YOU ARE THE REASON
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if i look back, i am lost
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@ihatethiswebsite77
Felt like sharing, finally trying my hand at drawing my favorite little child antichrist.
General rule I have when it comes to drawing Cartman is that he is supposed to look like his mom, but a bit scrunched up. His shape language is somewhere between a square and a circle, but he definitely has a permanent shit eating expression whether he is smiling or frowning or whatever.
Do you have a headcanon for which major each South Park (main) boy would choose to study in college?
It's been a while... I myself have been MIA from my dear South Park discourse due to college, lol.
Let's see...
To me, Stan feels like the type of guy who would go to collage because it's the most obvious next step, but who isn't the most passionate or introspective about what he actually wants to do so he picks one of the most "average dude" things to major in possible, like mechanical engineering or agriculture and then doesn't use that EVER. Our poor boy kinda feels doomed to become like his father in some ways, who I'm pretty sure was a Geologist in the begging of this show... So that tracks.
Cartman could genuinely do anything or nothing. With Cartman, it's never a question of if he is able to, more so is he willing to actually follow through. Personally, I think Cartman going into Law would be incredibly funny. For one, because it's what everyone expects of Kyle and Cartman doing it instead is incredibly funny to me. And for two, because I think it genuinely just fits Cartman so well. You can imagine a scene where Cartman pulls some Better Call Saul billboard scene ass bullshit. Of course you can.
The most obvious one for Kyle always seems to be Law, but outside of that fandom consensus, my take is that he'd do great in History. Mostly because I can see him becoming a professor and then getting to do his little speeches as much as his little heart desires. It feels very in line with the show's comedy to give that opportunity to Kyle, but also have it not matter because who is listening to their history professor's speeches (I was, but like the joke is still accurate lol).
With Kenny, I think he is definitely the type of kid to go straight to working after High School, but if he was to go to college I think the show got it pretty spot on with him becoming a doctor or scientists of some sort, so I guess a Biology major or something adjacent to it?
The panderverse special brought me back to life.
Who could have predicted that this special that's not in the slightest focused on Kyle and Cartman would have so many moments for them?
- "my favorite people"/people you love
- Cartman yelling out for Kyle specifically to help him as he is being dragged away to the multiverse
- the HUG??! like like he went straight for Kyle??
"Kyle! Kyle I'm back. I was so wrong about Kathleen Kennedy, Kyle. She's so awesome!"
- like the way he just wants to tell him about that is so??
- kyle being cartman's FAVORITE cereal. There is no denying it this child is just obsessed.
kyman shippers won this special and they weren't even playing to win.
So I was wondering if you could talk about the Kyle/cartman and batman/joker parallels because there is a LOT. Im considering doing my own analysis but I wanted to hear another perspective, if possible?
This is an Interesting topic.
I think it would be an understatement to call Cartman anything but an agent of chaos. The Joker believes that everyone around him is no different than himself, and he seeks to expose that. While Cartman doesn't really want to expose everyone for being just as bad as he is, as that would require admitting he is bad in the first place, that is still definitely a belief he holds deep down. With Joker this belief culminates into an obsession with Batman, someone who operates by a strict moral code, someone Joker believes is SO similar to him, whose attention he is constantly seeking while trying to get him to basically "admit" that they are the same by killing him. The Joker finds great amusement in his altercations with Batman. In a very similar way, which I'm sure you've already picked up, Cartman feels and behaves when it comes to Kyle. If there is on person in south park Cartman truly considers on his level it is Kyle. And in a similar vein to the Joker he find great amusement in his and Kyle's arguments.
Neither Batman nor the Joker can ever truly win against eachother tho. Due to their unchanging nature and beliefs they can never cross that bridge. The only way for Batman to truly beat the Joker is to kill him (aka become him), which goes against all his morals, and the Joker could never kill Batman.
“You just couldn’t let me go, could you? This is what happens when an unstoppable force meets an immovable object. You truly are incorruptible, aren’t you? You won’t kill me out of some misplaced sense of self-righteousness, and I won’t kill you because you’re just too much fun. I think you and I are destined to do this forever”, a quote of Jokers from the Dark Knight.
