I forgot at some point just how FLAVORFUL Siyeon was in the NOVEL compared to the manhwa. Re-reading got me excited and shit.
At this point, I'll be making a chapter-by-chapter comparison of the two since there are a LOT of things the manhwa just SKIPS over for the sake of budget and romance.
Take chapter 29 (manhwa ver.) or 27 (novel ver.), for example.
Novel ver:
You can really tell just how the mood plummeted and got tense when Callisto was mentioned, and Siyeon was genuinely afraid because he used his sword on her last time.
She was so upset that she slammed her fist down on the desk - a very Penelope-like behaviour - something she would have avoided because she tries to act logically.
Now the manhwa:
You cannot tell me that it didn't make the scene more of a "haha, he's back lol" moment.
Why did it put her like this? The way they put her thought bubble as "He's completely psychotic! He's doing it on purpose!" made it seem like she's overreacting. She isn't. She was nearly killed by the man.
Not just that, but the way the panels are framed set it in a more comedic effect, no?
They completely removed Siyeon's desk scene as well to instead make it seem like the maze scene wasn't a big deal, again. It was IMPORTANT that scene was shown because it not just puts into readers just how SERIOUS the situation is that Siyeon ACTUALLY loses her cool, but also on WHY she avoids Callisto.
"Callisto almost slit Siyeon's neck, yeah, that was bad, but you still can't just blame the manhwa for not drawing it, you're looking at it so deeply that you think they're pushing romance too much-"
BITCH, they just reused a scene from previous chapters, would it REALLY kill them to choose the most important one?? (I mean, if romance was considered MORE IMPORTANT than Siyeon's life, then the manhwa did right).
They could have very much just shown a flashback of him holding that sword to her since that's what Siyeon was mainly recalling anyway, and it made sense to show just WHAT she was so afraid of. What she was RISKING again in just being within his vicinity.
But instead, they ONLY put THIS:
??? Siyeon was thinking about how her NECK was nearly SLIT, NOT about the damn confession she gave.
Now why do you gotta make it look like she's bitching about the lie she gave? Or ACT like she WASN'T afraid of him anymore?
Literally, the recap went from 'Callisto nearly kills Siyeon' to 'Callisto looks forward to why Siyeon likes him'.
Narrative just DIDN'T give a brief reminder on why exactly she didn't want to go see him. It put more emphasis on "hey, he's looking forward to fl's justification to liking him" and ignore that Siyeon was STILL TRAUMATIZED from him nearly killing her.
Notice how, in the manhwa ver. they didn't mention ANYTHING related to DEATH. "Must have been the wind" ahh shit.
When it HAD the chance to recap the previous meeting, it CHERRY-PICKED how he was 'interested in her love confession' and NEVER mentioned how he almost KILLED her.
It was already trying to make the readers FORGET and was starting to SET him up as a love interest. And it WORKED because most manhwa readers usually don't read the novel ver. first.
The novel highlighted how dangerous Callisto was, and Siyeon's reason for not wanting to see him again was because she could never survive with him in-game, so it's natural she'd be afraid and associate him with death (reinforced when he DID try to kill her in that maze).
Meanwhile, the manhwa once again just pushed for the romance aspects, putting more emphasis on the "you must give me a reason as to why you fell in love with me" and CUT OUT the brief reminder that he nearly killed her.
The manhwa narrative not only REFUSED to acknowledge that Siyeon was LEGITIMATELY AND JUSTIFIABLY AFRAID because CALLISTO WAS ORIGINALLY GONNA SLIT HER THROAT, and instead reduced it to her being NERVOUS about a LIE, instead of her literally FEARING for her LIFE.
The manhwa can put comedic effects, OK, fine, I get that, but did it REALLY have to cut out about some scenes just to DOWNPLAY Siyeon's trauma and the fact Callisto tried to kill her??
Siyeon is more emotional in the novel, and ALL graphic scenes are heavily reduced to make it more sparkly and romantical since THAT'S just how the ARTSTYLE and NARRATIVE is, so if you want to see how the author intended them to be, give the novel a try.
Hello, I hope you’re doing well! I wanted to ask your opinion on two things.
