depending on what we focus on. I wouldn’t think many atheists would boast to have everything all figured out, but I could always be wrong. We’re trying our best to discern the best way of doing things just like everyone else, but as far as the lenses of religion go, we’ve seen nothing through them that promotes positive societal change, and that is where we often draw the line with you. At least when I argue with people on these issues, I’m asking for a good reason to be put forth as to why I should abandon my reason in favor of faith, and thus far no good argument has been presented. Religion has time and time again proven itself a dangerous pursuit when applied to society, whereas secularism has not proven out to be the case. I should know, our nation was founded on it, and we’ve managed to get this far on those principles despite our mistakes.
“Religion is an insult to human dignity. Without it you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion.” - Steven Weinberg.











