#roseverse lore

[coolingrosa]

Poppy’s creator is so evil bc making a nine year old raise a baby hurts me so much

Also, this is from ROSEVERSE where Ink was low-key at fault for Frisk taking in Poppy.

[coolingrosa]

What would happen if Core!Frisk, while attacking (most likely defending), injured Underplayer? And how would Underplayer react?

I’m so sorry to break this to you anon but Core Frisk would laugh. Core Frisk is many good things but these two hate each other so bad that they can not stand being in the same room as each other. Player would likely attempt to kill them directly after for even daring to defend themselves LMAO Error is sick of them.

[coolingrosa]

Rosa, I wish for you to lore dump about error and nightmare and their relationship in roseverse at least as much as you can say

Hello! I will try to provide as much as I can without spoiling the future! All the info I mention here is public knowledge. TW for Emotional and physical abuse

But I also need to make this VERY clear: These two are gods. I am NOT ever going to defend the abuse Error inflicted on Nightmare, but in God standards, this wouldn’t be classified as abuse as easily. If anything, it’s seen as a toxic friendship. There’s many reasons for this, with the main one being that neither can truly get hurt or die. They don’t go by regular standards of pain and abuse. Emotional abuse means practically nothing. Physically violence means nothing and could even be seen as intimate in some cases between certain gods. Example being Player and Reapertale Chara, with their main form of affection being digging their nails into one another’s skin and also slamming their foreheads together until the world blurs and they are bleeding. Both do this willingly. This is love to them. For what would be abuse to us is love to these two. They don’t feel pain like you and I. They have animalistic tendencies, and tend to view their friends and family under this lens. It’s why Nightmare cannot truly understand Killer. He’s not as emotionally connected as mortals are, and doesn’t view certain things as wrong because for gods, it’s seen completely different in their culture. Error and Nightmare battling when they first met Is normal for gods trying to extort territory. Error lashing out on Nightmare and throwing things is tame, and Nightmare would roll it off easily and would be back following his heels without a scratch. Even at their worst, where Error did inflict harm, it’s once again muddled and different for them than us. As I continue, I need everyone to understand while what Error does throughout their friendship is wrong, fighting and beatings between gods who love each other is going to happen. It doesn’t make it right by our standards, but they don’t follow our rules. If two adult gods are fighting and they injury one another, it’s considered a simple spat since both are capable of actually engaging in the fight. and I base my viewpoint off of typical Greek God relations, where Hera and Zeus have had multiple wars and fights and have tortured one another, and yet are still married and have children regardless while shrugging off the past as marital problems. It’s a different structure. It’s different expectations and morality. Please understand this while reading.

Error and Nightmare met as young children. Error had just lost Reaper as a friend and was very angry and lashing out. Nightmare was still reeling from the apple incident two years prior, and they met after Nightmare happened to be in a AU that Error was clearing out. Error wasn’t interested in chatting, and told him to leave. Nightmare began to get a strange fascination with Error, even though every time they met, Error would get angry and attack him. Nightmare was the first to listen to Error when he ranted about how planets couldn’t be destroyed— how other gods would cause issues where ever they wanted with little care for Errors’s job. Eventually, Error found Nightmare crying in the woods and they began speaking. Nightmare admitted he didn’t want to be alone anymore, and they were very similar, and thus began the start of their friendship.

Error and Nightmare do not have a healthy friendship, though. They never did. Error would fight Nightmare before they were close, and while Nightmare lived in the Anti-Void, he dealt with a lot of verbal lashings. Error would throw things at Nightmare when he was angry, and while he would NEVER leave marks on Nightmare or directly hurt him, he would scare him. Nightmare always just took it rather than fight back like most gods do in friendships along this nature— like Reaper likely would’ve. The reason was simple: Nightmare did not know any better. He assumed all friendships and relationships were layered with abuse, and he was SUPPOSED to take it until the person calmed down. He did not realize he was allowed to fight back in such a dynamic— that it was expected from him to meet Error’s hostility. He thought it was normal to sit quietly. Dream never was mean, but he reasoned that away by saying Dream was practically an angel. Of course, she never did what everyone else did. She was perfect and kind to everyone, and though Error was rude, he was the only replacement Nightmare had for Dream. He never spoke out when Error would hurt him because he thought that was how it was. Error, meanwhile, was using Nightmare as a replacement for Reaper, then slowly started using him as an outlet for all his pain in any variety. He would get drunk at 16 and cry for Nightmare to tell him that they would be friends— make Nightmare promise he’d never leave— which Nightmare would do. He’d take his bad days out on him by snapping, and he never apologized out of shame. Or simply because he didn’t think he needed to.

When Ink came into the picture when they were 19, all that stopped. Nightmare slowly realized that it WAS sorta wrong to at least be hit like that after thinking about how to discipline Ink, and Error also finally realized how horrible he was to Nightmare for YEARS when all he wanted was to be there for Error. When all he wanted was love and a friend. While raising Ink, they were softer. Nightmare stood up for himself, and Error let him without resorting to violence. Error also apologized for all the treatment he gave Nightmare, and with him healing his relationship with Reaper, he was a lot more peaceful and easy to be around. Nightmare likely shouldn’t have stayed, but he loved Error and Ink. Plus, he reasoned that things were peaceful, and calmer. Better. He stayed because he thought it would be okay again. Error didn’t protest because he was selfish and knows it. He just attempted to make up for their very toxic childhood friendship. They were happy here. Healthy, in a way. Truly friends.

