#caduceus meta

[angelsndragons]

So, after rewatching the Grove scenes enough times to make my head spin and rewatching Certain Scenes, let’s talk Caduceus. Yes, this is going to be long. No, I am not sorry.

Blanket TW for this series: as we will be delving into Caduceus’ backstory, quick warning for discussions of drug use, self-harm and self-neglect, and general depression.

Part 1: Chosen and Unchosen

So one of the most interesting aspects of 130 is how Taliesin and Matt took what could have been simple sibling rivalry and made it a fundamental core to both Caduceus and Calliope in particular. Back in episode 96, Colton and Calliope both were described as put out or annoyed that Caduceus saved them and created enough seeds to save the Grove. Matt specifically mentions their wanting to be the ‘hero of the family.’ 

In particular, what’s fascinating to me is that, all things considered, Calliope seems a much stronger ‘protagonist,’ a much stronger PC if you will than Caduceus on first glance. She wants out, she wants adventure, she wants to save her home and be a hero, she has spent years honing her fighting and crafting skills to be able to do it. If she is a paladin or cleric as many suspect, then her ‘lesser’ abilities connecting to the Wildmother and understanding her will are even the basis of a great campaign long character arc. Hell, her brother minding the Grove gives the party a somewhat isolated, out of the way base they can return to when things get rough. She seems to be precisely the character one would want on a journey like the Mighty Nein’s. And she would have been terrible at it, with them.

Caduceus, on the other hand. Well. Liam’s joke, “You’re just a random shop keep in the woods?’ is kind of on the nose. Unkind fans keep saying that Caduceus is a heal bot or a glorified NPC. Caduceus doesn’t fit the mold of adventurer and never has. And after 130, that is the point. Because the Calliopes are long gone; they don’t wait around for adventurers to find them. They don’t have the patience for it. From 130, we can gather that Caduceus was not just a quiet, responsible, self-sacrificing kid. He was also the kid who just went along with whatever was expected of him and who didn’t seem to have any contradictory opinions of his own. Notice that the Clays are confused and unsettled by Caduceus just walking out of the middle of the conversation; this is not normal to them. The Nein, on the other hand, are not bothered by it; they don’t consider it a tantrum or disrespectful. They are actually used to Caduceus not completing a conversation, to him saying something and walking away or shutting down the conversation. It’s only been the last several weeks that Caduceus has really been reaching out and actively trying to communicate fully. I think it is fairly obvious that Cornelius expected that Calliope would be able to shake Caduceus from his course because she had always been able to. As I said in my playlist analysis, Caduceus only realizes just how far he’s come, how far he has drifted from what his family expects of him when he runs into them again. And he is not ready to go home with them until he can resettle who exactly he is.

All of this is to say, Caduceus began the campaign fervently telling himself that he was chosen to save his home. He anchors himself to that fact. He says that he has always known deep down that saving the grove was his responsibility and that he had been neglecting it. Constance also says she expected him to do it in 96, Clarabelle accepts that Caduceus of all people saved her pretty quickly, Calliope reluctantly admits that everything seems connected to Caduceus, that it wasn’t her time, and thoughtfully agrees to let Caduceus continue traveling if he feels he must. So that begs the question: how did we get to episode 28? No, seriously, think about it. If everyone, from matriarch on down, had a sense that Caduceus would be their savior, what the hell happened? Why was Caduceus alone in that grove, waiting for the Nein? Why on Melora’s green earth did they leave him there?

Caduceus says it himself in 130: he didn’t want it. And his family loves him, imperfectly as we all do. So his sister steps up, says, “I will do it in his stead” and “I want this, let me have it.” And they all go about their lives hoping that it is enough. But. We can’t walk the path laid out for other people. They have to walk the path. Caduceus tried to unchose himself, Calliope tried to choose herself. And it didn’t work. At all. The Wildmother still waited for her chosen Clay to choose to start walking again then pointed him in the right direction. It sounds cruel, in a way. But the Exandrian Prime Deities have always allowed mortals to choose their fates. Even if Caduceus was the only one who could save the grove, it was still his choice whether to do so.

And here is what really gets Calliope’s goat and what Caduceus is sorry for: he enjoys being out there. He didn’t want it but now that he has been out there, there’s a part of him that likes it. What is left unspoken: What if you had left earlier? Taken your mantle sooner? You mean we did all of this for you, because you thought you couldn’t handle it and now you’re throwing it in my face how much the entire world has come to depend on you?

