Sand Pebbles IV w/ Christopher Hollow on the Velvet Underground
“’Blaze of Glory was #1, the Velvet Underground came at a good time.”
Sand Pebbles and The Spoils Present Peel Slowly And See: The Velvet Underground at the Flying Saucer Club, Elsternwick, Saturday August 22.
The Spoils play the debut album, The Velvet Underground & Nico, whilst Sand Pebbles take on the Velvets’ wild second record, White Light/White Heat. Patrick Emery got Sand Pebbles’ Christopher Hollow’s VU.
When did you first hear the Velvet Underground, and what was your immediate reaction?
I was a teenager and given the second and third albums by a girlfriend. My immediate reaction was devouring the records. It changed my idea of music, of songwriting and what I wanted to do if I ever got a band together. ‘Blaze of Glory’ was #1 so it came at a good time.
Were you conscious of the deviant themes being explored in the lyrics?
I suppose but it wasn’t the thing that interested me most. I loved the romance and the sadness and the intelligence of the lyrics. Most of all, I loved how the band sounded. Super quiet or poppy or totally abandoned, it all sounded amazing and full of possibilities. To my ears they were always only playing one chord. Turns out, they weren’t but that’s what I wanted to do. Boil things down to one chord and come up with ways to make it move.
The mythology of the first album is that - according to Brian Eno - only 300 people bought the album, but everyone one of the them started a band. I understand you challenge that mythology?
Well, it’s not me. Richie Unterberger put out a great book called White Light/White Heat. He calculated the debut sold close to 60,000 copies in the ’60s. That’s not such a bad showing for a first record. In the early ’80s, Lou Reed told Eno it was 30,000 and Eno’s quote in Kristine McKenna’s Book of Changes was: ‘I think everyone who bought one of those 30,000 copies started a band!’ 30,000 is better than 300.
Do you think Nico brought anything to the band's music, or was it just her icy Nordic personality and sensibility that was important?
Nico is an acquired taste. Maybe it’s the doomy Teutonic vibe? The not quite there pitching? The harmonium? Her solo records are much more challenging than the Velvet Underground’s. The songs she sang on the VU debut are out-and-out pop songs. She makes them much weirder with her voice. She would’ve done a great version of ‘Sunday Morning’ too.
Lou Reed came from a pop songwriting background, whereas John Cale came from a classical via avant-garde musical background. Are they complimentary or competing artistic perspectives?
It’s one of the great pairings. I love that Lou sings every song like it’s a pop song, like it’s going to be a hit. He lost that later on when he started barking his lyrics. John Cale owns those first two records, his ideas drive them but it helped that Lou wrote such great songs and plays amazing guitar. It helped that Moe Tucker’s limitations were her strength. It helped that Sterling Morrison’s guitar lines are so sympathetic. I also love what Doug Yule brought to the Velvets, too. I think Doug Yule’s contribution is very underrated. Growing up, nearly every piece about the VU praised John Cale and caned Doug Yule. Doug Yule was an incredible bass player, a beautiful singer, great harmony vocals. His organ on the 1969 Live version of ‘What Goes On’ is stunning. It’s outrageously good, a peak moment in the band. He also wrote one cracking song on Squeeze called ‘Friends’.
The VU is often reduced to the symbiotic (and later fraught) artistic relationship between Lou Reed and John Cale. But what about Sterling Morrison and Mo Tucker - what do you think they brought to the VU sound?
Out of all the Velvets, Sterling Morrison is the one I most wanted to meet. Apparently he was great company, an incredible storyteller. If you’re ever stuck for ideas on a song, it’s always good to ask, ‘What would Sterling Morrison do?’ I’m even starting to come round to his moustache. There was a time when that was the only thing I didn’t like about him.
Are you disappointed that Moe Tucker has thrown her support behind the Tea Party in the US?
It’s shattering. Wes [Sand Pebbles drummer] tells me that Moe sells toys on eBay. He bought a Star Wars figurine just to make contact. I don’t agree with her politics but her drumming is untouchable.
The timing of the Velvet Underground's classic period - 1967-1969 - coincided with the emergence of psychedelia and philosophical (hippie) idealism on the west coast, the latter which the Velvets seemed to consciously oppose. Do you think the Velvet Underground was being deliberately provocative in countering the misty-eyed idealism coming out of San Francisco, or were they just a New York band telling them like they saw it?
They were just competitive, like every band. They took a lot from the Byrds. The Byrds were ice cold, too. The VU also used plenty of 12-string guitar. Lou played a Fender Electric XII and it looks, and sounds, amazing.
The Spoils’ Sean Simmons says you have an alternative interpretation of ‘White Light/White Heat’ – what do you think that song's about?
In his book, Richie Unterberger details how Lou Reed was inspired to write ‘White Light, White Heat’ after reading a book by occult writer Alice Bailey called A Treatise on White Magic. Bailey wrote about the concept of channelling white light, some metaphysical energy within yourself so you can approach a more transcendental state. Lou later gave the book to Jonathan Richman and regretted it. Apparently it inspired Jonathan to write ‘Hey There Little Insect’. Lou had told him that insects are the manifestation of negative ego thoughts. Those Bailey books also inspired Billy Name to lock himself in his darkroom at Warhol’s Factory for five months.
I also like how Lou put a lot of credence in star signs – as a band, the Velvets were half-Pisces [Reed, Cale], half-Virgo [Morrison, Tucker]. And Doug Yule was Pisces too. It was one of the reasons Lou let him join. That shows a different side to Lou, an unexpected side. He also died doing tai chi looking at trees, he couldn’t have been too anti-hippie.
How many versions of Sister Ray have you heard, and what's your favourite?
I paid $45 at Greville for the Sweet Sister Ray bootleg with John Cale from La Cave, 1968. I have to like that one.
As a musician, what's the most challenging aspect of the Velvet Underground's music?
The quality and consistency.
If Waldo Jeffers wanted to impress Marcia in an on-line world, what would he do? Send a holographic virus of himself to her Facebook page?
[Laughs] No idea. ‘The Gift’ is probably my favourite song off the White Light/White Heat record. But only the instrumental track. I used to have to turn the balance to the left to hear it as an instrumental. One chord, amazing riff.