When Ink went away, Nightmare chose to lie to protect Error from the horror of never knowing where his baby was. The unknown was worse than anything. Nightmare knew about that deeply when it came to Dream. He still felt great guilt, so when Error resorted to violence again and began to attack Nightmare, he took it again. This time, believing he deserved it for his lies. It was worse, though. You could argue that when they were children, it was more bullying than anything. Error never hit Nightmare when they lived together because he truly didn’t want to hurt him. He was just a mean kid. As adult gods, with Error filled with grief and unable to leave the house in his depression, he targeted Nightmare and left marks. Nightmare could’ve defended himself and restrained him, but he never did. He let Error hit him because he lied. Because he lost Ink, too. Because he believed he failed. He wanted to be hit, and Error wanted to hurt. Once again, they got into a cycle of using each other to satisfy each other’s pain. Error felt guilty after his hands would be hurting from hitting him. It happened anyways. This power imbalance WOULD be seen as wrong by other Gods. THIS was abuse. Nightmare was unable to defend himself and both were adults who knew the lengths of their power, unlike when they were children. It made sense in the past that Nightmare didn’t know he could fight back— that he needed to. It also made sense that Error didn’t understand the power imbalance. He was a child. He was still learning. Now, it was simple cruelty by Error, beating someone who didn’t respond. Error was his abuser during this time frame.

Eventually, that stopped too. Error didn’t apologize. Nightmare stayed by him because Error was always all he had. Error let him because now Nightmare was also all he had too. But their relationship was shattered. They didn’t speak to one another like they used to. Error didn’t visit often, and when he did, he was mean and distant. Even though they likely should’ve let go and gone their separate ways, neither could. Nightmare trauma bonded with Error deeply, and Error couldn’t handle being alone. Nightmare also began to fight back, and when they would fight, violence was a constant, with both evenly matched.

After Horror, their relationship does improve immensely. They talk like they used to. It doesn’t last long, though, as Error soon finds out Nightmare lied to him, which ultimately led to him killing Nightmare and leaving him out of it for a month. He feels no remorse for this, and no longer feels bad for beating Nightmare when they were younger. Nightmare still thinks he deserves it all, and they will never directly discuss it.

They are toxic. They are abusive. They are entirely unhealthy, but they are also best friends. They have seen each other’s ugliest parts and knows the other’s deepest secrets. No matter how badly they hate each other, they will always return to one another when weak. They grow up with one another, and were there right after they both escaped a traumatic event. They cling to one another as children and refused to separate. They had no parents to guide them— all they had was each other to learn. They learned how to function through every single moment of their lives with one another. They are the only two they can cry in front of— the only person that the other trusts to hold them as they lose themselves. Error can not touch him unless it comes to violence, with only being able to touch his tentacles, but that’s enough for them. They don’t touch. They sit in silence and that’s safety to them. That’s comfort. They shouldn’t be friends, but nobody else would accept the other for all that they have done in life. No matter how kind Nightmare was in his friendship, he’s slaughtered many in his grief out of fun. He’s feared for a reason. Error does not fear him. He’s the only one who doesn’t. Nightmare is also the only one who doesn’t fear Error, no matter the abuse he faced. Error is the only person Nightmare can hit without feeling guilty for his actions. Nightmare is the only one (besides Ink, now) that can make Error feel guilty for hitting him or hurting someone. They are selfish, twisted entities who had nobody else but each other. Their love is ugly, but untouched. None of the other gods dare to question it or attempt to look at it. It’s something they can not match up against, nor belittle. The God of Destruction and the God of Negativity will always have a violent, bitter, and horrid relationship, but to them, it’s the only warmth they can trust in. They will not leave one another, as they mentally cannot comprehend the idea.

This conversation between Nightmare and Killer in Chapter One best summarizes:

“But it’s not just limited to mortals, right? Haven’t you got any god friends or something you’re scared of losing too? Like Error?”

“Error and I are one in the same. He is mine and I am his. We can not part if we remain so close together. “

“That’s what I thought about Chara too. We were always one. But I don’t know if that’s a good thing anymore. I don’t know if I could really breathe. I was always drowning with them, and they’d use me as a lifeboat and I’d do the same for them. I think that’s why we failed. We both needed to breathe, but only one of us had the strength to shove the other under to save themselves.“

“Your Chara would never let themselves drown. Error would go down with me, and I’d do the same for him.”

“I don’t know if that’s good either. If you’re holding on so tightly that you guys can’t keep afloat, doesn’t that mean you’re just as doomed?”

“Perhaps. But that isn’t something you need to worry about.”

Hopefully that explains it!

