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I think it would've really interesting for the Red Dwarf Novelverse if the Alternative Lister acted more like a corrupt, authoritarian CEO than a generic serial killer. It would've made for a nicely creepy contrast to the regular Lister.
I’m reading “Johnny Quick” by Barry Lyga. Again, no spoilers but there is something interesting. So Barry is going through multiverse and see glimpses of earths. Anyone want to guess what was that? I guessed only one so… It should be interesting. Lyga probably took these images from DC comics. I will count them. First he saw Supergirl (with an ad for her book :) ) and then:1) “Then that image swept aside and replace with a boy with long blond hair wrestling with what appeared to be a bipedal lion”. 2) “Now he beheld a woman in a purple tunic and tiara, gesturing toward a man whose face was dark and scarred". 3) “Then he saw a boy shouting to the sky as thunder clapped.” 4) “A man with a glowing green ring on his hand.” 5) “A rabbit in a cape and unitard.” 6) “A man and woman smaller than mice, wearing red capes, running along what looked like the turret of an old World War II-era tank.” 7) “A gleaming silver building floating in the air”. Well it’s pretty obvious that 4 is The Green Lantern but that’s it for me. Who will help to guess others?
1 is Kamandi the Last Boy on Earth, 3 is Captain Marvel , 5 is Captain Carrot and 6 is the Golden Age Doll Man and Doll Girl.
back to earth i
CRAIG CHARLES WAS IN A GHOST-HUNTING MOCKUMENTARY
e: tw- mentions of suicide, psychiatric institutions, child murder/abuse/violence/sexual abuse; food; tiny amounts of blood
There’s a sequel to Ghostwatch in the form of a short story called ‘31/10’. The writer, Stephen Volk has a free PDF of it on his website. Sadly, the ‘31/10’ story doesn’t mention if Craig was alright or not. Pondering about this resulted a Ghostwatch/Red Dwarf RPF idea that the real reason why there wasn’t a Red Dwarf movie was because Mr. Pipes terrorized the cast and crew. It also explains why it takes ten years to make a new series because they had to recover from the trauma of being attacked by a ghost.
write it.
I'm not sure if I can do the fic idea justice XD, but if anybody wants to use the idea themselves, they're free to do so. Just don't forget to credit me.
CRAIG CHARLES WAS IN A GHOST-HUNTING MOCKUMENTARY
e: tw- mentions of suicide, psychiatric institutions, child murder/abuse/violence/sexual abuse; food; tiny amounts of blood
There's a sequel to Ghostwatch in the form of a short story called '31/10'. The writer, Stephen Volk has a free PDF of it on his website. Sadly, the '31/10' story doesn't mention if Craig was alright or not. Pondering about this resulted a Ghostwatch/Red Dwarf RPF idea that the real reason why there wasn't a Red Dwarf movie was because Mr. Pipes terrorized the cast and crew. It also explains why it takes ten years to make a new series because they had to recover from the trauma of being attacked by a ghost.
I'm surprised that there aren't Fictional Expies based on the Red Dwarf Crew. There are plenty of Fictional Expies of Doctor Who, Star Trek and Star Wars, but not the Dwarfers.
I had to go to TVTropes to try to understand what the f it is and I still didn't.
Don't worry about it. There are some tropes I have a bit of a hard time understanding. XD
I would like to understand, but they don't explain anything, just list them like we all should know already. is there an explanation?
An expy is a character that is a copy based on a preexisting character. Yogi Bear was based on Ed Norton, a character from 'The Honeymooners' played by Art Carney and Mickey Mouse was based on Felix the Cat.
Like, authors based or people THINK they're similar? bc there is a difference. It's close to what I do with parallel doubles, I have so many lists of fictional characters that go as parallel doubles of each other. I called them hypostases tho then I found out the term is very different from what I mean :)
So I just want to know what exactly is this thing and how much it's similar to what I am doing.
What the authors based on. I'm pretty bad at explaining things sometimes. XD
The Red Dwarf Episode 'Trojan' really missed a hilarious opportunity to show that while Howard is more successful than Arnold, it isn't all that's cracked up to be. With his crew mutinying because he's such a tyrannical smeg-head. It would also have been nice to acknowledge that Arnold does have good reasons to hate his brother, since Howard did bully him in their childhood years and didn't even apologize for that.
Indeed. They kinda whitewashed Howard despite him not just being a bully as a child which I can forgive, children are never responsible, their parents were at fault then, but staying a bully as an adult.
While Arnold does need to get rid of his maladaptive behaviors in order to find true happiness, Trojan felt a little bit like it was implying that he deserved to be abused as a child. Which I find irritating as all get out. Not even smeg heads deserve childhood abuse.
A lot of adults do regret being childhood bullies, so it's a lot more forgivable. Kids definitely haven't developed the skills to realize when they're emotionally hurting someone. So it's understandable.
No child deserves to be abused, even child who behaves badly, children are not responsible for that, adults are responsible for teaching them. We all start from scratch, all the shit that goes wrong with us goes wrong bc we absorb wrong things. But as we become adults we are starting being responsible for unlearning bad things and not passing them further on next generation.
I was bullied in school and straight up abused by my older brother. Things like these are a lot to process and it takes time to unlearn all the coping mechanisms. I'm 50 and still consider myself not there.
I didn't rewatch Trojan I think since I watched it first time, I cannot say in detail what they did wrong but me not wanting to rewatch it I guess tells it all. I do not have any of Rimmers in Dip, I only have Arn's biological father... ish. Everyone else can smeg off.
I have to admit that I much prefer the deleted Rimmerworld scene where it turns out that even Rimmer's brothers didn't escape their psychological trauma. Although I think it would be way more interesting if they were forced to retire in disgrace because the 'Win At All Cost' mentality they learned from their father resulted in horrific scandals.
That would be best, yes.
I would've loved it if there was a Trojan AU where the Dwarfers meet up with Howard and Arnold finds out what his brother did to lose his officer's rank. It would horrify Rimmer and show him that trying to become a Space Corps Officer to please your parents isn't worth it.
I'm surprised that there aren't Fictional Expies based on the Red Dwarf Crew. There are plenty of Fictional Expies of Doctor Who, Star Trek and Star Wars, but not the Dwarfers.
I had to go to TVTropes to try to understand what the f it is and I still didn't.
Don't worry about it. There are some tropes I have a bit of a hard time understanding. XD
I would like to understand, but they don't explain anything, just list them like we all should know already. is there an explanation?
An expy is a character that is a copy based on a preexisting character. Yogi Bear was based on Ed Norton, a character from 'The Honeymooners' played by Art Carney and Mickey Mouse was based on Felix the Cat.
The Red Dwarf Episode 'Trojan' really missed a hilarious opportunity to show that while Howard is more successful than Arnold, it isn't all that's cracked up to be. With his crew mutinying because he's such a tyrannical smeg-head. It would also have been nice to acknowledge that Arnold does have good reasons to hate his brother, since Howard did bully him in their childhood years and didn't even apologize for that.
Indeed. They kinda whitewashed Howard despite him not just being a bully as a child which I can forgive, children are never responsible, their parents were at fault then, but staying a bully as an adult.
While Arnold does need to get rid of his maladaptive behaviors in order to find true happiness, Trojan felt a little bit like it was implying that he deserved to be abused as a child. Which I find irritating as all get out. Not even smeg heads deserve childhood abuse.
A lot of adults do regret being childhood bullies, so it's a lot more forgivable. Kids definitely haven't developed the skills to realize when they're emotionally hurting someone. So it's understandable.
No child deserves to be abused, even child who behaves badly, children are not responsible for that, adults are responsible for teaching them. We all start from scratch, all the shit that goes wrong with us goes wrong bc we absorb wrong things. But as we become adults we are starting being responsible for unlearning bad things and not passing them further on next generation.
I was bullied in school and straight up abused by my older brother. Things like these are a lot to process and it takes time to unlearn all the coping mechanisms. I'm 50 and still consider myself not there.
I didn't rewatch Trojan I think since I watched it first time, I cannot say in detail what they did wrong but me not wanting to rewatch it I guess tells it all. I do not have any of Rimmers in Dip, I only have Arn's biological father... ish. Everyone else can smeg off.
I have to admit that I much prefer the deleted Rimmerworld scene where it turns out that even Rimmer's brothers didn't escape their psychological trauma. Although I think it would be way more interesting if they were forced to retire in disgrace because the 'Win At All Cost' mentality they learned from their father resulted in horrific scandals.
I'm surprised that there aren't Fictional Expies based on the Red Dwarf Crew. There are plenty of Fictional Expies of Doctor Who, Star Trek and Star Wars, but not the Dwarfers.
I had to go to TVTropes to try to understand what the f it is and I still didn't.
Don't worry about it. There are some tropes I have a bit of a hard time understanding. XD
While Doug Naylor did some problematic jokes in Season 8, I'm not sure Rob Grant is any more sensitive about sexual assault. Considering that the Uncle Frank story from 'The Last Day' and Lister revealing how old he was when he lost his virginity in 'Marooned' were both written while they were still working together.
Have you read any of the DCU Comics? I've watched a lot of Season One and Two of the Flash and a little of Season Three. I did see part of the JSA's first appearance on Legends of Tomorrow before I turned it off because the writers' take on the Golden Age Justice Society ticked me off. XD
Some but not many, there's too many so I just go through wikia or smth if I need smth for Dip. I watched all Arrowverse until last seasons, last seasons I just checked out, even Legends of Tomorrow bc 1) writing became unbearable, and 2) I already decided to make a hard divergence in all Arrowverse in Dip (including "Lucifer" which I consider Arrowverse too) so keep watching would be unproductive for me. I still am writing this part for what, 10 years? So... it didn't help. Recently I decided to rewatch everything and watch what I didn't, but dropped, it eats so much time. I need to get back to it.
What was your beef with Golden Age JSA? Legends were honestly the best of them in representation, so I was hanging on for my dear life but even they went sideways, but as you didn't watch till then can't say what.
They came across as a little too much as jerkasses for my liking. I've read some of the original Golden Age comics featuring them, so it colors my view on their adapations. Still, despite my feelings, it did suck when the show killed most of them off. Patrick Adams should've been given more to do.
It was like one of two episodes, what should they have to do, make them main cast? I didn't take offense on that. I was appreciative though about Obsidian gay story, how he was suspended from the team for his homosexuality but that's what saved him lmao, fuck those assholes. But Legends making whole arc "freak circuses are actually good bc they give normal people tolerance to minorities" is what actually offended me in later season.
Good point. The JSA shouldn't hijack the Legends from their own show. Luckily, there are other media portrayals of the Justice Society that I've enjoyed. They were really cool in the Black Adam Movie. I love the idea of the Fonz playing Al Pratt. What happened to Todd sucked, but at least there was a silver lining to his misfortune as he got to live a long life.
Have you read any of the DCU Comics? I've watched a lot of Season One and Two of the Flash and a little of Season Three. I did see part of the JSA's first appearance on Legends of Tomorrow before I turned it off because the writers' take on the Golden Age Justice Society ticked me off. XD
Some but not many, there's too many so I just go through wikia or smth if I need smth for Dip. I watched all Arrowverse until last seasons, last seasons I just checked out, even Legends of Tomorrow bc 1) writing became unbearable, and 2) I already decided to make a hard divergence in all Arrowverse in Dip (including "Lucifer" which I consider Arrowverse too) so keep watching would be unproductive for me. I still am writing this part for what, 10 years? So... it didn't help. Recently I decided to rewatch everything and watch what I didn't, but dropped, it eats so much time. I need to get back to it.
What was your beef with Golden Age JSA? Legends were honestly the best of them in representation, so I was hanging on for my dear life but even they went sideways, but as you didn't watch till then can't say what.
They came across as a little too much as jerkasses for my liking. I've read some of the original Golden Age comics featuring them, so it colors my view on their adapations. Still, despite my feelings, it did suck when the show killed most of them off. Patrick Adams should've been given more to do.
who saw 8th season lately? Todhunter wasn’t mentioned as I see in scripts but do we see first officer at all whomever them would be?
Also not a question but a discussion. How do you reckon nanobots resurrected the crew? I still don’t actually understand what happened there even though I’ve read Prelude to Nanarchy. So I can be deadly wrong but I would say the most sure way has to be DNA base plus personality discs. And what do you think happened to Dave himself and Kris? Why there were no nano versions of them?
I checked the credits on IMDB and no, although we see several officers none are credited as “First Officer” and there’s no-one who obviously fulfils the role of Hollister’s second-in-command.
Of course, we don’t actually KNOW that Todhunter is Hollister’s second-in-command but it’s the obvious assumption to make from George McIntyre’s welcome back party where he’s the only other person at the top table apart from McIntyre and Hollister. He does seem rather young to have risen so high in the ranks so quickly, but it’s very useful for fics. ;)
As for how the nanobots resurrected the crew, I think you’re right about DNA and personality discs. As with many other things in Series VIII, it’s probably best not to think too hard about it. For example, why didn’t they do this as soon as Kryten became a permanent member of the team? :p
It does make more sense not to have nano versions of Lister and KK because the nanobots knew that there were already living versions of them.
Even if I think hard I don’t understand nano plot. For nanobots they have too sophisticated intelligence. One thing to repair things and other to recreate the whole crew, load them with their memories (how? they grew something with wich they were taking personality discs? why no one noticed? they couldn’t’ve done them all at once) and even exclude someone in the process. All this while overdoing things and then shrinking it in normal size. The whole shenanigan was the acid trip from wonderland. I’m not telling they couldn’t do it but I’m telling they’re too damn good for just a plot device. They should be at least an episode’s villain. Todhunter is so young for a first officer because he knew that Hollister is Dennis the donut boy :) Everybody on that ship is a fraud…
The JMC sent Todhunter as a First Officer to keep an eye on Dennis the Donut Boy and prevent any potential catastrophes from happening. All it would take is a single scandal and the JMC would go down quicker than a lead balloon. As Season One of Red Dwarf showed, poor Todhunter utterly failed in his Secret Mission. XD
In my convoluted Dip plot Dennis the Donut Boy is Rimmer’s dad Dennis Dungo The Gardener - nanobots lost actual captain’s personality disk and replaced it with the one that was in The Wild Fire as it was at the Red Dwarf at the time. One of Aces before ours found out about his biological dad and somehow procured his personality disk that since then was in Wild Fire’s glove compartment.
Tod Hunter in the same Dip was one of Arnolds from universe he looks slightly different, whose task was to care for all Rimmers so they would eventually become last holograms and all, same as some Listers and Kochanskis care for Listers to become last humans (that’s the couple we see in the future that is newly married). It’s not in the plot YET, in next part, but that’s the idea. That explains why Tod isn’t on nanobot version of the crew - he never left trace of himself on RD as he knew what will happen and never wanted to have a nanoversion of himself.
NanoKochanski in Dip skedaddled with replaced Rimmer (in Dip our Ace replaced nanoRimmer), that’s all over the plot. I still don’t know why Dave wasn’t resurrected though.
If Todhunter is a slightly different Arnold Rimmer from another dimension, then it puts his scenes with the TV Canon Series Lister and Rimmer in the Episode 'The End' in a weirdly hilarious light.
You've heard of the World of Darkness? Neat. I've always been a big fan of it. With Vampire, Wraith and Demon being my favorite games. But man oh man, the hateboner some of the writers have for the supernatural beings gets so annoying.
I didn't read anything official, and never played TTRPG or the VTM game myself, I just watch actual plays. I have a beef with Mage's magic system and still bitter they dropped some elements of VTM's character design but whatever. I don't know about official novels or what you mean by that. I know they have official timeline but I don't really care abt it, I kinda don't like the idea that the TTRPG has it. One thing is a history of the setting, another claiming that one game is official unlike everyone else's, that I never liked in WOD, so I just ignore it. If they would give it like any other actual game, but they claim that's exactly what happened in WOD and everyone else's games should acknowledge it pisses me off. It's a game, their game is not more official than anyone else's, that's the point of TTRPG, fuck canon.
World of Darkness is really bad at forcing you to play the game as they intended it to be. You want to play a game where vampires aren't doomed to degrade into evil or one where the rest of the Changing Breeds share the spotlight with the Werewolves? Then you're a filthy heretic!
Yeah, I don't like that. It obviously affects actual games too but that's why I do not want to know "the canon", so I have at least perceive what's happening in actual play as their own decisions. So yeah I don't wanna know.
I came up with my own NobleDark version of the World of Darkness so my favorite Canon Characters like Jan Pieterzoon, Theo Bell and Jonas Albrecht actually get a chance to be genuine good guys.