Honestly, I love this deconstruction of the Chosen One trope. Caduceus had to choose himself, as surely as he unchose himself. His fate, and the fate of so many others, is defined by his choices. What a painful lesson to learn.

I have *checks notes* four other parts I’m currently working on, including Apathy is Death and What Does Manure Do for a Garden, so I’ll be back soon with them.

[rowyndodendron]

Caduceus’ Tea Meta

Sometimes I think about what Taliesin brought Caduceus in to achieve, the circumstances of his arrival, the function he was supposed to serve both narratively and mechanically for this group, and the tragedy this has created within himself, and I get Emotional. 

Molly had just died. Fjord, Yasha, and Jester were all taken. The party was fractured, and beaten, and broken, and they crawled into the Blooming Grove trying to find a shred of hope, and peace. 

And they found Caduceus. 

They found Caduceus, a gentle giant, soft-spoken and welcoming who, despite the fact his family were missing, and his home was slowly dying around him, the last one remaining, just fretted about not having enough cups to serve them all tea. 

And I think this has been the most consistent thing about Caduceus, in all his time with the nein. Not having enough cups. 

Caduceus was never meant to be a replacement for Molly - either as a clone, a complement, or a foil. He was made to make sure that what happened to Molly never happened again to any of the rest of them. 

And he’s done that job so well. He’s done that job too well. 

Every beat of Caduceus’ arc so far has been about someone else. Even when he’s not buffing them in combat/mechanically, he’s buffing them narratively, and emotionally, and he’s often doing it without any of them being aware. 

The sword he travelled to repair he ended up giving to Fjord, as a beautiful symbol of him becoming a paladin of the Wildmother and finding that faith for himself. 

And tonight’s happenings were another great example of his role and his purpose and his role as support. (I am NOT saying Caduceus is a “supporting” character in this group - in case ur about to bail on me rn like ‘wtf taryn that’s so rude???’ PATIENCE). 

He made his insight checks with the Gentleman. He sat quietly. He steered the conversation away and did what needed to be done. 

Then he came back later. Alone. The best way to approach a man and a situation like this, as he well knew. 

He served his tea. And he asked about his home. He asked if someone could go back to check on it. He  spoke in the most candid way we’ve seen him in a long time. He was scared, he was lonely. So lonely. And afraid. 

But then he used this narrative, his narrative, his story, his goal, to ultimately “overshadow” that moment of his own and make it about someone else - make it about Jester. He used it to speak about family, to gently coax the gentleman into having an open talk with Jester, into the foundations of the two of them having a relationship together - and that will be built on the back of Caduceus’ selflessness, of his support, of his cups of tea. 

I’ve seen some meta about people being like ‘wow, damn, Cad spoke to the gentleman about his loneliness and how much he misses his family, and asked him for help rather than his party, to avoid distracting them from their goals at the moment. His friends never listen to him/make him feel he can talk to them wow they’re so shitty...’ And I agreed with that a bit, but I don’t now. Not fully, anyway. 

For a little while, really since Cad gave the sword to Fjord/made that about his transformation/rebirth/arc I’ve been worried that he doesn’t really have a story of his own. 

And then I realised that THAT is his story. That is his arc. That is his journey. 

Caduceus has spent his entire life making cups of tea. He’s spent his life cultivating the graves of those who’ve died and been laid to rest in the Blooming Grove. He’s spent his life serving the Wildmother. He’s spent his life looking after people - dead and alive. It’s what he does. It’s who he is. 

And it makes him a wonderful person. It makes him kind, and compassionate, and insightful. It means he always know what to say or do for his friends. He always knows when they need a little tea, and the only worry he ever lets them see is that he doesn’t have enough cups for all of them. 

It also makes him lonely. 

It makes him lonely because, in the end, he doesn’t have enough cups. He’s always one short. And the one who always ends up going without is himself. 

Everyone else has to be taken care of. And everyone else is always in a lot more need of that tea than he is himself. Caduceus has never, in all his life, put himself first. That’s just not what happens when you’ve got a hundred siblings, a dying home, graves to tend, a goddess to serve, and a ragged group of people with bright future’s and world-shaping destinies to keep together.

He can’t burden them with his problems. He can’t let them see that he’s uncertain, and scared, and lonely, and all these other things that he hides so well. Because they need him to be their hope, and their guidance, and their support cleric. 

