#lichloved

[virovac]

An unfulfilled niche

Hearing the outcry of people against ships with young or middle aged woman with corpselike men, 

I have decided we need more fiction where corpselike women are with attractive young guys.

[spanx-the-weasel]

The Weasel Speaks! 1.2: Okay. Last thing I'm going to say. I'm done.

     Understanding my PRIMUS objection requires understanding a bit about the lore.  I’ll keep it brief.

     PRIMUS is the Paranormal Research and Investigation Mission of the United States.  A militarized law enforcement agency created in response to superpower threats.  According to standing Federal Law, discrimination due to sexual orientation is illegal.  As a means to avoid that issue outright, sexual orientation is not documented as attempts to do so threaten the question of discrimination. Thus, no PRIMUS profile of personnel or metahumans would make explicit reference.  It isn’t done in the military.  It isn’t done in law enforcement.  It would not be done in PRIMUS.  Period.  Anybody posting sexual orientation within the context of a government dossier is doing it wrong, and for the worst reasons. As a slight aside, I’m actually surprised to see the matter of sexuality contrasted against favorite color and a secret identity.  I’ll just…Pointedly disagree and leave it at that.

The mention of how orientation posting becomes a convenience tool for filtering sexual roleplay preferences at a glance.  Consider this within the context of the chronic-open-erp-in-a-teen-rated-game bit, and there’s your answer for why it would deserve it’s special little corner in the Bingo.

