#hsmtmts asks

[gcladriel]

i don’t understand why portwell is rooted for so much. ive seen people say that she was happier with ej than with ricky. but i raise you this: gina’s happiness during 2b was a weird bubbly version of herself that came out of nowhere and honestly baffled me. good for her for moving on and easing the pain, but i triple dog dare you to compare the scenes, the dynamic with ricky vs ej. the happy buildup: with ej in 2b, she’s gina “2.0”. happy and sacrificing her goals, her aspirations, wants, and even the tough side of her personality for her friends and “crush” turned bf. however with ricky in 1b and somewhat a with the end of homecoming, it somehow feels a thousand times more real, authentic, passionate and mature. sofia herself told us the difference: acting as girlfriend-y as possible vs strictly platonic banter, and while that was probs for all of s3, it also applies here and of course, there. she’s happy, but it doesn’t feel over exaggerated, like she’s pushing for something to happen, like she’s not trying to fit in and be a sweeter version of herself with ricky, unlike ej. ive seen people comparing her facial expressions between her interactions with both boys but honestly? with ej she does giddy and bubbly. with ricky it’s edgy and real and serene and exciting and warm. she can banter with ricky, and not just the typical giggly flirty banter (which they have) but you can see her competitive side come through in episodes like 303. in that scene it’s not giggly and sweet, but it’s not mean, either. it feels more authentic, compared to the “race you there 🥰” moment that ej and gina have in 302. like idk im not sure how pws can possibly justify gina changing around ej however with ricky she looks the same as she did in s1. she has the balance.

hard agree on everything you've said here anon !!! i have nothing to add, but i will say this: lots of pws are former rinis. (former being the operative word) most of the time we're dealing with people who just don't want ricky and gina together bc of reasons OTHER than just not liking them as a couple.

also this set by @ginaricky perfectly encapsulates gina's growth !!! (which is tied to her relationships, esp her romantic ones) also in one gif nat managed to capture my hatred for 123 (ps read her tags she just GETS IT)

[multimetaverse]

apparently larry, joe, and mark are missing from the HSMTMTS cast lineup

Looks like it anon. It's been a week but there's been no further clarification regarding them being in S3 and they haven't been spotted on set yet (nor are the new season regulars following them on insta when they do follow everyone else mentioned in the S3 cast list). It does make a certain amount of sense why there are two new season regulars and Lily apparently being promoted to regular if they’re replacing Seb, Big Red, and Mazzara. I do think it’s likely that we see them briefly, if just over facetime, but it will be jarring if they just vanish for a quarter of the series and then pop back up in S4. And of course, with Seb potentially being gone we lose the only same-sex relationship on the show and half of the lgbtq rep which would be a horrible step backwards from the very real progress the show made in S2. I’ll use this as a jumping off point to share some half baked thoughts I have about S3, in no particular order:

- Will the events of S3 end up mattering very much? Let’s say that S3 is just the change of pace the series needs and that the new characters are well received by the audience. Are we ever going to see any of the new regulars or guest stars after S3? Will they be able to keep any momentum going from S3 into S4 when there will be a six month time jump?

- If they have dropped Seb, Big Red, and Mazzara it’s much more likely that EJ does get dropped in S4, or at least that he only appears sporadically 

- Val is obviously a foil for Gina. I don’t think EJ dumps Gina for Val but I do think Val being a college student will make Gina insecure and lead to Gina and EJ mutually breaking up near or at the end of S3 after agreeing that they’re in different stages of their lives. The most important thing about Val is that she keeps Ricky’s hands clean of any role in the Portwell breakup. There’s a slim chance that Val just ends up strengthening Portwell but Tim will easily sacrifice them so he can explore Rina 

- A default Rina endgame is looking much more likely as it’s now clear that Olivia and Joshua are not even on speaking terms. The chances of one or both of them simply refusing to film a romantic Rini get back together in the S4/series finale is something that Tim will have to keep in mind. It also means that if there is a Rini endgame then it will be very last minute and probably fairly low key

- A lot of people were surprised that Olivia Rodrigo is back but it never made sense that Disney would let one of the most famous pop singers in the world just walk away from her 4 season contract. It’s also important to keep in mind that Disney doesn’t pay their stars all that well and that her salary would have been negotiated when she wasn’t very famous so Disney is getting quite the bargain of using her popularity to boost the show while paying her a pittance

