I Welcome you, to the Church of Vows. I am Miriel, steward of this sacred chamber. My apologies, for the unseemly state of affairs...
Hello! Starting this blog as a place to dump all my ramblings (especially with the DLC on the way). It’s mostly going to be a lore blog, though From do enjoy mixing gameplay with storytelling so I may get sidetracked at times......
We don’t know the full story when it comes to the Lands Between, so it’s important to keep our minds open to ideas that we may consider heretical - remember, all things can be conjoined.
Over the first few days I’ll be outlining my own beliefs about the lore, and then possibly speculating on the DLC. Until then, here are some channels who make content I enjoy, who I will likely reference often:
https://www.youtube.com/@tarnishedarchaeologist
https://www.youtube.com/@SekiroDubi
https://www.youtube.com/@Hawkshaw
https://www.youtube.com/@VaatiVidya
ugh the most annoying thing to me among elden ring lore discussions is when people have a theory or a way they interpret the characters or story and they treat it as if it’s indisputable fact when it’s actually not… I think all lore people need to always be prepared to be wrong because it will happen often in a game with so much content that’s still entirely vague
Ahem... Apologies, it appears I was asleep for a while longer than intended. Well, I’m awake now, so let’s make the most of this time and try to learn some more about the world around us.
Just a bit of an update, I am back and I will hopefully be posting semi-regularly, no and I still intend to get out all of the content related to the gods and demigods of Elden Ring. Things got a little busy and I took a bit of a break from the game, and with that went my motivation to create lore content.
I played some souls-adjacent games in that time (Blasphemous, the Jedi games, Hollow Knight) and I think it’s really helped me solidify my understanding of what I enjoy about these games, so now I’m happy to be back in Elden Ring. I’ll be taking things slowly at first, catching up on any theories I’ve missed since my absence, and hopefully I’ll be able to start delving into some of the more heretical ideas before too long
I can’t take credit for much more than stringing all this together. I’ve heard bits and pieces of this theory suggested by others but this is my attempt to create a coherent narrative.
So we can establish that Miquella never grew to adulthood, having his development stunted by some kind of curse. This hardly even needs to be said, but I’ll cite my sources just because.
Remembrance of the Rot Goddess
Miquella and Malenia are both the children of a single god. As such they are both Empyreans, but suffered afflictions from birth. One was cursed with eternal childhood, and the other harbored rot within.
We can also establish with reasonable certainty that it is common for Misbegotten to seek treatment for their condition from Perfumers. We find a bunch of Misbegotten and Perfumers hanging out together along the main road in the ash-covered section of Leyndell. We also have the description of Perfumer Tricia.
Perfumer Tricia Ashes Description
Tricia was once known as a healer who dedicated her efforts to treating Misbegotten, Omen, and all those seen as impure.
When her efforts failed, she was their companion as they died, watching over them to ensure that they could pass peacefully, free of pain.
Trina’s Lily Description
A symbol of faith in St. Trina. Dulls the senses, preventing agitation.
Seems like an herb that calms the senses and eases pain would be helpful for a Perfumer attempting to ease the suffering of the Misbegotten, yes?
Hewg is a Misbegotten. Based off of the location of his hammer in the overworld, we can establish that Hewg lived in Leyndell at some point. Given the way the Golden Order is, he probably wasn’t there of his own free will.
We also know that Hewg once knew a spirit tuner who he feels deeply indebted to.
Hewg Dialogue
When asked about Roderika
               "The girl you brought here... She's crestfallen, and can scarcely swing a blade, but she has a gift for spirit tuning. I saw another one like her, long ago. Their eyes share the same hue.”
After speaking to Roderika again
               “I spoke with the girl. She has a gift for spirit tuning. So I told her everything I know. I'm indebted to a spirit tuner I met long ago. It was all I could do to honor her.”
I’ve heard some people suggest that Marika is the aforementioned spirit tuner. But... Come on. Hewg says that Roderika reminds him of the spirit tuner. Love her or hate her, the only thing Marika has in common with Roderika is her hair color.
Looking at it from Hewg’s perspective, he is clearly terrified of Marika, while his feelings toward Roderika (and possibly the other spirit tuner?) are more protective in nature.
