I was reading your "Takasugi is just like a butterfly" theory (excellent meta btw!) and now I am curious: do you like his actual manga!yukata design? as in which version do you like better? ofc Takasugi looks hot good in both lol--is just that I have never seen his actual manga design anywhere in fics or in fanarts (never even seen his manga panels colored T_T) but yeah the manga!yukata design is way more... complicated(?) so I can see why the anime decided to change it. what can I say, this man is a fashion icon 😭
omg I'm terribly sorry for getting to this so late! I've neglected my inbox a bit while working on my fanfic ideas, so this got buried in there T-T
Honestly, I love both equally and I can't speak in favor of the manga yukata since, like you stated, we haven't seen a colored version of it, BUT if we did, then perhaps that one would outshine his anime butterfly one. The design of his manga yukata is so intricate and the meaning behind it is well thought of! I've read this theory on aminoapp about its design and you can find it here if you'd like to read into it, but I'll quote some of the things mentioned regardless.
Manga!Shinsuke's yukata analysis!
Looking at Shinsuke's most iconic yukata, we can see the theme of nature in the form of sakura flowers, mountains, clouds, and trees.
Sakura blossoms are known for being ephemeral, an attribute shared with butterflies. Sorachi might have made his yukata have a simpler butterfly pattern for the anime so that it's easier to draw and anime, but the concept remains the same. Ephemeral beauty. Something that doesn't last long, unlike the impression it leaves behind. Therefore, sakura blossoms and butterflies are both perfect symbolisms for a man whose life, albeit strong, held an unparalleled beauty in its entirety.
On the other hand, mountains could be seen as the exact opposite of sakura blossoms and butterflies. Mountains are unmoving and unyielding. They remain even after all nature around them dies. This could indicate Shinsuke's unyielding focus to his goal, the memories and the comrades he never forsook, and his ideals. No matter what, mountains can be viewed as a symbol of strength, and Shinsuke surely is a very strong individual.
As for the clouds, in a way, they too symbolize impermanence and are also linked to the divine due to proximity, but personally, when I view the clouds in relation to Shinsuke, I think of his famous poem-like saying in the Rakuyo arc. Clouds bring rain, and we all know how Shinsuke's sick of seeing the rain. The rain to him is both something he can't escape and haunts him, as well as something he's initiated himself. The clouds are an omen of his struggles and the pain he's brought upon himself; the very pain he is tired of feeling.
To sum up, the pattern of his kimono shows his life's flow, his ambitions, and his struggles. It's a very intimate exposure of his inner world, and for a man who doesn't let others in, he sure likes to put all that he is on display.
Since we got into this, I want to include another similar yukata of his, and the meaning behind it.
They look very much alike I know, BUT this one has two notable elements: Peony flowers and Shochikubai.
Starting with the latter, Shochikubai is an expression for Sho, chiku, and bai, the japanese words for pine tree, bamboo, and plum (picture below for reference on what the basic design is supposed to look like). Shochikubai traditionally refers to the 3 friends of winter and it's associated with good fortune. To quote this article right here, Shochikubai is an allegory for weathering hard times through various attributes of each element. A pine tree is tenacious and rooted deep enough to hold. Bamboo can bend in the breeze without breaking, while plum trees are the first to blossom in winter like a promise of hope.
It's hard to properly discern them in this image, but the leaves definitely belong to the pine trees and the little flowers are a mix of sakura blossoms and plum blossoms. Anyway, tenacity is a trait that defines Shinsuke, and the hope that is carried through winter is similar to the hope for a miracle that carries him through his rebellion.
Lastly, the bigger flowers are peonies, a symbol of love and nobility that is mostly preferred by women. A lot of people say that Shinsuke went down this path because of revenge and hatred, but really, his love for Shinsuke and all that he held dear from his days back at Shoka Sonjuku drove him. Nobility is something that Shinsuke himself has forsaken and claims to have never had, but many times he's shown kindness towards others and done the righteous thing. They are both elements of his personality, albeit well hidden.
To conclude this unnecessarily LONG answer, the kimonos he wears in the manga have such deep symbolism that one cannot ignore. They are a small peek into who he is as a person and all he represents, and because of that, I'll have to give them an extra point over his iconic butterfly yukata. One thing's for sure, Shinsuke surely knows how to dress to impress and he might as well be the most fashionable character in the entirety of the show. Hopefully this wasn't a snoozefest for you, I just thought it'd be interesting to explain why I favor his manga yukata more and provide proper reasoning.
If Shouyou never got captured and killed, what do you think Takasugi would be?
