#c2e18

[ithinkthiswasabadidea]

For me, I don't think any character backstory revelation will ever, ever quite top Caleb's "I'm going to tell you the story of how I murdered my mother and father" and "I was so sure... until I wasn't, and I broke a bit" and "Anybody can make lights. Anybody could send a message through a wire. I want to bend reality to my will"

Nothing as brutally, terrifyingly visceral as the way the Empire's controlling individuals set up so many systems of abuse and manipulation. God.

[ariadne-mouse]

You know, even though Caleb’s tragic backstory has been memeified to hell and back by now, damn is it still chilling the way Caleb recounts it for the first time in 2x18. Liam's flat toned but very tense delivery. The fact that they had dinner with Astrid’s parents first. The ox cart pushed against the door. His parents' screams. He was sure until he wasn't.

[mareastrorum]

With each Nein Again episode, I wish more and more that we could have seen how the relationship and pressures from Nott and Molly would have developed in tandem.

Nott’s coping mechanisms for her own hangups are usually projection and an alcohol addiction. She’s quite intelligent; she has so many thoughts at all times, and when her fear ratchets up, she drinks so she can get things done. She doesn’t repress her feelings, but she questions others’ because that’s easier to do than to spiral about her own, and it’s easier to spread the judgment around than to center it entirely on herself. She has a life to go back to, and while she is stuck in circumstances where she doesn’t believe she can simply return, it’s still something she wants.

Molly opts for denial. He doesn’t know, he doesn’t care, and if someone forces him to face something, it doesn’t matter. He’s made up his mind that everything about Lucien is not and should not be something he has to deal with—unless it puts the group in danger. He only put up with Cree at Yasha’s insistence, and he couldn’t exactly cause a fuss in a crime boss’s personal hideout. Molly only told the Nein what he knows so that they could be ready if danger arises. As Taliesin said in a Talks, Molly is a celebration of the ephemeral. However, Molly also strives to exist only in that space. He doesn’t want fame, doesn’t want to be tied to anything, and he insists on having the option to cut and run, as shown with his reaction to the declaration of war in episode 18.

The most obvious example where they could have conflicted is Caleb’s backstory. We know from canon what Nott’s response was: Caleb did something horrible, but it was not his fault, he was a child, and he needs to forgive himself. Caleb pushed back on this for nearly the entire campaign, and whether he forgives himself or not, his perspective eventually shifts to recognizing that Trent Ikithon bears the brunt of the blame. Caleb also witnesses her struggle with the choice to go back to her family and when, and there’s no doubt in my mind that seeing Veth choose to adventure with the Nein impacted Caleb’s choice to destroy the T-dock. Her story was about reconciling elements from her past with her present, and Caleb eventually accepted that he is allowed to have a present life of his own.

We don’t know how Molly would have reacted to Caleb’s backstory, but it’s not a stretch to imagine that he’d say something along the lines of, “Well, that was Bren, and you’re Caleb. Don’t do it again.” And leave it at that. Nevermind that Caleb is Bren, because that would poke at Molly to consider that he and Lucien might be the same. Nevermind that Caleb wanted to do it (which is his primary hangup) because that was then and this is now, because anything otherwise suggests that Lucien might have something to do with why Molly is the way he is. Nevermind that Caleb’s memory was manipulated because that plants the idea that maybe something similar happened to Molly, and the sheer thought is terrifying. Why is Molly so skilled with swords? Why does he know things he doesn’t remember? Does it stop there, or is there more about him that actually comes from Lucien? Molly doesn’t even want to consider that, and he’s going to reject any mentality that even raises the question.

Molly would have been a character that resists Nott’s pressure in the group. He’s already been cruel to her unknowingly, but we don’t know the extent to which he would have done it once she revealed her story in Felderwin. I get the feeling he would have hated the whole arc; Nott has a kid, they’re chasing her kidnapped husband to Xhorhas, and then they’re the heroes of the Dynasty? Oh, that’s almost all his buttons. I have no doubt he’d have stuck with the group, but he’d have been anxious about it the entire way, and that would have added some delicious conflict.