- The show’s original flaw is that Tim wrote the core 4 as being in three different grades. It’s a flaw that has caused a lot damage and may yet end up wrecking the show. The basic problem is that the show was originally built around Ricky and Nini which is why they’re the same grade; the logical end for the show is them graduating and getting back together at the end of their senior year. But now with the personal drama between the actors the original plan may no longer be feasible. EJ was just meant to be a temporary obstacle to Rini which is why it didn’t matter that he was a year older. And Gina was just meant to be a minor obstacle to Rini which is why Tim was surprised that they had chemistry because he never expected or needed them to, so it didn’t matter that she was a year younger. Relatedly it was also the logical move to pair Portwell together after Rini got back together and they were no longer needed as plot devices. 

Now though with EJ graduated the Portwell age gap is a big issue and Ricky and Nini may never be able to get back together due to the actors personal enmity. Which leaves Rina except that Gina will still be a junior when Ricky graduates which leaves them with the same life stages gap issue that Portwell has. I think Tim is aware that he needs at least some of the core 4 to end the series in a relationship otherwise the ending just won’t work. If Tim does decide or is forced to go with a Rina endgame then he should lay the groundwork in S3 and just retcon Gina’s age so that she will be a senior in S4 just like Ricky. That way he can just graft her onto the original last semester plan for Ricky and Nini. 

- Are we getting new writers? Tim is ultimately to blame for the messy writing for S2 but since he won’t be fired is he at least going to make changes in his writer’s room?

- If Big Red isn’t in much of S3 that probably means that a fair bit of Ricky’s time is spent with Lily. I think they’ll inevitably be sunk by the end of S3 but I do think it’s likely that intentionally or not we’ll get some good development for Rily that will actually win over most of the audience

[sunset-bobby]

Can u talk more about the East High Drama Club gaslighting Ricky? I can't really see it - I believe it's there cause Rikcy just has A LOT going on but it's hard for me to pick out when it happens and stuff.

okay let’s talk about this...gaslighting is a broad term but it was this last episode where i was like...tf

Nini plays Kourtney her song tells her not to tell Ricky because she KNOWS he’s gonna be upset

Carlos posts the song and everyone but Ricky knows about what’s going on and the songs about...

Ricky is supportive and when anyone asks he tells them and praises Nini...they all ask him if he’s sure (even big red) and he continuously says yes but they keep asking

Nini isn’t satisfied that Ricky is supportive...she seemed upset because it didn’t expect it.

Lily talks to Ricky and Ricky again says he’s proud and Lily finally walks him through it, and Ricky talks to Nini, gives her an opportunity to say something by hinting at the songs tru meaning....was it petty? yes but it was still an opportunity to say something and Nini literally walks away and leaves her friends.

So Ricky’s off he’s not completely happy and in his mind he feels like he tried to talk to Nini and she blew him off...Nini is upset that Ricky now is questioning the song, despite the fact she was also upset when he was supportive.

Then Ricky calls her out. She wasn’t even at the dance off, auditions, or most of rehearsals and she tells them to take the risks and Ricky says something. He shouldn’t have embarrassed her but he wasn’t wrong.

Now, Nini and everyone is aware of what the song is truly about but all of a sudden it’s fine and there’s no deeper meaning when Ricky figures it out and their acting likes he’s delusional and making things up Nini accuses him of being fake supportive.

she literally tells him “it’s just a song” when they both know as songwriters songs always have some meaning.

Now it’s not necessarily gaslighting and Ricky’s response was a little outtapocket,

but the fact that they all knew what the song was about, how hinted at him that it was about him, and Nini wasn’t feeling satisfied about him being supportive, and when he’s rightfully angry but not even yelling just making snide remarks

and then they are all mad or annoyed at him for it like he’s reaching is not cool

[gcladriel]

sorry for this long ask but i gotta say, i feel like we don’t talk about the hypocrisies and utter complete that come with anti-rina arguments enough. because these people parrot the same arguments TO THIS DAY against rina and they all apply to rini and portwell as well:

1) “Ricky and Gina are toxic! Ricky treats Gina badly! Ricky doesn’t deserve Gina!”

