Apologies for taking an extra week to get this to you all-as promised, here is the Pokemon Mystery Dungeon interview featured in the April 6th, 2007 issue of Weekly Famitsu with Tsunekazu Ishihara and Koichi Nakamura!
I'll have another Pokemon Mystery Dungeon interview translation in the works soon so stay tuned 👀
Pokémon x Mystey Dungeon = ∞ Infinite
A new world view thought of by Tsunekazu Ishihara and Koichi Nakamura
Pokémon and Mystery Dungeon... The two completely different worlds were merged to give birth to an unexpected monster of a game. I was able to interview the two key figures about the popularity and secrets of Pokémon Mystery Dungeon, which has exceeded 5.5 million in sales worldwide.
On November 17th, 2005, the Pokémon released Pokémon Mystery Dungeon: Blue Rescue Team (Nintendo DS) and Red Rescue Team (Game Boy Advance)*1, exceeded total world-wide shipments of 5.5 million. The meeting between Pokémon, beloved by children all over the world, and Mystery Dungeon, known for its hard, unforgiving gameplay, caused a powerful chemical reaction, giving birth to a new world known as Pokémon Mystery Dungeon. But how did these two games, which should surely reject each other, manage this miraculous fusion?
I was able to have a long talk with the father of Pokémon, Tsunekazu Ishihara, and Koichi Nakamura from Chunsoft, who created Mystery Dungeon, and hear their secrets. Eventually, our conversation even extended to the Pokémon Mystery Dungeon sequel!
Altering the world to match the core of the game
Pokémon Mystery Dungeon has now exceeded 5.5 million. This really is an incredible number. Have you analyzed the reason for its success?
Ishihara: There is a pattern when it comes to Pokémon titles that are a hit worldwide. The sales ratio for Japan, North America and Europe start at 1:1:1. This time, we were able to replicate this pattern very well with Pokémon Mystery Dungeon. If it starts with this ratio, then the ratio for North America and Europe will increase, as there is a greater tendency for software to continue selling in those places compared to Japan. And so I think this 5.5 million number is a single waypoint.
And how do you view it, Nakamura-san?
Nakamura: I have also been involved in the production of Dragon Quest, but even then, I have never had the experience of selling 5.5 million copies worldwide with a single title before. It is a big number that really shows that people around the world are playing it. So as a creator, I could not be more happier.
For people currently in their 30s and 40s, I think that Dragon Quest would be the first game that showed them the ‘impact of a story.’ But these days, a child’s first game with a story would be Pokémon. The Dragon Quest phenomenon that occurred in Japan is now happening on a worldwide scale with Pokémon. I believe that creating games that ‘appeal to every market’ has been your lifework, Ishihara-san. What is your secret?
Ishihara: North America, Europe, Asia and other regions… I think that every market is incredibly unique and different in terms of what is accepted. With that being said, if we were to remake every game for every market, I doubt we would have been able to circulate this far and wide. For instance, the Pokémon called Pikachu is also Pikachu all over the world. The gameplay elements, the Pokémon trading system, the parts that are the core of the game are all shared. If we tried remaking them for each market, it would have crumbled eventually.
Previously, you have said, ‘There is no point in being fun if it is not fun all over the world.’ I suppose that applies here.
[← Pokémon Mystery Dungeon has sold an astonishing 5.5 million copies worldwide, and continues to sell.]
The Pokémon Company President and Ceo
If Game Freak president Satoshi Tajiri is the ‘birth parent,’ then Ishihara would be the ‘foster parent,’ whose work as producer allowed Pokémon to grow into the title it is now. He is the representative of the Pokémon Company, which single-handedly deals with the multidirectional development of Pokémon on a worldwide scale.
Spike Chunsoft Co., Ltd. Representative director
The creator of Mystery Dungeon and the sound novel, who is a representative of the Japanese gaming industry. His numerous games are created with perfect balance and always receive high praise.
*1 Blue Rescue Team and Red Rescue Team
Released on separate hardware, Nintendo DS and Game Boy Advance. The system of the player becoming the Pokémon and exploring a ‘Mystery Dungeon’ with other Pokémon attracted a lot of attention. The ‘Help a Friend’ system that allowed you to use an internet connection to help friends who fell in the dungeon was also quite innovative.
The ultimate Pokémon games that were released on the Nintendo DS and sold nearly 5 million copies in Japan alone. While they came out on September 28th, 2006, momentum has not slowed down for these monster titles.
A system from Diamond and Pearl that allowed players to trade Pokémon with other players around the country through Wi-Fi, even if they were not registered through friend codes.
Ishihara: I’ve operated with the mindset of, ‘What should I do to have the finished product be something that can be enjoyed all around the world?’ With Diamond and Pearl, *2 you were able to trade Pokémon with other players around the world through the Global Trade Station *3. However, if the content of the software that was circulating in each market was too different, it would not allow for any proper trading. On the other hand, I do think it’s important to enjoy ‘small differences.’ Just like with the first generation Pokémon, where different Pokémon appeared in Red and Green. But if the differences become too big, then it no longer feels like you’re enjoying it with everyone. This feeling is the same as an internet browser. The basic OS is the same, only localized for every territory. But we can use the same browser to see the same sites.
