#geirus

[etz-ashashiyot]

are you okay with getting asks about your decision to convert, the conversion process, what it was like for you, etc, and if so are there any subsections that you *aren’t* comfortable with getting asked about? You’ve mentioned that you converted several years ago a couple times, but I know that some gerim (I hope I’m conjugating that correctly) don’t openly discuss their conversion process outside of close friends and family, if that, so I don’t want to overstep.

Yeah, that's fine! Just DM me though — I want to know who I'm sharing what with.

[rabbiaharon]

תנא נעמן גר תושב היה נבוזראדן גר צדק היה מבני בניו של המן למדו תורה בבני ברק מבני בניו של סיסרא למדו תינוקות בירושלים מבני בניו של סנחריב למדו תורה ברבים מאן אינון שמעיה ואבטליון

Translation: Nemen was a righteous gentile, Nevuzradan (who personally took part in murdering tens of thousands of jews) became a righteous jewish convert. Some of the grandchildren of Haman (who tried to murder the entire jewish people) converted and learned Torah to in Bnei Brak. Among the descendents of Sisra (who wanted to destroy the jewish people in the time of the Judges) taught Torah to children in Jerusalem. From the descendents of Sancheriv (the Assyrian king who murdered hundreds of thousands of jews and sent us into exile) were some who taught Torah to the masses, and who were they? Shamaya and Avtalyon. (those were 2 of the greatest leaders of the jewish people during the time of the second temple, and the teachers of Hillel the Elder. Converts descended from one of the biggest enemies of the jews.)

The source? Tractate Gittin, a volume of the Babylonian Talmud, and a universally accepted text in traditional jewish literature. For those converts or prospective converts who are worried about being accepted in the jewish community because of your family's past, or even for your own past, don't worry. You won't be the first, and I'm sure you won't be the last. Even if you yourself are now an avid antisemite, if you come to me in the future and they are honestly looking to convert and live your life as a jew, you will always have a place at my shabbos table.

[returnofthejudai]

why aren't Syrians open to converts?

To prevent intermarriage. At first the takkana covered only those who had conversions for the sake of marriage to a Jew (something seen as insincere), which they — and many others, quite honestly — hold as invalid. Throughout the decades it has become more stringent.

There’s a Master’s dissertation available online about the community in NY specifically (although that’s by far the only SY community to hold by the takkana — they also do in Mexico, Argentina, Brazil…) that unfortunately I’m not being able to access, but it’s called “An analysis of Brooklyn’s rabbinical Takana prohibiting Syrian and Near Eastern Jews from marrying converts” (Sarina Roffe, 2006).

“This master’s thesis explores the roots of the 1935 Takana - which forbids marriage to those who convert for the purpose of marriage - and subsequent reaffirmations issued by Rabbi Jacob S. Kassin, the Brooklyn, NY Syrian Jewish community’s Chief Rabbi, and the Rabbinical Council of the Syrian community. 

Such marriages were not to be recognized by the community. Children of such marriages could not attend community yeshivot. Further, rites of passage such as bar mitzvahs, weddings and the right to be buried in the community’s cemetery were denied, as well as synagogue honors.

The author provides historical context, examines 18th century practices on marriage to converts in the United States, interviews community rabbis, discusses enforcement, provides individual cases, examines demographics, and analyzes the changes in the Takana with each Reaffirmation. The author also provides a social context for how the Takana is interpreted 70 years after it was issued. 

As a community member, the author provides valuable insight into how the Takana is interpreted by the community’s members.”

Source

[returnofthejudai]

Hi! I've just found this acc, and after reading your "biography" i remembered this thing i saw time ago, which said that to be jewish you had to have At least a grandfather who was jewish, or you couldn't convert... Is this true? Thank you anyway for creating this wonderful And useful blog （⌒_⌒）

to be jewish you had to have At least a grandfather who was jewish, or you couldn’t convert… Is this true? 

Not at all.

[returnofthejudai]

hi im so sorry because im 99% sure this has been asked before but I couldn't fine the post: if you convert through modern orthodox will stricter branches of orthodoxy not recognize your conversion? also, are there certain (specifically modern orthodox/orthodox) councils where converts who convert through those affiliated synagogues are not recognized if trying to make an aliyah?

if you convert through modern orthodox will stricter branches of orthodoxy not recognize your conversion?

Some, but not necessarily. It varies according to the community, and a RCA ger/giyoret may be asked to re-converted if they want to join certain communities. But most of the time it doesn’t seem to be an issue. Where I live the Litvish community does accept MO conversions (but they have their own beit din and definitely prefer someone going through it), as long as it’s kosher. 

The chassidish communities here (e.g. Vizhnitz, Belz, et al) most absolutely do not recognize MO conversions, even if the Rabbanut accepts them. My chassidish friend said that they don’t trust batei din that don’t have a chassid on it (the beit din here has Rabbis from different chassidish communities, as well as the main Litvish community, so it gets accepted all around). 

also, are there certain (specifically modern orthodox/orthodox) councils where converts who convert through those affiliated synagogues are not recognized if trying to make an aliyah?

The only one that I know of with such issues is “open Orthodox” — the IRF. Their conversions are not recognized by the Rabbanut (or by the RCA, or by MO Rabbis), and are not acceptable for the purpose of aliyah (read this for an example of a rejection of an IRF ger; the part about the RCA being “primarily ultra-Orthodox” is not true, though).

If you’re looking for a MO beit din, look at the RCA’s list of participating batei din to see which one is closest to you (that’s your regional beit din).

**For the future, though, questions about conversion and converting should be asked to someone going (or who has gone) through the process and who can assist you, talk about it — not us. We don’t touch the vast majority of questions about conversion, as neither of us are converts.

[returnofthejudai]

Are there any other blogs like b'nei ruth? on Tumblr or other platforms. I'm exploring the idea of converting and have read plenty of books and have a meeting scheduled with a rabbi. The blog seems to be inactive but I loved the q&a's, practical advice, and conversations happening there. It was more helpful than most conversion books!

I don’t know, quite honestly. I’ll publish this so others can answer and help you. :)

[returnofthejudai]

Hi! I'm sorry if you've been asked this already, I've just been looking everywhere all night but it's okay if you don't want to answer!! I was just wondering if converted Jewish people are still considered gentiles/goyim? Thank you for reading this ;;

Absolutely not. Once they convert (i.e. after dunking in the mikvah), they are as Jewish as anyone else.

[returnofthejudai]

I've been seriously considering converting to Judaism for a good few years now but I've internalised this view that only orthodox conversions are valid. It's a bit of a problem for me because I'm very liberal and identify with reform Judaism more, but if I convert reform I'll always have a gut feeling that I'm not really Jewish :(

Someone who had a Conservative conversion and then an Orthodox conversion wrote this post, that may be useful to you: “If You Think Only an Orthodox Conversion Is "Good Enough,” Then Don’t Get a Liberal One!“ Not all of it may apply to your case, but it could be an interesting read still.

Other than that, I’d recommend you to checking out the blogs of gerim, as there are things that we cannot help with. Lacking the experience as gerim, we at ROTJ can’t assist you with that kind of support and perspective. I usually re-direct people to @bneiruth.