He’s necessary to them, he’s so necessary. And he knows that. I don’t think Cad is insecure about his place in the group. And I don’t think he’s overly humble either. He knows these dumbass fuckwits need him. He knows they’d be dead without him. He knows they’d probably have fragmented and separated and let their threads of fate unravel all those months ago if he hadn’t served them tea and joined them. 

He’s needed. And he’s wanted. And he’s necessary. And he’s loved. And he’s valued. But he’s lonely. He’s lonely because they’ve all let him in, but he hasn’t really let any of them in. He’s lonely because, while the table is always set, and the tea is always poured, there’s always one less than there needs to be. And so he’s on the outside in a strange way, even though he’s the heart of this group, he’s never drinking tea with them. Not in the way that counts. 

And I think (I hope) that Caduceus’ story, and Caduceus’ arc, and Caduceus’ journey will be about him having one. It will be about him realising that he gets to have that, too. 

These people have whatever destinies he’s seen for them. They have all this potential and power and greatness waiting inside to blossom. And maybe he doesn’t. Maybe he’s just there to help them, to support them, to buff them through whatever they need to do to save the world. But he can still have a story, too. 

It doesn’t have to be huge. it doesn’t have to be world-ending. it doesn’t have to shape the future of creation. It just has to be his. Because he deserves it. Because you can only be the thing that holds everyone together on your own for so long before you need someone to hold you up, too. 

I’m so ready for that moment. I’m so ready for the moment when Caduceus falls, and this entire fucking party gets down on their knees to lift him back up again. 

I’m ready for him to say ‘I need you’ and for them to agree without hesitation - because how can they not? 

I’m ready for him to put himself first, and for this party to encourage him to do that, and to do it more often. 

I’m ready for him to break, to be scared, and to be lonely, and to know that he needs, and wants, and deserves their support in turn. 

I’m ready for him to pull up a chair, sit down at the table, and ask them to pour him his own goddamn cup of tea*. 

*(but much more politely, because this is Caduceus we’re talking about). 

[angelsndragons]

So, I think I’ve finally watched that Caduceus/Yasha conversation enough to really dig into it so here we go. Warning: as always with me, this is going to be a long word vomit.

Okay, so, to start with, I’m going to give myself props for calling the Menagerie like I did over on my meta about Caduceus’ playlist. I wrote on the Over Soon breakdown:  

The build-up Tal was talking about? This is it. The moment where Caduceus first puts himself and his desires above what he thinks is his duty. The moment that Caduceus fully realizes how much he has changed and what an earth-shattering revelation it is.

This conversation with Yasha confirms that reading. Caduceus misses home but he’s ‘afraid [he’ll] miss this more.’ I’ve seen some takes about how it’s sad that Caduceus sees the Nein as a duty but, as always with him, you have to look at both what he is literally saying and what he leaves unsaid. He says that he might feel ready to go home ‘once everyone is safe or at least on their way.’ That is one of the vaguest, least defined “duties” we’ve ever heard from Caduceus. What is safe? What is ‘on their way’? Yasha gently calls him out on it, pointing out that they aren’t going to be safe for a while. So what gives? To me, this is Caduceus’ way of giving himself permission to put his wants, being with his friends, over his duty to the Grove, as he started to back in the Menagerie. This is Caduceus taking some ownership of his future and what he wants it to look like. 

Which brings me to the second big line of the conversation: Patience is fine but it can curdle into apathy. Which oof. Caduceus. Baby boy. That is definitely a man speaking from experience. We all knew that he was fucked up from his ~10 years alone but holy hell, to have him confirm it with that line is a gut punch. If we go back and take a look at Caduceus’ early episodes with this line in mind...wow. I won’t say that it changes much, necessarily, but it does reframe a few key moments. How long did Caduceus actually have his bag packed? Had he first packed it a few months after the last of his family left? Did he ever unpack it? Why only four cups for a family of seven? Is that why he seemed so unbothered by what they found in Lorenzo’s stronghold? The way he seems to be slowing waking up until the docks isn’t just a man experiencing the outside world for the first time, it’s a man slowly shaking off years of apathy and neglect. That first big panic attack on the Mistake isn’t just him overwhelmed with the situation- almost drowning, almost being left behind again- it’s most likely his first Real Big Emotion in years. After years of apathy that had to be both quite a jolting surprise and a huge relief, that he was still capable of feeling that deeply and fully.

