Reader - why do big authors make IF recommendations that are filled with grammar, plot and other errors? I get trying to be supportive but there’s no way they actually read those stories because sometimes the writing is godawful. It makes it seem a little disingenuous if I’m honest.
Can only make suppositions here, only those authors know why they share/recommend other projects that you don't find as good.
Take those suppositions with a huge grain of salt, I'm just giving you some potential answer. Also none of them are good or bad. Not passing judgement here.
they are trying to be supportive to the community by sharing what they see on their dashboard
they are helping their IF friends get some interaction with their followers
[if they shared an intro post] the post itself was intriguing and they are keeping it for a later reading sesh.
they are like us, having headcanons about a character/theme/setting regardless of the actual content.
they actually like the writing style of the games they recommend
those recs are "guilty" pleasures
they have a different tolerance regarding writing issues (grammar, plot, etc...) when it comes to reading compared to yours or their own writing
and probably many, many more reasons than I can come up with...
But I think most importantly: everyone has different taste.
[old comments in tags: ofc everyone is also entitled to their opinions regardless of what written above only focusing on anon's view about “the big authors sharing other IFs” /]
Bruh I actually feel like kinda sad right now…. and I know it’s stupid but I just saw another brand new IF with NO DEMO blow up like crazy as in 100< notes in ONE HOUR WTH tumblr is actaully depressing and I honestly feel like quitting altogether and just deleting my entire page. Nothing against the author it’s just so demotivating to watch people hit the jackpot while I’m constantly trying gainreaders with no luck. Sigh I wish I could turn off the comparisons but it’s really hard
Hey Anon,
Take a deep breath.
Feel your feelings.
Take another deep breath.
Close Tumblr for a while and focus on something else (taking a walk helps cooldown).
With numbers being so visible on posts and game pages, it's often hard to stop watching them go up and not compare yourself.
But they are just this... numbers.
They don't say whether your project will tank or be successful either. Hitting the jackpot of notes on an intro post doesn't always translate in readership, or longevity of those projects either.
Most importantly, those numbers don't define your value as a creator or as a person. They don't define the quality of your work either.
Working on an IF project is not a sprint. It's a marathon. And a lot of projects never see the finish line...
Be kind and patient with yourself and your work.
[old comments in tags: author numbers Since I've been here I've seen a lot of intro posts without demo appearing and many being abandoned soon after but those new projects will pop up more around school holidays you will see more of them in the next few months /]
I love that so many new authors are discovering and writing IFs. At the same time, as an author, it can be hard to make your IF stand out against so many new ones.
Back to two or three years ago, I feel it was much easier for a new IF to gain a decent amount of people interested, while now sometimes it can be hard navigating through all the new stories.
And don't get me wrong, I believe readers have risen too with time, but it is still hard to create a story that has not been done over and over and that at the same time holds the tropes or characters dear to so many authors.
I think that once your IF is long enough, it all somehow equalises, but at the early stages stakes have become higher. Readers expect more and more customisation, since they have been accustomed to it, they expect variety and a certain level of polish of the story. Which is natural since IFs have become more popular, but it still can look daunting from a new author perspective.
Cherry, the author of A Tale of Crown, has also talked about how the IF landscape on Tumblr has changed on her blog ( X , X ) in the past years. I am sure she is not the only one... It is becoming a bit saturated in some genres for sure...
It is so nice people get to find a new way to be creative and tell stories. That's also something I love about IF. Anyone with an internet connection can create something.
But I agree with the sentiment of looking at the community and seeing a bit of a saturation with so many new IFs popping up on Tumblr. You have to be shinier and newer and grab the attention of readers in new ways and keep that attention, otherwise your project will get washed out by other ones... It can definitely feel frustrating, that's true.
This is why I always tell people who what to start: do a small contained story! Something simple, very linear, with few variation, to test the waters and the IF program. Then try bigger (or not, do whatever).
Though, having been behind the scene with the Interact-IF directory, there are waves of new IFs throughout the year. Usually, we'll see more new projects pooping up around school holidays, especially the summer ones. And of those, very little have available demos or do end up getting one out. Many, many, projects end up getting abandoned after being announced, more so if there is no demo out.
