jbnova: Hello.
[5:22 PM] fanficinpopculture: hi
[5:22 PM] jbnova: Welcome to the chat.
[5:22 PM] fanficinpopculture: thanks,
[5:22 PM] jbnova: So what brings you by?
[5:23 PM] fanficinpopculture: I need rt awsome fandoms help with a project on fanfiction I'm doing but if you are not intrested I totally understand :)
[5:23 PM] jbnova: I'm very interested.
[5:23 PM] acindra: what's the project about
[5:23 PM] acindra: also hi nova, tim
[5:23 PM] jbnova: Welcome back Cin.
[5:24 PM] acindra: aw i missed maris
[5:24 PM] timothay: Hey cin
[5:24 PM] fanficinpopculture: the project is just about fanfiction really and how it fits into popculture and if it DOES fit into popculture.
[5:24 PM] acindra: how would you need us to participate?
[5:26 PM] fanficinpopculture: I want to have this portion of the project where instead of me just saying my opinion and scholarly article sources I want it to be more of a discussion
[5:26 PM] fanficinpopculture: The topic is Shipping or Slash and why it happens
[5:26 PM] acindra: wouldn't that lose you credibility since you're talking to a group of ficcers?
[5:27 PM] jbnova: Not necessarily.
[5:27 PM] fanficinpopculture: For this portion not really because I'm asking people who do it why they do it,
[5:27 PM] jbnova: And Maris just left.
[5:27 PM] fanficinpopculture: I would lose credibility if I asked you guys if fanfiction was good or not :)
[5:28 PM] jbnova: Unfortunately, Cin and I are not very active in the writing side.
[5:28 PM] acindra: liol
[5:28 PM] acindra: not true anymore >.>
[5:28 PM] jbnova: Oh?
[5:28 PM] acindra: been writing a lot since the ss thing came out. none of it is edited tho
[5:29 PM] fanficinpopculture: writing is wriing, and you can ship characters together without nessisaryly creating content right?
[5:29 PM] acindra: yeah
[5:29 PM] jbnova: I also don't have a particular ship.
[5:30 PM] fanficinpopculture: no worries the questions are really about ships themseves but why people might do them
[5:31 PM] acindra: go for it then
[5:31 PM] jbnova: Ask away.
[5:32 PM] fanficinpopculture: What do you guys think shipping is?
[5:32 PM] jbnova: It gets its name from "relation*ship*, referring to a romantic pairing.
[5:32 PM] jbnova: So it'd be any group of 2 or more people in a meaningful relationship surpassing friendship, often a romantic or sexual one.
[5:32 PM] acindra: though it's not necessarily romantic when you say you ship people
[5:32 PM] acindra: ye
[5:33 PM] jbnova: I'm referring explicitly to ships, not BROTP.
[5:33 PM] acindra: you can still ship aromantic people
[5:33 PM] jbnova: I know.
[5:34 PM] jbnova: But aromantics are often in explicitly sexual or frienship only.
[5:34 PM] fanficinpopculture: Do you guys think that shipping is a crutial part of fanfiction?
[5:34 PM] acindra: generally i'd say it's the desire to have 2+ characters having a relationship that's more than just friendship
[5:35 PM] acindra: characters including real people's camera persona
[5:35 PM] acindra: no
[5:35 PM] jbnova: I wouldn't say it's crucial.
[5:35 PM] acindra: it's a large part of it but it's not a necessity
[5:35 PM] jbnova: A fanfic can consist entirely of a storyline you want to see.
[5:35 PM] jbnova: Like a group of people go to the zoo.
[5:35 PM] acindra: for example harry as a slytherin
[5:36 PM] jbnova: Harry as a Slytherin would be an example of an AU, or Alternate Universe.
[5:36 PM] jbnova: Where fans write them to speculate "What Ifs?".
[5:36 PM] acindra: fanfiction tends to explore personalities
[5:37 PM] acindra: and how characters react to other characters and situations
[5:37 PM] jbnova: It's mostly about character dynamics.
[5:37 PM] fanficinpopculture: what is the most important part of fanfiction? the "What if" or exploring characters dynamics, or something else?
[5:37 PM] jbnova: It's entirely dependent on the type of fic being written.
[5:37 PM] acindra: and the person reading it
[5:37 PM] jbnova: If it's a "slashfic" then it's the ship.
[5:38 PM] jbnova: If it's just an unseen event as depicted by the author, it's character dynamics.
[5:38 PM] jbnova: If it's the "What If" then it's "How would this character act under these conditions?".
[5:39 PM] acindra: this mob just dropped a hat that's literally a cat
[5:39 PM] jbnova: In Trove?
