#geten discourse

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I don't understand (I do though) why people hate Geten when she's basically perfect. Her pretty face contrasts with her feral gremlin behaviour and evil life philosophy, and her clothing makes her the opposite of most female ice users we see in media. Characters like Elsa and Killer Frost are slightly sexy and alluring, but Geten? She lives under a parka and has no table manners, I love her so much.

SAME FAM, SAME.

I am hoping that Horikoshi plays up her gremlin nature even more now that the hood is off. LET A GIRL BE MESSY AND OVER-THE-TOP, HORIKOSHI. LET HER BE AN ABSOLUTE TERROR!

More than just a female character with a different type of design from what we’ve gotten before in this manga, I am excited about the possibilities she opens in the story. It’s clearly no accident that she has ice powers, looks like Rei, but spits out Endeavor’s bullshit social Darwinism, or that she’s been explicitly set up as a counter for Dabi.

She is going to further his story, and I am SO EXCITED for the potential angst, drama, or intense backstory reveals that could come out of this. We’ve been waiting way the hell too long for some progress on the Dabi-is-Touya front, and here is a doorway opening right here! How can people dislike her when she is out here about to shoulder the burden of the backstory we’ve all been craving for years???

But likewise, I’m also super excited to see Geten grow as a person herself. Clearly her own arc is going to be dealing with her preconceptions that the world should work on the dog-eat-dog principle and that physical power determines one’s personal worth. She’s got to learn that people have value regardless of their quirks–and whether or not their bodies are suited to their quirks–and she’s got to learn that friendship is the real power that a powerful quirk is only meaningful if its used to protect, not to oppress. Dabi, and even the League of Villains as a whole, is a good place to learn that your identity isn’t predetermined by the circumstances of your birth.

Geten is a bad girl but she is G O O D for the story.

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People aren't as mad at Dabi because he is also disabled and mentally ill and while his behavior is problematic he isn't working to reduce the rights of his friends or people like them because of their mental/physical differences. It's like how black rappers can use the N-word and still be celebrated by other black people.1/2

I wouldn’t normally respond to something like this, but you’ve caught me in a terrible mood, so I’m sorry, buddy, but…

That Dabi is disabled, I’ll give you. But where has there been a shred of evidence that he’s mentally ill? Isn’t this just a fan extrapolation based on the assumption that he was abused as a child, something which hasn’t been confirmed at all in the story? Why is it okay to judge Dabi based on his assumed past, while making the opposite assumption for Geten, whose past we know EVEN LESS about? 

“…he isn’t working to reduce the rights of his friends or people like them…”

Geten isn’t working to reduce the rights of her friends either? She’s explicitly promoting and working hard to ensure her friends have the rights she wants them to have, namely the ability to use their powers freely, something which she–and the MLA–saw as a fundamental human right which was being oppressed.

Dabi is a literal terrorist working with a group whose goal is explicitly to DESTROY ALL OF PEACEFUL SOCIETY. By their very existence, the League of Villains works to reduce the rights of innocent people and spread their own dogma of heroism’s failings. I know we like to perceive them as oppressed because the story tells us directly we should sympathize with the villains, but they are STILL FUCKING VILLAINS, not helpless little victims that need to be protected.

I mean like, are you really, REALLY trying to argue that being a quirk supremacist is a worse crime than being an active MASS MURDERER???

Couldn’t you at least have argued that Geten kills people too, instead of taking the most bizarre route you possibly could?

“and other fan reactions to her (while also likely fueled by shipping and even sexism) are still reasonable.”

My dude. My guy. Y I K E S.

Thanks for telling me what is and isn’t okay to bring up on my own blog, I guess?

Like, I appreciate that you seem to mostly agree with the idea that the hate is influenced by shipping, but the message you’re sending here is exactly the double standard I was trying to point out in my post.

Because Dabi has become the fandom’s uwu precious abused baby, he (and Shigaraki) are completely forgiven no matter what they do; fans are willing to write off every evil action they take as a result of “those horrible adults who hurt them”–I say this an eager villain stan who loves Shigaraki and Dabi more than any other characters in this manga: a tragic past doesn’t excuse you from responsibility for your current crimes. Shigaraki (and likely Dabi) were manipulated and abused, BUT THEY’RE STILL BAD GUYS who have done terrible things to people who absolutely didn’t deserve it, on purpose.

It’s not woke to dismiss someone’s deliberate bad choices just because of their tragic past or physical circumstances; Dabi is not ANY less evil or less “problematic” than Geten just because he is disabled. And yet–because of the double standard of Geten being an attractive young female character who could threaten existing ships–she is treated as if she’s completely unforgivable for her crimes, even when her on-screen crimes are lesser than the male characters AND even when we have no idea what kind of tragic past she herself might have had.

Why is Geten expected to be a good person while Dabi literally gets away with murder?

The hate she’s receiving is FAR disproportionate to the crimes she’s committed, and it is motivated primarily by fandom bias toward good-looking male characters, shipping, and sexism.

It’s fucking gross, fam.