This is one hell of an interesting question that I've wondered about countless of times tbh, so I'll try to share my thoughts as best as I can. (note: I just finished Rakuyo arc so maaaybe I'm slightly off about certain things)
WARNING: INCREDIBLY LONG POST BASED ON PERSONAL SPECULATIONS
Before I can talk about what would become of Takasugi, I need to first assess the overall situation when it comes to the war and his friends, because without figuring out those, developing a solid theory will be hard to do.
Assuming that Shouyou doesn't get captured and killed, would the boys still join the war? To answer this, let's look back at this scene between Gin and Shinsuke.
Shinsuke asks Gin a question that neither of them are able to answer, only to bring up Shouyou a second later. Even when they don't know the reason why they fight for, their common point is wanting to save their sensei. That much is certain for both of them and there is no doubt that their motive for joining the war was to save him. But what happens if someone removes that motive from the equation? Would they still join the war?
The way I see it, yes, they would. Just like Gin suggests, Zura is an honorable person who cares about the people and his country. He has the leader ideals instilled in him, and so with or without their sensei getting captured, he'd still opt to save the country. Because of that, I believe Shinsuke would join him, not only due to their strong bond, but also because of Shinsuke's inner desire to prove himself.
Ever since he was a child, Shinsuke stirred trouble in order to test the waters around him. Rather than wanting to be the strongest among his weak classmates, he was itching to fight a worthy opponent. One that would test him, one that would be able to match him, one that would offer him a real competition, things that he found in Gin.
The military academy was an esteemed school that only privileged kids could attend, yet none of his classmates was worthy of attending it. Shinsuke was ages ahead in terms of both fighting ability and intellect, and thus he was deeply dissatisfied with his school's environment. Instead of power that comes from money, he wanted to be strong on his own accord. To fight over and over again and prove his own worth as a person, not that of his family's name, which wasn't something he could easily do there.
Like I said, his desire to compete and excel manifested in Gintoki, but really, is there an environment more competitive than that of a warzone? Even if Shinsuke doesn't care about glory and fame, he does care about honing himself. Joining the battle field would allow him to truly shine, fight strong opponents and relief his "fighting itch".
So, if Katsura and Shinsuke both join, Gin would have no choice but to also join. These two are his friends and he wouldn't miss on the opportunity to get on Shinsuke's nerves for nothing. Insert Sakamoto, and boom, Joui 4 achieved!
Now comes one of the biggest deciding factors. Who would win? As much as I believe in them, I think that the war would still be a loss. They were so young back then and inexperienced. No matter how great fighters they were, there was no way to take on the Amanto and the Tendoshu/Crows at that point, which leads us to post war period.
Shouyou lives, they live, no eye snatching, happy ever after. Well, not exactly. First of all, lets exam the potential career choices of the boys, considering how at that point, they'd likely feel directionless and defeated.
Tatsuma would 100% live the exact same life. Meet Mutsu, go to space, become the captain of the Kaientai. No doubts here. But when it comes to Katsura, I can see two possibilities. Either he becomes a terrorist in the name of reclaiming the country, or, inspired by Shouyou, he becomes some sort of teacher himself, with the second scenario having more chances to occur if they somehow win the war.
With Sakamoto off Earth and Katsura having found his way, that leaves us with Gin and Takasugi, the two no-good brats. Neither of them know of a way to live their lives. They are both skilled and could do anything they set their minds on, but they don't know what that something is.
Gin forming Yorozuya makes complete sense for his character, as someone who doesn't have a path se in stone and would rather do everything and nothing all at once. I strongly believe that this is something he'd still do, with or without Shouyou being around.
But where does Takasugi fit in all that? I have three possible outcomes in mind, depending on how the war changes his mindset. Although not as honorable and humanitarian as Katsura, Shinsuke does care about what happens to the world, even when his words and actions often suggest otherwise.
Back when he was a child, he entertained the idea of what would happen to the country, if his classmates from the Military Academy rose to power. He didn't think they were qualified to run things, and that could also explain his aggression towards them. Shinsuke is someone who values essence more than money and titles, and thus gets frustrated over people's incompetence. For someone his age, he surely spends a lot time analyzing and criticizing those around him, going as far as to test their worth himself.
Another instance of us learning about his frustration regarding the political stage of Edo, stems from episode 215 during which Matako and Bansai discussed the Kiheitai's goals.
We've always heard about how Takasugi wants to destroy the world, but they seem to have a different opinion. Rather than seeing him as someone who wants to destroy the country, they see him as the kind of hero who wants to reform the government after bringing it down.
