Obi-Wan: “Did you know that Anakin is still alive?”
Bail: “Skywalker? No way! There’s no way that Anakin Skywalker lived for twenty years without getting on at least half of the galaxy’s nerves or being the most dramatic man in the room or without fighting a ten-year-old or oh my heavens he’s Darth Vader, isn’t he?”
So how are you going to defend Alya on not figuring out the lucky charm? knowing you, you will never accept Alya made a mistake
Well this is rude. Yeah, she didn't manage to figure out the Lucky Charm. Which generally leads to bad outcomes, but it happens. Alya's not accustomed to thinking like a Ladybug holder, and even Marinette, who's unusually good at figuring out Lucky Charms, still flubs them occasionally.
Aaaand, notably, in the very next episode, Marinette doesn't manage to figure out the Lucky Charm she got. It happens. It generally leads to bad outcomes when it happens, but even a really experienced Ladybug Holder like Marinette can't always figure it out.
Also, I can not stop thinking about how.these two last Lucky Charm fumbles were foreshadowed during Werepapas. With no longer being limited to one power usage per transformation, Marinette just brute forced her Lucky Charms fighting Ringmaster, instead of analysing the object received and planning accordingly (its pretty much implied that: 1) The Lucky Charms are not chosen by Tikki but by GIMMI, who is The Very Universe, and 2) The Lucky Charms during that fight were meant to tell Ladybug to call for back-up)
If worried about something, Marinette is having trouble in using the Lucky Charms.
Alya: I was right earlier, wasn't I? Gabriel was Monarch?
Marinette: I never lied to you.
Alya: Technically, you didn't. You just kept the truth from me and manipulated me so you wouldn't have to answer my questions. Wow, thanks, Marinette, so this is what being BFFs is like?
Marinette: I didn't want to burden you will all my secrets.
Alya: It's not just me. You lie to Adrien too, every day.
Marinette: If I tell him the truth, it'll break his heart.
Alya: You don' get to decide for other people what's good for them.
Marinette: I'm so sorry. I don't know how else to do it. I- I just feel stuck, now.
Alya: I won't tell Adrien the truth. YOU'RE the one who should do it. But don't count on me to play your lying game. I'm still your stand-in. But if you want to stay my best friend, don't ever lie to me again.
I really like that Alya didn't just let the Lie slide, and that she identified that Marinette manipulated her to get out of her questions. Marinette worded her responses to not be outright denials, but to also make it sound like they were. And when that didn't work, she changed the subject, deflecting to freaking out about the intrusion into her home a few days ago and to going through with a plan that she'd come up with a while ago, but she deemed too risky before. I dunno whether Marinette realized that she was steering away from Alya's questions with her breakdown, but that was clearly what was happening. It's been a bit since the Butterfly Holder intruded into her home, so that wasn't such an urgent matter to contend with that it couldn't have waited.
And I'm really glad that Alya got to stay angry, while still being calm, and laid down a firm boundary. Marinette better not cross it. She's on shaky ground as it is.
The only thing I have to add is: to react with such anger, is because ALYA REALLY DOES LOVE MARINETTE VERY MUCH. Of course she will be that angry! At this point, Marinette KNOWS how much Alya hates being lying for her own sake. Sadnansi left that pretty clear.
Alya is giving Marinette the chance to clear her own mess. Because, as much as I love Marinette, this mess is her own. She does not own ANYTHING to Gabriel. But her love of Adrien blinds her. The series is not subtle in establishing Marinette and Gabriel as foils, and right now, Marinette is acting a lot like Gabriel, AND SHE KNOWS IT. Thats why her reflection spoke to her with Gabriel's voice during her breakdown while trying to draw that portrait of Gabriel.
So we have confirmation that Lila can shapeshift, even while an akuma's still active. Which makes it even more likely that she's Aglae, though it hasn't been confirmed.
I think that a REAL Aglae does exist. Her appearance is just one of many at Lila's disposal.
O.k. Hear me out. Remember how in Wreckless Driver, during her therapy session, Aglae told to Dr. Psiquat (and us, the audience) how she was akumatized into a butterfly-themed supervillain that trapped people in cocoons?
Well, what if those cocoons had and ulterior motive? or, more exactly, a hidden function unknown by Aglae at that moment?