Molly would have been the ongoing “We don’t have to go” voice whenever another PC was going to willingly face their backstory, which would have added more direct conversation for that PC to commit to why they’re doing it. Fjord doesn’t need to claim the last orb, but he felt he was responsible for keeping it safe from Uk’otoa. Beau doesn’t have to face her family, but she wanted to. Caleb could flee Rexxentrum instead of meeting with Trent Ikithon to see the beacon, but he accepted that he cannot run forever. We got some exposition on those regardless, but a character like Molly drags the reasoning to the forefront because he’s going to be sassy about it.

Granted, Molly could have sounded a lot like the annoying kid asking “but why?” after every answer, but Taliesin also played him as a bit of a pushover whenever someone offered up a reason. He didn’t want to deal with Cree at all, but when Yasha said she thought he should deal with it, he stayed instead of running out of the Evening Nip. He didn’t want to investigate the weird sounds in Labenda swamp, but once the group committed to saving the little bird girl, Molly ran into the fight. He didn’t want to get involved with the Scheuster kids beyond giving them some money, but once Fjord insisted on helping fellow orphans, Molly went along with it. One answer to the “why?” would have been enough, and “I felt like it” is good enough for him. He didn’t want to go deeper than that.

Nott served a similar purpose because she pushed back against the others as well. However, unlike Molly, Nott wanted to know the underlying motivation. She pushed Caleb to admit that he had grown to care for the Nein when they stayed at the inn in Shadycreek Run. Her questioning added tension to the arcs for Fjord, Jester, Yasha, and Essek.

So how would they have interacted? I could see Molly either refusing to engage with the conversations if he could avoid them or insisting that people don’t have to answer when Nott keeps asking them. But what happens when they ignore Molly and answer Nott? Would Molly have changed tactics when the other PCs decided they wanted to talk and they wanted to change? Would that have changed his perspective?

Crucially, how would he have reconciled his mentality with Yasha’s seeming betrayal? The PCs hadn’t had the time to recognize that she was under a Geas; it was a theory. Fjord and Beau believed Yasha had turned on them willingly. Jester and Caleb believed it was some kind of charm or control. Sure, Molly would have told Yasha not to chase Obann to begin with, but how can he reconcile “live in the present” with Yasha’s inevitable part in the Angel of Irons cult? He’d be clinging to that theory of mind control for his life, and the Nein went months without confirmation. Would Molly have changed his tune when Caleb insisted on meeting with the captive Volstrucker several times? Would Molly have supported Fjord’s decision to rebuke Uk’otoa when that meant the Nein had less power to rescue Yasha? Would Nott have needled him for trying to save Yasha after he likely needled others for trying to save their loved ones? Man, I’d have loved to see Nott corner Molly the way she had cornered Caleb in episode 27.

“Live in the present” is a lovely mantra—when there isn’t a past you want to return to or a past that’s chasing you. It would have been fascinating to see how that and Molly would have developed alongside Nott.

[bardicfisticuffs]

I have watched episode 18 and I have a TON of thoughts that I'm not sure I have the coherency for right now, but that that episode was wild in so many unintentional ways beyond just the Caleb Lore Dump proper. Caleb sees Trent Ikithon for the first time (that he knows of, given his shaky memories of his time in the sanatorium) in over a decade, where an ally of his makes herself seem as suspicious as it is possible to do and makes herself a target. Afterwards, Beau unknowingly asks him to tell her about how he killed his own parents while in that man's power. The party then spends several minutes opening up the care package from Jester's mama, with a lovely letter showing how much Marion Lavorre loves her daughter, along with not-as-much-money-as-Jester-was-expecting, which is still four times as much money as she and Caleb previously argued about being "more money than [his] parents made in their entire lives". Jester then apologizes about this argument.

Like that is a clusterfuck sequence of events to happen right before Caleb admits to traumatic parricide.