Now, there are two cases here. Either he lied to them (which I doubt, considering they are two of his closest people in the Kiheitai), or, he actually does care about what happens to the country. Rather than leaving the world in shambles and pissing off, he cares enough to restore it to what it should be, which is another sign that points towards his interest in politics.
What I'm trying to say is, regardless of Shouyou, Takasugi's always been a person who's been interested in his own country, be it in a different way from Katsura. While Zura is all about the people and the structured values of a bushido, Shinsuke cares about the deeper meaning of things. Combine this interest with his innate need to compete, it's not far fetched to see Takasugi taking on the terrorist route all over again, which is actually funny because so far, according to my theory, they all end up at the same place.
Anyways, rather than being the kind of terrorist who wants the world to burn, he'd be more sensible in this case. Just like when he was a child, he'd do everything to test the waters, check whether he could possibly topple the house of cards that the Bakufu is with his own two hands. He'd think of it as a challenge, but that's not to say he wouldn't take it seriously. Even when he acts as if he doesn't give two shits about the world, he'd try his best to bring a change and to lead those who are brave enough to take a stand, and this is where Zura fits in the picture.
Back when Shinsuke had yet to go full extremist on their asses, him and Zura were shown on good enough terms to kinda work together. In this Shouyou-being-alive-and-well-scenario, they'd have no reason to oppose each other. With the exception of a few minor disagreements (Shinsuke wanting to take on higher risks and be more radical, while Katsura carefully considers each move and takes things slow), they'd actually be even more successful as partners, whether they form separate factions or not.
So terrorist Katsura/Takasugi is one of the more likely scenarios.
Moving onto the second possible outcome, the one in which Zura founds some sort of school, I can actually imagine Takasugi joining as a mentor/fighting instructor from time to time.
In many flashbacks, we see him teaching kids how to fight and showing them moves. Not just that, but he is also someone of great insight and a hell of a listener. Even when he is lost himself, he's helped thousands of people find their own way and has supported them in his own way. He is cool headed, tolerant, patient, analytical and reads into things with ease.
The role of an advisor would suit him like a glove, considering he has the freedom to wander around as well as inspire others. Perhaps said inspiration would get a bit out of hand, resulting to Katsura scolding him for corrupting the youth, but his intentions would be good. So once again, these two working together is something I see happening.
Final potential work aspect, is actually semi-canon. Remember that alternate Gintama universe in which Gin was an escort? In that universe, Takasugi was the boss of Yorozuya, but not just that.
In the Class Z light novels where he is a delinquent, Takasugi is the one to form Yorozuya among his classmates. Because of these two instances, Shinsuke forming some sort of Yorozuya business himself is highly likely! Not only would he get to advise and assist people, but he'd also get the chance to straight up compete with him. Imagine the two of them getting hired for the same job, with either Yorozuya getting the reward according to who does a better job/finishes faster. Straight up comedy gold.
To sum up, it's likely that Takasugi would either: a) Become a terrorist in the hopes of changing the country, b) Become some sort of advisor, c) Take on a Yorozuya business of his own.
Now that I've managed to properly expand upon the different career choices of Shinsuke, I'll move along to a few other things.
First is the department of romance. Once again, looking at flashbacks and his brief interactions with women, Takasugi isn't exactly a ladies man. Unlike Gintoki or Tatsuma who act like dogs in heat, and Katsura who only has eyes for widows, Takasugi hasn't expressed any deep desire for the opposite gender, except of that one time with the Yoshiwara woman, which could easily be attributed to peer pressure.
What I'm trying to get to is that, most likely, Takasugi would have a hard time dating around. As I mentioned above, he cares about the essence of a human. Even if a woman charms him with her appearance and he engages in some sort of sexual activity with her, dating is a whole other thing. He'd have the kind of standards that are borderline impossible to cater to, while being a difficult person for one to handle. He shows interest in the same way he shows disinterest; g l a r i n g.
That's not to say that Shinsuke would never commit to a relationship or lacks emotion. In fact, it's quite the opposite. If he meets someone he actually likes, then that would be it for him. He is the type of person to form relationships for a lifetime, and although he'd never admit to it, finding "the one" means way more than banging some prostitute or dating some bimbo who only likes him for his looks.
Because of that, he'd probably keep his distance from women, until that someone special shows up. When that happens and assuming the feeling is mutual, he'd actually be one of the most devoted partners and would go to great extends for her. (I could actually expand more on the way I see Shinsuke approaching women or like what I imagine his dream type to be, but that's a whole other story.)