I think this is why you can see a bit of an equaliser once your project is long enough (or you are more settled/popular in the community). People like shiny new things, but they prefer consistency and substance.
On the story and trope note: everything had been beaten to death already, but it doesn't stop those stories or tropes from being used over and over again and achieving popularity. And you can have the exact same premise/plot/trope between two authors feeling different because those authors have different voices.
For the stakes rising... yeah... Readers can have a lot of power in the community. [I'm generalising here, there are exception to the rule.]
Readers are expecting more, more polish in the writing or the UI, more customisation and variation in choices, more choices being meaningful to the story, more updates, more words, more of everything they've been accustomed to have through popular or long-standing IFs (or IFs published/created by actual companies).
Note: this is not always a conscious thing, btw.
They will either forget that forget that IF is a hobby for most authors, that they do in their free time, that those authors may not have the knowledge to reach those expectations, or that they are limited by the resources they have (see this other confession).
Just because someone did it before or because it is technically possible, doesn't mean that everyone should or has to strive for it.
But at the same time, I feel part of it has to do with how great past and established works have been, how boundaries pushing they were in terms of polish or customisation or just what IF can do/be. Each new project as the potential to push that boundary, to increase people's expectations for the next wave of IF, and to put more pressure on newer creators.
And the issue with that is you can't stop that from happening. You can't take back what's been made, it's already out there. And you shouldn't want it to stop from happening either. Without people pushing boundaries, the medium would be come stale.
I am sure there are many different reasons for why the stakes have been increasing, aside from the saturation of new projects, increased readers' expectations, and increase of great works out there. But here are a few as to why there might be more pressure for creators:
creating an IF to get likes/numbers/interactions rather than just because,
not getting the amount of interactions you expected from the get-go or not seeing it increase as much as you hoped,
IF becoming more popular and the potentiality of your work being read by more people,
announcing a project before having planned or written part of the story,
promising mechanics or features without knowing whether it will possible/make sense/feasible to include it,
not setting expectations about the content of a project when announcing it (or soon after),
expecting too much from ourselves as creators,
believing their story isn't new enough,
starting an IF without having done any research about how to create one,
starting a big project without testing the waters of IF creation,
I wish there was more dimension with Romantic options when I play I’d rather want to see them as a character rather then just an option for the mc to romance, I feel like when characters are written like that it makes the story feel flat. I’m tired of seeing the kind sweet childhood best friend who will do anything for the mc I want more development then just being a trope. Or the super sexual cold RO it just feels like these characters don’t really have any personality and all feels very same . I’d just like a bit more with how many Ros are written in general. It’s okay to venture out the box’s when it comes to creating Ros I feel like the best ifs I’ve read have Ros that stand on their own, that feel like actual characters : )
As a writer and a reader, who has been around this community for the last three years, it has been crazy seeing the change in the if fandom as a community.
It used to be a positive environment for supporting independent game creators, but there is so much negativity against IF writers now. the readers are pushy, critical and demanding, expect games to cater to their exact preferences or be customisable to the point it might as well be a 'fill in the blanks' game instead of a narrative. IF writers are antagonistic towards each other, resentful of other creators success.
There is a trend that when games/demos are successful, the authors become the target of attacks that seem to be looking for any excuse to take them down, and punish them for their popularity. The result is that a lot of games that are in the alpha stage / completed no longer use tumblr at all, which is a shame, because it was a unique opportunity for readers to engage and support an indie game creator.
I think the IF fandom really needs to do some soul searching on the type of environment it has created for indie game development / IF writing.
[I am assuming Anon meant the Tumblr/CoG scene of IF, as this is not a sentiment/trend shared by the overall IF community. Other scenes of IF don't care or even reject customisation "expected" here (doesn't mean they don't have their issues either).]
LOL, Anon. I was having an eerily similar conversation about the customisation the other day.
Communities do change overtime. As older members leave (because they don't enjoy the Thing-tm anymore, they don't have time for it, they don't like where the community is moving, they've been rejected by the community, etc...) and newer members arrive, the dynamics adapts to the current members. Sometimes it is for the better (more positive contacts, barring less-desirable members creating conflict from staying, etc...), sometimes it's for the worse (like in your message, attracting more problematic members or enabling the worst in people).