(This quote is literally such a good description for Cartman and Kyle overall)
Just like these two Kyle and Cartman can never truly win against eachother. Kyle could never let himself stoop down to Cartman's level, and Cartman even tho he has attempted to "kill Kyle" many times, could never truly do it for the fact that his life would just be dull without him around to fight with.
There is a good chunk of works that depict that relationship between Joker and Batman as "friendly" (take that with like a grain of salt) in a way. The very fact that Batman refuses to kill him, even going so far as continually saving The Joker. Essentially allowing him to roam free again and again, simply because he believes that there is something worth saving there.
“Do you understand? I don’t want to hurt you. I don’t want either of us to end up killing the other. But we’re running out of alternatives and we both know it”, Batman in The Killing Joke.
In a similar manner Kyle is continuously trying to see something good in Cartman, even against his better judgement. Constantly saving him from trouble, from a sense of moral obligation and maybe even one of genuine friendships. There is a part of Kyle that genuinely believes that Cartman can change.
The same comic ends with the two characters realizing that they can never truly trust eachother (told to us through a metaphor in a joke The Joker tells to Batman). They both start cackling at the ridiculousness of their situation, almost as if they were two friends having a laugh.
We are shown so many times in this show that Cartman and Kyle could be genuinely good friends, there are multiple instances of them acting so. But their antagonistic relationship towards eachother is something Kyle and Cartman can never manage to escape, even after 40 years they seem to regress at the first look they have of eachother. In a way that's similar to the Joker and Batman they need eachother. Their characters linger on each other. They justify eachothers existence by being eachothers narrative foils. Which kinda dooms them to a life of fighting.
When will the "Cartman has a crush on Kyle, but shipping Kyman is crazy" crowd realize that they make absolutely zero sense.
Like-
IN CANON neither Cartman nor Kyle have a crush on eachother. What they do have is a deep and weird obsession with eachother. YOU are actively choosing to interpret that obsession as a crush Cartman has on Kyle, but that is not the "canon" dynamic or nature of that obsession. In the same way people who ship Kyman will interpret it as reciprocal (or maybe they won't, it depends), cause the thing is that Kyle is just as obsessed with Cartman as Cartman is with him. That's why you can interpret this dynamic as any shade from nonexistent, to one sided, to reciprocal.
If Kyle is as obsessed with Cartman as Cartman is with him, and you think that Cartman has a crush on Kyle because that's how you CHOOSE to interpret that obsesssion. Then it's just hypocritical to go off on people who use the exact same logic you did to come to that conclusion. You don't have to think of it as reciprocal, it's completely valid to see their obsession as manifesting as a crush in one and not the other, or to even see it as just obsession in both.
It's just god damn weird to be so nasty about it to other people. Both of them are obsessed with eachother in a way, and people are allowed to interpret each of their obsessions however they want. If people who ship kyman are delusional for interpreting Kyle's obsession with Cartman the same way you interpret Cartman's obsession with Kyle, then I'm afraid you are all sinking in the same boat load of delusional together.
The first two episodes of season 18 really said
"Kyle and Cartman are the brains of the operation, the one way these boys are getting anywhere is if these two work together to come up with a plan"
The further I get into this show the more proof I find that everyone who thinks this friendgroup hates Cartman is full of it. In so many episodes, where the focus is on the main 4 getting into shit, these two end up acting like best friends.
Behind every entertaining Kyman fic there is Butters revealing some big secret and then going "Oh Hamburgers" while covering his mouth.
Kyman Week 2023 - First Fight (kinda)
I rather opted to try and capture the essence of their conflict with eachother. Something where, there exists a sort of an opposite to a silver lining between the two. Where instead of finding the good in a bad situation, these two manage to find something to fight about even when the waters are calm. They are in their own worlds, but the slightest accidental bump against eachother can break that lining and cause conflict, cause them to "bleed into" eachother, have an effect on eachother like no one else has. And of course, the way they go about their words is very different, while Kyle is usually explosive and enraged, Cartman is slimy and conniving, so their speech bubbles reflect that.