Out of Joui 4, unironically I think he is the most likely to get married and have a family first. Although quite open minded, he remains a traditionalist as I've explained in previous posts, and so, if he had the chance to have a family of his own without complications, he'd probably go for it. (insert Gin meme-ing him about getting all domesticated)
won't dive into married Shinsuke territory now, because that also is a whole other story, I'm just talking about marriage since it's considered one of life's biggest events
Speaking of Gin, I want to state that yes, Joui 4 would be friends after the war, if nothing terrible -such as Shouyou getting captured and arrested- happened. They'd be in each other's lives and meet up fairly often, depending on their personal schedule, with Sakamoto being the black sheep that visits whenever and pulls them all together like glue.
They'd have cringy reunions for which Takasugi would complain, yet still attend, and they'd even include Shouyou sensei to these (assuming he doesn't pull a 180 and go all Utsuro, still not sure how that works so I'm actively refraining from saying too much about it ;-;)
Final point to end this monstrous post; would Takasugi's personality change? I personally believe that Takasugi actually hasn't changed. Yes, he went all radical and discarded everything and everyone, but deep, he is the same guy he's always been, just an angrier and sorrowful version of that person. Whether Shouyou dies or not, whether he becomes a terrorist or not, he is the same. The difference being that if Shouyou didn't die and Shinsuke had the choice of living a normal life without having to endure such excruciating pain and guilt, he'd be able to express himself more and allow himself to live a proper life.
He'd laugh more, joke more, smile more and act all petty without anything weighing him down. He wouldn't turn kinder or nicer or whatever, because he already is kind and nice. He just couldn't afford to be either (openly) because of his circumstances.
Him saving Matako, Bansai and every single Kiheitai member, shows just how kind he is. Even if his words don't always reflect that, his actions do. A guilt free Takasugi is the very same Takasugi we know and love, yet a Takasugi who doesn't suffer from rain anymore, a Takasugi who can achieve happiness of his own.
I was actually thinkin aloud here and I wanted you to see my entire thought process for this question, considering how hard it was to answer and think through. Apologies for it being overly lengthy, but in order to properly analyze it, I had to touch upon many aspects of his personality, tendencies, history and potential futures. Of course, this is all my opinion and depending on minor switches to outcomes, new routes would get created. These simply are the outcomes I can think of according to the image I have of him as a character.
p.s. man, i want to see an au in which he is happy now :( he deserves to be happy and have a guilt-free conscience. he deserves everything :(
I just thought about something interesting... do you think shinsuke's dad (and mom) is still alive?? and if yes what do you think was his reaction and he heard about his son's actions ? what did he think when shinsuke chose to leave with shoyo? does he even know his son died ? what does he think about the kiheitai ? just so many questions... I really wanna know what you think about this
poor format doing this on ipad ;-;
That’s actually something I’ve also been wondering about! Ever since we watched that flashback with Sakamoto’s arrival, you know the one where Gin teased Takasugi about his dad buying him legos and him being the firstborn son, I really started giving it some thought.
First of all, Takasugi has siblings?!?!? It’s only unexpected because he’s never mentioned it, but if you think about it, that can explain why his family didn’t have a hard time disowning him. If there is someone else behind him to carry on his family’s legacy (most likely a younger brother at the very least, idk his father seems to me like a real traditionalist to let a sister take up on that), then it shouldn’t be the end of the world for them to lose a son.
Also, there was someone else in his household who cared enough to feed him, judging by how his father asked him to stop giving him food. Now I am really not sure who that person is, could be a sibling, could be a servant, or anyone really, but it shows that there is someone who at the very least has immediate relationships with is family, and cares enough for him.
Now that I’ve sorted that out, hmmm whether his parents are alive or not, there is no telling. His father was a samurai who cared about what others had to say, considering how he freaked when Takasugi began to associate with Shouyou, a man who was already plagued by rumors. It wouldn’t be wild to assume that his father was pro amanto or at least not anti amanto, and so I doubt he participated in the war. Perhaps the anti sword law could affect him, considering he was also a samurai, but in the end he strikes me more as the conformist who cares about preservation of wealth. I don’t mean to say that he licked their boots for sure, but I’m trying to play profiler here with the few hints we have.
Whether his mom or siblings are alive, I suppose it depends entirely on his father, considering they used to wipe out clans and families very easily. If they survived the war, like no random casualty taking their lives, then they could be alive!