An issue with Tumblr that other communities may not have is how "decentralised" and lawless it is. Some groups may have guidelines/rules for interactions (resource blogs/authors asks rules), but you can't control all the members like you could in a Forum, for example. There is no Code of Conduct that limits what is and isn't acceptable (aside from the very board Tumblr CoC and even a lot of shitty things can be posted). There is no mods that can take down a post that will sent the community aflame (unless it is Staff bc the post was against their ToC/CoC). There is no consequences against bandwagon hate/harassment (even with the block button). So you end up with... well, this...
It would be nice if there was a bit more unity in the community, but that would require many people changing their behaviour and essentially stop being complete asswipes. And they are not the kind to stop shitting on others...
I'm pretty sure that a lot of those issue could be solved if people:
stopped being a dick in someome's dms/asks (should be a given, but damn are anons wild sometimes) <- like +75% of the issues would be gone with just this
would be respectful when sending messages/commenting (not making request, being pushy, etc...)
stopped following authors/projects not making them happy (that's a vicious cycle, easy to start hating on them...)
didn't put their problems and frustrations on strangers on the internet*
went outside to touch some grass (or take a break from Tumblr, it will do wonders!)
*This does not apply to the confession booth btw.. I'm talking reg accounts here.
This applies to everyone, btw. You'd think this would be common knowledge to be decent to one another... but I guess not.
As a side note, to remind everyone that:
you do not have to have an open inbox if you don't want to
you do not have to have your dms open either
you do not have to allow anonymous messages
you do not have to answer every messages you receive or reply to every comment you get
you can trash any message you do not feel comfortable answering
you can delete comments/replies you do not feel comfortable with
(creator) you do not have to include every request readers make
you can block/unfollow users for any reason (or no reason)
you can block/report hateful anonymous messages
you can restrict reblogs/replies
you can change your mind at any time about accepting a kind of asks (like the NSFW ones)
you do not have to be on Tumblr every free moment you have
you do not have to interact with every post crossing your dashboard
Having boundaries is good, setting and voicing those boundaries is better, enforcing those boundaries is extra important.
Until then...
🤷
Now making a fill-in the blank IF would be a fun idea...
[old comments in tags: be the change you want to see i guess im just trying to stay silly here /]
Under the cut, some more rambling and wild assumptions about how we got here.
===> Increased entitlement in the community
Note: this is a generalisation. Not every reader is entitled, not every request is outrageous, and not every author is a pushover. We are talking about visible trends.
There's no denying that it has had quite the impact on the community and how games are set. Gone(-kinda) are the days with completely unique characters with a unique voice and its set path, hail the rule of customisation that inevitably becomes too overwhelming for any creator to keep track and complete the story.
Is the "CoG expectations" the culprit, there? With the CoG to Tumblr exodus, yaknow...
But it must have started from somewhere to have those vocal entitled readers hounding creators for all this stuff, they can't have appeared out of nowhere! Twine games from the 2010s were not chokefull of customisation...
Honestly, it wouldn't surprise me if it all started with some minor request for customisation, which was accepted by the author, which may have made other readers realise they too could have requests or expect the same kind of customisation in other project, and this snowballed into... *wave at the mess*, creating a vicious cycle of base customisation expectations (which are getting insane...), shunning pieces who do not fit those expectations, and still having more special requests*.
*Honestly, the authors could just accept those request but as like paid content. Oh, you want more that will definitely fuck my whole timeline of planned work? Tip me like 100$ and I will...
At the same time, and this is an observation that has been accentuated with the kinds of asks I've gotten here, some authors have not helped the situation either. With people almost begging for interactions and notes or just to please the readers because they are interested in that stilly little project (or the pressure from blowing up, or before the idea is set in stone), some authors will seriously bend over and backwards for those requests, even if it means forgoing the OG plans altogether because it doesn't fit with the promised request.
Readers feels more empowered to ask -> there is a pressure to cater to readers to get interactions or the request has become part of the base expectations -> request is accepted, but author might feels resentful -> readers feels more entitled to ask -> etc...
or
Readers feel more empowered to ask -> the author refuses -> readers put pressure on the author because another one accepted it or iT Is cOmMon KnOwLeDge -> author feels resentful towards the community...
