Gerard Way in Carry the Fire Podcast Oct/28/19
Gerard Speaks About Catholicism, Magick, and Witchcraft
D: So you grew up with the Catholic guilt, you said. Did you ever feel like you inhabited that world, or was it something being kind of thrust on you that you didn’t- I mean, it’s hard as a kid.
D: You don’t even know, but I’m curious about that and then where you’d feel like your kind of big frame worldview is now on like, “What are we all doing on this rock?”
G: Right, right. My family, my parents, they weren’t super religious. I come from this Italian Catholic background though so it was the kind of thing, my grandmother would go to church sometimes, but never would push us to really go. But for Christmas or something, my mom would go with her. But I think they thought, my parents thought, “This is the right thing to do. We should raise our child with believing in God and raise them Catholic because we’re good. Even though we’re not always there, we’re good Catholics.” So, they kind of put me on that path and I think the first thing I learned from being Catholic, or just religion in general, maybe it’s somewhat at times specific to Catholicism, is this fear. And this fear of Hell, that’s they really instilled in us. I think I was in the 1st grade or something, really young, and there was this thing that would happen where they would talk about death and Hell and all that stuff, and there was this period which, because of these classes, these after school classes, I would have these bouts of just crying. I guess I was coming to terms with the fact that my parents wouldn’t be there forever or I would lose them and they would die. But then the additional fear of, “Well, if they behave bad, they’ll go to Hell, and I’ll go to Hell too,” and so, there was this period where it was really upsetting for me, and I channeled that. I tapped into that stuff on a couple records, and on Three Cheers For Sweet Revenge, I borrowed a lot of Catholic imagery, and that second video for Helena being in a church, and things like that. So I kinda started- and in some of our merch designs too. I remember we had one with a cathedral and a rosary and all this stuff, and then that would come to a head in the song Mama on Black Parade but, yeah, my journey in terms of spirituality and where I came with that. Obviously, at some point, I was confirmed in the 5th grade, so I did that. But then after that, my parents didn’t have any more requirements out of me, because it was all about baptism, communion, and confirmation. And if you did those three things, you were good, then you could go as you wanted. So they never pushed me to go. And then, over the years, obviously I got into punk rock and I didn’t believe in God for the longest time, and then I just started to really need spirituality in my life as I got older. And I’m more of the sense where I believe in there being some- I don’t know if it’s a God, but I do believe there’s something.
G: Yeah. There’s something out there, there’s some kind of reason. I also believe we come from- because we do, we come from star stuff.
G: We come from the universe. We’re birthed from the universe. I’m a believer in the fact that the universe is chaos and born out of chaos and it’s uncontrollable, and there’s kind of no rhyme or reason to anything, and tragedies and accidents and bad things happen and good things happen, and it’s really just chaos being this constant true thing in the universe, and I came to those discoveries through my study of magick, occultism, and things like that, which I was inspired to do by my friend Grant Morrison. He’s kind of like a big brother to me, mentor, he’s really supportive and he’s very into magick. And so I became interested and he’s given me some lessons, and I actually wanted to do a podcast one day with him where I literally just sit down with him and have him talk about magick, because the way he describes it is, you would almost need it to be recorded to fully explore all the theories and things like that. So, I started to need magick, high magick, chaos magick, and eventually witchcraft, and witchcraft is something I felt more comfortable with because I always felt like, when I was reading about chaos magick, it felt like it was about making the universe bend to your will, whereas I was looking for something more that you were in service to the universe.
G: I think I got this from reading Crowley’s book on magick, but basically, I don’t know exactly what he said, but basically reality is your perspective. And that was kinda one of the key points of magick, your brain builds your reality.
G: And I thought that was a really great take away from all that. So, yeah, I’ve been interested in spirituality and things like that and studying shamanism, and all that stuff. We, with our daughter, we didn’t raise her with religion, but we, Lindsey, my wife, is really spiritual too. Not like a practicing witch or anything, but she’s just naturally adept at those kind of things. She’s really in tune with nature, she knows a ton about herbology, a lot of the founding cornerstones of witchcraft is just kinda part of her life. And so, we do raise Bandit with- Lindsey teaches her all about herbs and plants and we have a witch’s garden, and communicating with nature and trees and animals and things like that. So we’re teaching our daughter that there is a kind of magick to life and magick does exist. It’s not Harry Potter magic, but you know.
D: A lot of that seems like it’s about an embodiment, a connectedness to everything, to other people.
G: Yeah, connectedness, for sure, yeah. And just teaching her that she’s connected to the universe. And if she grows up and wants a different kind of religion, that’s great too, and I know I explored those. I was looking for a religion in art school, because I had a class where we had to study all the religions, or most of them. And I kept going from each one and I was like, “I like bits of this one, but I don’t like that.” I couldn’t find one that I landed on until I got later in life into more spiritual things like magick and witchcraft.
D: Cool. So with something like witchcraft, which for a lot of people are gonna hear it and have not at all the idea that you’re talking about I think, so something like the idea of goodness in that, where does that derive from? Is that coming from the inter-connectedness? It seems like there’s a moral view to it rather than morality being a decree maybe. It’s something that arises out of those connections?
G: Right right, yeah! I think the positivity in it, to me, and here’s the thing. I don’t consider myself a practicing witch or anything like that, I just read a ton of this stuff. And that’s one of the things they kinda warn you about with magick and everything, you could read all the books you want and some people spend their whole life reading books and never practice, but the thing they tell you to do is practice. And I think yeah, the goodness comes from being in service to the earth. Being connected to that and also, what I’ve learned about witchcraft, or at least the kind of witchcraft that I like, is it’s very gray. It’s not black magick, it’s not totally white magick, it’s just understanding that the universe and all things in it are very gray, there’s no black and white to everything. And I’ve really liked that the most, because I get older- when I was younger, I was very black and white about a lot of things. Especially in the earlier days of My Chemical Romance, everything was really military and rigid, and black and white, and this is right and this is wrong. You kind of get older and you start to realize, “No, things aren’t that simple. Not everybody’s all good or all bad. There’s a grayness there."
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