Think about it. The concept the Butterfly embodies is Transmition. As in sending something (powers via a kamiko/akuma) from Point A (The Butterfly Holder) to Point B (the victim) What if, during the weeks between the events of the London Special and the beginning of the new school semester, Lila was able to break her limiter (possibly with the help of whoever arrived from that portal shown at the end of season 5) to now allow her victims to transmit BACK to her something more that their thoughts?
More specifically, what if the akumatization of Aglae (and maybe the rest of this season's victims) had the hidden purpose to obtain "skins" for Lila to take? This could give the new akumatization sequence, with Chrysalis closing her fist over her victim, a whole new meaning.
Dammit Marinette, stop saying you "don't have a choice" about lying! Or telling the truth! Or whatever! Yes, you very clearly DO have a choice!
Also she'd better not break up with Adrien here. Doing it without letting him know why, while still lying to him, isn't gonna help him at all, it's just gonna hurt him. I'm not against them breaking up, necessarily, but not like this.
So we can all agree that Alya's line of "You don't get to decide for others what's good for them." Is 100% based on her parents not telling her that Nora is actually her half-sister for the majority of her life?
Alya: I was right earlier, wasn't I? Gabriel was Monarch.
Marinette: I never lied to you.
Alya: Technically, you didn't. You just kept the truth from me and manipulated me so you wouldn't have to answer my questions. Wow, thanks Marinette. So this is what being BFFs is like?
The show saved me the trouble of needing to argue that Marinette was manipulative in Nemesis by outright saying that she manipulated Alya to avoid answering her questions. Nice!
This means that I can skip the tedious part of making my case that Marinette isn't a perfect innocent angel and go straight to the fun part of breaking down exactly how she tried to manipulate Alya and why those tactics work.
Just to get this out of the way: no, I'm not accusing Marinette of being some heartless manipulative mastermind. Most manipulation is learned intuitively, by people noticing what works and what doesn't work in order to get them what they want.
Marinette knows those things can make Alya stop asking questions that she doesn't want to answer, so she does them. How much she actually understands what it is she's doing is debatable. She may be thinking "I can't let Alya know no matter what" and so is willing to resort to tactics she knows are manipulative, or she may be running purely on instinct without thinking too much about why those tactics work.
So lets get into it:
Alya: I know you have a secret, I know it's about Adrien and I know you don't want to tell me about it.
(...)
*Alya shows Marinette the mirage of Monarch detransforming into Gabriel Agreste*
Marinette: Why would I have done that? Why keep it a secret that Gabriel Agreste was Monarch?
Marinette's first reaction to being confronted with the accusation of lying is to double down and defend the lie by trying to poke holes in Alya's story.
This, by itself, isn't manipulation. However, it does show us where Marinette's head is at. She doesn't want Alya knowing about the lie, so she keeps trying to cover it up even after she got caught. She knows Alya isn't certain yet, that the guess she's making may be educated, but it's still a guess.
So she tries to exploit that uncertainty, sow even more doubt that this story is right. If Alya can't give a motivation or gives a wrong motivation, that would allow Marinette to point out how the story doesn't make sense and spin the entire thing as being wrong and illogical.
I would classify this as more of a debate tactic than a manipulation tactic. She's attacking the idea itself and trying to debunk it.
Unfortunately for Marinette, it doesn't work because Alya gets the motivation right.
Alya: To protect Adrien.
So Marinette switches to another tactic.
Marinette: You really think I could lie to my boyfriend like that? And to my BFF? And to the whole world?
She sounds and looks angry when she says that, which is an expression she didn't have when asking why she would've lied about Monarch. Obviously YMMV on the exact nuances of the tone (I would classify it as a mix of offended and indignant), but it's undeniably the tone of someone unjustly accused of something horrible.
And she is accused of something horrible. Alya's accusations are serious. Marinette is aware that lying about Gabriel being Monarch to Adrien, Alya and the entire world is a bad thing. So for Alya to imply such a thing about her best friend? To even consider that Marinette is such a horrible person who would be willing to do any of it?
Try to imagine for a moment accusing someone you're really close and love of being a pedophile. Not a fun experience, right? Leaving aside how half this site is so conflict avoidant that even telling someone a valid criticism to their face is something they can't do, accusing someone you love of something bad isn't easy for the accuser.