Which is kind of related to point number 2...
===> Numbers go up and Jealousy
Note about this point: I am not talking about the want to be seen by other people, to feel like your message has been heard, to have your presence acknowledged. That's what we are kinda all doing by putting our stuff out there.
Every time I get an ask about someone worrying that to do have enough traction on their project or get zero interactions and they have lost all their motivations or are resentful to newer projects blowing up*, I honestly struggle to see a positive future for this scene. It seems like everything is about notes and reblogs and how many followers you have and how many ratings you can get and how many asks you get and etc...
*see the no demo discussion
What is supposed to be a hobby for 99% of us is turning into some ugly race to have the highest number of *wave again at things*, by tanking other creators rating average, manipulating your followers to boost your own, creating rumours about a project/author, sending hate anons, creating dumb drama, stealing/plagiarising whole ass games, etc... Just to be at the top and have the biggest number. Numbers, I feel like I need to point out, means absolutely nothing outside of this website (or even this scene of IF).
I really don't understand this dumb race...
And it is so frustrating to see, because we should be hyping each other up, discussing each others fav games, being excited to see another voice join and create stuff. It's not like we have to all be the best of friends and blind ourselves from any misgivings. No, we should still be able to criticise constructively or call out bad behaviour. But the whole envy and jealousy* oozing from the community is really... bleh.
*doesn't mean you can't be jealous/envious of someone else, I know I am. Just use those feelings creatively, not to put down yourself or others.
Same with the whole notes/interaction thing. Outside affirmation is great, it really is, and boy does it gives a nice boost to the ego and the energy levels to continue when you get some (especially when the other person is gushing about your project). But basing all your motivation to create on outside approval will lead to a lot of pressure to perform when you get it, despair and disappointment when you don't, and resentment when you see other get more.
===> Parting notes
Ugh... I spent too long on this shit. I'm going for a walk before I get more sad. Then, I'm coming back to play my friend's game and create something weird.
Don't know if this falls under confession or is just a hot take. 🤣 But the really horny anon asks some IF authors get? Yeah I do not think all them anons are really that horny, i am ready to bet my coin collection that half those anons are just teasingly messing with the authors.
I wouldn't be surprised if that was the case either :P
Though I'd wager more of a 25/75 split. There are a lot more horny people on the internet than you think ;)
[old comments in tags: as long as the author is ok about it there's not harm :) /]
Just because something is a hobby doesn't preclude it from being something people treat seriously, in fact a hobby is more likely to be treated seriously by the people who enjoy it than something that isn't since it's something they pursue in their free time. Serious does not equal not having fun.
Nothing's wrong with treating a hobby seriously, neither is going at it with a silly manner, or any other manner*. There should be no expectation when going into a hobby aside from... finding if it is for you and if you do, how much free time you want to invest in it.
*as long as it is not harming others...
If you have fun, and your hobby is bringing you joy/positive things in your life, that's what should matters. Whether you go at it seriously or silly... 🤷
I don't particularly like the implication that it's a fact that people who enjoy something are more likely to treat it seriously just because they invest a lot of their free time on it... I don't know... feels kind of shame-y for people who spend all their free time on a hobby but stay silly, you know? But I could just be overanalizing things again...
my confession is that I don't even know what a parser IF is </3
A Parser is a text-based game with text-inputs as commands (instead of clicking on a link). It usually will have puzzles to solve, in some sort of adventure form, which you can go through by inputing a verb or a verb+noun combo to create actions.
It was the most prominent form of IF until about two decades ago, when hypertext started to flourish (Inkle, ChoiceofGames, Twine, Visual Novels...).
It is a very interesting way of doing Interactive Fiction, especially in terms of gameplay or creating puzzles. Many out there, especially the older ones, can be quite hard, but quite a few have walkthroughs or a hint system now.
If you are starting out, I recommend playing games from the Text Adventure Literacy Project (a.k.a. games meant for beginners) or this list of Easy to Solve games.
Aisle is one of my favs short IF parser game!!