-Lichloved

Okay, that's it. Ladies and gentlemen, this is the last time I'm going to respond to this particular thread because, honestly, there's nothing else I can really say at this point without repeating myself. All this post is going to do is address his reply and I'm going to leave it at that. First of all. Are you serious? Are you actually god damned serious? You are taking www.primusdatabase.com completely and totally seriously. Completely cannon. 100% the actual real deal thing? I really don't know what words to use to describe what I'm feeling right now. Confusion? Outrage? Dying on the inside? I'm at a loss. I want you to look at that website. If you are going to say that the Primus Database website is completely cannon and in character, then you must also accept that many of the pages are made to look super fancy and not at all official. You would have to accept that there is information often posted on the Primus Database that shouldn't even be there (not just because it would be illegal in that context but also because it might be information that they shouldn't even have access to). You would have to accept that the Primus Database has, in many cases, made the secret identity of more then a few people very easily accessible to anyone with the right clearance, a clearance that is never openly stated in the game and can easily be stretched to mean someone with a low security level if the player saw fit (and considering the number of characters with a "high clearance" level, that's a dangerous spot to be treading). You might even have to accept that PRIMUS apparently has way too much time on their hands and selects one profile to be page of the month. Now, I might agree with you if and only if the PRIMUS Database profile explicitly states that it is, indeed, a PRIMUS dossier, but otherwise this is just going too far. It is one thing to force your own personal ideals upon a description and attempt to dictate (in the stead of advising) what sort of details should be in someone's description. But to go so far as to claim that something as obviously not in cannon as the PRIMUS Database website is actually cannon is going well beyond a few thousand lines of crazy. The Primus Database is named this because it gives a link to Champions Online. It is just like Virtue Verse (named after the primary roleplay server) of City of Heroes fame. A collection of character profiles. Going to go so far as to state that the Primus Database website is completely cannon is a totally idiotic thing to say, let alone believe. I am half tempted to contact the owners of the website and ask if they believe the entire website should be taken as pure cannon. No, wait, I was tempted and I did. I contacted the current lead administrator of the Primus Database website and asked him if the website should be taken completely in cannon. I am quoting directly from @Doctor_Awesome: "The Primus Website can be considered IC and OOC - General rule of thumb is it is extremely OOC - and all information used off of it without that information being somewhat general about your character is meta-gaming... Some posters on Primus post IC things your character could know. Some posters on Primus post OOC things just for context of what a bad ass character you are. Nearly no one at all ever on Primus posts IC things that only PRIMUS would know - and things you'd need clearance for." So. If simple common sense isn't enough, the actual administrator for PRIMUS Database has basically said that the website should not be held to the standards of the actual database. If the lead administrator of PRIMUS Database wasn't enough to prove that the concept of the website being held in the same standards of federal law I dare you, I fucking dare you to try and come up with a rebuttal besides, "because I feel that this is the case." Because if you refuse to accept the truth after hearing it from the very person who leads administrative efforts on the website, I doubt any of your opinions can be changed. Next, I would like to point out something to you. As I stated, the only OBVIOUS advantage that it gives is a shortcut for people who are looking to know if they want to attempt anything or not. It is by no means the only reason. Again, as I stated, the advantages, overall, are very slim. Just because you don't think there is any context to posting your character's sexual orientation besides meeting up for sex does not mean that other players only put it on there for that very reason. Even if I am generous and give you that it was originally only used for quick identification as to who people can fuck, it has clearly just become standard practice for many players and just another random tidbit about the character. It adds little and takes little. Although its most overt purpose is, indeed, for those who want an easy means of catching a hook-up, labeling it as only being used for that purpose puts far more people on the spot who don't deserve it then those who might. And, finally...you really weren't seeing what I was trying to show with the examples of colours and secret identities? The first example was a means of showing that, much like the colour green where the colour  doesn't matter unless it's St. Patrick's day or your one of those small niche people who care that much about fashion, posting your character's sexual orientation wont matter unless you're actively looking for a hook-up (the St. Patrick's day example) or you honestly just feel like putting it int here (people who are just that into fashion). Few instances where it actually applies a great benefit means that, just like trying to defend wearing green, posting your character description has few defenses unless it's "St. Patrick's Day" or you just feel like it. And the contrast to the secret identities was to show that, just like posting your secret identity with your character's actual name, it doesn't really do that much for you. There's very little point. Adds little, takes little. And to add onto that, yes, this might be a teen rated game, but not everyone looking for a date in Club Caprice is looking for ERP. How do I know? The same way you know that the opposite is true. I guessed (although my version is a bit more forgiving to the community). As I stated, I'm done. Not going to respond to this thread anymore unless someone else brings it up because it has become very obvious to me that neither of our opinions are going to change (at least on the issue of posting sexual orientation). I am unsure if you were ever open to the concept of your mind changing in the first place, but I'm going to lean towards the best case scenario and just assume that the evidence I could put forward was not sufficient. In Conclusion: Primus Database, by the lead administrator's own admission, should not be taken as the in character actual Primus Database, (again) posting your character's orientation doesn't have many benefits or disadvantages (with the exception being people looking for a hook-up), and I'm stopping this thread before it becomes an endless loop of you saying my evidence isn't good enough and me trying to defend something which has very little weight to it to begin with. PS: I know these posts are verbose. I know they are wordy and may seem to be so for no good reason. Believe it or not, this isn't stream of consciousness. It's just how I talk, think, and write. My friends can all attest to me talking like this. So, yes. Verbose. I know. If you keep mentioning that in your replies I'm going to wonder if you've turned into a broken record.

[spanx-the-weasel]

The Weasel Speaks! Episode 1.1: Not good enough? Alright, let's focus here.

"It seems that the core of your argument is that mention of sexual orientation isn’t an overt crime, the same as advertising for erp or anything else explicit.  I’ll grant that, it isn’t something I’d rip on someone alone about.  However…

To start, points are lost for verisimilitude when sexual orientation is posted within the context of a PRIMUS profile.  That shit is kinda illegal and not since just a couple of years ago.

To follow, this is something I’d actually like you to take another shot at.  It’s conceded that simple notice of orientation isn’t explicit invitation for erp or otherwise overtly sexual in nature.  It’s a question of what the point is.  Of what this is meant to communicate to the reader and for what purpose, particularly within the context of Club Caprice."

-Lichloved

Not good enough? Fine, fine, I'll try and elaborate further. I would like to note that I am trying to keep long responses such as this one limited, but since the guy who I initially quoted is the one who asked, I suppose it's only fair I focus in on posting your character's orientation. Besides, with the limited follower base I have right now, hey, might as well have some fun. Likely wont be doing this nearly as often after I get way more, but so long as I have so few, I see no reason in taking some time out of my day to elaborate.