1. Would you ever consider making a list of Callisto’s wrongdoings in the future? I’d love to see a character analysis on him, especially since most discussions about him seem to focus only on his love for Penelope rather than his actual character.
2. Although we didn’t see much of Callisto and Penelope as parents, do you think they would be good ones? I’m not sure, but I noticed some red flags in how they treated Judith. I don’t know if it’s a tradition or something, but why is a three-year-old living in a palace of her own? Even with maids and attendants, shouldn’t she be closer to Penelope and Callisto’s room? There’s also a scene where Judith says “papa” and Callisto tells her to call him Your Majesty or Father from now on. Maybe I’m overthinking it, but these moment didn’t sit well with me.
1. Would you ever consider making a list of Callisto’s wrongdoings in the future? I’d love to see a character analysis on him, especially since most discussions about him seem to focus only on his love for Penelope rather than his actual character.
Yes, I'm considering that, since I noticed that the manhwa ver. ACTIVELY SOFTENS Callisto even BEFORE he genuinely liked Siyeon, which I think is so that his more undesirable traits (like his sadistic tendencies) would be less pronounced to the readers.
The narrative doesn't want him to be a 'red flag', he is supposed to be a likeable ML, that's why there are so many 'cute and funny' moments between them, and chibi drawings of him to make him seem less scary.
While that certainly worked, it also makes people take him less seriously since (heavy on the manhwa) the story was never keen on showing the FULL extent of his selfishness, nor treat side characters as people.
"It's a historical manhwa, and at first Siyeon thought it was just a game-" to be fair, in the first place, yes, that's how the story presented itself. That's why it's so important just WHAT was shown and HOW it was shown as.
The reason I think people talk more about Callisto as a love interest and less about him as a character or person is because THAT is how the narrative prefers to PRESENT him as. It doesn’t want to show him too much as his own person other than "Siyeon's boy", and so also downplays the times where he was 'against' her, as well as some scenes of his violence.
An example is the garden scene where he was about to kill Siyeon by raising his sword to cut her down.
Take a look here in the manhwa version:
Then here is how he is portrayed in the novel:
I felt like I might pass out. I couldn’t find the button anywhere. What’s worse, the crown prince was still intent on killing me. He was lifting his sword above his head, preparing to strike.
“W-wait! Wait a second!” I shouted at him.
He tilted his head to the side.
“So you feel more like talking now, do you?”
In this case of the manhwa, there was a certain detachment between Callisto and the sword (even putting them in separate panels). It didn't even fully show him holding the sword when he raised it to kill her since it truly DIDN'T WANT the scene to leave an impact on the readers.
More than how he is portrayed less of his own character just to be more palatable as an ML, some of his ACTIONS itself were changed, which while is okay, no doubt made the scenes less impactful.
Look at this manhwa ver. of the second prince's birthday banquet:
(Note that he simply stabbed the assassin...)
(And then walked away.)
Now look at the novel ver:
He DECAPITATED the assassin and THREW the head to the second prince's feet.
In comparison of the manhwa and novel, the former clearly waters down his actions and makes him seem more reasonable, covering his unpalatable sides like how unnecessary it was to be extra morbid for the sake of it.
"He barely grazed Siyeon's neck tho-" in the manhwa, yes.
Here, we can see that Siyeon doesn't have any injury on her or anything; just the fabric was cut.
We can also see here that while Callisto was holding her at swordpoint, he was rather 'loose' in it and didn't truly press the blade to her neck that much.
The novel did no such thing.
The scene was definitely more 'romantic' in the manhwa, which is why many tend to just glaze over the fact that Siyeon was ACTUALLY close to being KILLED just like that. Callisto was really going to kill her in that moment had she not done what she did.
In the novel, however, we were spared no expense on just how WILLING Callisto was to kill Siyeon and how much he ENJOYED her being afraid of him.
While both overall showed that he wasn't afraid of confrontations, had some sadism in him, and found Siyeon's lie of liking him as amusing, it was the manhwa ver. that ROMANTICIZED it and made it look MUCH LESS life-threatening.
I'll definitely do an actual analysis on him in the future when I have time for it. This was more on about how the manhwa diluted his character, but it really goes to show just how much of it was INTENDED to be that way.
