what's wrong with P5A's characterization? (admittedly I haven't been watching it but I thought you liked it o3o;; )
This is mostly aimed at Anne and Ryuji tbh. Ren…..I like his name, as of the later chapters in the manga I think I might Akira’s personality more….mostly cause he really is a newbie goofball and 100% not like what the fandom considers the MC to be like. It’s kinda refreshing (of course the art doesn’t help but I can slowly see some funny quirks).
This all mostly happens in the first 3 episodes, and tbh sours the first dungeon for me.
Anyway from least irritating to most (there’s 4 things but technically the first two are in the same scene so maybe there’s only 3), Ryuji I think is the worst part but Anne’s is so confusing tho she does actually get railroaded back to her game counterpart the early episodes really screw her character over (anyway basically they have some….OOC moments….big ones….important ones). Sorry it’s not SUPER in depth, maybe later I can go frame by frame between the game, anime, and manga.
Anyway under the cut because in this essay I will be (btw sorry if it’s all over the place)….
Let’s start with the weirdest one….when you first meet her, ok well…the first first one is just a minor one the thing RIGHT AFTER is the weirdest one. Ok so there’s more going on in the anime/game than the manga, but the anime unlike the game has dialogue. That’s fine….thing is…..the manga might do….a better job with capturing Anne’s character than the anime did. I mean it’s less shippy (but we get new shippy scenes later I’ll get to that). I mean let’s look at her reaction to the MC staring at her:
Game:
Manga:
Anime:
What’s the difference?
The smile. Doesn’t Anne look friendlier in the Game/Manga? Isn’t your first impression….”huh she seems nice!” I think the anime tried to give her more of an action like “actions speak louder than words” kinda thing, with her taking the petal off of the MC’s head. “See? Isn’t she nice? She helped remove the thing he couldn’t see!” And, I get what they are trying to do there, but she still comes off as coldish. I said a second ago they wanted to give her an action, but the thing is…..smiling is already an action! A very simple one! She’s already showing she’s friendly by giving him a greeting smile (or just a polite one). Also the way it’s presented, the manga and game give off a warmer atmosphere than the anime. The game’s colors are soft and bright and welcoming (and she’s drawn in a softish way), the anime it’s darker and dreary. The manga, even tho it’s black and white and has a plain ass background, Anne is drawn in such a soft way, it’s even shaded a little to give off her being illuminated (like notice the lower corners where it’s darker, the way it’s shaded the light is drawn to her fact brightening out her smile).
Like we got all we needed to know from our first meeting in both the game/manga, she’s friendly. Maybe the anime wanted to amplify her cold exterior to make the “oh she’s really friendly underneath” hiddens side of her a reveal…..but….the thing is….THEY DIDN’T DO THAT! They set it up with no pay off, like it would’ve been different and I can’t knock them for that, but now it’s just different FOR NO REASON! Like the game/manga show she’s friendly, and later we see her colder wall she puts up all while hearing rumors and putting the pieces together as to WHY she has a cold wall, all while knowing she’s friendlier than she appears. And if the anime wanted to do something different that’s fine but it didn’t follow through so it’s an issue for me.
Anyway, again, it’s minor, it still bugs me tho. Moving on to….when we first meet Kamoshida in the car. And this one is weird. Let’s compare Anne again.
Game:
Manga:
Anime:
What’s the difference?
It’s the way they look, the way the lines are delivered, the dialogue, the way she moves. I mean one thing to keep in mind is they want to have her smile so they can cut away to her looking unhappy and have you thing “hmmmmm something is up.”
Game!Anne, her smile is mandatory polite (smile cause it’s the right thing to do, she probably also did this in mind with the MC too but hey she had the music with him and not Kamo 8V basically what I’m trying to say a person who is uber cold wouldn’t politely smile and at the same time just cause they smile doesn’t mean they are happy). Her dialogue is also a bit….apprehensive, and just mandatory polite as well. It’s what I would say if I didn’t want to get in the car with someone but also had no reason to say no. Anyway the cut to her looking upset shows us her real emotions.
Manga!Anne however really doesn’t look pleased, I mean you could totally read it as “relief,” possibly due to not being trapped in the rain. Same as the game, it cuts away to her not looking happy (and actually amplifies it some more in the manga with Kamoshida talking to her).
Anime!Anne. Unlike the other two, she had yet to show a smile, unlike the other two who came off as polite with no wall, Anime!Anne does not have that frame of reference. Instead it’s a juxtaposition. She had a bit of a wall but then as soon as Kamo showed up, she bursted out into this big smile. Her words are a bit more eager, it looks like she practically runs to the car (while she just casually walks to it in the other versions). She seems happy. Sure maybe it’s cause she doesn’t need to be in the rain. But again, this is the first time we’ve seen her smile. Then it cuts away to her not looking happy. It’s…..it’s some whiplash man. I think it’s cause they wanted us to buy into thinking Anne is Kamo’s girl by choice….. I mean later in ep 2 Kamo shows jealousy over the fact the MC was with Anne alone. But the thing is….this misdirection makes no sense, they don’t spend nor have the time to slow things down to make us wonder. The whole plot point is useless because it’s dropped very fast considering her later reactions in ep 2.