Let me start by saying that if you were to judge if something shouldn't be in a description simply on if something has an actual beneficial purpose besides what is absolutely necessary and not to just what the author feels is important, descriptions would be FAR shorter and would likely look more like a spec sheet then an interesting description of a character (if it's boring, there's less of an incentive to read it). A description is a place for a player to post everything they feel important for a person to know before they begin to roleplay with that character (at the very least, on an OOC level). The fact that there is no harm in posting sexual orientation on these grounds should be enough, but as it isn't, I'll try and give you a few more. Before I do, however, the fact that you said a character's sexual orientation isn't allowed on the PRIMUS Database baffled me. I read through the website's guidelines and it looks like they don't allow things that are sexual in content or the like. That's the closest restriction I found to "sexual orientation". Someone's sexual orientation is not by any means sexual in actual nature. The only people who are likely to freak the fuck out over someone announcing their sexual orientation to the world is Fox News. And, come on. All of the news (especially Fox) is hardwired to freak out over small shit like that and isn't exactly something most people want to emulate. But, alright. It would seem that the fact that there is no harm in actually DOING it isn't enough. You need a flat out advantage for it. Let's see if I can't find a few to quench your thirst for more explanation. One of the hard parts about this is that because of how harmless posting your character's orientation IS, it lacks much firepower in advantages.

It's sort of like asking someone what the difference is between wearing green or not. There's really no real advantage to wearing green unless it's Saint Patrick's day and everyone's being a complete asshole and pinching you (unless your my mum and were lucky enough to be born on that day, in which case, stop pinching that person you ass hat, it's her birthday!). It's much like displaying your character's hero name and their real name when you intend to keep their actual identity secret. You don't really gain anything from posting the real name in addition to the false one except for maybe refreshing your memory in the future, and the only real downside is that meta-gamers can use it for their own purposes. In fact, one could say that posting your orientation is actually less useful to a meta gamer because there's less they can really do with it.

Really, the strongest and only truly obvious advantage is if you're looking to set your character up to more easily find a sexual or romantic partner. And that, my friends, is the wearing green on St. Patrick's Day example. A fairly specific situation that only applies to certain individuals. The advantages to someone who aren't using their descriptions as a shortcut to know if their character is available are very few and pretty damn small. As I have mentioned, it's pretty much just additional icing on the cake and you don't really gain much by adding it or vice versa. If your character is female, straight, and you don't want to constantly get hit on by ERP crazed players playing female characters, the simple mention that your character is straight in a description can reduce that somewhat, or at least quickly put a stop to it. If your female character is bi/lesbian and you don't want your character to get hit on by those people, a simple post of your character's relationship status set to "Not Looking" will generally stave off people who scour descriptions for people they can fuck. The same applies to male characters, however, the danger there is far less. And besides just another fun little tidbit about the character, I honestly have nothing else for you. Again, the problem with defending this is that you're asking me to defend something that adds and takes very little with or without its presence. Just like wearing a different colour shirt, it will mean very little to you if you aren't into fashion or don't care about being pinched by your friends (or so they say. Damn pinching ass hats). In Conclusion: This is a very difficult subject to defend because posting your sexual orientation does almost nothing overtly positive to most and most negative aspects that it can bring are very easily fixed or ignored. It gives little and it takes little. It's like arguing between two brands of bottled water. No matter which you choose, the differences are few and far between. Now if you excuse me, I have to continue working on my full body chain mail in preparation for St. Patrick's Day. Those sons of bitches will regret pinching me this year, oh god yes, they will!! PS: For future reference, save questions, comments and challenges for the "Comments, Questions, Challenges" button at the top of my Tumblr page if you honestly want a response in the future. I don't want to give people the habit of calling me out on their own Tumblr page. If my stuff starts to get re-blogged like crazy, there will eventually only be so much I can view. PSS: Yes, I know this was wordy. I'm just sort of a wordy person.

[spanx-the-weasel]

The Weasel Speaks! Episode 1: Challenge Accepted...sort of!

"Shameless, open sexual content is not ‘mature’ or ‘healthy’ in a teen rated game.  Playing off of a popular fad with little effort to distinguish or develop the character is not ‘mature’ or ‘healthy’ or otherwise something that should be encouraged.