2. Although we didn’t see much of Callisto and Penelope as parents, do you think they would be good ones? I’m not sure, but I noticed some red flags in how they treated Judith. I don’t know if it’s a tradition or something, but why is a three-year-old living in a palace of her own? Even with maids and attendants, shouldn't she be closer to Penelope and Callisto’s room? There’s also a scene where Judith says “papa” and Callisto tells her to call him Your Majesty or Father from now on. Maybe I’m overthinking it, but these moments didn’t sit well with me.
(First off, I was gonna put more pics as evidence, but apparently there's a 10 only limit in Tumblr smh. Anyway, I'll just copy-paste from the novel directly.)
I think Siyeon and Callisto were shown as good parents. They're not perfect, and they clearly sort of project what they wish they had onto their own daughter, which is love, attention, freedom, and anything she wants.
They're protective, as expected, given their own childhood, and Judith not only being their baby, but also her abilities and the people that are against her being Callisto’s successor.
The palace thing, I assume, is their way of protecting Judith from politics and other 'adult' stuff. While there are cons to it, I can understand the pros that come with it since not only does having a separate space JUST FOR JUDITH herself to live in, but it also lessens the chances of people getting into contact with her as compared to if she had been raised in the main palace (where nobles can have access to if they were summoned, if there were parties, etc.)
Their dynamics as parents were shown in Special Side Story Chapter 3:
My child was gentle and well-behaved for the most part, but when she made trouble, the scale of it was beyond belief.
---
(From the same chapter, here is Siyeon and Callisto’s chat while Judith was asleep)
“She’s only being so rude to you because you’re too soft on her.”
“And you’re too strict with her.”
“You never scold her at all.” I wanted our child to have all the power and glory the world had to offer, and I would make it so. I didn’t want, however, for her to become an ill-mannered, arrogant, reckless person.
Basically, Siyeon trusts Judith but isn't afraid to scold her when she does wrong, while Callisto is a major pushover when it comes to her.
I do think they have their own rooms in Judith's palace since it was implied in Special Side Story Chapter 4 that they stayed in the princess' palace when their daughter was just born:
It had been when Judith had just started mumbling things that weren’t quite full words. Callisto and I had been getting rather handsy in the princess’s palace. Because we’d done nothing but hold hands at night for a long time after having the baby, our passion for one another had ignited without warning.
There was also the implication that they held back their passion in favor of taking care of Judith first. They PRIORITIZED Judith over their own wants.
And as for this scene:
Callisto was by our side in an instant, hugging us both and muttering darkly, “Don’t you worry. Even if she were to leave us, I would chase her to the ends of the earth to bring her back. I’d dive into hell if I needed to.”
“Why would you say something like that in front of Judith?” I scolded him, but the feeling of being held against his muscular chest immediately slowed my heart rate.
“Daddy! Daddy!” Judith, who’d stopped crying completely by now, reached out for Callisto to pick her up.
He took her in his arms and pressed a kiss to her cheek. “Not Daddy. From now on you should call me Father or Your Majesty.”
“Your... mighty?” she said, tilting her head cutely and giggling. Then she took a fistful of the emperor’s hair in each hand and started tugging enthusiastically as she shouted, “High and mighty! You’re high and mighty!”
“Never mind... just call me Father.”
Though it's understandable to just assume Callisto told Judith to call him 'Father' or 'Your Majesty' to be distant or cold since his reasoning wasn't explained and it was confusing at first, if you look at it with the context of how protective and a pushover he is over both Siyeon and Judith, it really MAKES SENSE.
It’s to protect themselves.
I feel like it was this moment where he realized he can't be too soft on Judith (since before that he always just does what she wants) and sets to try and make it right.
There's no way it was intended to be negative when, along with it, he KISSED Judith's cheek, which is clearly AFFECTIONATE. He didn't say it out of malice or coldness.
He's still the emperor. That's something he should remember, and DID remember when his family was in a vulnerable moment. Because it's just in his nature to become 'tough' in order to protect himself (and by now, extension of Siyeon and Judith).
He may be soft to them, but not to others, and to just let his 'weakness' show to those that will take advantage of it wasn't something he'll allow.
He’s both indirectly teaching Judith the way nobility goes and reinforcing his own image as someone who must always project strength and dignity, for the purpose of discouraging people that might wish harm on them.
Think about it, he was always fine with 'daddy' up until this scene when he saw both his wife and daughter crying. The change was BECAUSE he didn't want to see them THIS anguished again, hurt by something he failed to protect them from because he was away for work (remember that he worked late because he looked for Judith who went under the palace).
In a way, probably in his mind, this incident could be taken as his failure to discipline Judith, which led to both her and Siyeon hurt in the end.
It's less about distancing himself emotionally and more about shielding his family. Basically a method of making sure his softness isn’t exploited by those who look for his weaknesses, INCLUDING Judith.
By telling Judith to call him a formal title instead, Callisto is NOT rejecting her love, just preserving the structure and respect his role as a father and the emperor demands. It's a 'correction' that shows his character as a man both ruthless in duty and tender in love; being a father needs a mix of both.
In short, while Judith’s “daddy” is innocent and familial, Callisto’s insistence of a more formal "father" or "your majesty" was his way of merging his identity as a father and an emperor, for the sake of protecting his family from both outsiders and themselves.
Overall, I think that even if they only care about themselves and those close to them, they'd still be good parents. At worst, they may spoil Judith too much, and probably have some trouble when her rebellious phase comes and she'll see them as overprotective like many sheltered teens do their parents, but they'll still do their best.
I appreciate the ask, enchantedquill13! Hope you're doing well, too.
Y'know reading your post about that anon who acted like you're just being mindlessly critical and hateful is so good, cuz when will this attitude where just because someone is critical, they're automatically not allowed to even argue? VADD is fairly a toxic cesspool I had refused to jump in, only see posts where ppl talk openly and honestly about how bad it is
VADD is honestly a good life lesson in Fiction for me, it's basically proof to see just how Media literacy is non-existent and biases are terrible to the point, you can't say anything without others coming at you like cutthroat knives, there's nothing wrong with being biased about a character, it's another story when you act like another one is bad compared to your faves even when they do the exact same thing, it's hypocritical at best, it's funny though, they do say what you see is how you are, the state of your emotions, I can say some Callisto's fans are as hypocritical as he is, you don't get to act "Oh I'm so pitiful" after a long history of being a tyrannical monster, I prefer someone like Eros from Your Throne, the guy has a Greece origin name and the same title as Callisto but Eros' character is handled way better, why? He's written to be hateful and disgusting and that's exactly what he makes the readers feel: Hateful and disgusted
There's nothing wrong with having disastrous characters, what is wrong is the narrative being the biggest hypocrite by treating them as what they're NOT, not what they are
I would rather Callisto stay a well-written asshole and have anyone call him out on him being disgusting, then whatever he is now
EXACTLY. I totally agree with you. People often dismiss genuine criticism as “mindless hate” rather than consider its legibility. We shouldn’t have to tiptoe around every negative observation just because it’s not what we want to hear.
It’s not about being biased in favor of your favorite characters, it’s about REALLY SEEING what the story gives us (even though there are a hella lot of plotholes; so ig we just have to make do with it).
SOME Callisto fans never want to admit his wrongdoings, instead excusing it as something like "Oh, he almost got assassinated as a child, you can't blame him-" YES WE CAN, his original plan and intention for becoming emperor was literally to take the ENTIRE EMPIRE DOWN WITH HIM.
Listen, I feel for him, really. It must have been terrible the way he grew up, but that is NOT justification to plan genocide (he never said he'll 'kill' them, per se, but he clearly intended to ruin the MILLIONS of lives within his empire, aka 'destroy the empire').
It gives reason to his behavior but doesn't excuse it. Yes, he changed his mind about it after he met Siyeon, but are we REALLY going to ignore the fact that he is GENUINELY SELFISH?
No, don't just say "but he's turned a new leaf, he loves Siyeon so much, he's willing to die for her and give her everything" like it's a big deal when, in the first place, he's willing to take down everything or kill anyone for NO REASON other than that he "wanted to". (Literally, Siyeon herself died so many times in game because of him, he is THAT uncaring of human lives.)
It really takes the awe out of it when you think about how lowly he considers human life in general, and how willing he is to kill someone or an entire empire that it WOULDN'T EVEN BE A BIG DEAL to him that he'll do it if it concerns his loved ones.
Then again, it's understandable to want someone who won't hesitate to put you first even at the cost of others (which is why I think people love Callisto so much, since he's loyal despite being selfish and possessive), but at the same time, let's not act like he's NOT a bad person.
"But he's a great husband-" and? Being a good spouse is different from being a decent human being. "He's still the ML of the story-" no one needs to like him just because of his role. "Idc, I still like him, he's my husbando even if he's crazy-" good for you, just don't be a hypocrite and hate someone for the same reason you love him.
Eros from Your Throne is a great example of a character who is handled in a way that makes you feel exactly what the narrative intends, though I have to say that Callisto still somewhat does that, too (considering the majority of the community adore him) despite some of us not getting the hype.
Anyway, it's always good to be able and willing to point out inconsistencies or call hypocrisy for what it is. Media literacy really is not common in everyone, but people should still try engaging honestly - even if it stings- and recognize that they don't need to romanticize a character to justify liking them, and a well-written asshole can still be compelling.
I really don't mind it when people love their fave characters enough to glaze them (I literally love Penelope enough to begin learning how to draw), but let's remember to cultivate media literacy and honest engagement, ESPECIALLY since one of the main themes of VADTD is not taking everything at face value and instead looking deeper.
At least that's what I got when the novel kept dropping bombs like the details on how Penelope was neglected and reduced to a "childish idiot", Siyeon is a piece of Penelope’s soul, Yvonne is already dead and Leila’s using the body as a vessel, etc. (Though it's a shame none of the characters really grew as people).
Who hurt you so much or why are you so angry about a novel? It's almost like you're just another attempt at being a ragebaiting account about VADTD and I'm sick of people like you, who excuse themselves by saying that it's your opinion and end up doing what you criticize other fans for doing with all possible malice. Other people have already had your opinion too, and with almost the same words, it's even strange that you end up repeating their same patterns. But in the end we all are or were part of that chain of hate that makes us act like rabid dogs following a car that will take us nowhere. I hope you can break the cycle someday.
You really gonna give me that block paragraph anonymously, huh?
First off, I don’t need to be unhappy to have an opinion that isn’t just praise. While I do think the premise was good, that doesn’t change the fact that it wasn’t executed well. That’s why even the side characters don’t feel human.
Second, I assume what you said of me “doing what you criticize other fans for” comes from how I’ve said I like Leila and wanted to see more of her, while saying that Callisto's boring and overrated.
So let me clarify what I meant, since it seems like my words are reduced to just "oh, Callisto sucks.”
If someone likes Callisto but hates Eckles or Derrick for the SAME possessive behavior, THAT is a double standard. My issue isn’t with liking villains or morally gray characters, it’s with how people selectively excuse bad behavior in him while condemning the other two for doing the exact same thing.
I condemn Leila for being a maniac who feeds on human lives, just as I condemn Callisto for his own misdeeds. Like I said before “Don't treat one character as if they're actual people whose bad deeds should be taken seriously, then another as a fictional husbando whose actions are all okay because it's fictional." and I stand by that.
When I said it, I was pointing out how the DITOEFTV fandom constantly shifts between “fiction is just fiction” and “fiction has real-world implications” depending on what they want to see. If you say Derrick and Eckles are bad because they’re possessive, but Callisto’s possessiveness is fine because it’s fictional, that’s just contradictory and hypocritical.
That’s why this ISN'T the same as what I criticize others for. Because while I’m interested in Leila as a character, I have NEVER excused or justified her actions. I’ve specifically stated before in a previous post that I don’t see the Leila x Penelope ship as romantic.
My interest is in how they spent dozens of loops together, most likely having countless clashes that I think a lot of people would have loved to see.
Leila is clearly a HORRIBLE person, possibly the worst in the cast. And that’s EXACTLY why I would have loved to see her interactions with Penelope - someone who is practically her opposite (and has always tried to stop her in the loops). It’s really such a shame the story never explored that complexity despite the potential.
