#ramcoavictims

[belovedofbede]

Discussing RAMCOA Deniers

TW FOR RAMCOA TALK

What is RAMCOA?

Ritual Abuse (RA): A mix between emotional, physical, and/or sexual abuse that follows a specific, ritualistic pattern and is used to control the victim's behavior and thoughts. This often comes in the form of a religious, spiritual, or political belief system to justify the actions and further manipulate the victim.

Mind Control (MC): Extreme psychological manipulation, often through torture, conditioning, and programming, to create dependency and loyalty to the abusive group and to cause the victim to develop specific psychological responses, like repetition compulsion.

Organized Abuse (OA): Abuse that is conducted in an organized fashion by multiple perpetrators working together with a specific goal, such as human trafficking rings, cults, or other groups.

If YOU believe you are going through RA, MC or OA, please head to these links: Ritual Abuse Counseling Safe Haven / Organized Abuse Counseling

Additional note: I do not support the ISSTD organization and their actions, they do internal harm to victims of RAMCOA, but that shouldn't demean said victims and make them into bad people. Victims are victims, and remain victims.

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I see a lot of people denying all of RAMCOA simply because they don't believe in one part of it, most commonly programming, and coming from someone who has been in a cult, it's only pushing us down even further.

I would prefer to talk about my experiences in a later post, but just to clarify, the space I was in never called itself a cult, it was a community. However, I have seen the red flags now that I'm out of it, and I can call it what it is: a cult.

Sure, you're allowed to not believe in something if you don't think it's true or possible, but you should be able to add some nuance when it comes to an umbrella term. What if LGBTQIA+ was instead LGBTQIAR+ for radqueer? Obviously, you can be capable of invalidating, or not believing in radqueer ideology, while still understanding every other sexuality and identity label, lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender, queer/questioning, intersex, and aroace/abrosexual/agender.

The same should apply to victims of RAMCOA who still use the full umbrella term as a way to find a community with more victims. You can believe that programming doesn't exist (though I personally believe it does), but what about those who were in human trafficking rings, cults, hypnosis groups, grooming circles, and so on? RA, MC and OA are all umbrella terms that dive into so much more than just programming, so why are we invalidating the whole thing because you simply dislike one? I genuinely cannot bring myself to process that kind of mindset.

[belovedofbede]

people aren't invalidating the whole thing bc of one part they don't like. alter programming is a conspiracy theory stemming from project monarch, which is a far right conspiracy theory that perpetuates a lot of profoundly harmful misinformation and bigotry. that's why people don't like the term. it's not impossible to talk about abuse without the term ramcoa? cults still exist. a lot of people talk about being cult survivors or trafficking survivors. the word torture exists. csa as a term exists. creature-wizard on tumblr has a lot of really excellent posts about why this conspiracy theory is dangerous and why the terminology associated is deeply harmful. people just get too defensive and reactionary to ever listen when this is pointed out and people trying desperately to combat this conspiracy theory get called abuse deniers even though many of us are ourselves survivors who have seen people fall into really awful qanon type conspiracy spaces because of this.

I understand that the root of the term is bad, the ISSTD is extremely disgusting and actively does harm to victims of this form of abuse, however, a term can still be reclaimed, or used because it does contain real experiences that victims go through. You can call yourself a RAMCOA victim without supporting ISSTD, including me.

RAMCOA is so much more than programming though, and each abbreviation (Mind Control, Ritual Abuse, and Organized Abuse) has many forms of abuse underneath each of them. I myself am not programmed so I do not get to have a say on the validity of it, but I am under multiple of those umbrellas trauma-wise, that of which I will never speak up on since it's extremely touchy, and I still need time to recover.

I'm not saying you HAVE to use the term RAMCOA, that's insensitive and obviously should be a term someone should only use if it makes them comfortable, like me, for example. However, RAMCOA itself is not a conspiracy, because again, it's too broad to fit into one box. There are many forms of mind control, many forms of ritual abuse, and many forms of organized abuse.

I'm saying RAMCOA as a general term, not in the form of C-DID, HC-DID or PF-DID systems. Not all victims of RAMCOA are systems, and that's something that should also be talked about. Repetition compulsion doesn't always lead to systemhood, but is a form of mind control. Sex trafficking doesn't either, but is a form of organized abuse. Being in a cult doesn't always lead to systemhood, but is a form of ritual abuse. If someone went through all three of those, they have a right to refer to themself as a RAMCOA victim. That should be something they can use if it describes them best, especially if, whether the root of the term is bad or not, that's what the term means.

When I talk about RAMCOA, I'm not just referring to systems. In fact, I want to acknowledge the fact that not all victims of RAMCOA end up being systems.

I am sorry my phrasing was toned as if I was calling other victims "abuse deniers", that was not my intention whatsoever, and if I made it sound that way, that's completely my fault.

[belovedofbede]

‘What if LGBTQIA+ was instead LGBTQIAR+ for radqueer?’ ????? what if the moon was made of cheese? like that’s a nonsensical comparison. I simply wouldn’t say the R. people do this with pedophiles already, trying to say they’re part of the community, and we all just go ‘absolutely not’ and proceed as normal. because language matters.

I'm anti-radqueer, and that was exactly my point.

RAMCOA is still a thing even if you don't believe in one part, just like how you can still say LGBTQIA+ if, in some universe, there was an R added to it for Radqueer. I think, if you could read through what I was saying in it's entirety, you'd understand that my point was that RAMCOA is an umbrella term for numerous forms of abuse, like cults, trafficking, religious abuse, hypnosis circles, grooming circles, and so much more. Just because you don't believe in, let's say programming, you can still believe in all the other forms of abuse under Mind Control, Organized Abuse, and Ritual Abuse.

Programming isn't the only form of mind control. Repetition compulsion and trauma reenactment are forms of mind control, it'll still exist as a term even if programming, under mind control, wasn't a thing. Mind control, ritual abuse, and organized abuse will still exist as a whole, because they're too broad of terms to simply dislike one single thing under them, and then deny all of it in its entirety.

That wasn't meant to be a pro-radqueer take, that was simply saying that you can deny the existence of something under a larger umbrella, but that umbrella still exists and always will.

Note: I do edit my posts a lot, please spare some patience, because I often get ideas or better ways to reword after I post.