Side minor nitpick before moving on. I don’t like the way they introduce Ryuji. The Game/Manga have him running after Kamo’s car, well after Kamo has driven away (not aware of Ryu even approaching). The anime has Ryujis slowly approaching the car and Kamo takes notice and has him drive off. I dunno it feels weird, Ryu would totally run after that car and Kamo wouldn’t really give a shit about Ryu approaching. Minor but a bit annoying, this change wasn’t needed.
Now onto…..my biggest problems with how they handled Anne, it’s this scene, this fudging scene right here:
This did not happen in the game. This did not happen in Spain. This did not happen in the Game writer’s brain. It did not happen here Nor there. It did not happen anywhere. It did not happen in the manga. It did not happen under Obama. It did not happen in a conga. It did not happen here nor there. It did not happen anywhere. SO WHY THE FUDGE IS IT HAPPENING HERE?????
First off half of this convo is taking place a day early, they are talking about Shiho’s volleyball problems which is suppose to take place the next day on the bench:
OH THE BENCH SCENE STILL TAKES PLACE! But they change the first half of the dialogue to reflect the optional dialogue you can hear when talking to the volleyball team, WHICH INSTEAD HAPPENS A DAY PRIOR TO THE BENCH DAY:
(let’s play I was using didn’t have them talk to Anne/Shiho but there’s the location/date, it’s about the same dialogue, talking about how BS the rumors are about the MC).
But like what purpose does the corridor thing hold??? Cause when I first saw it I thought they were moving the bench scene. But obviously that didn’t happen. So why include it? Then I realized it was suppose to replace this scene:
The scene they are reinterpreting is happening a day later in the anime (4/13), with the bench scene still taking place (4/14) in the anime, but it moves the optional scene from the game (4/13, mentioned above) to 4/14 as well. They also removed Anne telling them to be careful about asking questions (4/13 in the game) to 4/14 when the bench scene is taking place. Giving Anne a more aggressive/protective role over Shiho, rather than going out of her way to warn them where it doesn’t involve Shiho at all (the manga did something similar to he anime). Now before we got back to the corridor and why it’s just SO FREAKING BAD, the reason why I don’t like Anne telling off the guys in the anime/manga is because it makes her ignorant. It brings about her now being aware of Kamo’s bad traits and the rumors to full force. The game she just knows they are going around and trying to dig up dirt about Kamo and considering what happen to Ryuji a year prior, she’s like “Guys she’s a teacher you aren’t going to win.” Coupled with the fact she’s kept in the dark about what they are investigating, as opposed to the anime (the manga she’s still in the dark, but it’s still a negative because she didn’t approach them herself to warn them they are getting into deep shit, you know cause she actually cares).
Moving the confrontation also hurts the anime. In the game, it’s before Shiho gets bruised (or at least before Anne can see Shiho to see she’s bruised). The manga it happens right after Shiho mentions spraining her wrist but it’s def played off more convincingly that it was just a normal practice that did that. She does seem to attempt to tell Anne the truth, but Anne misreads what she was trying to say and assumed it was how she felt inadequate about her spot on the team (which they were also just discussing earlier). And….it works out fine, sure Anne loses some of her caring points from the game (so only real issue with that) but she’s in the dark about the truth so that’s good (from a story stand point that is). But why is it bad in the anime? It’s because…..she hears something is up with the volleyball club, and doesn’t believe Ryu/Ren LITERALLY AFTER LOOKING AT SHIHO’S INJURIES. ANNE IS NOT THIS DUMB (and no her CoOp doesn’t cout that is filled with OOC messes too). Outside her CoOp, Anne is characterized as being able to pick up on people’s emotions. She can read people pretty well (when the writers don’t depower that ability cause they suck). She would’ve figured it out right then and there.
Anyway what’s wrong with the corridor scene? Other than screwing up the bench scene from here to hell? Just look at it. Look at those two pictures. WHat do you see? Anne gets invited to join the club and she bails. SHE BAILS! AND SHE GETS AN IN! WHAT THE FUDGE?! Like, no nononononon nonono no NOOOO NO! nO FOR ONE aNNE WOULD NOT BAIL ON SHIHO LIKE THAT! She can actually watch Shiho, be near her, one of the issues in the game is that Anne doesn’t see Shiho often. Their lifeline to each other is cut. Yeah maybe Kamo would try something with those two, but I think he wouldn’t want to take his chances since it’d be hard to fight off two at once. So Anne SHOULD be in the clear, him talking to her after the club would be a new issue, but ANNE WOULD TOTALLY GO TO THE CLUB TO WATCH SHIHO FIGHT ME. And as for reason number two as to why this scene sucks. It’s the life line, you can see in the game’s bench scene, even in the manga, Anne can’t follow Shiho. She has no in. She’s an outsider. She doesn’t know what’s going on because she’s an outsider and she can’t make Shiho talk. That’s one of the big conflicts of the game (and manga). She’s not on the team, she’s not on some committee like the Student Council, the most she can do for Shiho is cheer her on and try to string Kamo along. But what does Anime!Anne get? A FUDGING IN! The one thing Anne needed in P5, not to be an outsider, she gets an invitation to a thing she needed and she turns it the fudge down!! LIke no! Noooo???!!!!
