#toronto blessing

[alevelrs]

Corporate Religious Experience

Corporate (‘as a body’) religious experience is where several different people have the same, or similar, religious experiences at the same time. A Biblical example is the story of Pentecost, where everyone felt the same sensation of a rushing mighty wind, and saw the same tongues of fire appearing.

Other examples:

In the town of Medjugorje in Bosnia and Herzegovina, six young teenagers allegedly had regular visions of the Virgin Mary, claiming that she appeared to them, giving them secrets and messages of peace, telling them the world needed more prayer.

This example may be convincing as six people reporting the same experience may have more evidential force, especially the fact that they were all children, as they could be considered to be less calculating than adults and less able to present a convincing/coherent narrative.

However, the six may have been encouraging each other, influencing one another’s memories and encouraging them to believe they saw and heard things that didn’t happen. The Catholic Church is sceptical about the claims but has not completely disowned them, although Pope Francis didn’t visit the shrine when nearby.

The ‘Toronto Blessing’ is a modern phenomenon, in which groups of people all worshipping together in a Church appeared to have the same ecstatic religious experience. They had been said to be overcome by the Holy Spirit, causing them to weep or laugh uncontrollably, or speak in strange ‘languages’ and fall to the ground.

Some take this as a sign of God’s blessing, where people experience the Holy Spirit so intensely that they lose all sense of self in religious ecstasy.

Others argue that this is mass hysteria, why would the Holy Spirit cause people to act so strangely? When the Holy Spirit is genuinely experienced, it leads believers to work for others and to be humble and self-controlled.

[duggarsetal]

Anyone got any good sources on the Toronto Blessing?

[lowcymilosci]

Przestroga dla szukających cudów i uzdrowień.

Przestroga dla szukających cudów i uzdrowień.

Wielu z nas boryka się z różnymi problemami, przypadłościami, chorobami. Z pewnością jest to czas wielu znaków, cudów i uzdrowień. Czy wszystkie one jednak pochodzą od Boga? Z pewnością część z nich tak, ale nie wszystkie. Wystarczy wejść w google aby dowiedzieć się, że podobne cuda dzieją się też winnych religiach. Nawet będących z dala od chrześcijaństwa, czy więc roztropny chrześcijanin,…

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[ohdoubters-blog]

"The 18th-century Swedish "visionary," Emanuel Swedenborg - who was a strange forerunner of today's occult and "spiritual" revival- had extensive experience with spiritual beings, whom he frequently saw and communicated with. He distinguished two kinds of spirits, the "good" and the "evil"; his experience has been recently confirmed by the findings of a clinical psychologist in his work with "hallucinating" patients in a state mental hospital in Ukiah, California. This psychologist took seriously the voices heard by his patients and undertook a series of "dialogues" with them (through the intermediary of the patients themselves). He concluded, like Swedenborg, that there are two very different kinds of "beings" who have entered into contact with the patients: the "higher" and the "lower." In his own words: "Lower-order voices are similar to drunken bums at a bar who like to tease and torment just for the fun of it. They suggest lewd acts and then scold the patient for considering them. They find a weak point of conscience and work on it interminably...The vocabulary and range of ideas of the lower order is limited, but they have a persistent will to destroy...They work on every weakness and belief, claim awesome powers, lie, make promises, and then undermine the patient's will... All of the lower order are irreligious or anti-religious... To one person they appeared as conventional devils and referred to themselves as demons."

"In direct contrast stand the rarer higher-order hallucinations... This contrast may be illustrated by the experience of one man. He had heard the lower order arguing for a long while about how they would murder him. But he also had a light come to him at night, like the sun. He knew it was a different order because the light respected his freedom and would withdraw if it frightened him... When the man was encouraged to approach his friendly sun he entered a world of powerful numinous experiences... [Once] a very powerful and impressive Christ-like figure appeared... Some patients experience both the higher and lower orders at various times and feel caught between a private heaven and hell. Many only know the attacks of the lower order. The higher order claims power over the lower order and, indeed, shows it at times, but not enough to give peace of mind to most patients... The higher order appeared strangely gifted, sensitive, wise, and religious".

Any reader of the Orthodox Lives of Saints and other spiritual literature knows that all of these spiritsboth "good" and "evil," the "lower" with the "higher" - are equally demons, and that the discernment between true good spirits (angels) and these evil spirits cannot be made on the basis of ones own feelings or impressions. The widespread practice of "exorcism" in "charismatic" circles offers no guarantee whatever that evil spirits are actually being driven out; exorcisms are also very common (and seemingly successful) among primitive shamans,14 who also recognize that there are different kinds of spirits - which are all, however, equally demons, whether they seem to flee when exorcised or come when invoked to give shamanistic powers."

-Fr. Seraphim Rose, "Orthodoxy and the Religion of the Future"

Case in point, this is more terrifying than any horror movie I've ever seen:

[thetoilandthetoll]

had a Toronto weekend, if ya know what I mean.. more to come later when I'm not exhuasted.. :):):) absolutely full of peace and joy. praising Jesus for all that He has done..

[revisewithannie]

Philosophy: Religious Experience: Corporate Religious Experience

Corporate Religious Experience is where several difference people all have the same, or a similar, religious experience, at the same time- it's pretty unusual, as religious experiences usually happen privately to individuals. There have, however, been reports of groups of people sharing the same feelings and receiving the same messages. 

Biblically, we see an example in the book of Acts, at Pentecost, where everyone felt the same sensation of wind and saw the same tongues of fire. 

A more modern example is the Toronto Blessing, mainly in the USA and in Canada, occurring since the 1990s. People worshipping together appear to have the same example of being overcome by the Holy Spirit, laughing uncontrollably or falling to the ground. 

In the village of Medjugorje in Bosnia, 6 young teenagers and children reported visions of the Virgin Mary, receiving messages from her. 

These experiences can be said to have more evidential force than solitary experiences because, following the scientific principle of reliability, the results are reliable because they've been replicated many times to have the same result. If we cannot measure a religious experience scientifically, however, what use is applying this idea of science? 

Others argue that there may be group pressure, someone might claim to have an experience and others claim similarly, to join in and feel included. The Toronto Blessing in particular has attracted accusations of mass hysteria, in a heightened emotional environment- is it that this is the cause?

[faithfullydrunk]

A history of the Toronto Blessing

[juliaschild]

Toronto blessing.

creepy stuff.