For one, there's the entire aspect of trying to reconcile the the person you love doing something horrible, which is complex and a big reason (although far from the only one) why it's unfortunately common for loved ones of abusers (who aren't being abused) to not believe victims.
But more importantly in our case, what if you're wrong? What does it say about you that you thought so lowly about the person that you were willing to consider that they could do something so horrible? Those are not the kind of things you're supposed to think about the people you care about. Many would consider it justified to reconsider whether you should actually be friends with someone who accuses you of something like that.
This is what Marinette is banking on. If Marinette was innocent, then Alya's accusations are an insulting. Alya knows Marinette, she's her best friend. Hell, she knows Marinette is a superhero! She should know better than to think that Marinette is capable of such a thing.
(If you doubt that this is the train of thought which is expected in such a situation, I recommend you go and check the reactions to Heartfixer. Quite a few people were pissed at Adrien for believing his girlfriend was cheating on him when he saw it with his own eyes. Most of their arguments boiled down to "Adrien knows Marinette and how much she loves him, he should've known better than to suspect she would be capable of such a thing.")
By acting indignant and offended, Marinette is implicitly making Alya to be the bad guy in this situation. Alya is the one doing something wrong here by thinking about Marinette so badly. She's shifting the blame, so that now Alya has to defend her actions (accusing Marinette) rather than Marinette having to defend her actions (gaslighting her boyfriend and lying to everyone).
And once Alya has to defend her action, she's implicitly accepting the premise that she's doing something wrong that needs defending in the first place. That would allow Marinette to keep pressing Alya about her being the bad guy for accusing Marinette, which would serve two purposes: 1) It derails the discussion away from Marinette's misdeed 2) If Alya is the bad guy for accusing Marinette, they could "resolve" the conflict by coming to a compromise where Marinette graciously forgives Alya for accusing her so long as Alya doesn't do it again.
This is a full-on manipulation tactic. Marinette isn't attacking the idea itself, she's exploiting human feelings and tendencies (such as the desire to not feel like the bad guy) in order to get Alya to drop the topic without Marinette ever needing to admit to anything. She's unfairly placing blame on Alya when all Alya did was try to hold her accountable. She isn't trying to defend herself, she's trying to make Alya feel bad enough that she stops asking questions.
This tactic ends up not working because instead of turning defensive, Alya is fully willing to own up to her opinion of Marinette.
Alya: Do I think Marinette Dupain-Cheng would do anything in order to protect other people even if it means ruining her own life?
Alya: Yes.
I'm going to ignore how even in this Alya is framing Marinette as someone selfless and heroic, because that has to do more with with the show's bonkers moral framing of the big lie (which is its own can of worms) rather than the actual dynamic of the conversation.
But despite the dubious way the writers went about it, this is still Alya justifying her opinion and owning up to it. She rejects Marinette's framing of Alya accusing her being a deplorable liar and instead gives her own framing which is more accurate to who Marinette is as a person but still supports Alya's accusations.
(Ignore that Marinette is a massive liar and that Alya's interpretation is far more charitable than many would agree with. As said, this is the show's weird morality at play. As far as the narrative is concerned, Marinette is a long suffering noble hero who's willing to do anything for the people she loves, even if it means getting her hands dirty. So Alya's framing is very in line with who the narrative claims Marinette is.)
We also get a zoom in on Alya's face and a sound cue to indicate to us that what Alya is saying is not trivial. This is a serious thing to admit. Yet Alya says this calmly and with conviction. There's nothing about this that Marinette can attack.
So once again she switches tactics.
Marinette: Don't you think my life is enough of a disaster as it is?
Alya: Why would you say that?
Marinette: Because clearly *starting to speak in more panicked/stressed tone, sounding on the verge of tears* everything is falling apart! I couldn't defeat Hawkmoth and get his miraculous back, so now there's this holder of the butterfly miraculous. A new Hawkmoth, who's more dangerous than ever! They even attacked me and my family!
Marinette: *starting to cry* I've never seen my parents so afraid. I'm scared too, Alya! We have to stop them, before I can't go on anymore. But we have nothing on them, we know nothing about this new butterfly miraculous holder! Whether they're a man, or a woman, or what their name is, or what they really want!
Those stresses Marinette is crying over are all very valid.
They're also utterly irrelevant to the conversation.
Like, just to put this in perspective, this is Alya asking Marinette "did you lie to me and gaslight your boyfriend?" and Marinette responding "my life is such a disaster" and starts crying.
None of the things Marinette speaks about have anything to do with the big lie. If the thing she was crying to Alya about was how hard making the decision to lie to Adrien was, or how stressful keeping it a secret had been or anything at all that's related to the big lie, I would be willing to read it as a genuine reaction that's only accidentally manipulative. That she burst under the pressure of Alya's questioning because of how stressed she is, and her tears are more an expression of her emotional turmoil rather than an attempt to fish for sympathy.
But that's not what happened.
Instead, the things she cried about was how much of a failure she is as Ladybug and how scary it was for the butterfly holder to target her personally.
Again, all things that she's genuinely very stressed about. But they're not things that the conversation reminded her of. Nor are they things that she was so preoccupied and bothered by that she was already on the verge of spilling them to anyone.
We saw her in the scene right before this conversation. The things she was preoccupied by and anxious about were the big lie and feeling like she's lying to everyone. She didn't bring up these topic even when she interacted with her parents (who were reassuring her of how supportive they were), where it would be the perfect opportunity to talk about it. If nothing else, her parents fully understand feeling scared because the new butterfly holder attacked them personally.
Marinette is choosing to bring those things up.
There are two possible reads here.
Either Marinette is just so stressed by the sheer act of Alya pressing her for answers about whether she lied or not, that she places it as equivalent to all those things she ranted about that make her life a total disaster. And so she starts crying because Alya is supposed to be her friend but here she is, adding even more stress to Marinette's life and helping ruin it.
Or she's bringing it all up with the intention of distracting Alya from pressing her about the big lie.
We don't actually have to wonder which read is correct because the show outright tells us.
Marinette: I never lied to you.
Alya: Technically, you didn't. You just kept the truth from me and manipulated me so you wouldn't have to answer my questions.
Alya is framed in this scene to be the one cutting through Marinette's bullshit and saying the truth as it is. We're supposed to see her words and actions as giving Marinette a reality check. Therefore, we're supposed to take her assessment here as a correct read of Marinette's motivations in the scene. This is further supported by how Marinette doesn't even try to deny this.
The manipulation Marinette pulls here is two fold. She hijacks the conversation with something very emotional, stuff that Alya can't simply brush aside and return to the original conversation without feeling like a jerk.
And she tries to get Alya on her side by fishing for sympathy. Can't Alya see how much her best friend is dealing with? How her life is a complete and utter disaster so she needs to be coddled and reassured to let her know she's not alone? How can Alya keep on criticizing Marinette and adding to her burdens when Marinette is already suffering so much, doesn't she have a heart?
This time, the manipulation works.
Alya may be angry at Marinette, but that's still her best friend. She cares for her. She can't stay unmoved when she sees how bad Marinette is feeling.
*Alya's expression turns sympathetic and she approaches Marinette, dispelling the mirage in the process, and lays a hand on Marinette's shoulder.*
Marinette: I've had this idea but it's very dangerous and I don't know if you'd wanna hear about it.
That's a very manipulative line. Marinette is implying that Alya wouldn't want to hear about Marinette's idea to stop the butterfly holder because Alya is angry at Marinette.
She's creating this false association where "being angry at Marinette" = "putting Paris in danger", and "helping save Paris" = "being on Marinette's side and not questioning her about the big lie".
If Alya continues pushing now, she would be doing it at the expanse of catching the butterfly holder.
Alya: If it can help save Paris, of course I wanna know.
But Marinette knows Alya would never do that. She's a hero, so she would pick helping Paris over questioning Marinette. That's the exact thing Marinette is counting on.
The entire thing is textbook DARVO (Deny, Attack, Reverse Victim and Offender), which is a classic manipulation technique that often comes out in response to being held accountable.
Marinette started out by trying to deny this was possible. Then she attacked Alya by implicitly placing her as the bad guy for accusing Marinette of horrible things. Finally she hijacked the conversation by painting herself as the real victim in all of this because her life is just such a disaster, you see.
And it worked. She did manage to get Alya to drop the topic and instead go and comfort Marinette. She got exactly what she wanted out of all of this.
For the short term, at least. But Marinette tends to only think about solving the immediate problem in front of her without ever thinking about the consequences beyond that. See: Her being upset that the boyfriend she gaslighted the entire season to think positively about Gabriel now thinks positively about Gabriel.
This wasn't just predictable, this was the outcome she was actively working towards. Marinette just never stopped to consider what achieving this outcome would actually be like.
And she didn't stop to consider that just because she got Alya to drop the topic now doesn't mean she was going to drop it forever.
I want to add that I think Marinette bringing up how stressed and scared she is to try to get Alya to stop pressing is a learned response. It's worked before. Specifically, at the end of season 4. There, Chat learned that Ladybug had secretly recruited Rena Furtive and had had her helping out with battles without his knowledge, while deliberately keeping it secret from him. Which he wasn't happy about, but he set aside for the most part to deal with the akuma. And then Monarch stole all the Miraculous, Ladybug freaked out and broke down (understandably, that wasn't a manipulation tactic like it is during the Nemesis conversation), and he just comforted her, without ever getting mad at her, or even bringing up the fact that she kept an entire teammate secret from him. Like. Ever.
Of course Marinette would, consciously or subconsciously, try to repeat the same tactic. It worked perfectly last time.
Unfortunately for her, Alya is far less downtrodden than Adrien.
This episode feels more like a bridge episode between two seasons than a season finale. NGL, Secret Protocol set the bar very high in terms of thrills and sensations. And the teasers in trying to hide the most they could felt misleading to the fandom (the episode summary was on point though). Nonetheless, the episode notably reestablishes and summarizes all the consequences of Marinette's Secret™ about Gabriel this season.
Marinette sees what her actions with Adrien have leading him to : he is yet again living in his father's shadows. It wasn't her wish for him yet this is the result of her constant lies. She has gaslighted him into this false reality and she regrets it. Yet she cannot figure out how to untangle the multilayered mess she created. She is deep into an hole she dug herself and she doesn't see the light of the surface. At this point, no matter what her options are, she has also realized she will only hurt him and break his heart. And this is what pains her. Which leads me back to her dialog as Viper Bug in Mister Agreste - what happens when you are the one responsible behind the suffering and misery of the one you have sworn to protect at all cost? Do you truly get a second chance? Can you hope for forgiveness?
And surprisingly, they make a little parallel with the Gabriel's secret and her revealing her parents her super-identity. Now that they know the truth, they try to act chill but Marinette sees how worried they are about her. This is a permanent change from the season. With time, she might accept and welcome their support more, but right now, she regrets having told them precisely because they aren't blissed by ignorance anymore.
Same goes with Alya who has now figured out the truth and no memory erase spell can save Marinette this time around. In this episode Alya states clear boundaries between Marinette and her. IMO this is to me the best possible outcome. She will still help out if Paris is in trouble because that much is at stake (and that is why Alya is a A-ranking superheroine in my book). But Alya draws a line at what Marinette can use her for from now on. Cross that line again and they won't be friends anymore. And her line reminds us what Marinette made her do back in Lady Chaos. The episode gave the tone about upcoming Alya's interactions. Respectful but colder and distant for next season. So long Marinette's hasn't told Adrien the truth about his father.
Speaking of Alya, as Rena, she handled the team extremely well when LB was incapacitated. Even if it was part of the plan, Rena has material to be the leader of her own dedicated unit one day. (Again, linking back to Illustrhater ending).
For those mad that the episode had to spell it out that Chrysalis is a shapeshifter while it was obvious to the (older) audience, it wasn't for the characters. The new information is rather that Chrysalis is able to shapeshift consecutively. For us, I think it is safe to theorize that whoever was from that portal at the end of S5 finale gave her that power. And it might not be a Miraculous power either.
In Nemesis, Lila suffers her first real setback imo. It's the first time the Miraculers get that close to her. Although, they didn't do much further than that. The Butterfly Holder escaped and burn all the evidences in their lair. After this, it won't be surprising if the Miraculers won't get access to the Butterfly Holder for a long time. Lila will be more careful from now on. And so will the Miraculers now that they know about the Butterfly's additional ability.
Btw, it was nice for them to clarify that Marinette's secret protocol did work in the previous episode and truly bought herself time. Lila might not suspect her as being LB anymore, but she sure cannot help but be delighted and profit out of Marinette's misery has a little vengeance.
Alya rocked this season, I love arc she's had, and how she's been shown to be capable, empathetic, but also willing to stand her ground, even with her closest friends.
I hope that Adrien gets to have that kind of thing at some point. Despite a lot of the season's plot revolving around his feelings, it didn't really feel like he got much empathy, or like we truly got to feel his perspective much.
One thing that stuck out to me was that Marinette and Adrien's conversation at the beginning of the episode was roughhh. I don't think we've ever seen them "argue" like that when they're not LB and CN (well, excluding Heartfixer). It kinda hurts to watch.
Adrien is definitely trying to force himself to commit to believing Gabriel was a hero, even if he's unwilling to admit it. He said something along the lines of "You told me I should make my own decisions but now that I have you don't like it." but to me it screamed "I'm finally believing my father is a hero like you guys told me to, but now you're unhappy about it. What do you want from me?"
But of course he couldn't say that because. Well. It's bloody depressing.
Adrien is still struggling to make his own decisions, even if he doesn't realise it.
No, she isn't a bad friend. No, she wasn't "too hard" on Mari. No, she's not a hypocrite. No, just because she's Mari's bff doesn't mean she has to agree with everything she does.
In fact, I think she wasn't angry enough.
As much as I love Marinette, she's not the only 14 year old here, and she's not the only victim of Gabriel/Monarch.
Alya I Appreciate You So Much In Nemesis Oh My Gosh...
(SPOILERS FOR NEMESIS IF YOU DON'T WANT TO SEE THEM THEN IGNORE THE POST!!!)
 Not only did she figure out what happened on her own, but how she confronted her was the best way she could.
  She was upset of course, but she was stern and professional. She wasn’t screaming at her in anger like she did during Revelator. She kept her voice calm, and even showed she did feel sympathy for her and understood why she did it.Â
“Do I think my best friend would ruin her life over to protect Adrien? Yes…” She sounded bitterly sad about that. She knows that what Marinette did had to be out of love but she still keeps a level head about the situation at hand.
And Mari…?
  Mari…. doubles down on lying, becoming insulted and now she's the one screaming. (I think someone's projecting here too...)
She then turns the conversation to be about her and Chrysalis has made her so terrified and while I do feel sorry for her… wow was I not a fan of Mari in this ep. Because seeing her do this I suddenly realized Mari really is starting to become a worse person from holding this lie.
  Alya rightfully calls her out for emotionally manipulating her in that moment later on, something Mari I’m sure didn’t mean to do intentionally but the irony that she’s essentially not just becoming like Gabriel but Lila is pretty telling.
 Also notice how when Marinette does this that this is when Alya’s anger and frustration at her friend starts to bubble over. Because now she knows Mari isn’t just lying to her face, not only did she rope her into it but she realized that Marinette turned the situation about her, she manipulated Alya again. She lied to her once more and (unintentionally I repeat) almost made it seem like she was making Alya the bad guy and feel bad about trying to confront her about this.
This isn’t just some little lie, this isn't just her friend not trusting her, this is Marinette using and tricking Alya and Alya realizes it happened first hand. I don’t blame her for being angry I would be too.
  Alya tries to get her to confess again and Mari still insists on lying and by that point I’m just shaking my head. Mari I feel sorry for you but oh my gosh did she deserve to get some sense shaken into her. The sad thing is if Mari had finally just relented before doubling down on the lie and projecting on Alya in anger insisting she’s calling her a terrible person/girlfriend/best friend, then their relationship might not have become as strained as it did in the end of the ep. It still would have fractured some, but the fact that Alya saw first hand that she’s been played by her friend and still was willing to doing so despite coming to her calmly…?
That’s messed up.
  Yes I know Secret Protocol really freaked Marinette out, I know that she's reaching her breaking point and those tears and fear she has about Chrysalis are real, but the fact still stands she was still intent on manipulating Alya about not learning the truth. The fact still stands that instead of telling the truth to Adrien she's deciding to once again take away agency from him and break up with him. When she had done all she could be be his source of comfort and rock during the loss of his father now she's going to take it away from him. Adrien is isolated as is when it comes to friends and it only seemed to have gotten worse during Season 6.
Marinette isn't being selfless, she's being selfish.
So yes I do like Mari, but this ep tells us and shows us that she is 100% in the wrong in what she's doing.
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