The entirety of both the rini and portwell ships are RIGHT THERE. Miscommunication, calling each other out in public, arguing in public, saying nasty things to each other like E.J insinuating that Gina cheated on him in the woman in the woods search game thing, ricky pretty much slut-shaming nini with the “sounds familiar?” comment, brushing things off constantly until it all explodes in front of them: i.e Gina saying “this isn’t about that” referring to the letter this time instead of their usual “you aren’t there for me enough this summer” issue, and his corny ass just taking her hand and not even acknowledging his previous mistake that she’s referencing and saying sorry, i could go on and on. and fans blame the writing in those instances saying they’re meant to be but the writing made them bad but the writing for rina that we saw on screen shows us that they’re just toxic period 😭 lmao sure

2) “Ricky chose Gina after Nini and Lily!” She’s his second/third choice!” “She deserves better than being his second and third choice!”

You have five seconds to show me a scene where he explicitly picks Nini or Lily over Gina. Where Gina is even mentioned while he was pursuing those two other girls. If there was a choice at all, and Gina knew she was being rejected, then why the fuck did she keep saying she “didn’t know where she stood with him”, all homeboy did was say ok and hug her after her confession. Where is the rejection. Where is the second/third choice. She didn’t get anything back from him, not a yes or a no, something she EXPLICITLY SAYS in 205. He said nothing at all. Y’alls own personal opinion that you made up and ran with for three years is not fact. Read Tim’s interview articles on the ships and why whatever happened happened with them and you’ll know what’s up and finally stop talking for once.

3) Ricky only wants Gina after he saw her with E.J.

Nini’s whole arc with Ricky and herself in 1a was I don’t need boys, I’m over you Ricky, I’m done.

AS SOON AS SHE SEES RICKY AND GINA FLIRTING IN WHAT TEAM, THE LITERAL NEXT EPISODE AFTER SAYING THESE THINGS, SHES SOMEHOW JEALOUS?? and proceeds to be throughout the episode and until the end of thanksgiving. like come fucking on man. not to mention it took gina leaving for them to get together.

all in all rinis and pws who are essentially the same people who ship rini with the mindset of them somehow being soulmates despite all this and ship pw with the mindset of “gina can just have e.j i guess, idk. even if his male lead slot was on a countdown to going bye bye as soon as he debuted on the show because the character is a senior, and that would be bad for a character who needs someone to show up and stay around. even if they make no sense romantically and have zilch chemistry matter how much i pretend they do. as long as it’s not ricky.” (ive literally seen people say that gina needs to move on and date ej during 2a tiktoks 😭 these people aren’t slick), these people need to move on and stop attacking and claiming the writing when it’s convenient for them, and they need to stop acting like rini and pw didn’t have their own problems. it’s annoying and we’re tired.

anon you're soooo real i have no notes shjshjsh

[gcladriel]

whenever someone says that rini and portwell were supposed to be endgame to me it’s verbatim just “ricky and nini belong together! and gina can just have ej i guess, idk.”

shjshsjhsj YEAH it always feels very transparent !! when i say most pw shippers used to be rini shippers this is exactly what i mean lmao

[gcladriel]

The writes clearly water down Gina's personality when she's around EJ. The parallels between Gina and Anna are the same! Anna was obsessed with the idea of being in love and her first romantic relationship that failed miserably but ended up with the guy that loves her for her and makes her a better person. The foreshadowing of LIAOD is very telling. Sofia Wylie is KILLING it with the difference on how she plays Gina around EJ versus how she plays Gina around Ricky. Practically, night and day.

oooh YEAH. the parallels go HARD. it’s also very interesting when we think abt balance and the implications of gina 1.0 vs gina 2.0. gina 1.0 at this point hasn’t really made a reappearance? one of gina 1.0′s core characteristics was that she felt like she NEEDED to be the lead. that’s the entire reason she turns to sabotage. gina now doesn’t feel like she needs to be the lead: she just wants to be the lead. gina around ej is VERY gina 2.0 which is essentially gina softening the more competitive side of her personality in order to fit in and be liked. it’s the side we saw during s2 when she constantly makes compromises. in 202 she feels like she can either audition on her own and get the role she wants, or audition as a group, get a role she doesn’t necessarily want and keep her friends. she’s also asked by carlos to be a co choreographer even though she’d very clearly be happy doing it on her own. gina during s2 KEEPS making sacrifices in order to keep her so called friends happy. we’re seeing this again in s3 (especially around ej) even though she is letting a little bit of 1.0 through (ty ashlyn)

but we really do see gina being her most authentic self around ricky. she’s not afraid to be larger than life and ambitious and even a little braggy. and unlike literally EVERYONE else, ricky doesn’t make her feel bad abt going after what she wants or being proud of herself (someone needs to smack ashlyn in the face pls let val do it i believe in her). gina’s allowed to just exist without fear of judgement, which is why everytime she’s around ricky she feels so free and liberated. around ricky, gina clearly feels as though she can be herself. as she says in balance “not the old me, 2.0 me, no it’s all of me combined” and this kind of perfectly encapsulates the way she acts around ricky. with ej it’s gina trying to be the perfect girlfriend and therefore not allowing herself to fully shine. 