[5:39 PM] fanficinpopculture: Would it be fair to say then that fanfiction is simply a medium and what happens depends solely on the people using it
[5:39 PM] jbnova: Yes.
[5:39 PM] acindra: yes. to both
[5:40 PM] jbnova: Essentially fanfiction is taking a published and established work and putting your own spin on it.
[5:40 PM] jbnova: "Novels are just published original fanfiction."
[5:41 PM] acindra: in our case the piece of work is the camera personalities of roosterteeth employees
[5:41 PM] jbnova: For instance, I am in the middle of writing a fanfiction based on Achievement Hunter in an Alternate Universe of Avatar: The Last Airbender.
[5:41 PM] jbnova: It focuses on the character dynamics and relationships in a platonic manner, as well as them existing in that setting.
[5:43 PM] fanficinpopculture: So fanfiction is an exploration of types and that shipping is just exploring a character in a different way?
[5:43 PM] acindra: yes
[5:43 PM] jbnova: Indeed.
[5:43 PM] acindra: there's also the lack of mogai relationships in pop culture
[5:43 PM] fanficinpopculture: But why do you think that shipping is so popular?
[5:44 PM] acindra: that makes fanfiction appealing
[5:44 PM] acindra: because people like having opinions
[5:44 PM] acindra: they like characters and putting them together
[5:44 PM] jbnova: I think shipping is popular because people like the idea of Character A and B, and sometimes A+, in a relationship.
[5:45 PM] fanficinpopculture: and maybe putting some of their identity into something they love
[5:45 PM] acindra: it's like in disney movies we get presented two characters who oftentimes are unlikely to get together
[5:45 PM] jbnova: I know that there are fanfic writers who write solely for recognition.
[5:45 PM] acindra: but they do end up getting together
[5:45 PM] acindra: like kovu and kiara
[5:46 PM] jbnova: Is that the Princess and the Frog remake?
[5:46 PM] acindra: sometimes we see personalities that would go well together in other works that aren't explored in said work
[5:46 PM] acindra: no that's lion king 2
[5:46 PM] jbnova: There's a Lion King 2?
[5:46 PM] jbnova: So there is.
[5:46 PM] acindra: you haven't seen lion king 2?
[5:46 PM] fanficinpopculture: and a lion king 1/2
[5:46 PM] acindra: IT HAS THE BEST MUSIC NOVA
[5:46 PM] jbnova: Cin you know I don't like Disney.
[5:46 PM] acindra: you make me sad
[5:47 PM] jbnova: What else is new.
[5:47 PM] jbnova: Aw, Maris' internet got capped again.
[5:47 PM] acindra: it's about that time yeah
[5:48 PM] fanficinpopculture: Do you guys think that a reason why there is a lot of male/male pairings in fanfiction is becuase there is a lack of strong female characters? (ie sherlock or supernatural)
[5:49 PM] acindra: partially that and partially the lack of gay/mogai characters
[5:49 PM] jbnova: Though that issue is mostly on Tumblr, it has slowly began to spread as a more reasonable belief
[5:50 PM] jbnova: A prime example is the Naruto fandom that violently proclaimed that Naruto and Sasuke are "totally gay for each other".
[5:50 PM] jbnova: And led to a significant amount of Naruto/Sasuke fanfiction alongside Naruto/Hinata and Sasuke/Sakura.
[5:51 PM] fanficinpopculture: like have a sexuality enbellished upon the character?
[5:51 PM] jbnova: Yes.
[5:52 PM] jbnova: Often times, and especially in the RT fandom, sexuality is embellished.
[5:52 PM] jbnova: Sometimes gay, pansexual, asexual, anything in the sexuality spectrum.
[5:52 PM] jbnova: As well as gender, though I believe that's specific to Tumblr and AO3.
[5:53 PM] fanficinpopculture: What are your views on this? is this good, bad, or something that just happens?
[5:53 PM] acindra: i disagree
[5:53 PM] acindra: there was plenty of gender themed fics on livejournal
[5:53 PM] jbnova: I will concede on that as I do not actively read fanfiction.
[5:53 PM] acindra: i think it's a good thing
[5:53 PM] acindra: for multiple reasons
[5:53 PM] acindra: the first being people are reading
[5:53 PM] jbnova: It's an outlet for people who are those "invisible" genders and sexualities to have a character that is.
[5:54 PM] acindra: representation is important
[5:54 PM] jbnova: I have seen numerous fics of transgender characters when the "canon" version of those characters are cisgender.
[5:54 PM] jbnova: Is it bad? No.
