#sapp ask

[silenceandpatiencepining]

2/2 I don't think every song is about Karlie. Kaylor. Some are about being gutted, hurt & betrayed. I have my doubts at times but then I listen to the lakes, cardigan, willow, this is me trying, peace, gold rush. I don't know why I just don't think it's over. I should also mention I was a gaylor before a Kaylor. I'm here for Taylor & her music. I'm not here to fight or engage in petty squabble with other either, I have real life shit for that lol. Like you I'm interested what others think. FIN

Hard agree on your part 1 points about the general range of emotions and the variety of people in her life !!

I think they’ve (Kaylor) definitely been through the ringer, but to me the found love doesn’t sound like it’s quite within that same relationship. Like I hear all of that and it sounds like those were the breaking points and aftermath emotional processing, or hopes that things would’ve turned out differently.

Definitely things to think about. I think both albums are just so overwhelmingly sad to me that it’s hard to think that the personal outcome is still happy relationship.

But there are sooo many interpretations of each song so it’s possible that we feel the same emotions of the songs but believe they tell different stories.

Thank you for sharing !!

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And yet again, the most awkward part of the interview was the 20 seconds that talked about William Bowery/her bf

facts—I was ~uncomfy~ when jimmy was like 🤪just turn the camera around🤪

I know damn well that we won’t ever get an answer about where the name came from

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I'm curious, how do you think the relationship between Taylor and Karlie is now? Cause I think it's pretty apparent they're not dating anymore, but what do you think?

I really truly don’t know—I personally have a few different theories (explaining them in detail is a much much longer ordeal) that I’m working through at the moment but my thoughts on their current relationship status actually varies on a near daily basis just because of how little we know. I base a lot of my understanding on a combination of lyrics and patterns and behaviors, but the delay between when Taylor writes a song and when we hear it is quite long, and pr is not reflective of the truth a lot of the time, but I think it’s not impossible that rep and Lover are about Karlie, and for Kaylor to not be together at this very moment, as much as I’d like them to be.

I absolutely believe that they were together for several years and at a minimum are still very close friends. There’s a lot of things about Taylor’s relationship with Joe that I find v suspect and lots of things about Karlie’s relationship with Josh that I also find v suspect. And the fact that the girls were soooo close and now do not directly interact online is also sus to me—I think that that at a minimum indicates that whatever sort of relationship they have now is private.

I think that I would consider Taylor and Karlie to be soulmates in that they’ve both indelibly marked each other and have a forever love between them, but I don’t know if that means they’ll always be together. It’s like that whole right person, wrong time thing maybe? Or “it’s always been you, it’ll always be you. “

All of that was a non-answer lol but I guess I’d say that I think they still love each other. Other circumstances have prevented them from being able to enjoy the fullest extent of their relationship without undue public scrutiny so whether they are just friends now, or dating, or engaged, or married, they still choose to not be public about it. I miss seeing them together because I think they brought out the best in each other and there is a vibrancy between them that neither has with anyone else. I personally am okay if they aren’t romantically involved and find happiness in other relationships, but firmly stand behind the belief that they have something special that goes beyond just friendship.

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Ok third listen of champagne problems and there’s a bit of bait and switch where from the rejected perspective TS sings “she’ll patch up your tapestry confirmed” makes me think that it’s two girls and one rejected the proposal to be with another girl.

It was probably just a typo but I believe the lyric is “She’ll patch up your tapestry that I shred”

also my brain is still not totally totally with it yet nor have I processed evermore so more analysis/interpretation to come later when I’ve given the whole thing many more listens.

but to start:

I think the part in the bridge where it says that “one for the money two for the show, I never was ready so I watch you go, sometimes you just don’t know the answer, til someone’s on their knees and asks you” sounds like there was always something missing from the relationship or holding her back from taking that next step, but she was so invested she couldn’t ever admit to herself that things weren’t right, and even if she never felt ready to be the one that pushed leap of commitment forward (ie, being the one to take the next step and propose), she probably assumed that she’d know her answer if someone asked her...until perhaps she was asked and was finally confronted with need to make that decision and her “no” was unexpected.

