NOKTURNAL SUBJUGATION, Issue 3, Sacramence Interview
-Q. You started as a black metal/punk project, appearing on previous split releases. What made you decide to incorporate wider musical spectrum such as industrial, ambient, electronic, neo-folk? What was the turning point?
>A. Sacramence started, initially, as a “side project” of sorts, when I was performing in a full band, roughly around the Summer of 2013. I had become friendly with an L.A. band called Golden Milk, and Sacramence was meant to be a one-release thing, cutting a split release with GM. It kind of just went from there. I never really set out to create a strictly blackened-punk band, and since the start, Sacramence has been my outlet for any music within this project’s theme, regardless of genre. When I began work on “LSD,” I found that I was not able to express what I wanted with black metal or punk instrumentation. This in no way is an attempt to separate the project from black metal, and I don’t know where the project will go next.
- Q. There is big chance that in the region of black metal, many bands start to shift musical direction, such as Emperor, Mortiis, Burzum, Beherit, to name a few. They would go further into the noise/industrial/ambient/P.E. stuff. I was always curious about this. How do you comment such phenomenon?
>A. To me, black metal is a concept much like that of punk rock. Both concepts have evolved to represent much more than simply musical styles. The idea of BM encompasses more than that which can be confined to raw vocals, distorted guitars and fast paced drums. I have always seen black metal as the ultimate separation from establishment, normality, and conformity, so black metal artists straying away from the “normal” sound makes perfect sense from a certain point of view. Consistently releasing records with the same sound, and staying within boundaries almost goes against the idea behind the concept of BM.
- Q. Concerning your first full length, Lovers Seek Dominance, I can tell that there’s some kind of mysterious aura surrounding the album. What’s the theme that you brought up in the album?
>A. While I don’t think there is any one, exact theme that the entire album revolves around, and at the same time I don’t want to tell the listener what they must take from it, the subject matter definitely deals with human kind’s separation from the natural realm of life and the chaotic, mindless by-product that comes of it, most namely, modern religion. Organized religion is a dark thing, yet it is seen by the masses as the origin of all moral values that we must live by in order to be “good.” I hate the notion that humans are separate from animal kind and that everything is put at our disposal, which is unfortunately a common belief of many modern religious people . I thoroughly believe this is leading our kind to an inevitable end. Once the spiritual side of human existence took a turn away from celebrating our role within the natural law and moved toward a more narcissistic celebration of ourselves as the rulers of the planet, we created our path to our own destruction.
- Q. You also added Rune text in the cover, bringing more ‘esoteric’ taste towards the album. What’s the story behind this?
> A. I have been interested in the various runic alphabets for some time. Despite my contempt for some modern forms of faith, in the last couple of years, I developed a huge interest in reading into religious texts, especially those that many would consider to be “esoteric." This is what led to my attraction to the runic alphabet. Using runes in the artwork was a way of illustrating a time before modern beliefs and morals, a time before human kind’s separation from the natural order.
- Q. Bands play with symbols, sigil, or emblems, but most of them are rubbish. How do you see the symbol as meaningful and powerful code to represent your music, belief and message?
> A. I believe that symbols can be used by musical projects in order to separate themselves from the standard artist, presenting the project as a more serious thing, and establishing a sense of militancy in their message. This is, at least, what I strive to do with the symbology of Sacramence. I don’t see a point in bringing an artistic endeavor into existence without putting everything you have into it. False art has no place in our community. Many musical artists that I respect the most, utilize symbology, whether it be original or borrowed, in exactly this way. These symbols, throughout the years, have evolved into more than just representing a band and the music that they perform, but instead representing the ideals and themes behind the individuals. To me, this idea is what separates the underground from the mainstream. Its about more than just music. It is about more than money. And its supposed to represent more than whats at face value.
- Q. You also mention Gnosticism, Hermeticism, Thelema a lot. Does this have a direct influence on your album as it is reflected in the title? What do you think about love as a universal law?
> A. "Love” is a theme of Sacramence, in many different forms, Divine love, romantic love, unconditional love, etc. However, the title refers more to the concept of how many “lovers” of God “seek” the “dominance” of the nonbeliever. In many religious texts, especially those within Islam and Christianity, there are instructions to rid the world of outsiders, the heretics, the infidels. I have always been confused by the notion that many “Men of God” only have any interest in following the rules of their religions when it comes to others of the same faith.
- Q. The will and desire have been the subjects of philosophical and even religious debate, from Schopenhauer to Nietzsche, from Judeo-Christian to Thelema. Thelema offers the concept of True Will focusing on the purpose and meaning of oneself in life. I also found your lyrics to be empowering in discovering the self, don’t you think so?