[coolingrosa]

How does Error feel about Dream (and vise versa)? He’s kinda mentioned her a few times (in the fanfic) but I can’t tell if he’s neutral or if he’s jealous of her/hates her. 🙏

Error doesn’t like many people, so he does dislike her, but not on a personal level. Before he realized who Ink truly was, he disliked her on principle, but also wouldn’t go out of his way to hurt her, as he also did pity her. He mainly left that role to Nightmare, and didn’t want to Interfere into a personal fight. Does he view her in a good light? In a logical sense, he understands she’s kind, so yes. However, that doesn’t really matter to him, so he doesn’t in a personal lenses.

When he finds out who Ink is, he does have to wrestle with the fact that he’s jealous of EVERYONE who was around Ink during his upbringing. Dream is one of those people, but because he understands that she’s kind, he struggles with his inner feelings towards her. He’s thankful for her, knowing she likely took care of him, but he’s angry it couldn’t be him. Again, it’s not really about her as a person and more about his own insecurities and feelings.

For Error, he’s the closest to neutral a guy like him can be, with random thoughts of jealousy and anger that’s not really about her as a whole and usually has different reasons for why they manifested.

[coolingrosa]

Not to subtly ✨trauma-dump✨ but as someone who finds myself in very similar situations and relationships as RV Dream, I feel very seen by your portrayal of the character, and I appreciate the depth you’ve given to her conflict with Nightmare. It’s not often I see a character who chooses not to embrace an estranged family member, and for good reason, only to end up internally tortured, bitter, and jealous when seeing said family member give the love and care to someone else in their life that used to be shown to them. It’s the kind of pain that just eats at you the more you think about it, and it feels unfair to want love from someone who seems to have changed for the worse in a way you can’t accept, not without ignoring your own morals and your empathy for the people that they unjustly hurt. It feels like you’re wrong to want it, but nothing can really fit wholly enough in the hole that was left when you cut them out.

Forever hoping for almost every iteration of Dream and Nightmare to reconcile in the future, even if it takes a lot of work on both ends and their relationship is different from what it used to be. At the very least, some closure might help them both move on, and I can stop crying like a baby every time I see them at odds XD

OKAY IM FINALLY SITTING DOWN TO RESPOND TO ASKS HELLO HELLO

A big reason I struggled answering asks this week is because this ask hit the nail on the head so perfectly I didn’t know what else to add! I’m glad you’ve been seen by RV!Dream. That’s all I want with these characters, as they are all supposed to be regular monsters/humans at the end of the day.

Dream was not wrong for declining Nightmare’s attempts to come back into her life and she was especially not wrong in defending herself by pushing him physically away. Nightmare was a grown man, while she was a teenager, and he should’ve known better than to smother her and expect her to give in so easily. While he has his reasons that will be expanded on when I release the RV document, the age difference is still a thing. At the same time, Nightmare is literally all she’s ever had. Psychological too. I haven’t been able to dive deep into this yet, but in some ways, Nightmare was the only parental figure Dream had when they were young. Nim was never around, and Nightmare sought to find purpose by making Dream happy, which made her naturally trust him in ways that you normally would a parent. Even though they were the same age, Nightmare was teaching her to read and write. He taught her to tie her shoes. He cleaned the house, made her bed, cleaned her clothes, even helped her wash when she was washed after helping the villagers. Nightmare was a baby, but also Dream’s brother. Also Dream’s only mom, dad, guardian, older brother, older sister, everything. Nightmare filled in all the bases because children NEED parental support and connection in order to grow, and he provided. They were never normal siblings and terribly codependent, and I plan to write a oneshot detailing some of their daily life to showcase this. Anyone looking in would find their relationship odd as children with Nightmare babying her and therefore her clinging so hard. It’s not typical for your sibling of your same age to help dress you, even at twelve years old. It’s not typical for your sibling to make you dinner and clean your face after, but Nightmare did so anyways and nobody ever told them it wasn’t right for him to do with his age. That was always the problem. Nobody told them or helped. Dream losing Nightmare due to her own efforts of pushing him away shattered her soul. Not only did it prove Nightmare wouldn’t stay and “raise” her again no matter what she said and did, but it only made her image of who he was now even crueler. Because the old Nightmare would withstand getting slapped by her and then clean her fingers after. And though she knows that’s wrong, the knowledge that no matter what she did, he’d stay and cherish her, was all she had as a safety net for years.

And then, seeing that same person who raised you, loved you, kissed your forehead every night go off and raise another child, despite hating them so hard? Knowing deep down just how sweet and gentle he is as a parent and knowing that whoever gets that now is lucky and has the grace she used to have? The forever lasting devotion?

Dream didn’t just lose her brother. She lost her everything. She lost her dad. She lost her mom. She lost her only form of guardian her mind ever projected onto. And though she hates him and has seen the horror he’s committed, she still misses him so much. She misses him every time she doesn’t know how to do something, because her Nighty is no longer there to teach her and gently do it for her. She’s completely, and utterly, alone.

At least she has Ink to dig her teeth into and refuse to let go. At least he won’t leave her, right?

:)

[coolingrosa]