Now, basically everything we know about Saint Trina comes from two item descriptions.
Sword of Saint Trina Description
St. Trina is an enigmatic figure. Some say she is a comely young girl, others are sure he is a boy. The only certainty is that their appearance was as sudden as their disappearance.
St. Trina’s Torch Description
Candle-stand torch that burns with a light-purple flame. The carvings depict St. Trina, but in adult form, somewhat unnervingly.
So we can establish that Trina is a person of ambiguous gender, feminine-looking but could also be a young boy. They weren’t around for very long. And the image of them depicted as an adult seems unnatural and unnerving.
One more thing -- Ranni comes to check out the Player character in Limgrave because she heard that Torrent was in the area.
Ranni Dialogue
               “I'd heard tell of a Tarnished hurtling about atop a spectral steed. And upon looking into the matter, the talk, I surmise, is of thee.”
               “I was entrusted this, for thee. By Torrent's former master. 'Tis a bell for calling forth spirits.”
Torrent’s former master was a spirit tuner.
Putting it all together:
               As a young prince in Leyndell, Miquella sees the suffering of the Misbegotten and wishes to use his skills as a healer to help them. Marika, Radagon, or both tell him that treating Misbegotten is beneath his station and would be an embarrassment to the royal family. He either talks them into letting him go out incognito, or just straight-up sneaks out in disguise.
               Under the guise of St. Trina, a humble Perfumer, Miquella does his best to ease the suffering of the Misbegotten. Specifically, he uses the soporific lilies that he originally developed to help soothe Malenia’s Rot-induced nightmares. During this period, Miquella/Trina treats Hewg, a smith “employed” by the Roundtable Hold. Hewg never learns “Trina’s” true identity, but remembers “her” kindness all the same.
               Miquella eventually makes a clean break with the Golden Order and leaves to establish the Haligtree. He now no longer needs to hide his humanitarian work, so the St. Trina disguise becomes redundant, accounting for St. Trina’s sudden disappearance.
               Some time later, Miquella is kidnapped by Mohg and disappears from the Lands Between. No one seems to have any idea what happened to him. When his half-sister Ranni hears that his spectral steed has been spotted in Limgrave, of course she zooms over to check out the rumor -- for a moment, she likely believed that her long-lost little brother, one of the few remaining members of her family that isn’t either dead, insane, or trying to kill her, had finally resurfaced.
Enter Shadow of the Erdtree, where someone who looks an awful lot like Miquella seems to be riding Torrent through the dream/spirit realm.
I love how Tarnished Archaeologist's latest video touches upon two Elden Ring lore theories that I first read on @dragon-communion's blog: the Empyrean status is connected to the female gender, and Godwyn the Golden might have been Ranni's betrothed.
It makes me so happy that the the Elden Ring lore community as a whole is discussing increasingly bolder and more abstract topics and focusing on more obscure and unique interpretations of the game. It feels like, one year after the release, we are finally getting to the essence of the game together (or should I say togethaaaaa).
While their names are certainly a little funny, Hawkshaw has a great video (below the cut) on Morgott, in which they discuss some ideas regarding the fake identity - in summary, the name doesn't need to be convincing, because nobody really knows who Morgott is.
As for Ranni/Renna, it's entirely possible that Renna was a real person, perhaps Ranni's mentor, or even a previous name of the Carian Queen, Rennala.
Skip to ~15:30 for the discussion around his false name
Hewg says Roderika remind him of someone, "their eyes share the same hue," and because of her spirit tuning ability
The dlc preview shows miquella riding torrent
I saw another person's post about how that implies Miquella was torrent's original owner
And ranni gave us the spirit calling bell and the wolf ashes, courtesy of torrent's former owner
Hewg at the very least has encountered Marika in the past, since she is the one responsible for his imprisonment and in his prayer he begs for her forgiveness
So he could have lived in Leyndell and known other demigods
The haligtree is full of misbegotten so we know Miquella was sympathetic to them
Hewg also still worships Marika, despite being Misbegotten, and being imprisoned at her command (or possibly even directly by her). In addition to the Misbegotten found in Leyndell, this supports the idea that the hatred of Misbegotten is likely recent. I believe it began with the Erdtree, as many of their features resemble aspects of the Crucible, which was abolished and very quickly became a heretical worship.