Moving on to his father reaction regarding his son’s “accomplishments”. Supposing his father is alive and he doesn’t live in an igloo, he must have heard about what’s become of him. I believe his opinion of Takasugi remains negative, considering how he’s been “soiling” their family’s name. He wouldn’t reach out to scold him or anything (That’d be funny to see), but it will just reaffirm to him that kicking Takasugi out was for the best. I don’t think that he’d ever acknowledge him, even if he succeeded everything on his agenda. People like him are very specific about their values and beliefs, and anything that strays from that road is inherently bad.
Minor mention that this is an interesting difference between the two father figures in his life. Shouyou told him he can choose his own path, whatever that is, while his father chose a path for him to follow, whether he wanted to take on such a path or not. This should also be one of the reasons why Takasugi favored Shouyou over his own family. He must have felt so oppressed! Imagine not knowing what you want to do with your life, while having people over your head telling you what you must do. What must be done and what someone wants to do are completely different things and while Takasugi didn’t have an answer for the latter, he knew he didn’t want to choose the life his family wanted for him. If he did, then he would have been satisfied with going to the Military Academy, he wouldn’t be nagging to Katsura or beat kids up, and he wouldn’t have joined Shouyou.
Also I feel like, if Shouyou gave him some sort of criteria as to what makes a samurai good, then Takasugi wouldn’t bite it. He is someone who does what he wants to do and hates being told what to do. By choosing Shouyo, he chose freedom, one that his family didn’t offer. Oh and another thing; it’s not that he opposed becoming a samurai. He wanted to become one, he just didn’t want to do so while following his father’s Bushido, which might as well be a career change in their eyes. I think that if his family was supportive, then rather than running and sneaking around, Takasugi could have had a healthier family environment. He is not a bad son or anything, he just wanted to find his own way, something he couldn’t do within his family. Had they accepted that he wants to take on their wishes but follow them in his own way, then things would have been much better for him.
Abou his reaction when it came to him joining Shouyou hmmm, perhaps he didn’t see it coming. Disowning someone is a big thing and it didn’t come from the first “mishap”. It looks to me like his father gave him many chances to “get his shit together” because he didn’t really want to do it. Maybe his other kids weren’t as skilled as he was, maybe he knew that Takasugi deep down was a good son. But, if Takasugi is anything like his father, then pride would have kept either party from reaching out, even if there were some regrets in the way. Most likely, the moment he chose Shouyou, Takasugi died to him, considering how he wouldn’t think that his son would actually give up on everything he’d build for some random dude.
Whether he knows of Takasugi’s death, that’s hard to say. I don’t think he’d get to know, unless Katsura or something personally informed him of it. He strikes me as the “no contact, you are dead to me” kinda guy, but if he found out what he did at the end, then maybe he’d feel a sense of pride as well as sadness. I’d like to believe that Takasugi’s father wasn’t a complete monster and like all parents he did have some love for him. Any parent who finds out of their son’s death would be sad, even for a minute.
And about the Kiheitai well, maybe he finds it stupid that so many people followed someone as incompetent as him. That’s one side of the coin. The other would be him experiencing failure? What I mean to say is that perhaps his father knew that he wasn’t doing a good job as a parent. He couldn’t support him nor guide him but now his son has managed to do that for many people. Everything he couldn’t give him as a father, he found in others, and while the vast majority shunned him because you knew, terrorist, there were many inspired. In the end, he wouldn’t admit it okay, this is all personal thinking stuff.
Final paragraph of this madness of a post lmao I could go on all night long, but I feel like my eyes will pop out from all the tears they shed. Based on clues, Takasugi’s father is a prideful and stubborn man, who values society’s opinions more than the well-being of his children. In a time and age where honor and public opinion mattered most, it is unsurprising for him to be like that. However, considering how the frequency and severity of his grounding increased (up until disowning), he should be someone who has the minimum consideration for Takasugi. Whether that’s because he valued him as an heir, or because he loved him as a child, there is no telling. After all, his pride would never allow such a man to show actual affection, which should explain why Takasugi is not great at displaying such emotions either. Shouyou was warm and affectionate, he took him in without second thoughts and offered him a different path. He have a love starved boy everything his pride wouldn’t let him admit he wanted, because in the end, Takasugi is a human being with human needs. He wants to have bonds with others, to be happy and to make his own choices. The end.
THIS TURNED INTO A HUGE MESS AND I WENT FROM ONE POINT TO THE OTHER BUT ITS 3 AM AND MY EYES ARE BLOODSHOT AHAHA I JUST REALLY WANTED TO ANALYZE AND REPLY TO THAT! i don’t know what I’m yelling for smh. oh and if u have more questions and wanna discuss things further, lemme know, im a sucker for such conversations :p