[5:54 PM] acindra: it helps people be more open minded about their peers
[5:54 PM] acindra: well. you don't know that
[5:55 PM] acindra: unless they're stated as explicitly cisgender they could be trans or non binary and it's just never discussed
[5:55 PM] acindra: like dumbledore being gay.
[5:55 PM] jbnova: That was explicitly stated.
[5:55 PM] acindra: though tbh that was a cheap way to say it. it should've been in the book
[5:55 PM] jbnova: Yes it was.
[5:55 PM] acindra: yes after the books were done
[5:55 PM] jbnova: I thought it was during Book 7?
[5:55 PM] acindra: no
[5:55 PM] acindra: it was never said in the books
[5:56 PM] jbnova: No, I meant that she revealed it before Book 7 was published.
[5:56 PM] jbnova: I know it was never stated but for World of Author.
[5:56 PM] acindra: either way it wasn't actually in the book, it's an author's headcannon but that means jack shit in the content
[5:56 PM] fanficinpopculture: Do you feel that Rowling was swayed by the fandom to say that? Or was that he true intentions from the start
[5:57 PM] acindra: it doesn't matter either way
[5:57 PM] jbnova: It had no impact on the story.
[5:57 PM] jbnova: Dumbledore could have been a non-binary pansexual and it would have changed nothing.
[5:57 PM] jbnova: J. K. Rowling would have written Dumbledore the exact same way.
[5:59 PM] jbnova: It was a poor copout to the lack of representation.
[5:59 PM] jbnova: A proper example is in Game of Thrones were there are characters explicitly shown to be gay and an entire culture of agender individuals.
[5:59 PM] acindra: yess
[5:59 PM] jbnova: But I digress, as this topic is no longer about fanfiction.
[6:00 PM] jbnova: Cin, you read A Song of Ice and Fire, right?
[6:00 PM] acindra: no
[6:00 PM] jbnova: Ah.
[6:00 PM] jbnova: Well, there's a group of (initally) male warriors who at birth have their junk cut off and trained to be warriors.
[6:00 PM] acindra: the dothraki ye
[6:00 PM] acindra: no
[6:00 PM] jbnova: Not Dothraki.
[6:00 PM] fanficinpopculture: But why is there a lack of represenation in media?
[6:01 PM] jbnova: The Unsullied.
[6:01 PM] acindra: the dudes dragon lady gets
[6:01 PM] jbnova: Yes.
[6:01 PM] acindra: i'm waiting for the last book to actually read it
[6:01 PM] jbnova: The dudes the bi or pansexual dragon queen gets.
[6:01 PM] acindra: i fucking hate unfinished stories
[6:01 PM] acindra: why?
[6:01 PM] acindra: because our media and government is still full of racist bigoted sexist assholes
[6:02 PM] jbnova: And some media outlets are just uninformed.
[6:02 PM] acindra: it's getting better. but it's slow
[6:02 PM] jbnova: Not everyone is a racist, bigoted, sexist.
[6:02 PM] acindra: but a lot of the producers are
[6:02 PM] jbnova: Yes.
[6:02 PM] acindra: like bubbline not being able to happen
[6:02 PM] jbnova: Which is BS, as it's super canon.
[6:03 PM] jbnova: "Why isn't PB into Finn?" "Because she's a hardcore lesbian with a vampire."
[6:03 PM] jbnova: A demisexual lesbian at that.
[6:03 PM] acindra: plus he's like 12
[6:03 PM] jbnova: Demisexual is the one where you have to know the person first, right?
[6:03 PM] acindra: ye
[6:04 PM] jbnova: Also yes Finn is 14 or something and PB is at least several hundred years old.
[6:04 PM] fanficinpopculture: Sodo you think that fanfiction is created to combat the hetronormative tendencies of today's media?
[6:04 PM] jbnova: No. Not in the slightest.
[6:04 PM] jbnova: It was because fans wanted events to happen that didn't happen in canon.
[6:05 PM] jbnova: I must go now.
[6:05 PM] fanficinpopculture: okay thanks for the help :)
[6:05 PM] fanficinpopculture: it was super intresting
[6:05 PM] acindra: no problem
[6:05 PM] fanficinpopculture: can i post this on the blog portion of the project?
[6:05 PM] acindra: sure
[6:05 PM] acindra: but link us to it
[6:06 PM] acindra: or is it an essay?
[6:06 PM] acindra: either way i would like to see the completed project
[6:06 PM] fanficinpopculture: it's a blog,
[6:06 PM] fanficinpopculture: want a link?
[6:06 PM] acindra: yes
[6:06 PM] fanficinpopculture: http: