The future saves the past: How Venti traveled to the past, became the Bard, split his soul into the wisp, and sacrificed to save Mondstadt
For a while, I theorized that the Nameless Bard had Time powers [you can see here how much pointed to that since the beta]. That was now proven true, and, before, I though the bard was a normal human who just managed to manipulate Time, perhaps borrowed from Venti.
Now? I think he is Venti, who traveled to the past, split his soul into the wisp, and sacrificed and got erased in order to save future Mondstadt.
It all clicked thanks to AQ where Columbina traveled to the past and created Luonnotar, then merged back - both times involving a chemical marriage.
(If you don't like to read, the pictures are at least half of what you should retain)
(I also add possible connections with Istaroth)
Disclaimer: I have in the past written a separate theory proposing that Venti is Phanes (but not the Primordial One or the Heavenly Principles). I have notes about it:
It’s such a long analysis that 1) points explored there will be relevant regardless of what theory proves true 2) it didn’t fit reddit’s character limit, so you have to read in notion, tumblr or even ao3
It helps if you understand how the game relies heavily on the concept of the chemical marriage [my link] (union of opposites - sun and moon, male and female, dragon and seelie). It’s what brought most ancient civilizations to ruin, and it can be used in 2 directions:
One: To split the soul, a necessary step for the creation of hiveminds. Examples: Remuria, Deshret’s Golden Slumber, Ochk-kan and Cocouik;
Two: To join body, spirit and soul. It’s meant to create the philosopher’s stone that imo parallels the egg/pearl and grants the power/authorship to change the world, and is an alchemical process that the game recently brought to the forefront. Examples: Durin, probably Phanes
Wisp Venti was someone’s soul. That was important to my Phanes theory (where I explained how Phanes was the soul fragment of the Primordial One, and drew parallels between PO<>Phanes and Ochkan<>Cocouik, besides listing how Venti could factor there). Now, I think Venti was just a metaphor, and he is instead the soul of the Bard, at most connected with Istaroth too.
The previous Phanes theory contradicts the current one in some points, but they aren’t necessarily incompatible. Depends on how Hoyo chooses to execute the specifics, and how far back Venti will manage to go.
Section 1: The Bard’s connections with Time and Venti-related stuff
» The Bard’s confirmed connections to Time
We have now confirmation that the Nameless Bard utilized time powers, at least once, thanks to the artifact set A Day carved from Rising Winds. We know this:
Decarabian, upon being killed, was going to “explode” like gods tend to do, and wipe everyone in the area.
To avoid that, the bard’s body “became the instrument, strummed strings that once belonged solely to the Master of Time”. The powers were too strong for him and in, doing so, his existence got erased and forgotten.
Venti later salvages his name and Fate with powers from Istaroth.
It’s theorized that the bard sent the explosion to the future, and that Alice helped contain it. She mentions in her Traveler’s Guide Vol.1 that she went to old Mondstadt and exploded it to make it look properly like ruins, but that reason might be a disguise.
» The Bard saw/knew locations from the future
In the bard's cutscene, when he is bent over scrolls with the wisp at his side, they seem to be talking about locations of the future. The spots illustrated match locations in current Mondstadt - visible from Starsnatch Cliff, one of Venti’s favorite spots and where Cecilias grow.
While it could be symbolic, to represent the pair dreaming of a brighter future, I think it’s too precise to be.
Before the current theory, I thought it could be Venti’s doing, if he already had time powers and could show scenes from the future. Now, I think the bard is the one who is envisioning ad telling the wisp about them - it would be possible if he was from the future.
» The book Lost Prayer to the Sacred Winds
It was supposedly written after Venti’s ascension to godhood, but the unascended version of that catalyst contains an illustration of the Nameless Bard (this is actually what kickstarted my delirium a few years ago)
The book itself has multiple anonymous authors, and scriptures were added over time.
The book gained life and escaped its confines after the Aristocracy was defeated, thus the name “Lost Prayers”. Although it seems to be the book that Dahlia possesses.
It contains very suspicious verses that I couldn’t quite fully understand if they were said by Barbatos, the bard, or Barbatos but adapted from the bard in some way.
The figure clearly expected to die and to be merged into the Thousand Winds. They also seem to think that their essence would be part of the land.
The only reason I ruled out the bard for a long time was because, well, it mentions the aristocratic period, which came after the fall of Old Mondstadt. But if the bard was Venti from the future, then it works, and it’s true that the bard ended up being erased and becoming one with the Thousand Winds. In any case, scriptures were added over time so he could have simply written the first scriptures.
The Bard clearly knew what fate awaited him. According to the plume from the artifact set A Day Carved From Rising Winds, he says: "Until the breath of dawn erases my name, and reveals for you the light that is true." Venti, when acquiring time powers, managed to salvage the erased name of the bard and also apparently his Fate. So, if the Bard was Venti from the future who went back to the past, it would make sense for him to know what Fate he inherited.
In the artifact, that whole “do not grieve for me” section, echoes closely what was written in that book. Here are the respective passages of both for comparison:
From the book: “Children of the Anemo Archon, heed these words: From the winds we have come, and with the winds we shall go. Never, ever grieve for me. 'Tis but my flesh and bones which rest in the soil: My soul has become one with the thousand winds. When flowers bloom, when leaves sway, That is me who sings the songs of freedom, of the winds.
Bard’s dying words: "My dear friend, take now this breeze of a thousand years, and with it, a yearning for joy, and dreams of liberty. Do not grieve for me. While the winds still blow, folk shall sing as I once did, of their hope for tomorrow."
» Windblume and the Thousand Winds
The windblume festival was invented in Old Mondstadt, as a celebration to the Thousand Winds of Time. Venti only borrowed the powers of time AFTER the rebellion, so gratitude can't be the reason.
Many people in Old Mondsatdt (From the Gunnhildr Clan, and likely Amos too, who looks like Istaroth and is implied to be a prophet due to her dreams and inspiration behind her name) have been revealed to be descendants of Arcadia. We visit the ruins of Arcadia during Kaeya’s quest, where he says “thank the Thousand Winds”, so it’s possible that Arcadia was an ancient civilization with connections to Istaroth
The Windblume Star is the person who made the most sacrifices.
The Windblume represents an undefined flower, and was used as a codeword by the rebels.
The game contains a bow called Windblume’s Ode.
It’s described as: The bow adorned with nameless flowers that bears the hopes of an equally nameless person.
The flowers in the bow are very similar to one type of flowers that appear in the bard’s cutscene.
Funnily enough, the flowers resemble a lot how the plaza with Venti’s statue looks from above, in turn looking like a clock thanks to the winds. It’s also the place where the main ceremony of Windblume is held, and where they ask the Windblume Star to pick a flower
» Windblume flowers and Cecilias
The bard’s trailer contains 3 flowers that don’t match exactly to any flower from current Mondstadt, despite similarities:
The bard was associated with Cecilia-like flowers - it was pinned to his chest, and was also in the banner of the rebels. They aren't the same, and it’s possible that they didn’t exist back then - despite being fit for windy places, like Decarabian’s Mondstadt.
There are flowers that resemble blue Windwheel Asters
The other blue flower doesn’t match anything besides the map representation of the statue from above, that looks almost like a clock, in the location where current-day Windblume is held. It also resembles the flower in the bow Windblume’s Ode
It’s possible that the flowers were purposefully different from any known flower. That would make sense since the rebels invented the Windblume as a codeword, and Venti in the present tries to stay faithful to that principle and refuses to pick a singular flower to represent the Windblume, although he is partial to Cecilias.
In the plume of the artifact set A Day Carved from rising Winds, the bard once again references the nameless flowers: "Let the nameless flowers kiss away your tears, and grieve not for the parting that tomorrow brings.”
The only characters in the game connected with Cecilias are: Venti, and Albedo (a prototype primordial human, who uses Cecilias as his Ascencion material too)
In Albedo’s trailer, it says “Earth, the accumulative memory of time and being”, and the Cecilia appears associated with the word “being”
Cecilias were confirmed in an event, and then at the start of Natlan, to represent “the true feelings of the prodigal son”. But that information actually is as old as his announcement, way back in 2019.
That echoes the description of the Cecilia herself, “just as intangible as the true heart of an unbound soul.” The reference to “soul” in that sentence is also interesting given how it connects with the rest of this theory.
In his official dish, it’s said that the only difference with the traditional version is the inclusion of the Cecilia, and yet it adds: “But if you taste it carefully, you can taste the flavor of a wind that brings hope and tiny twists of fate.“
There seems to be a Cecilia in the Dust of Enlightment feather/material, that allows us to reroll artifacts or, in other words, rewrite fate.
Cecilias grow exclusively on Starsnatch Cliff. It’s one of Venti’s favorite places, it’s the place from where we can see all the locations that bard and wisp Venti mentioned from future Mondstadt, and it’s also close to the Thousand Winds Temple.
Domains often show Cecilia-like symbols, typically the triquetra. More about it’s symbolism in the irl references section
Inazuma puzzles possess the Cecilia symbol
Cecilia Garden is one of two regular domain entrances that does not have a Solomon's knot above its doorway, the other being Hidden Palace of Zhou Formula. It’s unclear when that Domain was created. There are ruins in a similar architecture to Decarabian’s Mondstadt around Cecilia’s garden, and it’s possible that Decarabian’s reach went that far, but we can’t say for sure. We also can’t really say if the name “Cecilia Garden” was only adopted after Barbatos became archon, or before. We know that the civilization who lived in this domain grew Cecilias in greenhouses.
Columbina’s body became the land, and flowers in Nod-Krai react to her emotions and Kuuvaki fluctuations because Kuuvahki is a part of her power.
A similar thing might happen to Venti when he dies as the bard, and wisp-Venti-turned-Archon might be able to use that to terraform the land and basically wield his wishes for the Mondstadt they both dreamed of.
The Cecilias might be born in that moment, representing what both of them felt - thus defined as “the true feelings of the prodigal son”. This would also tie with Albedo associating Cecilias with “being” in his stance about Earth.
The Natlan Summer Event in 2025 revealed that Venti has Time powers bestowed by Istaroth
That opened up some possibilities regarding his involvement in past events. Namely, that many things previously attributed to Istaroth might have been done by Venti instead.
Istaroth is indifferent and aloof, so why would she bother getting involved and helping? Although she might be faking it. But her appearance doesn’t include a single Cecilia.
One example: When the Traveler goes back to Ei’s battle against the Shogun where, after winning and changing her opinion, Ei plants a seed left by Makoto in the past, which transformed into the Sakura tree that protected Inazuma in her absence, effectively creating a Loom of Fate. It’s possible that the one interfering was Venti, using the authority borrowed from Istaroth, since we see a Cecilia in the cutscene with the wrapping, and Venti was the one likely present during the cataclysm (before heading to save Mondstadt), capable of making a plan with his friend Makoto.
They are the symbol of the House Schariac, known for Divine Maidens, warriors who have a chance of taking in the Holy Blood.
The Black Abyss White Flower in that game, a ‘Divine Key’ and weapon from the civilization’s Previous Era made specifically to kill herrschers, is also a Cecilia. That Abyss Flower is wielded by the character Cecilia Schariac.
Istaroth turned out to NOT be an expy of HI3’s Cecilia, and has no cecilias in her design - Venti seems more connected to the flower than her.
As u/daydream1437 on tumblr pointed out: They are also a key of creation, which is relevant when Phanes is a deity of Light and Creation
It ties very well with how the game recently confirmed that Venti is “The Sentinel who holds the Key” (source: Lunar Arcanum V: The Hierophant)
An inactive user in this post found that the name Cecilia possibly came from a Latin word meaning "blind", and according to this source, “Cecilia is as much to say as the lily of heaven, or a way to blind men.” SexyPoro also commented that it’s a variant of the word caecus, that can mean other variations of blind, such as Devoid of light, Vague, Aimless, Invisible, Hidden, Secret, Obscure
Caecus sounds like Caerus, a deity who:
Like Hermes, he has wings in his feet to fly with the wind.
Is an alternate spelling for Kairos, a greek word for permanent time, and how Istaroth is called in Enkanomiya
The Saint Cecilia is a virgin martyr in christianity, and the patron of musicians, composers and poets.
The closest real inspiration would be the flower trillium, which represent the Holy Trinity in Christianity, in turn correlated with the chemical marriage (another int to the splitting/union of body, spirit and soul)
Cecilias look like triquetras, once again connected with the Holy Trinity in Christianism, while in Celtic culture it represents the triple goddesses.
» Millenial Movement weapon set
Venti’s first signature bow was the Elegy of the End, which belonged to this set. The weapon creates a visual effect, Millenial Symphony, similar to Irminsul-like terminals
It belonged to the set Millenial Movement.
The set contains more information on the story of Old Mondstadt
The name probably also derives from Thousand Winds (in my language, the word for thousand and millenial are literally the same)
In the beta version of this set:
The descriptions mentioned that all the weapons were given to the bard by the “Anemo Archon” (which sounds like it’s being written from a present-day perspective, since the Anemo Archon didn’t exist in that time)
The old description also mentioned that the bard had seen “countless worlds”
One weapon of that set that ended up never being released was the Catalyst. Ironically, it was released with the exact same lore and description in 2025 - but it wasn’t a catalyst anymore, and instead became Venti’s new signature bow, The Daybreak Chronicles.
» Daybreak Chronicles, Kreuzlied and rebels with time powers
As mentioned, the new signature bow has the same name and lore as a discarded catalyst from the beta version of the Millenial Movement series.
It tells the story of the alias Kreuzlied, used by many rebels across the history of Mondstadt, many of which from Old Mondstadt. The alias is used often negatively, associated with rebels destined to fight and fail, since the name derives from a punishment created during the aristocratic period.
The last figure who used that name was from the Aristocratic period, and a member of the Wandering Troupe.
They were 4 figures who fought with song, who traveled through places with time anomalies like the Mare Jivari and were fine
They used an hourglass that was also a lyre to mark the tempo of their battles - “when the performance was coming to an end, the Troupe would play this harp” (turn the hourglass/revert time?).
They met their end when trying to free the people of Mondstadt, failing, but the member who went by the name Kreuzlied was spared due to being a Lawrence, and managed to keep supporting the rebellion.
More: he was the wielder of The Bell. Yes, that awful weapon… that literally has a clock.
Daybreak Chronicles says: “Till at last the final Kreuzlied would-awaken from a thousand-year slumber, answering the small cry of a foreign maiden who had drifted to this land, just as he had once been born from the wishes of a certain youth.”
The last person we knew of with that alias (the one from the Wandering Troupe, mentioned previously) didn’t seem to match this story at all.
So, many people associated this passage with Venti. He is a wisp born from the bard’s wishes, goes into slumbers, and he is possibly trying to help Istaroth, since he declared to feel the hope she doesn’t have anymore. My guess is that he is going to achieve all of this by traveling to the past.
» Constellations point that Vent is Fated to defy the Storm
In Teyvat, constellations dictate someone’s Fate. Let me summarize some points:
Constellations can be mapped into waypoints, which follow leyline logic, and waypoints are (mostly) used by the Traveler who has the will to change Fate
Fallen stars have the power to pull someone into the dream of the owner of the respective fate (see the Unreconciled Stars event)
The fallen stars/meteors in question are called Irminsul Fruit, and we know that the Irminsul is responsible for calculating Fate (it’s really just a big hivemind that people are connected to)
Intertwined Fates are shaped like stars, and described as “A fateful stone that connects dreams. Its glimmers can entwine fates and connect dreams, just as how its glimmer links stars into the shapes of a heart's desires.” It’s implied that the player’s party is the result of the Traveler using these to change a character’s Fate in order to bring them along, in an alternate-timeline type of thing
Hydromancy allows the reading of Fate thanks to the reflection of stars in the water
We have cases of playable characters realizing what their Fate was, and literally quoting what their constellations say. For example, Hu Tao during 2025 Lantern Rite. It’s reasonable to infer that the same will apply to other characters.
Alright, so why is this relevant to Venti and the Bard?
Vent’s constellation names are, for the most part, obvious and not that special: Splitting Gales, Breeze of Reminiscence, Ode to Thousand Winds, Hurricane of Freedom, Concerto dal Cielo and Storm of Defiance
It’s the last one that I want to focus on. I also confirmed that the name is translated correctly from chinese.
While it can be a hint that he might want to defy… Celestia, Fate? - I don’t think the inclusion of ‘Storm’ there is a coincidence.
Venti would be the one creating the Storm, which would work given his Anemo Powers. But I wonder if we can also interpret this as “Defiance of Storms”.
Decarabian was called Storm Lord and created a Strom barrier around Old Mondstadt. If the Storm Venti defies is his, it wouldn’t make sense for this constellation to be the last one… unless his Fate took him back to the past, to when the Tyrant existed.
It's represented by a shield being broken, and Venti doesn’t have any associations with shields. The only other shield I can imagine him trying to break, besides Decarabian’s barrier, could be the Firmament, but the story of Decarabian and other ancient civilizations are an allegory for the story of Teyvat and the Primordial One, Koitar, etc
Final constellations really are important and I wouldn’t be surprised if Hoyo hid his Fate under our noses from the beginning.
» Other relevant symbolism
Divine imagery: Why would any of this be done if the bard didn’t possess any divinity, or connection with the seat of Anemo?
The bard was repeatedly framed in religious imagery, similarly to Barbatos
The bard literally is introduced framed in the Queen chess-piece, the same one that Venti has, that represents his status as Archon.
Barbatos’ old lyre: The cutscenes don’t really depict this, but it’s theorize that the bard’s lyre was the Holy Lyre der Himmel, that wisp-Venti-turned-Archon picked up upon the Bard’s death.
We know that, canonically, Barbatos used that Lyre at first - we don’t know if it really belonged to the bard, nor how it ended at the hands of the Church
People theorized, derived from the previous guess, that the bard’s name was Himmel. If that is true, could this be a sneaky way to preserve his name? Since Himmel means sky, it wasn’t a word that could really be erased, just the association
The bard’s lyre was different from other lyre’s in Old Mondstadt, aligned with models from the future. Lyres back then were huge decorative pieces, not instruments meant to be portable, as stated in the description of this teapot item [Tenor of the Wind].
Apples (the fruit of Fate) and seeds of stories:
This section was more relevant to my [Venti is Phanes] theory, that I still recommend since a lot of sus things about Venti are not explained by the theory in this post. But I still think this particular point can still provide extra insight to the current theory.
Venti has MANY associations with apples
His head in wisp form is shaped like an apple, with the top with a stem and leaf
He is always asking for apples, even as payment. He also offers them sometimes. He also really enjoys apple cider.
While terraforming Mondstadt, he created the Golden Apple Archipelago
Speaking of golden apples, he literally offers one in one of his birthday arts, and the text that accompanies it is one of the most suspicious things ever: “It is written that there is a whole tiny world hidden inside an apple core. Here, this half is for you. Let's take a stroll in the tiny little world. But remember to keep it a secret because... you're the only one I want to bring there.”
How mythology maps to the game:
Apples are seen as the Fruit of Fate in anime (ex: Mawaru Penguindrum) - in Inazuma, the girl giving Fortune Slips is called Gendou Ringo (Ringo means apple).
In Sethian Gnosticism, many interpret the forbidden fruit, that the serpent tempted Adam and Eve with, as an apple from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil.
Greek Mythology has the Golden Apple of Discord, while in Irish Mythology, golden apples are depicted on the Silver Branch of the Otherworld.
Other noteworthy references and notes:
In Lyney’s teaser, the apple he holds transforms into the moon.
Amphoreus/HSR presented a golden apple as the Fruit of Time, obtained after playing a tune on wind chimes. It’s described as “the treasure at the end of the adventure, and the benchmark of a legend’s prologue”
Venti is always quoting that “seeds of stories, brought by the wind and cultivated by time”. Considering how the Irminsul stores stories, and is the truth that people perceive, then who planted the Irminsul (Nibelung?) basically planted the world.
In other words, the seed of the Irminsul is the Genesis Pearl/dragon egg/etc referenced in the Gnostic Chorus cutscene - which is narrated by Venti, indicating at least that he knows that information.
In turn, Istaroth has extra relevance in Old Mondstadt given how people worshiped the Thousand Winds of Time, amongst other aspects mentioned in this post
Section 2: How the time shenanigans work in practice
» Similarities and differences between Columbina and Venti’s journeys
Differences that seem to spell tragedy for Venti:
On one hand, he lacks an anchor in the present. While with Columbina, Luonnotar stays in the present, wisp Venti ascends, lives in the present for a long time, and then that is the version of him that heads to the past
On the other hand, Columbina sacrificed, but she never got erased, nor is that written in her Fate. Venti is not so lucky in that regard
Luonnotar never became anything more than a soul, except when Columbina came back and merged back into her.
I wonder… if Venti as a wisp was a soul, could it mean that, by ascending and acquiring a human appearance, he was becoming his complete self without knowing? Perhaps what he perceived as a loss was, in some ways, the opposite.
Similarities that could work really well:
Every time Columbina was pulled further back, she was pulled by a strong wind, which is appropriate.
Columbina was losing power as she went back, so Venti might also lose a lot of his power until he reaches the time of Old Mondstadt, which would explain why 1) the bard’s braids didn’t glow and seemed fully human 2) the fact he managed to use the winds of time to sacrifice at the end came as a surprised to everyone
Columbina’s body became the land, and Venti’s might too:
That is probably how Cecilias will be born, representing the true feelings of the prodigal son (refer back to my section about Cecilias).
In fact, the book Lost Prayer to the Sacred Winds states that: “'Tis but my flesh and bones which rest in the soil” and “When flowers bloom, when leaves sway, That is me who sings the songs of freedom, of the winds.” It passes the idea that he was simply buried, but considering the rest of the context, it might mean directly that his flesh IS the land
» Slumbers as a chance to visit and affect the past + timeline contradictions
First, how could this work?
Maybe his slumbers take him to periods in the past. Just like Columbina traveled through the past and got the chance to influence it, Venti might do the same, and one opportunity for that to happen would be his slumbers.
Although, he might not be able to travel all the way back at once, so he might not be able to reach the moment he was born as a wisp, and that will only happen in his “final slumber”.
Columbina influenced past events, and there are hints that Venti does the same thing. He sometimes confuses the period he is in. We see several instances in the beginning of the game, likely because his awakening was recent. For example:
During the Prologue, he tells the Traveler to meet “at the usual place” which was under Venessa’s tree, but they had never met there at that point
That weird “you don’t remember me?” voiceline that could fit many different theories.
Contradictions regarding Barbatos age+ascension:
Technically, he only ascended and became Barbatos after Decarabian was defeated. That was around 2600 years ago.
We know that the civilization in the Chasm belonged to the Unified Civilization (in other words, from before the Archon War started) - now confirmed by Zibai’s introduction into the game, since she was the region’s envoy, when it was still called Lang-Gan (before it was “nailed”).
But if we explore the Chasm, we can find this [Mysterious Letter] that mentions “the lyre of Barbatos”… even though he couldn’t have ascended back then, eve if he existed.
If anything, this proves at least that Venti is involved in some form of “time travel”, and is able to reach the time of the Unified Civilization.
Wisp Venti never knew they were the soul of the Bard. I think it’s clear that the bard never told the truth to the wisp, contrary to Columbina, potentially to preserve the loop.
Wisp Venti was driven to steal the bard’s name and fate as soon as he got hands on Time powers, to deal with his own mourning - with the goal of taking the bard’s fate upon himself (and potentially revive and save the bard, who wouldn’t have that fate anymore, in a new samsara or something).
Perhaps, since the bard knew that the wisp would do all of that, he opted to hide the truth. If the wisp knew the truth, they would realize that taking the bard’s Fate would just mean it would doom them to a loop, and he wouldn’t do it.
Does Venti currently know? He clearly knows what Fate he stole and decided to wear, and seems to know he will eventually be erased and merge with the Thousand Winds (see my analysis of Lost Prayer to the Thousand Winds, and consider for example how he is hiding it from Barbeloth).
Maybe he doesn’t realize that he will meet that Fate by traveling to the past, and that the bard was always himself. It’s possible that he expects the bard to just be revived one day in some way, or has other plans to try to save him, without realizing that they are the same person.
I think he knows, given how much secret information he is aware about - for that, I recommend once again my [Venti is Phanes] theory (still has lots of useful analysis). Much goes unexplained by the current theory, from how he seems to know the Sourcesong, how he is the Sentinel who holds the Key, how he relates to so much in the gnostic myth…
A possible relation, that could even explain things like their shared VA in all languages… is that Istaroth is a Venti who went through a Thousand Cycles
Canon: Venti is a thread of the Thousand Winds of Time. The Thousand Winds of Time is Istaroth
If my theory is correct, Venti is stuck in a perfect loop. Bard splits soul (wisp) » Bard sacrifices, merges with the Thousand Winds and body protects the land » Wisp gains human form by uniting with the land and becoming whole, not just a soul » Barbatos acquires time powers » Barbatos goes back and loop restarts
No new people or timelines are created. It’s all the same soul, the same land. Even when the bard gets erased and merges with the thousand winds, that only happens in spirit, because the body goes to the land, and the soul was already outside the host who dies. The spirit keeps being merged and unmerged, while the body and soul are recycled, and the only point where all three are together is when Venti exists as Barbatos.
If Venti goes through this a thousand times, and gains the authority of time in each… wouldn’t that mean that, at the end of a thousand loops, he would have gained the full power of Istaroth? And at every death, he merges back with her. A thousand threads of wind gain the power of time a thousand times. He is literally the Thousand Winds of Time
I can’t say that Istaroth shows up after Venti goes through a thousand cycles, in part because Venti needs Istaroth to exist to be able to pull this, but the thing with Time is that it doesn’t have a beginning or a end
Extra thing I noticed: Old Mondstadt existed 2600 years ago, and was the period when Istaroth was most involved. The aristocracy of Mondstadt existed 1600 ago, and by then, Istaroth had already been forgotten and her temple was repurposed into an Arena for slaves. It’s… a thousand years of difference. Istaroth is called the Thousand Winds. At this point, I really have to wonder if that’s just a coincidence.
» Hoyoverse is the one idea company, and we have seem this many times
For better or worse, we have seen this before. At this point, I wouldn’t be surprised if most archons (all those with a double), phanes/the PO and the traveler were stuck in a similar situation.
With the Traveler: We have pseudo-gotten confirmation that they are in a loop already, thanks to the AQ A space and time for you. I wouldn’t fully call it a timeloop, although it’s still a useful term, but I recommend checking [this video from Ashikai] for a detailed explanation
Khaenri’ah: Was literally created in the present, or at least in the space where the traveler’s existed, thanks to a Loom of Fate. But it’s a recreation of the past Khaenri’ah, woven from the memories of Dain who knows that the cataclysm will happen, and is consequently bound to repeat the same Fate.
Archons besides Venti: Nahida is another branch of the Irminsul, like Rukkhadevata was, and described by the previous Dendro Archon as “me in another samshara”. Furina is the human aspect of Focalors, so they are technically the same person in a way, and it relies heavily on the splitting of the soul allowed by chemical marriages. Ei and Makoto are twins - but many people theorize that actually, they are also the same person, or even that Ei was never Makoto’s sister and was created (cloned? sometimes with remnants of the electro sovereign or of a moon, depending on the theory) and implanted fake memories. Why would Venti be any different?
Primordial One/Phanes: There’s a reason why I thought Venti could be Phanes - I guess he was just the perfect metaphor (although I will celebrate if Hoyo actually makes them one and the same, since a lot of what I found for the other theory still isn’t explained).
Examples from other Hoyoverse games: Look no further than the Mem/Cyrene/Elysia situation during the Amphoreus arc of Star Rail. I basically think Venti will stay in an Elysia situation
Teyvat - and perhaps the rest of the Hoyoverse, judging from recent revelations in star rail about the Terminus universe loop - uses a time-cube model. I will try to summarize the main points, to show how the cases above make perfect sense:
As the game puts it, time is a cube (sources: Time Trekker and a speech from Natlan’s AQ1 by Mavuika). That means all of the events are contained within that cube, at the same time, so all that will happen has already happened. Minds are nor able to perceive everything simultaneously, so they need to sort it through cause and consequence, but there is no actual beginning and end.
If we go with a book metaphor, or a stage play, we can imagine that chapters or scenes all exist at the same time (for example, the book encapsulates all chapters, already written). But the order in which they are perceived is dependent on the reader/witness - nothing stops them from opening pages at random and checking the story out of intended order.