Wanting Leila and Penelope to have had more screentime because not just their DYNAMIC but also THEY THEMSELVES could have been interesting is NOT THE SAME as the people I criticize for excusing Callisto’s behavior but then turn around and shame Eckles and Derrick for the SAME thing. (I don't like them either, but again, Callisto put a magic tracker on Siyeon and locked her in her room before, and you seriously cannot say that would have been something Eckles and Derrick wouldn't do, because they ARE similar).
Now, as for you saying that many others share the same criticisms of this novel as me, what exactly is wrong with that? Obviously, if some people love it, others will dislike it. But, it's like you find ONLY the latter strange. It’s as if you think any criticism is inherently bad and should be rid off unless it aligns with popular opinion.
If that’s not what you meant, maybe you should clarify it next time.
And of course, I know we’re part of the same fandom. But when you say I should “break the cycle,” you make it sound like I’m mindlessly hating for no reason.
I’ve clearly explained my thoughts and my reasoning for them.
YOU HAVEN'T, though, have you? All you did was say "you're all the same, hope you get better", acting like you're on a higher moral ground. You AREN'T, buddy. You're just butt-hurt there are people who give valid criticism on your 'precious' novel.
Like anyone else, I can change my mind based on new information. I am open to change, but since nothing I said was wrong, I don’t see any reason to.
And if there are, then people should point it out to me and hopefully not just be as cowardly as you.
If you think something I said is wrong, then ACTUALLY POINT IT OUT out instead of dropping a vague and passive-aggressive message that was NOT ONLY ANONYMOUS, but also had NO REAL ARGUMENT to it.
Anyway, thanks for the ask, I’ll be rereading the novel later to see if there’s anything I missed.
Someone has to help me understand why I don't like Callisto and Cha Siyeon AT ALL. But then again, I don't like anyone in there aside from Penelope, and maybe Leila, whose blankness makes her somewhat interesting to think about.
I think in Penelope's case it's because she's the type of lead we usually root for in these kinds of genre.
And yet even with such little information, we can somewhat get the gist of it. Penelope, despite being emotionally immature, must have had the mentality of a BEAST (taking her soul dozens of loops to shatter) while having a pure heart (as proven by how she still tried to save the same people that would kill her time and time again).
Compared to that, Cha Siyeon frankly only cares about herself or those she cares about (notice how she uses and can discard people, only shows pity when she sees others similar to her past, and even victim-blames Penelope many times). It is understandable to be that human, but when you look back at her after thinking more on what Penelope’s story was, it really just feels disappointing.
Just imagine for at least a minute on just how wild it would have been to get at least ONE side story of Penelope suffering throughout the loops, the number of deaths she experiences, and desperation of STILL trying despite always losing. It's a determination that is so hopeful and engaging, especially considering just how much she was already suffering. Even Siyeon can't handle that as she gave up after Eckles betrayed her.
Callisto is your typical romance male lead, really. Sad backstory, doesn't care about anything but himself and those he's personally affiliated with, and extremely violent (like many men lol). I don't get all the hype about him.
His possessiveness was not romantic at all and he is much more similar to Eckles and Derrick than people are comfortable of admitting. All three of these men are extremely controlling, as clear by their actions, and Callisto who locked Cha Siyeon up in a room later on, and put a magic tracking device on her is no different.
Stop cherrypicking. It really does get annoying when someone hates a character for something that another character is loved for. A great example of this is how people hate Eckles' 'yandere-ness' over Siyeon and his desire to keep her to himself, then go "uwu, Callisto so manly and romantic, he threatened whoever Siyeon is interested in (even BEFORE they were official)." Fucking hypocrites.
Callisto’s fear of losing Cha Siyeon should NOT have overrode her most basic human rights (i dont even like her, but cmon, she's entitled to that much). Don't treat one character as if they're actual people whose bad deeds should be taken seriously, then another as a fictional husbando whose actions are all okay because it's fictional.
I likely just read too many romances, but literally everything about him was predictable (but then again, perhaps a lot of the characters are).
Maybe I'm being a bit too harsh. There are simply too many plot holes, in general, and the system and mechanics are underdeveloped.
I seriously am just considering making myself content. I doubt there are a lot of people who share similar views (that much is clear from the amount of glazing around), but I stand by everything I say. I like the story overall, and especially those that are interesting to me. Personal preference.