Case in point (Please, oh please, oh fucking PLEASE, I challenge you on this): Explain the point, purpose, or otherwise positive contribution involved in advertising sexual orientation or the specific nature of one’s genitalia in a profile.  I think we’d all like to hear this."

-Lichloved

CHALLENGE ACCEPTED, BEEEOOOOCH! Let me start with the second one. I'm not even going to bother. As I have stated prior, there are some things I agree with CCB on. I do not think that it is a good idea to post that your character is a futa. Now, if someone is dead set on doing that, it's fine. But I'm going to draw the line when they also post that they're an ERPer and warn them to not fucking do that. It's an EXTREMELY bad idea from the standpoint of wanting others to roleplay with you. Although there is nothing wrong with with HAVING a futa character (or hermaphrodite), there is a huge risk of being judged incorrectly. You can have a completely legitimate character who happens to have the opposite gender's genitalia but still be looked down upon with a first impression BECAUSE of the stigma that comes with those characters. Adding on an ERP tag only makes things worse. There is no way I or anyone else can stop you from posting both, but it is advised you do not for the simple fact of people like Club Caprice Bingo might target you and put you on the spot for it without even giving your character a chance. It's a sad fact of the community and not one I see changing any time soon. Do at your own risk. HOWEVER! This is where the challenge accepted comes in! I shall defend posting your character orientation to the best of my ability. First off, there's really no reason you SHOULDN'T post it. Unlike posting that your a futa, you ERP, or both, there is very little if any stigma attached to posting your character's orientation. Second of all, a description, more often then not, contains information that the player wishes to display for others to see (one of the reasons I say I can't stop people from posting that they're an ERPing futa). It's up to them what they put out there for people to see. There's even a risk when it comes to posting information since many people will meta the shit out of it and pull every single lick of information they can out of it and come up with some bullshit reason for it. Because of this, every bit of information one puts out in their description is something the author (or at least authors who have discovered what I mentioned about meta gamers) feels comfortable sharing with the reader or feels is important enough to include in it.

One can make the argument that it promotes characters to try and pick up ones of the same orientation. So? If someone doesn't have their character hit on another because the other person posted their character's orientation, that's the fault of the reader or taking OOC as IC and the risk that the author takes.

My next point comes from the fact that many (and the quoted post up above) seems to believe that if a character posts their sexuality, that instantly means that the person is LOOKING for sexual contact or the like. I personally post my character's orientation and I'm the last person to do it because I want to find a like-minded individual to fuck with words. Finally, to wrap things up overall with sexual content in general, there lies the in game moderation. It is true that most of the RPer community (at least those I have encountered) are 18+, however, that does bring up the point that lewd content in descriptions shouldn't even be there. Well, you know what? There are two ways they combat this. The first is the automatic profanity filter which blocks out words such as fuck, penis, and other words that makes nuns faint. However, the second major force is YOU. If YOU think a description breaches the EULA and puts forward content that you do not believe should be in a teen rated game, then REPORT them. If you honestly care that much, report it. Let the devs decide if the content being put forward does not represent the behavior they want to see in their game and let them deal with it. As cold of a move as it may seem, if your distaste for sexual content is really so strong, it is up to you to help Cryptic police their game. Posting their description up on a website doesn't do anything to get the inappropriate content off of the game. So in conclusion: Not only is there really no significant reason to not post your character's orientation, but the author him or herself is putting it there because they believe it to be important enough to mention. A character's sexual orientation does not mean that there will be ERP or anything inappropriate behavior quickly following. The only reason you shouldn't put it in is if you don't think it's important to mention in a character description, which is entirely a personal preference. However, if you find content within a description that you believe breaches the EULA, then stop whining about it on a blog in the back alleys of Tumblr and put in the five or less minutes it takes to voice your complaint on an in game report form so the devs can examine it and decide for themselves. Hidden Club Caprice Bingo Message: FUTAS! Hit the deck! Take cover! Oh god, the sexual content! It burns! Shield the children! Oh for the love of GOD someone shield the children! PS: Who the hell was encouraging people to use things in popular culture to lazily ham fist their characters to seem more dynamic? Sure as hell wasn't me. I've said it once and I'll say it again: Get creative. If you have to pull from an external source for inspiration, adapt the story and make it your own. Just don't steal it whole sale.