And this brings me to that first big line: Everybody’s haunted by who they thought they’d be. We know who Caduceus thought he would be under gentler, kinder circumstances. He was the Clay content to stay home and tend the garden. He was the Clay who was satisfied with what he had. The steady constant in an ever changing world. But circumstances weren’t kind and he did step outside, far outside, what he ever imagined he could be. I wonder which part haunts him most: that he could have had that future or that he would have been content with it?

Which, honestly, brings me to why I am so damn proud of our boy. He’s grown so damn much in the eighty-one episodes he’s had. He’s quietly working his way through his trauma and finding a new path forward. He’s no longer quite so go with the flow or reactive, he’s taking an active interest in not only his friends’ futures but his own. Like Beau, he’s learning to take ownership of and carve out a space for himself. Like Jester, he’s learning to have faith in the friends around him. Like Fjord, he’s learning who he wants to be and what impact he wants to have on the world. Like Yasha, he’s doing the quiet work necessary to believe he has a future.

In summary, Caduceus tells Yasha that it would be a ‘fine future’ to be stuck with the Nein and I cry. 

Thank you to @primrose-path-of-dalliance for talking with me through this.

[angelsndragons]

Day 3

Oh, man, y’all, I have been saving this for weeks so you have been warned. Today, I’m going to talk about Caduceus, Caleb, and their connection. Because honestly, though they rarely interact one on one, their relationship is fascinating.

Now, my first hot take is that their relationship is more similar to that of Caleb and Beau’s than Caleb’s relationships with anyone else. Caleb’s high Int, meh Wis combined with Caduceus’ high Wis, low Int means that the pair of them just do not get the other and both of them know it. They often get to the same conclusion using wildly different methods and as such, are in danger of talking past each other and going in circles like Caleb and Beau do. They simply use different methods to avoid the same pitfalls. Any time they zoom in on the other in a group chat, we can see how each of them keeps an open mind and does his best to make the other understand. Caleb accommodates Caduceus by simplifying his language and talking more about direct actions and feelings rather than the abstract tangents. In turn, Caduceus accommodates Caleb by giving him his full focus, clarifying what Caleb actually says, and above all, lowering his insight. What do I mean by that? Caduceus knows that he makes Caleb uncomfortable with his ridiculous ability to read people and that Caleb genuinely doesn’t want to be read, both because Caleb spent most of their relationship hiding a lot- what he did to his parents, how he feels about Jester and Veth, his time travel plans, etc- and because Caleb is afraid of how Caduceus perceives him. Like he and Yasha said way in the 90s, it is the forgiveness and acceptance which are the most difficult to deal with. And Caduceus can accept and forgive a lot. Honestly, a great example of this is during ep 98, Caduceus repeatedly asks Caleb what he wants and what his goals are relative to the rest of the group. 

Beyond their very different outlooks, Caduceus and Caleb do share some core internal commonalities. Neither of them are good at articulating their feelings- they both find it hard, uncomfortable, and often unnecessary. They are both project and gift-giving boys at heart; Caleb’s magical developments lately have all been about helping his friends even as he takes those first uncertain steps in verbalizing how much he actually cares about them. Caduceus focuses on helping his friends achieve their aims as he takes his own uncertain steps towards claiming his own future. The two of them clocked each other as fellow project nerds almost from the beginning; Caduceus likes Caleb in their first meeting because while the others are hemming and hawing, Caleb says do this for us and we will do something for you, no ifs, ands, or buts. Caleb gifts Caduceus the periapt and the book on corrupted plants; Caduceus supports Caleb’s lead on the Assembly and Essek and protects him from Ickithon. At their cores, Caleb and Caduceus are each driven by a sense of duty, serving his country for Caleb and serving the Wildmother for Caduceus. Duty has become a cornerstone in how they talk about and to each other, especially lately. Family means the world to each of them.  

What I love about this relationship is how firmly it is built on mutual respect and on similar moral outlooks. The two of them use entirely different methods and beliefs to get to those outlooks but I love that they can recognize the other as a kindred spirit and ally anyway. Caleb and Caduceus recognize each other’s talents and check in with each other during difficult conversations or important decisions. It’s nice watching them have each other’s backs.