Hope you like it!
Made a lil kyman animatic cause I love them sm???
Song's by Reel Big Fish!
A headcanon I have for Kyman is that there is just an abundance of pictures taken over the course of their lives in South Park, either of them in their friend group, or pictures where they can be spotted in the background. And in so many of those pictures they are interacting in some way.
Someone was taking a picture of themselves or something and in the background of it you can see Cartman and Kyle arguing about something.
Their class was posing for a yearly photo and Cartman elbowed Kyle and Kyle tried to keep himself from falling by catching onto Cartman so in the picture you can just see both of them falling off to the side.
If someone is taking a picture in the hallway, Cartman and Kyle aren't together but you can see Kyle is walking away from him in a pissed off manner and Cartman doesn't look all that pleased either.
In the Cafeteria they are eating lunch at separate tables. Wendy wants to take a pic of her and Stan or something. Kyle is right behind them and you can see he is playing with his food dejectedly and in the far backround you can see Cartman is looking over to their table.
Someone is posting about how class was really lame today with a picture that's facing the blackboard. In front you can see Cartman passing some kinda note over to Kyle.
I could go on, but I think you get it.
So in defense of Ginger Cow.
I know people's big grip with this episode is Cartman's behavior, and I get it... To an extent.
We know Cartman likes fighting with Kyle because Kyle is usually the only person who is going to give Cartman the kind of reaction he seeks to be given.
But I think it's also important to remember that Cartman is a little sadistic bastard. Cartman doesn't enjoy ripping on Butters instead of Kyle because Butters just happily agrees with him. Cartman doesn't enjoy ripping on Kyle about basketball once the coach rejects him because Kyle genuinely agrees with what the coach has told him.
But in Passion of the Jew Cartman does enjoy hearing Kyle agree with him after watching the movie. Because in that moment Cartman feels as tho he won a round of their little game. He beat Kyle and he gets to enjoy the fact that he is the cause of his beat down attitude.
Because what Cartman really enjoys the most about his interactions with Kyle, is that Kyle puts up a fight. So the only time Cartman can enjoy a lack of "resistance" from Kyle is when he feels like he has personally beaten Kyle in a round of the game that is their rivalry.
He doesn't want Kyle to happily agree with him (Like Butters does) . But he also doesn't want Kyle to give up (like he does when the coach tells him he can't play basketball). Because that would mean that he hasn't won, because what is winning if Kyle isn't acting like he lost?
He wants to fight with Kyle, and he wants to beat Kyle in those fights of theirs. The same way Kyle wants to beat him. So it's not crazy to think that he would act this way after finally having "beaten Kyle". As long as he beat a Kyle who put up a fight and not one that didn't, and as long as that Kyle is actually acting like he lost. I think it's safe to say that he would get pretty bored of this farts thing relatively quickly and they would go back to "playing another round" of their game/rivalry.
Viewing their entire dynamic like a game where Player 1 and Player 2 compete in an endless amount of rounds feels pretty accurate to me. Because as much as either of them like that moment of triumph that comes with having won a round, they still want to go back to playing the next one.
I think the only place where this episode does mess up a bit is in the way it's plot requires Kyle to not say anything in protest to Cartman. So it's not unreasonable for people to see this as mischaracterization of Cartman, and his dynamic with Kyle at first. Because you can't tell immediately that the thing Cartman is relishing in is the fact that his "victory" is immensely pissing Kyle off. But If you look deeper into, and reframe your view it really does make sense for Cartman to act his way.