Miquella being close to Hewg would be a very nice touch, and I hope that this is something we get to explore in the DLC - it would be interesting to learn more about spirit summoning, and also the Misbegotten themselves
Apologies if you're already answered, but why do you think Radahn fought Malenia? It seems pretty easy to assume that Malenia came to Caelid to retrieve Miquella from Mohgwyn palace, but why did Radahn oppose her? Is it just because Malenia came in without knocking or was he trying to protect Mohg, or was there another reason?
I know you've mentioned that Radahn seems aligned with both Godfrey and the primordial Crucible, but does that have anything to do with the Omen? Godfrey seemed to show love for Morgott despite his being an Omen, meaning that Radahn may have been more considerate towards Omen in taking after him, but that feels like a leap. That also assumes that Radahn knew about Mohgwyn Palace underneath Caelid, which feels unlikely
Personally I think Malenia might have just squared up Radahn (and/or vice versa) because he was in her way, to prove herself as a warrior or something, but I'd like to know what you make of it
Again, apologies if this is already known or something
literally who knows! we never get an answer! all we can do is speculate… I don’t think that Radahn and Malenia fought because of Mohg, though. To try to get an idea of their motivations during the Shattering, I looked at references to their movements during the war:
We don’t have much of a timeline of the Shattering, nor a good idea of the war strategies of each participating demigod. What we do have are small scraps of info that tell us where a demigod and their army was at a point in time, and which battles they participated in. Of all the info regarding the Shattering war, Radahn and Malenia crop up the most in sword monuments, dialogue, art, and cinematics, which tells us they were often on the move and participated in the most battles. Regarding Radahn’s movements during the Shattering, we know from Kenneth Haight’s dialogue that Godrick hid from him at Stormveil. There is also the art from the intro cutscene that shows what is certainly meant to be Radahn in combat with Morgott — it’s debatable how literal this art is supposed to be, but I think it’s very likely that it means Radahn attacked Leyndell.
Malenia has a sword monument that marks her southward march through Liurnia, and we know (also from Kenneth) that Godrick challenged her in battle and lost. These snippets tell us that Radahn and Malenia’s war campaigns have been quite mobile, putting them in conflict with other demigods.
Of the rest of the demigods, we know that Ranni was in hiding, and Miquella was probably encased in the Haligtree for the majority of the war. The only battle we know to have involved Rykard is the assault on Volcano Manor by Leyndell’s army, which tells me that he was probably stuck under siege since the beginning of the Shattering. We know Morgott stuck around to defend Leyndell, and Mohg only surfaced to abduct Miquella. Godrick had a few conflicts (with both Radahn and Malenia, and he was probably allied with Godefroy before he got captured after the First Defense of Leyndell) but he obviously lost all of them. Sad! The main takeaway from all of this is that it makes sense why Radahn and Malenia were called the mightiest demigods of the Shattering — they were pretty much the only ones actively going out on successful war campaigns.
Now, what we have to ask ourselves is not only why they fought each other, but why they were fighting in general… I get the impression from their war campaigns that both Radahn and Malenia were simply fighting for control of the Lands Between in order to enact a new order. It’s definitely possible that Malenia marched across the lands because Miquella had been stolen, but I lean more towards the idea that she was out fighting for control on his behalf so he could usher in his new age, and he was swiped from the Haligtree while she was gone (it makes more sense that Mohg would try to steal Miquella while his scary sister was away). We know less about Radahn’s idea of a new order than Miquella’s, but I think it’s safe to say that he saw the Haligtree as a rival. The three Carians seem to more readily collaborate with each other than with their half siblings, and regarding Radahn’s war effort, we know that Rykard was supplying him with weapons (his abductor virgins). Whatever Radahn had planned, it did not go hand in hand with the Haligtree.
So to answer the main question, like you said, I simply think that Radahn and Malenia fought because they stood in each others’ way, and their conflict was inevitable. I also think that fighting Malenia was something Radahn was looking forward to, as she is famously undefeated and would be the perfect test of his strength.
While nothing can be said for certain, I believe that the two combatants may not have had any intent on conquest; Malenia trekked from the far North, through Liurnia, and defeated Godrick taking any land, while Radahn could have easily bested Limgrave's forces and taken Stormveil for himself if he wanted to. While he likely did attack Leyndell, it seems that this is the only location of interest to him, likely due to his reverence of his father.
Instead, I am of the opinion that the two fought at the request of Miquella. There are various threads in the Lands Between which point to a ritual Miquella wished to conduct, involving the Eclipse. However, the ritual never came to be. While this could simple be due to Mohg kidnapping Miquella before he was able to finish the ritual, it is curious that Malenia was (presumably) absent, warring in the South, while this happened...
Radahn was not intentionally in the way of the twins, but in his attempts to save the town of Sellia from a meteor impact, he halted the very stars. Whether or not this prevented the eclipse from happening cannot be said for certain, but it is worth noting that neither of the moons visible in the Lands Between appear to be moving. Without the movement of the moons, the Eclipse would be impossible - perhaps then, the moons were also stopped by Radahn?
If this is the case, Miquella would have required his sister to best Radahn, to restore the natural order of the moons and stars. With theories suggesting that the purpose of the ritual was to remove the influence of the Outer Gods from the twins, it was of some urgency, and could easily justify a war.
It could also have been an attempt to fully resurrect Godwyn, as the Eclipse also makes reference to the Prince of Death, for example the Eclipse Shotel's skill reads "Set the lusterless sun ablaze with the Prince of Death's flames, inflicting the death ailment upon foes". The Mausoleum Guards bear the Eclipse Crest Greatshield, which reads "The eclipsed sun, drained of color, is the protective star of soulless demigods. It aids the mausoleum knights by keeping Destined Death at bay".
As for Godrick, I believe he only ended up in combat against Malenia at his own hands, as Kenneth Haight claims he insulted her. Perhaps he was simply jealous that she is considered an Empyrean and a candidate for the throne, while he is just the runt of the litter, and the weakest of the Demigods.
Most of my Eclipse theories from above come from a video by V-Limit, well worth checking out:
Ok sooo I've just had a MASSIVE realization about Godfrey's children with Marika and I need to share it with the Elden Ring lore community. I have no idea if anyone has already put this theory forward, but as soon as it crossed my mind I knew I had to write it down before I forgot about it.
ELDEN RING SPOILERS BELOW.
I had always kind of assumed that Godwyn the Golden was Godfrey and Marika's firstborn child. This is not stated anywhere though, it was no more than an assumption on my behalf. So I began to wonder... what if the omen twins were actually older than Godwyn? What if they were Marika's first children with Godfrey? The Crucible predates the Golden Age of the Erdtree after all...
Once again, I had always assumed that Morgott and Mohg were thrown into the sewers of Leyndell as soon as they were born, which doesn't really make any sense considering:
- They are both quite well-spoken. They don't act like they were brought up by giant slugs and rats with no contact with the outside world. They are not like the feral omens we fight in the sewers.
- They had to use special shackles in order to keep them down there. As if... they would try to escape. To go back home. Someone had to make sure they never got out.
- They brought at least one doll with them. Newborn babies don't play with dolls, children do.
- Godfrey's words towards Morgott ("It's been a long while...") and the way he holds his son's dead body imply they once knew each other. They once had some kind of relationship. And I'm inclined to believe that Morgott remembers and loves his father too: as SmoughTown points out in his latest video, the magic seal from which Godfrey's golden ghost appears is the exact same Crucible seal that Morgott uses when he "teleports". Morgott created a spectral protector of the Erdtree in the image of his father (I'm about to cry).
So, if Mo & Mo once lived in the surface, why were they shunned? Well, here comes the crazy part. Once upon a time, in the Age of the Crucible, horns, scales, wings and other beastly parts were considered sacred, divine. They were the manifestation of the power of the Tree, from which all life begins, where all life is blended together. With Godfrey being a man from the Age of the Crucible (his knights are the Crucible Knights), it is possible that his first children with Marika, Mo & Mo, were actually revered when they were born.