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classic tumblr: Geten is a horrific abuser who questions why disabled people are alive and promotes quirk supremacy! She’s unforgivable; I can’t trust anyone who would ship Dabi with someone so problematic!!!

Dabi: *is a literal mass murderer who frequently insults the physical appearances and mental health statuses of his own allies*

me: Just say you hate her because she might interfere with your preferred ship and go, plz

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People hate Geten because she's a girl, there it is. It's one of the biggest reasons why I don't like being in any fandoms, because of the constant misogyny, be it from men or internalized by women. Of course you can dislike a character but looking at how female characters are being treated compared to male ones who have the same personality/flaws etc. ... it's kinda hard to ignore, cause if those female characters were Male, the hate would never be as extreme 🤐

I won’t imply that everyone who dislikes Geten dislikes her for being a girl, but I will argue that people are less likely to sympathize with and forgive her than they are Dabi and Tomura because she is a girl. Among fandoms, precious uwu abused bby boys get passes that female villains do not, regardless of their backstories, and that’s just cold, honest truth.

Here’s to hoping she had a horrible childhood or something, so the fandom will at least move on to woobifying her instead of crucifying her.

(That said, weirdly enough, I actually disagree? I think in this specific case, if Geten was revealed to be a good-looking young male character, he would have gotten quite a bit of hate as well. As much as misogyny likely contributes to the double standard Geten is treated with, at the heart of a lot of this “I don’t like Geten” outpouring is the knee-jerk reaction of ShigaDabi and DabiHawks shippers who now have to deal with the possibility of a whole new Dabi ship taking over and becoming more popular. I mean, I literally ship ShigaDabi and DabiHawks and have seen the progression of the fandom from day one… It’s a cycle–Hawks got hate from ShigaDabi shippers when his connection to Dabi was introduced; female or male, Geten will just naturally be the target of hate from shippers who feel like another Dabi ship will draw attention away from their favorite. Geten being a girl might make the threat a little worse, because het ships have a higher chance of becoming canon, but I imagine that if Geten had been revealed as a hot guy character, he still would have been a lightning rod for a lot of hate. People don’t know how to ship and let ship, man…)

Okay, I promise to shut up about Geten now. Promise.

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def of a killer anon here i just wanted to say i’m not excusing dabi or trying to make him sound better or anything. he’s someone who kills at the slightest provocation and doesn’t show guilt/sometimes shows guilt? not for killing the person, but for the persons families. so technically he’s not a psychopath or sociopath either. he’s just someone with a skewed sense of morals that believes he’s okay in his actions, but understands his actions have repercussions on other people. still bad tho lol

I appreciate you being sporting about my snarky answer.

I think what I’m trying to get at this: People who stan Dabi or Shigaraki but are hating on Geten for her behavior need to really think critically about their biases and motivations.

She’s bad! She’s a villain! She has an awful worldview and personality! She’s downright cruel!

But so are Shigaraki and Dabi, and if you’re not out here saying those two should be brutally murdered for their crimes–if you’re not out here critiquing their behavior and saying “I can’t be a fan of them until they improve”–I really think you need to ask yourself why you’re holding Geten to a higher standard.

No one is arguing that she’s a good person or that her views are anything but horrible.

But I am asking people to really think about why they find it okay to call out a female character for being cruel, while being fans of male characters who have done things even worse.

That’s all, guys.

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Ok but you've got to stop downplaying Geten's whole supremacist thing. Like fans are hating for ship and sexism reasons but also some fans just hate the whole supremacist angle. Same as how Overhaul got massive hate for his whole transphobe/child abuse bit. And with the rise of white supremacy in our world a lot of people are extra sensitive to that then say the LOVs "kill corrupt people/systems" or shigs "destroy everything" evil. One hits close to home in a way the others don't.

Like, I'd rather not talk about this anymore because the discourse is making people I was mutuals with uncomfortable now, so this will be my last word on this.

No one is downplaying Geten's behavior. I've said in every post I've made about her that her worldviews are terrible and never agreed with or supported her quirk supremacist stance. I've pointed out repeatedly that she IS problematic and awful.

BUT if you're "extra sensitive" to supremacy while actively turning a blind eye to literal genocide, that's seems like a pretty questionable stance to me. I'm not saying people need to become feral Geten fans and act like she's a ray of sunshine who has never done anything wrong, not at all--but if you like Dabi and Shigaraki and are willing to overlook their blatantly evil acts (up to and including Shigaraki trying to murder children--are we not sensitive to that?!), I really, really don't think you have the moral ground to be out here saying Geten's behavior makes her unacceptable.

The question isn't whether Geten is a good person (because she's not), but whether she's being held to a higher moral standard than the other villains in the series (which she is).

I didn't truck with people who spewed hate on Overhaul fans while professing to be "League of Villains" fans either, because even though Overhaul has way heavier crimes on his hands--killing two well-liked recurring characters, for one thing--it's still hypocritical to attack others while excusing the actions of your favorites.

Like, go wild, man. Hate or like whichever characters you want. But don't try to couch it in a moral superiority debate. They're villains, Jan. They're never NOT gonna be problematic.