TL;DR: Kyle doesn't verbally push back on the things Cartman does and says in this episode. But it's not really out of Cartman's character to enjoy the type of dynamic him and Kyle have in this episode, because Kyle is very clearly not ok or happy with what is happening. And that in itself is another part of their dynamic that Cartman, as evident in many episodes (see tags for another reference too), finds amusement in. Cartman does want Kyle to talk back to him, fight him on his statements, but Cartman also wants to beat Kyle, and have Kyle be humiliated by that loss. Cartman is one sadistic person. And I have seen a lot of people say that him enjoying Kyle's "submissive attitude" in this episode is out of character for him. And I say that's wrong, because what he is finding amusement in isn't that attitude. Because the kind of "submissive attitude" Kyle presents in this episode is not the one Cartman hates and has shown to hate. He hates Butters' submissive attitude in Smug Alert. The one with a cadence of facing ridicule and insults with acceptance and positive attitude and little to no negative reaction or emotion. What Cartman finds amusement in here is that he knows Kyle hates what is happening. Even tho Kyle has to behave as tho he is happy with eating his farts. Cartman knows that's not really the case. They're fundamentally different.
Kyle's behavior in Casa Bonita is genuinely one of my favorite examples of him being a bit fuckin obsessed with Cartman/the idea of fixing Cartman.
So the first thing Kyle does in this episode is enter the room excitedly announcing that he is able to invite 3 of his friends to his birthday party to his only 3 friends. Then he tells one of them they actually aren't inviting them. So first things first. No one in their right mind does that, not unless they want to get a specific reaction out of that person when letting them know they aren't invited.
Kyle also appears to be angry when Cartman says that he wants to go to Casa Bonita specifically, and not his birthday.
Also the little instance of his crossing his arms and looking away while saying "sorry my minds made up" seems like a normal thing but looking at it in tandem with the rest of his behavior this episode I think it screams "my minds not made up I am just waiting to see if you'll say what I want to hear you say"
Speaking of the rest of his behavior. Kyle hasn't already invited Butters when he announces the exciting news to the guys. He just makes it clear that he is planning to invite him instead of Cartman.
Even Cartman somewhat recognizes what Kyle wants in this situation. When Cartman comes to him in an attempt to win him over with his "nice sweater" Kyle immediately clocks what he is trying. But he doesn't turn him away. He doesn't say "no matter what you do I'm not inviting you". Kyle just says that "that's not the same as being nice". And leaves Cartman to figure it out on his own. By this point Kyle still hasn't invited Butters.
In the next scene Kyle witnesses Cartman beating up Jimmy in an attempt to prove that he is Kyle's friend. What is Kyle's response to this. Well I call it the Kyle equivalent of "Not quite what I meant. Try again later." He could not give less of a crap that Cartman just beat up Jimmy. Nope. All he has to say to him is that that isn't "being nice" either.
After this Kyle invites Butters to his birthday. But then immediately as Cartman is walking down the hallway he initiates a conversation to find out what Cartman will try this time. Even tho, as Cartman points out, he has already invited Butters, and he knows that he has already invited Butters. He still wants so desperately to fix Cartman. To make him learn a lesson. And he wants to be the one to do that. Not anyone else. Kyle. Because Kyle is the only one that actually tries to pull this crap with Cartman.
And nothing makes this sweeter than the fact that he just outright admits it in the fucking episode. That is exactly what he wanted to hear from him all along. All along. From the start of this episode.
Is it just me that genuinely doesn't understand what people mean when they say that they like platonic kyman but they morally disagree with and dislike romantic kyman.
Like, obviously, romantic relationships and friendships are very much not the same thing.
But how is being okay with Kyle being friends with Cartman any different than being okay with him being in a romantic relationship with Cartman?
Like in their nature both of those require Kyle to have a positive relationship with Cartman. No? I just feels a bit hypocritical when I see people comment something like "I like platonic kyman but romantic kyman is 😬". Like at least have some self awareness if you are going to comment on a ship.
Insecurity is such a good Cartman episode it's actually insane. Cuz like, he isn't even the main main focus.