And I guess I have to talk about the eighth floor since it stirred up so much controversy. Here is what Caduceus was going off of in that conversation: Caleb had never entered any of the bittersweet rooms on the floor, just the bad ones. Caduceus knows that Caleb will never let himself forget his childhood or what he did. Caduceus does not think Caleb needs a physical embodiment of his childhood home which he has to earn the right to enter. That is what he meant, same as Jester. This place should not be a punishment or a reward he earns. That is what he could not communicate and he recognized that. Like he did with Beau later in dead forest, Caduceus kept trying to communicate what he really meant but backed off once Caleb wasn’t having it. He finds the memory lovely. He leaves tea in the room just in case Caleb wants to come back. Honestly, I am okay with some friction between them over this miscommunication- they both need practice in verbalizing their hurts, boundaries, and general feelings. 

Can’t wait to see if the pair has a few minutes this week to chat; there is a lot going on with both of them and their conversations tend to be productive.

[angelsndragons]

still waiting for coherence on my main ideas from 130 but until then, i’m gonna talk a bit about calliope and caduceus. going by current canon confirmation, calliope - the yang to caduceus’ yin- is caduceus’ little sister, not clarabelle, so i am going proceed from that angle. honestly, i think what trips matt up with the sisters is that he established that clarabelle had been frozen long enough to still be a small, still growing teenager while her little siblings have grown up; i don’t think he is twisting around where calliope is in the birth order even if he mixed up the gifts caduceus gave them.

that said, looking at the conversation from ‘older caduceus, younger calliope’ just has so many layers. caduceus speaks to her like a peer, like his equal, until he falls back into older sibling ‘here’s what you are going to do’ mode. as an older sibling, it is a sign of great trust, and probably a little desperation, to be that vulnerable with your younger sibling. you’re used to protecting them, even if it is just from yourself, you’re used to just carrying on because from the day they were born, you became their example, tormentor, protector, and fan all wrapped into one. for cad to take off the mask like he did and let his little sister see his worry and pain is whew, look how far we have come. because the clays were surprised that caduceus ‘stormed’ out. being the quiet, responsible kid who did what he was told, who loved his little sister so fiercely that he let her “jump the line” just because she wanted it, that was the caduceus they knew. the caduceus who eventually slid into a deep dark hole without an idea of how to stop digging. but caduceus isn’t that person anymore. and sure, calliope fell into old habits and rhythms back in the menagerie, caduceus did too, but even there, she caught a glimpse of the caduceus who had been molded loneliness and reshaped by the care and caring of the nein. and she accepted it. she didn’t begrudge caduceus his time in the world. it’s only here, now, when calliope might be left completely alone, adrift without her favorite big brother, that she objects. when she might be stuck with the fate he was supposed to have: staying home.

it’s tough as an older sibling to ‘take’ something from a younger one, especially if it is their thing. caduceus’ thing has never been combat; he was the sensitive, perceptive one who could sense fate’s currents around them and feel the wildmother in everything. calliope was the warrior of the two. and honestly, it hurts how much both of them recognize that melora does not need a warrior in the upcoming struggle; she, and the world by extension, needs a healer. the thing that calliope has been training for and waiting for all her life and it isn’t saving her home or a battle for the fate of all creation. what a bitter pill to swallow. the thing caduceus has been training for all his life and it isn’t sustaining his home. yet, somewhere deep down, they both knew that this was coming. calliope only made armor and a shield for caduceus, after all, not her other siblings or the adults.

just like we saw in the menagerie, caduceus trusts his warrior baby sister above all others to do what has to be done in difficult circumstances. he charges her with getting everyone home safely, he charges her with his secret pain, his last wishes, and the grove’s last defense. and she hates it. waiting and preparing doesn’t seem to come easily to her the way it too easily does to caduceus.

finally, as an older sibling, i felt caduceus’ ‘i don’t want to do it but if keeps you from doing it, if i can protect you from this, i will’ remark deep down in my soul. as an older sibling with an amazing younger one, yeah, you definitely had that dunk in the water coming, caduceus. they have to do something to keep us humble and in check when we start throwing that shit around.   

[angelsndragons]

Part 2: Apathy is Death

Blanket trigger warning once again: discussions of Caduceus’ past, including depression, self-harm, self-neglect, potential suicide, and drug use.