However, at some point, something motivated Marika to change the dogma. The conquest of the Mountaintops of the Giants gave way to the Golden Age of the Erdtree. All things Crucible were suddenly frown upon. Lord Godfrey and his warriors were exiled from the Lands Between. And the omen twins had to be forsaken.
LUCKILY the royal couple had produced another child, one more in line with the religious ideals of the new age: Godwyn, a perfectly built golden boy, without any Crucible in him. A strikingly handsome prince, with a gorgeous set of long, androginous, golden hair, who we've only seen wearing a beautifully embroidered skirt. His looks and his fashion sense always reminded me of a certain red-headed champion of the Golden Age of the Erdtree...
Has anyone else noticed that the items related to the Prince of Death require both Faith and Intelligence? I'm talking about the Prince of Death's Staff (allegedly made out of a fragment of Godwyn's corpse) and all of the Death sorceries (which said staff boosts). You know which other items also require both of those stats, right? Well, as far as I know, only Rykard's Magma sorceries and the Golden Order incantations need both Fai and Int to be used. And the Sword of Night and Flame, yes, a Carian heirloom hidden in their Manor.
HUH. I wonder what the Carian royal family and Golden Order Fundamentalism have in common... OH, I KNOW. They are both connected to Radagon, the champion who aspired to be complete by dominating both sorceries and incantations.
My point is... What if Godwyn is not Godfrey's? What if he's Radagon's? What if he was Marika's first attempt at having descendants by herself? She was devastated by Godwyn's death because he was her favorite, her perfect golden boy, a personification of the Golden Order and a living proof that she was the One True God.
Now let's have some fun with this theory. We all know about Miquella's obsession with Godwyn ("O brother, lord brother..."). Some have speculated that the statue of the older figure embracing young Miquella and Malenia in Loretta's arena in the Haligtree might be Godwyn, because it doesn't sport Marika/Radagon's signature braid and the asset is apparently flat-chested (according to Vaati's Miquella Lore video).
Did either Miquella or Godwyn know the truth? Was Godwyn particularly protective of the Empyrean twins because they were more than just his half-siblings? I honestly don't know, buy it's not hard to imagine what they felt after their older brother's murder...
I obviously don't have all the answers, but if all of the above was true, it would mean that the whole Golden Lineage is built on a lie, because the firstborn male heir of Godfrey was not only not the firstborn at all, but he was also not Godfrey's! This would be so GRRM it's insane! Even Godrick's pride and his fondness of Lion iconography becomes all the more ridiculous!
Am I going too far with this? Please let me know if I'm losing my mind over this game.
(Oh and link me to any similar theories if you know of any, because I can't be the only one crazy enough to have thought about this).
I really like the idea of Godwyn being a child of Radagon and Marika, it goes a long way to describing this transitive period. It also would be far from the first secret kept by the dual-natured god...
I think it’s worth pointing out that, while it doesn’t detract from your argument, the “Doll” taken by Morgott is most likely not to be played with, as its counterpart, the regular Omen Bairn, is described as a fetish, i.e. an inanimate object of worship, sometimes associated with spirits. I believe it is more likely that this was an heirloom used to remember Morgott, most likely owned by his parents, and recovered later once he rose as the “Last of All Kings”.
I also think the link between the Sword of Night and Flame and the Golden Order is tenuous, as the sword comes from a time where the Astrologers worked alongside the Fire Giants of the mountains. This sword predates the Golden Order, and is likely unrelated to Radagon or Marika. The combined use of Faith and Intelligence is more symbolic of the relationship between the two cultures, and each aspect of the blade is charged by a different source.
I’m unsure how I feel about the Golden Lineage being built upon a lie - it could explain why both of Godwyn's named descendants (Godefroy and Godrick) had to resort to Grafting to try and become more powerful. It also sparks a catalyst for Godfrey’s banishment from the Lands Between, as Marika would not be able to keep this guise up forever.