His first response to learning that his friends mom is having sex with someone other than his dad is to think that it wasn't consensual. Something about that, and other instances where he interperts acts of love as acts of violence and vice versa is telling me that the incessant exposure he's had to Liane's, life choices, has messed him up quite a bit. And yet he still feels a responsibility to keep his mom safe. He is the only one of the children to participate in this episode, he fills the same role that the adult male/father figure characters of the show do. I touched on this in another post, but i really do feel like a lot of Cartman's obsession with authority stems from him thinking that he is supposed to fill in the same role in his home as another adult male character would in theirs (largely due to how his mother treats him). And this episode really solidified that idea for me. What's really crazy is that it really seems like the episode wants to touch on some of these themes too. By calling back to Cartman being insecure about his lack of a father, by showing him aligning himself with the collective of all the dads in the town, figuratively throughout most of the episode, but then literally at the end, even with his mention of authority in that moment. I just think it's really neat that this kind of Cartman analysis really isn't a reach, because the show canon actively supports so much of it.
If Kyle ever found out Cartman liked him he would simply just- not believe it for one second.
If by some chance Cartman decided to be genuinely nice to Kyle upon discovering that his feelings for him go a little bit deeper than just "hatred" that he's called them for all the years they've known eachother. You know just doing little things that you'd usually never see Cartman doing. Enough to raise a few eyebrows but not so far as to say that Cartman is a changed individual. Kyle would immediately catch on to these small changes, and then proceed to be suspicious. Kyle knows that he shouldn't trust Cartman as far as he can throw him, especially when he is being "nice". To the point where he would seek out ways to spy on Cartman just to see what he is up to. And when he finds nothing he will just end up questioning Cartman head on. And if by that point Cartman decides to tell him the truth, that he is being nice because he likes him. Kyle will not buy it. Not even consider it. His reaction will simply be "Stop lying, what is it that you are really scheming Fatass?" And I suspect that Cartman, being genuine for the first time in his life, will be quite thrown off by this. Cartman isn't one to resort to introspection in times of tribulation. He is simply going to be confused as to why Kyle is refusing to believe him when he is actually telling the truth. It fails to occur to him that all the times he has lied led to Kyle not trusting him. He can only percieve the situation from his point of view and that is that he is telling the truth and that that should mean that Kyle will believe him. And so for like a long period of time. Cartman will just put his entire focus into making Kyle believe him. Simply because he is an obsessive individual and he really likes proving Kyle wrong (even tho he likes him). That of course will only lead to Kyle being even more convinced that Cartman is scheming. Kyle's thought process will equate the amount of Cartman's effort, not to him being genuine, but rather to the scope of his scheme. And as long as that's the case Kyle will refuse to believe it. But there is one thing Kyle can't resist to fall for when it comes to Cartman. And that's when Cartman shows genuine emotions of being hurt or upset. After a while of trying to get Kyle to believe him and it absolutely just not working. Cartman gives up. Kyle being Kyle, feels a slight sense of triumph over not letting Cartman's "scheme" get the better of him, but as he notices Cartman talking to him less and less he begins to feel a slight sense of longing, almost as if he misses him. He decides to find Cartman and question him about why he has stopped (to gloat and inquire about his scheme of course, no other reason, or so he will tell himself.) And by this point. Cartman just wants to be left alone, returning to a more dejected and defensive attitude which is meant to cover up some hurt feelings. He entertains Kyle for a bit, but quickly it becomes clear to Kyle that something is wrong. This is not how he saw this scene playing out. And being Kyle. He wants to know more. He can't help but pry. And this time, when Eric tells him the truth. With the memories of the past few months coming at him like a tidal wave, he gets that big moment of realization.
imagine thinking jersey kyle is ooc like that wasn’t a perfect and hilarious extension of his already pre establish anger and aggression
People are saying this??? LMAO??
Sorry but even Stan was like "It explains a lot" when he found out Kyle's mom is from Jersey. Like sorry to ppl who headcanon him as level headed but Kyle has the most anger issues out of anyone on the show.
Kyle "I hate Cartman with all my heart, but..." Broflovski
He will swear up and down that he hates Cartman more than anything and then the second he thinks that he has somehow hurt his feelings or that Cartman is genuinely upset about something he will fold completely and just get all sad and pouty 😕
It's the funniest thing cuz he is so fucking oblivious to the fact that he does it too.