I think the tapestry lyric (and this is literally only after two and half listens) might be saying that she literally created this image and life with someone and then took it apart and basically said, you can go make this with someone else. If what you’re saying is that the person who was rejected didn’t see this coming, I can definitely see that. But I also don’t think it’s what taylor herself saw coming. I personally don’t care for the term “bait and switch” because I feel that it implies intention that may not always be there but what I am saying is that it sounds like the rejection of a proposal may have been mutually unexpected.

I definitely think this could be about two girls (our girls), and that the one who was rejected moved on to another relationship, but I don’t know if that relationship was necessarily the reason for or a factor in the rejection. Like, I think they left and ended up with someone else, but I haven’t decided if they left to be with someone else specifically. I think the hope was always that the proposal would be accepted and when it wasn’t, they fell into someone else’s arms.

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LMFAO. Didn't Joe say in a filmed interview that everything that the tabloids say about him & Taylor is a lie in December 2019? The ONLY things tabloids say about him & Taylor is that they love each other & will get married one day... Joe's not interested in that, he doesn't love her or want to marry her, or else why would he have said on film that the tabloids are lying when all they say is that he loves Taylor? He's either a conspicuous gold digger or was hired for a low effort PR fauxmance 😂

I literally have no idea what interview you are talking about but agree/generally think that all of the press coverage I’ve seen about them as a couple has been overwhelmingly positive. My first thought if he said it is all lies is in regard to engagement/marriage rumors??

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Re: Dianna... I get the vibe from di’s reputation as a womanizer. The Peter losing Wendy and tattooed kiss lines also say dianna, at least to me. It reads to me like I was hurt before by a relationship that ended not of my own volition so I had this expectation that it would happen again but I am also young and starry eyed. I also feel like dianna being older than taylor is also an undercurrent if cardigan is in fact a dianna song. Not to mention that red era Taylor was peak cardigan.

Ooh yeah I can totally see that—I think the two feelings that really came through to me were naivety and disregard/use which can definitely be viewed in the swiftgon light

Haha and yes! the literal cardigans!

folklore feels like red’s cool, older, indie sister that’s grown up and has Seen Things but still comes back to comfort you wherever you’re at

I still need many more listens before I feel like I have a decent grasp on the songs and themes

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i appreciate the research in the taylor & joe timeline, but a lot of it is speculation for me (i admit there's speculation re: kaylor too). and even tho taylor might've said, "we threw a big nye party in london this year," i'm still not sold she was even there. it's the narrative. i'd be more inclined to believe in the taylor and joe relationship if we got photos of them together - not photos of taylor or benji that "joe took," like, real photos of their adventures. together. not from pap walks.

I think we all have different thresholds for how much information we need to decide if we accept something new—if it fits with something you already know, it doesn’t take that much, but if it’s something you disagree with, it takes more to get you there/convince you. I think when it comes to the Joe timeline, the things that make perfect sense to the typical fan just aren’t enough for me. But I know the same can be said of fans would aren’t kaylors trying to understand our perspective too. I think most people in this fandom will accept anything Taylor says as the absolute truth and put their full trust in what she shares and analyze her lyrics in a fundamentally different way. I think the fact that kaylors sort of already operate in this state of “distrusting the narrator” and watching her actions/easter eggs more than her actual words or looking at the patterns of her behavior rather than each thing individually and usually assume that anything she says means something different really plays into this.

anyway, my point is the “evidence” that we (kaylors) find most compelling and most telling and most indicative of the truth are just not available for Taylor’s relationship with Joe like they were for Karlie—specifically pictures together, body language, openness about how close they are, seeing their friendship circles mix, wearing each other’s clothes, etc.

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Pro tip: listen to the 1 and then clean in a row. The rhythm is perfect b

OMG DOING THIS!! Thank you for the tip