However, Godwyn himself did seem to possess some powers of gold, as evidenced in the black-gold glimmer of Deathblight. The capacity and origin of these powers aren't explicitly stated, but there are many types of gold in the game; from the Golden Order, the Golden Lineage, Unalloyed Gold, or even the gold of the Erdtree itself.
Perhaps, then, the Golden Lineage truly has nothing to do with Godfrey. If the golden guidance of grace could be plucked from his eyes, then maybe he was no more than a proud warrior, who was elevated to the title of Lord at the whim of Marika. This potentially brings greater sadness to the story of Morgott, who likely envisioned his father as a pure being, and even depicts him in gold.
Whenever the gold guidance of grace is visible to the player, it tells them either the direction of a rune, or the path they must follow to find Marika and Radagon. This appears to be a path laid out by the Greater Will or Two Fingers; note that in Farum Azula, the guidance is never present. Enia tells us at the Roundtable that the Fingers would “never permit” burning the tree, and so it makes sense that this guidance would not want to show us the way.
Perhaps, then, it is the case that the golden grace was only given to Godfrey by Marika, the Two Fingers, or the Greater Will, and was removed when they no longer had need for them. In this case, they realised they no longer needed him as soon as Marika was able to produce a child without him; our perfect golden boy, Godwyn.
Whoever we consider to be “true” inheritors of the Golden Lineage, it appears that there is a significant split between the Omen and non-Omen sides of the family. This split being caused by different parents is something which I believe is perfectly plausible, and hopefully it will be something we continue to explore in Shadow of the Erdtree.
I'm happy to see more people discussing the "curse" of the Omen as it was seen in antiquity; the blessing of the Crucible has seemingly been forgotten in modern times. This is a topic I hope to discuss in some detail soon, from the Crucible and its Knights, to the Omens and Misbegotten, and even the Loathsome Dung Eater.
The first demigods were The Elden Lord Godfrey and his offspring, the golden lineage.
The Gods and Demigods of the Lands Between hold complex relationships, frequently changing loyalties. To better understand these relationships, we can start by looking at the family tree. As a definitive chronology is hard to be certain of, I have instead chosen to format these images in the way which I believe best illustrates the connections.
(Beware - some spoilers and speculation ahead)
Rennala and Radagon
Married here at the Church of Vows at the end of the Second Liurnian War, Rennala and Radagon appear to have brought about three demigods - Radahn, the Starscourge; Ranni, the Witch; and Rykard, the Blasphemous. While Radahn and Ranni have no known offspring, Radahn appears to have sired at least one child after offering himself to the vile Serpent God.Â
There is some speculation about who the mother could be; some think his consort, Tanith, as she is referred to as Rya’s mother. However, this could be purely an adoptive status. Another theory points towards a woman known as Daedicar. This woman is mentioned only in passing, but it is stated that she gave birth to “a myriad of grotesque children“. It is important to note that this is only a rumour, and we have no solid proof here.
Marika and Godfrey
Some time before our own Queen was married to Radagon, the “Eternal” Queen Marika waged war against the Giants of the North, and afterwards granted Godfrey the title of Elden Lord, the first of this rank. Together, they had 3 children - the cursed Omen Twins, Morgott and Mohg; and Godwyn the Golden. These children of Godfrey were the first of the Golden Lineage, which continues to this day. The youngest of this lineage is Godrick, the Grafted, but other ancestors include Godefroy, who seems to have been the first to discover the power of Grafting. It is currently unclear who, if anyone, Godwyn had his children with...
Marika and Radagon
This leads us into perhaps the most contentious branch of this family tree; the dual-identity of Marika/Radagon, and the children they had together. Whether the two were once separate beings, or their children were born of parthenogenesis, it is unclear. However, this is far from where the strangeness ends...
Firstly, the cursed Empyrean twins. Miquella the Unalloyed and Malenia, Goddess of Rot are the most well-known children of the pair. Both were afflicted with curses from birth; Miquella lived eternally as a child, and Malenia was afflicted by the Scarlet Rot. Seeking to end their curses, Miquella worked alongside his father to develop and grow the Golden Order. Once he saw that it held no cure for their afflictions, he instead turned to more drastic measures. Both the Unalloyed Gold and the Haligtree appear to have been attempts to remove the curses from the pair, but these methods went against the orthodox of the Golden Order and the sanctity of the Erdtree.