It was then that you encountered Mystery Dungeon. It must have looked quite strange, coming from the world of Pokémon.
Nakamura: Just as he’s said already, Ishihara-san is very particular when it comes to the world of Pokémon. But first and foremost, Ishihara-san is a genuine game fanatic. What I mean to say is, even with such a fixation on the world, he still allows the gameplay to be the priority. He prioritizes the essence of what makes a game fun, and is very tolerant of certain rule changes in regards to the Pokémon world. For instance, you know how the Pokémon talk, or how the player is a Pokémon in Pokémon Mystery Dungeon? This had not been done in the series before, and is a very big change to the rules, but he reacted with incredible flexibility.
These rule changes. Were they ‘acceptable’ with the Pokémon world?
Ishihara: The things that others might say should not happen, are not really that big of a problem for me (laughs). Instead of that, I think it’s much more important to be faithful in conveying the fun of computer games, or rather, the ‘structure of fun.’
Ishihara: In Mystery Dungeon, the map is automatically generated, you can write what you want on scrolls and use them. It is a game with a very traditional computer game structure. Pokémon is the same. After all, the foundation of networking and trading was demonstrated 10 years ago. These two series have proven that ‘Playing with a computer is so fun!’ And if the two were combined, then it would result in a game that is even more fun. And so even if Pikachu starts talking, I don’t mind it at all (laughs). If anything, it’s fun to think of how you can make such an idea ‘acceptable.’
That’s an incredibly flexible way of thinking.
Ishihara: When it comes to great ‘gameplay’ that is along the lines of the traditional, I would very much like to increase the fun through multiplication. Because of that, there was meaning and value to creating something new with Mystery Dungeon and Nakamura-san.
[← Tsunekazu Ishihara and Koichi Nakamura…
With exceptional talent as producers and creatives, the two are treasures within the Japanese game industry. What lies ahead of where they are looking… What new ‘experience’ will it be, that uses that catalyst called ‘gaming’?]
Pokémon and Mystery Dungeon exist as a mechanism to create fun…
Ishihara: I think there is also compatibility. Between games.
Was that something that you had already felt? That Pokémon and Mystery Dungeon were compatible?
Ishihara: Indeed. Also, I just happened to like them personally (Laughs).
I heard that you are a big fan of Mystery Dungeon.
Ishihara: After all, I consider myself a Mystery Dungeon professional (Laughs).
Everyone (Bursts into laughter)
Nakamura-san, do you also feel the same way as Ishihara-san?
Nakamura: When the possibility was first brought up to me, I did feel that they were greatly suited for each other, as Pokémon has a lot of characters, a lot of tools and different kinds of skills. But on the other hand, Mystery Dungeon has a high difficulty level, and a game system that is quite hands-off with the player. Would it really be able to fuse with a game that is beloved by children…? I did have some doubts.
Nakamura: But judging by the surveys gathered from people around the world who have played the game, while many had the opinion that it was ‘difficult,’ they were all able to finish it. I’ve always believed that the ideal form of a game is when you have a person who thinks they are the only one in their class who can beat it, but actually everyone can… It is that balance. And I think that with Pokémon Mystery Dungeon, we were able to get incredibly close to achieving that balance.
It seems like a difficult adjustment to make…
Nakamura: In Japan, there might be certain immunity or a foundation for playing, due to Torneko and Shiren. But they don’t have those in other countries, so I was anxious about whether it would be well-received or not. But the results were… Well, that’s the power of Pokémon for you (Laughs).
They were a good match in the end.
Nakamura: Looking back, I really do think it was a wonderful encounter.
The sequel is also in development!
After the game has become such a worldwide hit, I cannot help but ask about the next game…
Ishihara: We’ve actually been working on the next game for quite some time. It will be for Nintendo DS hardware.
Ohh! Previously, you released one game for DS and Advance respectively. How will it be this time?
Ohhh! When did development begin?
Nakamura: A very long time ago (Laughs).
Ishihara: We are developing it with the hope of releasing it in 2007.
That is not very far away!
Ishihara: Yes. So we wouldn’t finish it in time if we had just started now, right? (Laughs)
Well, that is what Ishihara-san says, but how are things at your place, Nakamura-san…?
Nakamura: The situation is quite hectic, of course (Awkward laugh).
Did you always plan to make sequels?
Ishihara: No. It would be difficult to do until you felt confident in the first game. A big part of it was that the reception abroad was better than expected.
What was the reason you chose to release both games on the DS?
Ishihara: When the previous game first went on sale, it was the perfect time, as the leading platform was switching from the Game Boy Advance to the DS. But the situation has changed completely in just one year. When deciding to release two different types, we had to discuss which hardware to choose, and there were even some suggestions of ‘Why not DS and Wii?’ (Laughs). But considering the current market and development environment, we felt it would be best to have both released and played on the DS.