Even after that though? Caleb at the library going "I'll read a little bit about the political entity that Ikithon belongs to, the guy I just revealed is a monster and will absolutely be a major villain going forwards. Mostly though I'm going to look into what I've implied my long term goal is, something that could very well tear apart the fabric of reality or at the very least rewrite everything we have already done even if I manage it." and Matt going"Cool. I'm going to allude here to the Calamity, a world ending event that happened because of mages and their hubris, and also you read about other wizards who have attempted to do what you want to do and have eradicated themselves in the process." And most of the rest of the table have NO CONTEXT FOR ANY OF THAT and are bored out of their minds?? Exquisite. 10/10, no notes.

[dirtyassvoiceactors]

*battle at the colosseum ends*

Fjord *looks at caleb next to him*: "No big deal, right?"

Caleb: *hides even more in his hood*

[whereislarkin]

ahhhhhh oh my god the caleb backstory, I finally have it and OH MAN liam didn't disappoint, that is SO FUCKED UP

[devinsds]

Listening to Critical Role on Spotify is both a mood killer and hilarious.

Caleb explains his fear of fire to Beauregard, and after she leaves, Nott goes to comfort him like a good motherly figure.

Then all of a sudden "GREETINGS ADVENTURERS!"

[mooshlovely]

Nein Again Episode 18

Slowly catching up! This is another episode that has been ingrained in my brain. Not only do we get the Caleb backstory reveal but it also sets up the empire siblings friendship which is my bread and butter

Do they ever bring the compass battle map thing back? I have no memory of it

The absolute fear in Travis' voice when Matt mentions the legendary action (23) Level 4! Level 4!

I love how much Liam makes a point to describe Caleb's idiosyncrasies, like hiding his face when the crowd is cheering. They're all such minor details that almost go overlooked if you don't know his deal, but they add so much flavor (53)

Got to love Nott and Jester giving a second layer of fake names while Caleb sticks with Caleb (1:10)

It is very funny to send Beau and Yasha to talk to people. Definitely the most charismatic of the group lol (1:20)

and the Caleb freeze. (1:23) An impressive dead-eye stare from Liam. Travis' "sure it is" when Trent gives his name is mildly funny.

Yasha's legendary skill with wisdom saving throws xD (1:25)

Yasha sounds so fucking suspicious lol

Got to love Nott for just straight up asking Yasha if shes a spy. Molly's comment about how she's been working at the circus (and thus cant be a spy) is actually not super useful when Yasha is well known for randomly disappearing. Tbh it would have been very interesting if Yasha had been a spy and it could've fit into her current lore p well. (1:35)

Beau: "Why are you afraid of fire" I love every conversation between Beau and Caleb. (2:11) I feel like they're willing to be honest and straight forward about things to each other in a different way then they are with the rest of the party. I think they clocked early on that neither of them tolerate bullshit well. It's also just super interesting that the favor Beau asks in return is information, her curiosity (and nosiness) is such a consistent trait of hers and it's in full force here

It feels like of course it would be Nott and Beau that hear Caleb's story first, but I guess it could've been anyone to give Caleb an ultimatum like that. Crazy how stuff works out, how would things have been different if this bonding/sharing had happened with someone else.

In some way I think Caleb was looking for a reason to tell this story. Like yes he wants to get into the library, but also if he really didn't want to share, I think he could've bargained with Beau or tried visiting on his own (2:44)

"but those dancing lights make sure I can punch people in the face when I can't see shit" aw Beau that's so sweet (2:58)

Also hot damn, Liam's acting in this conversation is so spectacular. Sometimes I have a hard time remembering that it isn't actually Caleb sitting at that table

Damn I didn't realize that Nott used Veth as a fake name ever. She was remarkably bad at coming up with aliases (3:29)

First reference to Caleb's interest in manipulating time

its pretty impressive how often they visit Pumat. Literally multiple times a week for multiple weeks (3:50)

The intense look that Beau gives Caleb when they talk about staying together. (3:56) To me it reads like she is expecting him to leave (expecting to be abandoned again), but in being worried about him leaving, it also implies that she wants him to stay