To start this off, for a long time one particular quote from an old video game has stuck with me regarding Caduceus: 

So you will do nothing? Apathy is death, no, worse than death, because at least a rotting corpse can feed the beasts and insects. -Star Wars, KOTOR: TSL

This statement, I feel, really sums up everything that has gone into Caduceus’ arc and growth thus far. We start with a young man who doesn’t speak up, who is content to just let things happen to him, who neglects his duty, who chooses to not make a decision and doesn’t seem to realize he has made a choice. And that it has consequences. Caduceus is left alone. His siblings leave one by one, his parents and aunt too. And he wilts. Time passes, he does his work at the shrine, and all the while he curls further into himself, sustained only by the notion that someone else, in this case the Wildmother, will a) tell him when to go, and b) tell him if there is something he needs to know regarding his family. Never mind that Caduceus could easily step out of the Grove whenever he wants, never mind that he (at least towards the end of that ten years) has the power and means to contact his family himself. The Wildmother has given him all the tools he needs; he just can’t bring himself to do anything with them. As ever with Caduceus’ arc, he must learn to take ownership and agency regarding his life. And he spends ten stubborn years, after losing what really mattered to him, not doing so. Until the Wildmother stops speaking to him. Losing this last fragile tether finally, finally moves him to action. 

This is really the part I want to emphasize about what he revealed with the lilies: Caduceus was reaching out for the first time in years and looking for help the only way he could. On some level, buried deep under several layers of neglect, apathy, and depression, he realized that he needed to do something or everything would get worse. I know that a lot of people think he was poisoning himself intentionally but I disagree hard on that interpretation. First of all, that requires a level of effort that I don’t think he was capable of at that time. There is a reason that the first several weeks on an anti-depressant are the most dangerous; you finally have energy again but haven’t yet begun to feel better. If you were suicidal before the meds, going on them initially increases your risk of doing it. Secondly, while it seems crass to the audience, Constance’s comment about Caduceus micro-dosing indicates that he was well-known to have done drugs before everyone left and that they were okay with it. Caduceus knows what he is doing with them. We see him in 130 place a petal in his mouth, not actively eat a bunch of flowers. He’s stronger now than he was then, his ties to the Wildmother are nearly unbreakable at this point. But back then? If she had stopped speaking, if he had lost his connection to her like that, nine levels weaker than he is now, yeah, I can see him going overboard trying to reestablish that connection.  

Now, at some point, the line between intentional self-harm and reckless self-neglect blurs quite a bit so if people read Caduceus as intentionally harming himself with the lilies, power to y’all. Personally, his lines about patience curdling to apathy and time stopped meaning anything read as neglect, not harm. Caduceus does not actively harm himself that we can see in the show; for example, in battle, he takes care to stay out of the line of fire and protect himself. However, he does actively neglect himself; again, often in battle when he is wounded, he will focus on a more injured teammate, say he is okay, and move on without healing himself.

That aside, as painful as the lily reveal is, that is the moment that Caduceus first makes an active choice. And Wildmom rewards him for it (I know there is debate whether he was tapping into the Somnovem in that vision but the timing combined with Wildmom personally vouching for the Nein with that breeze, I tend to lean towards her giving him that vision). He feels her presence once more, she readies him to leave, and sends him people with which to travel. He’s half out of it, has no idea what he doing, but now, at last, he is moving forward. It takes a lot of time to shake off that much neglect but we see him slowly wake up until the alarm blares in his ears with that panic attack. Caring for the Nein becomes his way of learning to care for himself again. Making group meals, for example, means he is much more likely to be eating regularly, even if it probably isn’t as much as people would like him to. Listening to their problems gives him focus while he isn’t ready to look at his own, and learning to unconditionally accept this group of fuckups with all their baggage gives him the space to accept his own. Allowing them to care for him in their own imperfect ways allows him to learn to extend that care to himself and the world around him. 

That doesn’t mean he didn’t have his struggles. Right up until about episode 49, we see Caduceus deflect making choices. He is ‘learning to embrace the chaos’. He asks if any of the Nein have a plan and is content to just follow along with Fjord’s visions. He has Opinions on quite a lot of their encounters but keeps quiet and keeps his head down most of the time. While the others make plans, he sits by and watches. He has small successes, too. He buys a broken sword to fix and declares it a gift to Fjord. He seeks out information on Vandran for Fjord completely on his own. He gets to know the crew. He decides to get everything he can out of their little pirate venture, from sampling new food to learning to be okay with being uncomfortable and learning to swim. I would say his biggest early game step forward comes when Nott’s situation (and Caleb by extensions) crops up, a clear cut ‘we can help make this better, we are meant to make it better’ moment if ever there was one. Also, let’s not talk about Caduceus and his sad, almost understanding ‘I am so sorry’ to Nott when he detoxes her in light of 130 right now, okay. I don’t have the space here. This episode, we see Caduceus step up in a big way- keeping Caleb grounded in the basement, taking charge of driving the cart around, planning for Luc, figuring out what to do for Nott and Yeza, communing with the Wildmother for help, etc. 