Authors can break free of fate, or change it. They can add following volumes with new details and revelations, that can re-contextualize past scenes already written (technically that’s also what Hoyo does all the time: if we learn that the bard was Venti all along, that is literally an example of such). If the witness, and everyone, start perceiving things differently, the new interpretation becomes the truth of the world. It’s also what Durin was managing to do when he added twists of fate in Nod-Krai’s quest, getting to talk to people from Hyperborea despite not managing to change their fate fully, and he broke free of his own fate by becoming an author. Venti has many indications that he tried to do the same over time, and Wanderer also realized that truth during Durin’s quest, amongst many characters who take advantage of this to different degrees.
Another way to try to change fate, although less successful, is by destroying information. The abyss can literally be perceived as ink that stains words in the book, and if we go with the computer metaphor, information can also be deleted from the database. However, the rest of the story will still stay intact, so the reader and the characters inside will try to make sense of everything else by filling in the gaps of the absent information. It’s also semi-implied that the abyss doesnt fully destroy information, but absorbs it and stores it somewhere else instead - that’s how he learns how to mimic, for example.
This is why Hoyo’s theme is “the future saves the past”. Because, to change fate, someone in the future has to add scenes to what has already happened. The past can’t change itself, and it can’t change the future either because it’s bound by an already realized fate. It’s also why the Traveler is so important, because they aren’t affected by the irminsul and can just witness scenes in any order they wish, and by not losing information when irminsul erasure happens, their sense of truth is never tampered with - so they could technically go and add the missing information later, similarly to what the Wanderer is doing about past events. They could also lie, technically.
Looms of Fate are often represented through Irminsul Trees, and can be thought of as computers with alternative databases, that can compete with the idea of truth of the majority of people. If we go with the book metaphor instead, they can be history books written by authors that didn’t become so popular, and consequently don’t influence the opinion of the public about what happened to a relevant extent. They are also always planted by authors/witnesses/gardeners ig. Basically people in the present who decide to write their recording of how they perceived history.
Ending notes: How I feel about this
I feel conflicted, for several reasons. I will go over the themes, Venti’s experience of loss, and how fandoms approach conflicting ideas.
» The themes of the game:
Hoyoverse is the one-idea company, and has several themes going on that, for better or worse, are going to keep being reused. That alone brings mixed feelings. On one hand, the fact that they always pull the same tropes can lead to a sense of repetitiveness and even “laziness” on their part, especially after we crack how it works. On the other hands, it’s a way to keep themes cohesive, and write stories that rhyme and have some poetic parallels. It takes skill to fool people for so long, and to use every instance when this happens to reveal just another piece of the bigger puzzle, since I think they are aiming to slowly show the story of the universe itself.
For people who don’t like this repetitiveness, I really recommend stepping away from Hoyoverse titles sometimes. I don’t see this going anywhere else. Personally, I think I’ll stick around, since plot and the “what” doesn’t matter to me (that’s why I love spoilers and even story leaks), and I only care about the “how”.
Now, what themes does hoyoverse actually tackle?
Power and love for humanity: Genshin is particularly clear that it’s a story about giving power to humans, over their own Fates in particular. Almost every arc serves that purpose, and dragons and gods of all kinds are in decline. Besides that, many figures in the Hoyoverse - especially god-like figures, like Elysia - have an arc tied to protecting humanity, and sacrificing out of love for humans.
Freedom to write their own Fate: I have a whole section about how Teyvat works: The Irminsul, the hivemind, the dreams, and time-space itself. I also demonstrate briefly how, to break free from Fate, someone has to become the author of their own story, like Durin has done. But most often, people can’t do that, they can only write tiny twists to fill unspecified information, which is something Venti himself has been trying to do for a long time, along with other characters. Keep in mind that gods are also tied to Fate, so this point isn’t so much about humanity, and about Teyvat as a whole.
The future saves the past: I mention this one in the theory’s title because, well, is the theme that fits more clearly. It works thanks to the time-cube model, so changing something in the present affects the entire truth/taints the whole cube. That’s also why time paradox arcs align well with the story of Genshin.
Are these themes being undermined if this theory turns out true?
The “future saves the past” point definitely isn’t being undermined, and thankfully no one argued that. As for the others, it comes down to interpretation - but I think this theory would reinforce the themes, not the opposite.
First, the rebells are the ones who take down the Tyrant. Without them, there would be no victory, and all of humanity within the firmament has to bond together to fight their oppressor - which in this case, it’s Decarabian with his barrier. I think this is a metaphor for the whole story of the game, and how the Traveler might unite humanity against the Primordial One. If that isn’t enough, the one who killed Decarabian wasn’t even the bard - he was killed by Amos, a human, his own ex-lover. This theory doesn’t affect that at all.
The role of the bard was simply to unite humanity, and inspire them to join and fight for their freedom. This actually makes me more certain of my theory, because it perfectly fits the way Venti has always “ruled”/guided Mondstadt in times of crisis. He calls upon people, but let them make all decisions and be the ones taking action. “What does Freedom really mean, when demanded from you by a god?” Some people are bringing up this quote, but… there is no demand here. If you accept that Venti is not being hypocritical in the present, you would have to accept the same would be true if he traveled to the past, because his actions and role are consistent.