> A. I am thrilled that you find Sacramence empowering in any way, but, honestly, I never really thought of any of my lyrics as empowering in self discovery. Personally though, I am a proponent of the idea that humans should stop lumping themselves into groups. All people should view themselves as individuals- individuals that are capable of fulfilling their own subjective purpose and realizing their own subjective life’s worth. Building borders between ourselves through religion, race, political affiliation, or social ranking does nothing but limit our existence in our world while striving for acceptence in a political, racial, religious, or social groups rids us of our individualism. Not that my views matter more than anyone else’s, but I believe the concept of “One’s True Will” cannot be realized by becoming like someone else.
- Q. I think an ideology is a matter of perspective. Music stands apart society, space, and time and cannot be justified by political ideology, therefore the accusation of fascism, right or left wing, nazism towards many bands (DiJ or Blood Axis maybe?) is ridiculous. Because I think music can also speaks outside social consciousness of what’s right or wrong. What do you think about this? Do you think that Sacramence could be a vessel to promote belief that has been strongly rejected by society?
> A. I couldn’t agree with you more. I will never understand why music is the only medium of art in which an ideal cannot be touched upon without the creator being instantly thought of as an advocate of that ideal. A film maker can make a film about the Third Reich, and he/she is simply an artist working with daring subject matter. If a writer depicts ambiguous fascist or communist themes in his/ her work, it is often times considered metaphor. But for some reason it is not the case in music. Once the wrong symbol is used or the wrong image is depicted in the artwork, the musician is nailed to it. As for the second question, I am not really sure how to answer. Perhaps I do not understand the question or perhaps I just don’t know. I can assure you that Sacramence presents no ideals concerning politics or race.
- Q. I completely agree with your explanation on Civilisation and Want (or is it the lyrics?). Our benefit is someone elses loss. Men always seek something in return, and therefore unconditional love is nonsense. I think that joy is delusional. It is only a denial towards pain and horror. I think that if one relates love with joy, he/she’s completely mistaken.
> A. That is a very intriguing take on the text of this song. When writing the text, I wasn’t really taking a stance on whether or not joy and happiness are logical human emotions. Moreso, I was attempting to present a commentary on human kind’s undying desire for more, and their inability or refusal to recognize the suffering required to fulfill their hunger. This constant greed has led to destruction and sadism being an everyday part of the human experience. Life is truly nothing more than the strong benefiting from the suffering of the weak. Living as a human being in the western world, I have constant feelings of guilt regarding the part I play in the suffering of other beings. Putting it into words, I guess, was a way of trying to understand that guilt.
“Who hasn’t asked oneself, am I a monster, or is this what it means to be human?”
- C. Lispector
- Q. And how about the track Judas Cradle? Does this have something to do with Judas explained in Abrahamic bibles?
> A. A Judas Cradle is a Medieval, European torture/execution device. It was a wooden pyramid in which the victim would be placed atop of. The top point of the pyramid would be oiled and inserted into the anus or vagina, with weights attached to the victim’s limbs. You can probably see where this is going. I find it funny that in a society ruled by the “moral teachings,” of the church, a society in which sexuality is such a taboo and oppressed subject, that something so perverse and sexually depraved was viewed as an acceptable method of punishment by those in charge. Apparently things like that are only wrong when perpetrated by the common man.
- Q. Colonisation is somewhat pretty nihilistic, in my opinion.
> A. I agree. The song features a sample from one of Godard’s masterpieces and one of my personal favorites of his, “2 ou 3 choses que je sais d'elle.” The film demonstrates Godard’s criticisms of consumerism, greed, and his views of American culture and its spreading through Europe at the time. The monologue sampled from the film is a commentary on our true helplessness and inability to really control what’s around us. Layering this over Kevin Slaven’s lyrics of the inevitability of death, I would say, is certainly nihilistic, but also uplifting when understanding that the acceptance of this fact leads us to a sense of freedom in life.
- Q. Last, can you tell us how the Sacramence born into this world? Who’s the personnel? What kind of instrumentation did you use to deliver the music?
> A. Like I stated before, Sacramence is my solo musical project. It is a vessel for me to releases any music, regardless of genre. Each release so far, though, has had the help of at least one other performer. Kevin Slaven of Earth Mesmerism has has been my most frequent collaborator, and I owe him endlessly for his continuing support of this endeavor. Ryanne Wyne also contributed vocals to “Ashes” which is personally my favorite track on the album. As for instrumentation, it really depends on the track. The black metal material has a more traditional approach with the drums, bass, guitar combination, with some straying off to a more electronic sound, while the new record was done mostly with synthesizers, sampling, and computer-based programming mixed with acoustic drums and bass.
>>>>I would like to take this opportunity to show my gratitude to J. Neumaier at Knife Vision Records, C. Main, K. Slaven, R. Wyne, and R. Aircraft for their immense support and help to the project.