I want to go back to the title: Apathy is death. One cannot make changes in their life if they don’t care enough on some level to do so. Apathy is self-perpetuating because it requires no effort, it is so easy to slip into, and can feel like it will never end, regardless of actual mental health. Caduceus’ arc has been about breaking out of that mentality, recovering from it, and moving forward. And he is doing so well. This is why I refuse to treat that reveal with only angst and pity. The fact that he has broken through and come so far in less than a year is awe-inspiring. 

Next up, we answer the question: what does manure do for a garden? 

[angelsndragons]

Clay Timeline

Or our best guess at it, really. I am trying to reference Matt primarily because it is his world and because Taliesin has admitted to being fuzzy on some details, owing to Caduceus’ own navel-gazing/not paying attention to said details. There is also the chance that Matt swapped things around in the background in the six irl months between Dust and Clay and Family Shatters. 

Update as of 130/131: No one can keep track of the Clays and it is hysterical. You know you have a problem when the Lorekeeper has to ask for a family tree. 

~545 - Molaesmyr falls to whatever corruption or experiments its elves were running. This corruption is eerily similar to that of the corruption found in Aeor, a floating city once known for having god-killer weapons. Ref. EGtW and the timing of Ludinus Da’leth founding the Cerberus Assembly in A Game of Names.

~735 - The Corruption of Molaesmyr begins assaulting the Blooming Grove. Ref Caduceus and the Clays saying the corruption within the Savalirwood began overtaking the temple about a century before the start of the game.

~715-755 - Caduceus Clay is born. Taliesin has said he is anywhere between 80-120, however the lower numbers have come up more frequently. What is also interesting is that the reference age for Caduceus settled into early 20s/23, down from mid 20s/23-26.

826 - The Gorgon comes to the Menagerie and petrifies the inhabitants. Ref Family Shatters, Eremus Stone confirms he was frozen ten years ago.

826-827 - Constance and Corrin leave the Grove together. Ref. Family Shatters, Constance confirms that they left around 827. Also reference Calm before the Storm.

828 - The last of the Clays leaves the Grove. Ref Family Shatters, Caduceus says that Clarabelle left eight or seven years previously. Also Ref Within the Nest, Caduceus says that one of his sisters was the last to leave, heading East.

      - Okay, so Taliesin talks like they left one by one once they had their visions but we know that is not strictly true because of Constance and Corrin. Either way, this timeline lines up with Taliesin’s ‘once every six months the next one would leave’ comments; you can accommodate more individual trips by adjusting the time of year they left. For example, put Constance and Corrin later in 826 for leaving pairs or put them earlier for the rest of the family leaving individually. Remember that the Exandrian calendar only has 11 months.

        ---Update from Episode 130, Calm before the Storm. Caduceus says that after Corrin and Constance left, Calliope left by herself, followed by Colton (who may have left with Cornelius), Cornelius, and finally Clarabelle.

We also know that the Family Shatters Clay pairs probably did not travel together exclusively throughout their journeys.

- Constance and Corrin arrive separately at the Kiln. They also leave separately, lacking the residuum they need. This was ‘a few years ago,’ according to the Dusts. Ref Jeramiss Dust in Clay and Dust.

     - On a maybe relevant note, Corrin is the Clay who comments on Uthodurnian food, stating she likes it a lot better than the Empire’s food in Family Shatters.

- Constance and Corrin arrive at the Menagerie together and are petrified. They came hoping the Stones might have some residuum to use at the Kiln. Ref Family Shatters, Constance confirms they came together and that the trip took ‘quite a few months.’

- At some point, Colton also arrives alone at the Kiln. He leaves like his mother and aunt do, confused and lacking materials. Ref Clay and Dust. Note that we do not know if Colton got there before or after his mother and aunt, he is simply brought up later in the conversation, as though it was easier for Jeramiss to remember Constance and Corrin than him.

- Colton is found with Clarabelle inside the Menagerie Cave, protecting her from something.

- Clarabelle is the most visibly confused of the Clays re Caduceus’ apparent age. She also is not panicked or defensive like Colton is when he awakes. I would guess her lack of darkvision meant that she did not see the statues or the gorgon when she entered the Cave, even if she brought a light source.