The only thing that Venti does, that other humans couldn’t do, is the final sacrifice. Let me reinforce that he was weakened at that point - as shown by his appearance (bard’s braids don’t glow), the fact his sacrifice surprised Istaroth (so she couldn’t even detect that the bard had time powers), and the parallels with Columbina (she lost more power the further back she went). We also know that the wisp only acquired time powers AFTER the ascension, since he used it to rescue the bard’s name and Fate. So the powers of the Thousand Winds were not as involved as people fear, and they were NOT what takes down the Tyrant, that is the humans doing. This was only relevant to let Venti sacrifice, when he accepted being erased for the sake of preventing humanity from being wiped out.
» How the theory reframes Venti’s loss
I was very attached to the idea of Venti preserving the image and values of his friend, and to Venti and the Bard has their own separate characters: I even have a whole fic trilogy telling the story of Old Mondstadt, and it’s very important that they are separate for that fic. Even if I didn’t, a big reason so many people connected with Venti was because of how relatable and understandable the feelings he shared in his first SQ were.
So I get why people would feel sad if my theory came true. I would as well, because it feels like the mourning was for nothing, pointless. If the bard was Venti, that means Venti never lost someone. But does it?
After siting with my feelings for a while, I don’t think this undoes the weight of the mourning Venti carried, or his sense of loss, nor the way he learned over time to develop into his own person instead of trying to mimic the little he remembered of the bard.
The way I see it, the Bard and the wisp will always see each other as separate, just like Columbina perceived Luonnotar as a being separate from her own person. But there are even more layers.
Yes, when Venti goes into the past, and realizes he was always the bard, he will known the truth - but that only makes his life more bittersweet and ironic, and the loss more profound:
For one, he is going to see all of his old friends, except for the one he loved the most, because it never existed.
He is going to understand that he succeeded in becoming like his friend, and properly preserving his image and legacy, after he had properly moved on and become happy with the person he was.
His attempt at saving the bard, in the moment he stole his name and Fate, was what doomed him and made him fail to break free from Fate.
The feelings of loss he experienced are not undone just because he knows the truth - if anything, they are compounded by knowing the person he loved “never existed”, while also having the comfort that said person was always with him.
Last but not least, he will probably care for the little wisp and want to spare them from suffering, while knowing very well the pain they are going to go through.
As for the wisp, they won’t know they are the soul of the bard, like I mentioned in the theory. They will only feel the loss of someone they love and, by the time Venti tells the Traveler about his backstory, they will be just as clueless. So what Venti shares in that scene, and what he feels, is real, and it’s his truth. He will only find out that the truth was different when something happens that sends him back to Old Mondstadt.
» Canon, Fandoms, and compartmentalization
I feel like many people are not engaging with my theory properly, and instead of rejecting it because of canon I failed to acknowledge, they are rejecting it because it makes them uncomfortable or destroys their headcanons. As I mentioned, it destroys several of mine too, and I understand the initial rejection, since I also felt it. But the beauty of fandoms is that we can bend canon to fit whatever we like.
For example, right above I shared how I view the theory coming true as a reinforcement of the loss and the themes, not the other way around. Is that the correct interpretations? Who knows! But fans don’t have to be correct.
I will also keep writing fics and making content where the bard and Venti are separate beings entirely - while doing the same to the new connection I just proposed. I personally like to hoard headcanons and interpretations, even conflicting ones, and just compartmentalize. That’s why I can be a multishipper, and use contradicting theories for the content I create.
And I understand that not everyone has the same ease in keeping interpretations separate, and feels like canon has the capacity to destroy the headcanons they love. I understand the frustration of spending time and energy into an interpretation that “loses”, and that it can be uncomfortable to see many people jump into a fandom or pairing or wtv over canon revelations that contradict the very thing that made you attached to them in the first place.
However, as someone who is pushing 30yo and is starting to give in to nostalgia, I would love to see fandoms go back to a time where we dictated what parts of canon we wanted to keep, were better at curate our own content, and didn’t beef with people having fun with opposing preferences. More, we need to relearn how to twist canon so it can actually feed our favorite ideas, instead of undermining them. If we learn that, that just means we keep getting more content, instead of having to abandon canon entirely and compartmentalize so much that we are basically playing with OCs after a point (not that there’s anything wrong with that)
Anyway, I think get every perspective in this, I’m not judging. But I hope people don’t reject their theory just out of a sense of “ew this is different from the things I enjoyed”
Good luck with your pulls and your fan-content! No matter what interpretations of Old Mondstadt you have, I am going to love all of them, and it would be amazing if this subfandom grew. Keep being creative!
I am working on a fic for this theory, and this Nameless Bard 3D model, that I will release to the public once it’s ready, and I will recreate the rest of the Old Mondstadt’s cast too:
origamiaround
stormborns
tangentwithtanner
yousharknotpass
discoholicmusic
areudirty