[gcladriel]

how did rina go from having adorable puppy chemistry in s1&2 to INSANE sexual tension this season 😭😭 and they aren’t even dating either like ??? if this is rina in only s3 i’m so scared for them in the next seasons because we’re only just getting started holy shit 😳😳 also the fact that they can have such sexual chemistry from a DISNEY duet.. most people could have strong enough chemistry to pull that off 🤷‍♀️🤷‍♀️

i have nothing to add bc like. EXACTLY this. i’m so ready for them to conquer the world <3

[multimetaverse]

have you seen the hsmtmts season 3 trailer? definitely looks interesting and i think the change of scenery is a great change for the show.

I agree anon, it really does look like changing up the location and doing a lot of outdoor scenes. S3 definitely looks better than S2 and I think it will end up being much better as well; something much closer to the charm and quality that S1 had. Of course, the question remains whether S3 will end up mattering very much in the long run and whether the quality and momentum of a much improved S3 can carry forward into S4.

As I said way back when it was confirmed that S3 would be a summer camp season with several characters being reduced to recurring and several new mains being introduced, I'm skeptical that Tim has much of a plan when it comes to making S3 feel connected to what came before and what comes after on the show. Especially with a probable 6 month time jump to the final semester of Ricky's senior year being likely for S4 and the show reverting back to East High (though this time largely filmed on soundstages in California rather than on location in Utah).

The trailer does make clear that those Rina leaks were largely correct which is deeply unfortunate and I hope that they don't happen again for S4. I had hoped that Tim would break up Portwell without having Ricky be the reason but it seems he's having Ricky pursue a girl EJ is in a relationship with yet again. I'm sure it will be among the worst parts of S3. As I've said before, a default Rina endgame is pretty much the only option for how Ricky's romantic arc ends when the series likely ends with S4. 

The only other possibility is that because it’s so obvious that there are no other options and with the difficulty of Ricky graduating while Gina still has a year of school left that Tim decides to ‘subvert expectations’ and does an open or ambiguous ending. I’m no Rina shipper but even I think that would be a terrible idea that would really damage the show’s ending and legacy. I don’t think it’s at all likely but it can’t be dismissed out of hand because Tim just might be stupid enough to try and pull a stunt like that.

It’s funny how cynically Disney is using Olivia Rodrigo to promote the show when it’s likely the trailer shows like 80% of her total scenes. A bit boring to have Ricky be the male lead in the musical once more, it looks like he gets to be the lead for all 4 seasons then. Good on Sofia Wylie for becoming the new female lead of the series. With Gina the musical lead this season there’s a good chance Kourtney might get the lead in S4. Looks like Lily won’t be a very big part of the season at all. Not sure why they’re having S3 only take place within 2 weeks in universe. It seems that 8 episode seasons might be a new Disney thing; Love Victor, Secrets of Sulphur Springs, and Percy Jackson all have had recent or upcoming season orders of 8 eps only. Is it enough? Probably not with all the new and returning characters they’re packing in but there’s no way that HSMTMTS should be allowed 12 eps again. 

There is positive news on the lgbtq rep front. Before it looked like Seb basically being written out of S3 would wipe out half the rep in S3 but it looks like one of the female characters will be bisexual and have a relationship develop with JoJo Siwa. It’s a huge step forward for representation on Disney and builds on the genuine progress Disney has made with their series and movies in recent months. 

Although it is darkly ironic that Disney has finally gotten the balls to provide good rep just as lgbtq rights in the USA are under their greatest threat in decades. I do fear that we will end up looking back at these years as the high water mark of lgbtq rep in entertainment before things get much worse. It’s becoming painfully clear that Joe Biden is presiding over a new Weimar Republic and that democracy, women’s rights, lgbtq rights, and human rights in America could be lost for a generation. What comes next may not be Hitler’s Germany but it sure as hell could be Franco’s Spain. If nothing else, HSMTMTS as a fun escapist show is a useful distraction from an ever gloomier world.