Malenia does not appear to have given birth willingly or intentionally, but it appears that the blooms of her scarlet rot have given life to at least five children, who do not seem to have inherited (or grown into) the Demigod status: Millicent, Polyanna, Maureen, Amy and Mary. They, along with the Scarlet Rot, are a topic for another day...
Finally, Melina. I am not the first to propose this idea, but I understand that it may be something new for some people, so I will do my best to explain the reasoning here. Firstly, we have some simple statements from Melina herself in which she claims Marika to be her mother:
“Me, I'm searching for my purpose given to me by my mother inside the Erdtree long ago, for the reason that I yet live, burned and bodyless.”
This quote directly references the fact that Melina’s mother is inside the Erdtree, which we know to be occupied only by Marika/Radagon and the Elden Beast. We also know that Melina can recite the “spoken echoes” of Marika, and she also makes reference to her “mother’s designs” later in the game. I believe that this is enough evidence to cement Melina as the daughter of Marika.
Being the daughter of Marika does not prove her to be the daughter of Radagon however, and here we must begin to speculate. The first, and most visually appealing idea, refers to the three types of butterfly found across the Lands Between. These are the Aeonian, Nascent, and Smoldering variants.
The first has a clear connection to Malenia; the name refers to a region blighted by Malenia and her rot, the butterfly appears rotten itself, and it is often found around areas afflicted with rot, but also within the Haligtree.Â
The second may not be immediately obvious, but the connection is solidified when we look to the item description: “This butterfly appears as if it's just emerged from its cocoon for its entire life“. This makes clear reference to Miquella, who put himself in a cocoon to try and advance his cursed life to adulthood.
This leaves only the Smoldering Butterfly. This cannot refer to either of the other gods, but it also does not appear to have any connection to Ranni, the other Empyrean child. The description also doesn’t give us much to go off, though it does mention that the butterfly serves as “kindling”. Various items in the game make reference to a “Kindling Maiden”, and we know that titles like this hold much importance in the world of Elden Ring - enough so that Fromsoft have corrected and altered the descriptions of various items to provide a more cohesive picture. This could, at the end of the day, just be a coincidence - but I think it is unlikely.
The identity of this “Kindling Maiden” is all but confirmed to be Melina, who (from her earlier quote) we know was burned and is now bodyless. This leaves us with three butterflies, each linked to a powerful being in the Lands Between. The fact that two of them are siblings, and all three of them have the same mother, points a finger at the three of them being more closely related that it may first seem.
The other key piece of evidence I will be using to make this case hinges on the identity of the Gloam-Eyed Queen. This woman rose to power, alongside her Godskin cult, during (or possibly just after) the Age of the Erdtree. The Incantation “Black Flame Ritual” declares that she was “an Empyrean chosen by the Fingers“, which strongly implies she was a child of either Marika or Radagon. We know of most of these children, and none of them appear to fit the description; the only daughters are Malenia, who was afflicted by rot, and Ranni, who we can find atop the Divine Tower of Liurnia, slain but not burned. This means that, barring the technicalities of the ambiguous gender of Miquella/St Trina (a topic for another time), there must be at least one daughter of either Marika or Radagon who we do not know about.
There may be some subtle hints throughout the game, but the additional scene granted at the end of the Frenzied Flame ending if Melina is still alive provides a clear view of her second eye; an eye coloured as a gloam sky. If you prefer textual evidence, it is said that it was the Gloam-Eyed Queen who fought Maliketh in an attempt to steal Destined Death, and once it is unleashed, Melina tells you that Destined Death is exactly what she will return to you.
I’m not really sure how to close this off - if you read this, or even just the trees themselves, then I hope you enjoyed. I’m open to new ideas, as we all should be, and so I welcome debate and discussion below. I understand that the idea of Melina being the daughter of Radagon and Marika is not universally accepted, but I believe we have been given a lot of evidence to support it so far.
Next, I plan to discuss the demigods in more detail, including their families and their roles in the wider plot of Elden Ring.Â