*inhales* As you can see I have issues with this on a number of levels. Now do I think it could’ve worked in the anime? Hell yes. Reorder everything to the right order from the game. Change the corridor scene to the optional scene you can overhear with Anne/Shiho on 4/13 talking about the MC and rumors, they split up and after Shiho rounds the corner Kamo catches Anne and the 4/12 scene (the one that MC overhears) happens. Anne declines him and walks away, cut to Shiho who is like “oh I need to tell Anne something” and have her round the corner and run into Kamo. The scene from the anime plays out where he abuses her. This way Anne doesn’t get an in and doesn’t abandon Shiho. Now move Anne yelling at Ren/Ryu about digging up dirt about Kamo, where she shows concern about them, but they don’t reveal any info so she’s still in the dark. Then the bench scene plays out like in the game with no interruptions, and they question Shiho like in the game.
*inhales* Ok now let’s go to Ryu……Thankfully this should be more straight forward. But man, even the manga got Ryuji right (or at least didn’t get him wrong like the anime did).
Ok so we all know the issue with Ryuji (and by extension the MC) right? Both are “protector of women” in the first arc, very respectable (well the MC does have the one line I didn’t like but haha we’ll get that THAT in a second), just good guys all around. Then everything post-dungeon 1 it’s “let’s make everything horribly sexual and objectify Anne and IT’S OK IF WE DO IT CAUSE WE’RE THE MAIN CHARACTERS!” Yeah THAT problem. One of the reasons the first dungeon is my fav. So let’s compare how Ryuji reacts to seeing Cognitive Anne (as well to the other sexual imagery) shall we?
Game:
Anime:
Manga:
Before I rip into it, the manga they don’t actually showcase his good boy status like in the game, but they also don’t make him a perv so I’ll fudging take it. And yeah I think it’s Akira talking in that panel, but again, Ryuji isn’t acting like a perv and she’s clearly not happy. (also they never see Cognitive Anne till Anne’s awakening, which….and Mona falls for the real Anne instead of the Cognition as he first meets her when she accidentally gets pulled into the Metaverse)
So……remember how I had a minor nitpick with how they introduced Ryuji? Him not running? Well there was……another thing I realized while typing this. Anime Ryuji doesn’t call Kamo a pervy teacher when he first speaks, Game/Manga!Ryuji do but not Anime!Ryuji. Instead he just calls him a bastard, but not a perv. He doesn’t call him a perv till Anne’s awakening in the anime. YEs this is important. Game/Manga!Ryuji make a point that they hate how pervy Kamo is, and how horrified they are of his perviness. Anime!Ryuji doesn’t until it’s too late. Is it more in-character considering the perv pile he becomes post-dungeon 1 in-game? Maybe, but why would you wanna double down on that? Ryuji was great in dungeon 1! Anyway Ryuji doesn’t show his horror until it’s too late, instead he avoids calling Kamo a perv so he’s not seen as a hypocrite in terms of perving, but then they just…..make him a hypocrite anyway cause he still calls Kamo a perv just later after perving himself. It’s just…..what the fudge….
Also did you notice, the “so jealous line” was originally the MC’s. Now I hate the line, but it really makes no sense for Ryu to say it esp during dungeon 1. I mean it makes no sense for the MC to say it (this is probably why I hate the MC, I really hate some of his “cheeky lines). But why give….a character that already speaks…a lot more than the silent MC? Why give Ryuji one that makes him look worse to boot???? Like I didn’t like Yu Narukami or the P4 Anime, but it at least made sense why Yu took Yosuke’s “hey it’s the pint size detective” line from him. Yu needs more lines, so does Ren. So why add something unnecessary when you could just give Ren more lines? It’s just…..I’m sorry this really pisses me off. This really killed my goodwill for the anime, and it was dead by episode 3 (but I did finish arc 1).
Like, the anime did two good things that remember from those eps, 1) Having Kamo be jealous over the MC for being near Anne and the rumors about Ren/Anne hitting on each other (cause it’s SOOOOO in character for him, 2) Shiho’s abuse being shown. And I do like the idea that they are….slightly capitalizing on the fact they are suppose to have their personality change when in the Metaverse (this is mostly Ren tho), but I saw it with Anne as well. I mean they promised that with the game and I thought they did jack with it. Anyway not sure how much they’ve….continue to capitalized on it but…..at least they tried. Tho I think I prefer the manga the most in this case, just a bunch of useless, newbie doofuses trying their best but they know they aren’t all that. Instead of being a bunch of useless thieves who think they are all that but really they all suck at being thieves (more of a game problem than the anime but tbh considering how Ren is cocky in the anime I wouldn’t be surprised if this was a shared problem).