- Calliope has a single residuum seed on her when she is restored, indicating she too went to the Kiln at some point and had residuum on her when she did so. Ref Calliope Clay, Family Shatters, she straight-up tells Beau she got it at the Kiln.

- Notably, she is found with Cornelius, who has residuum glass on him but no seed. He states that he got confused when Caduceus shows him his residuum seeds. 

- Also notably, Cornelius had spotted Constance and Corrin before he was petrified, indicating that he and Calliope arrived after them.

835,  Fessuran 22 - Mollymauk Tealeaf dies.

835,  Fessuran 23 - Caduceus Clay has visions of eyes in the trees, sky, spring, and stones in the Blooming Grove. He then sees nine butterflies.

835, Fessuran 24 - Caduceus Clay joins the Mighty Nein.

836, Thunsheer 25 - Cornelius, Calliope, and Constance Clay reunite with Caduceus. Corrin, Clarabelle, and Colton are found but are unable to be restored due to a lack of spell slots.

836, Thunsheer 26 - The Clays reunite as Clarabelle, Colton, and Corrin are all successfully restored. They begin their trek back to the Grove. 

     Update as of 131: Reani totally dished the deets on the Nein while she escorted the Clays home. Reference Clarabelle asking about the Xhorhaus’ tree when no one mentioned it around her in 96 or 130.

836, Brussendar 19: The latest date the Clays make it home; Jester checks in with Calliope on this date and confirms that they have planted the seeds. They probably have been back for a while at this point, as Colton and Corrin are on a supply run on Brussendar 31 during Calm Before the Storm.

Speculation on the timeline below - 

Updated as of 131: Matt and Taliesin apparently mixed up which sister is the crafty one, aka which one made the armor. Clarabelle is the sensitive artist while Calliope is the warrior but according to 130 and 131, Calliope made Caduceus and her own armor (which honestly was my thought the whole time, the two of them being a matched/equal and opposite set, but the idea of Clarabelle making her siblings’ matching armor is too dang cute). Obviously Calliope can be a warrior and make her own stuff, in fact, it is probably smart on her end considering she wants to go out on her own.

The fact that Calliope has a seed but no residuum and her father has residuum but no seed and seemed confused by Caduceus’ indicates to me that Calliope and Cornelius met up at the Menagerie not too long before they were petrified. Calliope did not have the time to explain to her father how she got the seed or perhaps that she even had it in the first place. I lean towards lack of time because she, like Colton, seems really gung-ho about being the hero of the family/Grove. It seems weird to me that she wants that validation but would withhold the seed from her dad.

Given that Calliope does have a seed but was not mentioned at all during the stay at the Kiln, I wonder if she came in behind Caduceus and made it to the Kiln after the group reforged the sword and left. I thought that Caduceus mentioned he wanted to leave a record of his time there but I cannot find it at the moment. Maybe someone else will or maybe that was all in my imagination. If she actually did come in behind Caduceus, that means that she was aging for the vast majority of her time away from the Grove, as was her father if they met up at the Menagerie. CritRole Stats tells me that the Nein were at the sanctum on 18 and 25 Misuthar, while the Clays are reunited on 25 Thunsheer, two months later. It would be a tight schedule for Calliope to make across the entire freaking continent in that two months but considering that Matt has said that Molaesmyr is only a few days to a week from the Sanctum and the fact that she is a badass, it might be possible.

I think we can reasonably say that Clarabelle found the Menagerie first and that she probably came alone. Colton found her statue when he came and tried to protect it before he succumbed. Or Clarabelle and Colton met up at some point and she wandered off for a hot second before being petrified.

Out of universe, I think Matt just flubbed with which sibling made it to the Kiln and flubbed the girls’ introductions; I think he meant to have Clarabelle and Cornelius together outside and Colton and Calliope inside, esp given the potentially poetic imagery of Calliope and Colton being that close to saving their home before they are taken out of the game. But if mistakes were made, they have yet to be clarified so until then, we just have to deal with what canon gave us.

[angelsndragons]

soooooo

I was rewatching Family Shatters FOR REASONS when it hit me that we as a fandom seem to have the wrong birth order for Caduceus’ sisters.

Everyone seems to think that Calliope is the older sister and Clarabelle the younger sister but...um...that is actually incorrect.

Cornelius introduces Calliope as Caduceus’ younger sister.

Matt describes Colton and Clarabelle as Caduceus’ elder brother and sister and describes an unpetrified Clarabelle as visibly younger than Caduceus, not actually younger.

Which...well.

I’ll give you a minute.