How was it as a creator? Releasing only on the DS.
[Check ‘Pokémon Mystery Dungeon’ anime to be streamed!
Pokémon Mystery Dungeon became an anime in North America, and recorded incredibly high viewership. Since Pokémon Mystery Dungeon plays differently from previous Pokémon, and it takes place in a new setting where the Pokémon can talk, Ishihara explained that it was made with the intent of being an ‘orientation.’
In fact, this anime is to be released in Japan as well. It will commemorate the release of the new sequel mentioned in this interview, and be available on March 23. The episodes will be streamed exclusively on Yahoo!. Let’s enjoy the unique world of the Pokémon Mystery Dungeon series through the anime.
↑ You are guaranteed to be able to see a new side to these Pokémon. Fans should not miss it!]
You can play in this many new ways
Nakamura: With the previous games, we were forced to create them in a way that accommodated the inferior capabilities of the Advance. But since both will be on the DS this time, we can incorporate ideas involving the dual screens as much as we wish.
It sounds like there will be a lot of new elements.
Nakamura: That’s right. In particular, as we can create it on the basis of there being Wi-Fi support, aside from the ‘Help a Friend’ system from the previous game, we are putting even more effort into having that feeling of ‘playing with everyone.’
Specifically, what kinds of elements are being added?
Nakamura: I can’t say (Awkward laugh).
Will Pokémon from Diamond and Pearl be included?
Ishihara: Of course, they will be. Not only that, as simply being put in without a solid role would be meaningless. So please look forward to that. Also, one thing that I can say is in regards to the question of ‘releasing two types?’ If there are two dungeons, then the two games will be slightly different… Well, I am still discussing various things with Nakamura-san (Laughs).
Nakamura: For instance. This is an example, alright? Even if it’s the same dungeon, if the items you pick up are different, then it would affect the way you finish the game, or what strategies you use. …Well, that is just an example (Laughs).
It would be a very big difference for Mystery Dungeon!
Ishihara: Originally, in Pokémon games, the gap between Pokémon was a gap in playing. In other words, it dictated the direction of the game. In Mystery Dungeon, the acquiring of items has been added to that. I think that things like that will become the great difference between the two sequels.
With the sequel, as far as you are able to say at this time, can you tell us what point you want players to focus on the most?
Nakamura: For the previous games, we received a lot of feedback about how the scenarios and story parts were incredibly interesting. And so we are consciously trying to create a game with a substantial story that surpasses the previous games and be a more enjoyable adventure. An even longer story is waiting for you.
Ishihara: In regards to the amount of story, there were many different opinions. We thought that we had incorporated a great amount of it, but there were still people who said there ‘wasn’t enough.’ And so we thought, ‘what wasn’t there enough of…’
In the previous game, after you see the ending and closing credits, quite a lot of elements are unlocked. But expanding on things like controls and character selection may have made the partner relationship between the player and the Pokémon feel a little more distant. That was the conclusion I reached after analyzing it. This time, we mean to create the story while taking that into account.
Always be bold towards things that seem traditional!
Lastly, in regards to future developments. It seems like Pokémon will continue to develop in many different directions.
Ishihara: There are plenty of ideas when it comes to simply expanding the license. However, when you find themes or mechanisms that make you wish to collaborate in some form, like Mystery Dungeon, it is very helpful. In fact, there is no meaning in making something new without that relationship. Once you realize you can combine two things to create a new way to play, as we did with this game, it makes you want to try out many other different things too. When it comes to things that are considered traditional with video games, I would like to be bold at all times.
Nakamura-san. Mystery Dungeon turned out to be an incredibly good game. Has this experience made you want to try out anything in the future?
Nakamura: The DS has complete network capabilities now, so I believe that it’s time to start focusing on that. With Wi-Fi taken into consideration, I think some interesting things could be done with Mystery Dungeon. I have all kinds of ideas.
Ishihara: There is something that both Pokémon fans and Mystery Dungeon fans can look forward to the most this year, and that is these two games. Whether it's the gameplay or the expanding world of Pokémon, I hope that they are looking forward to it.
Nakamura: I feel like I’m being pressured (Laughs). As Ishihara-san said, we will create something that won’t disappoint fans, so please look forward to it.
The moment that I saw Tsunekazu Ishihara and Koichi Nakamura sitting together, I felt goosebumps all over my body. And then the two spoke directly of the worldwide hit, Pokémon Mystery Dungeon. I could not help but think about how it was such a privilege, and somewhat forgot about my work.
Pokémon Mystery Dungeon was created from this meeting between the two, and while listening to them, I nodded with an ‘I see,’ many times. At a glance, the two worlds might seem to oppose each other, but with Ishihara’s flexible stance, and the technical ability of Chunsoft led by Nakamura, I think that the creation of a balanced game that was a hit on a worldwide scale was not so much ‘miraculous,’ but ‘inevitable.’ I have great expectations for the sequel, which is said to be released in 2007. Geniuses don’t stop. (O)
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