Replies: space capitalism conspiracy
baronuberstein said:
Well, I’m not economist (I passed basic econ with a B but flunked the higher courses), but basically with a post-scarcity society, I think the idea is that since everything is obtainable with minimal effort, labor is no longer necessary for the production of goods. Since everyone can get everything, there is no reason to do something you don’t want to do just to survive, and nobody will buy your product because they can conjure it them self.
This brings up the question of, “Who maintains the systems that allow post-scarcity, and what is their incentive to maintain the systems for those who cannot maintain them?” You could possibly see a post-scarcity society that relies on technology for their post-scarcity…ness turn into a kind of oligarchy as those who have the ability to maintain the systems take the systems hostage. The question would be, why? What could taking over provide when all resources are already available at the push of the button?
So the “how” is fairly easy to solve. The real question, imo, is why would somebody go to the effort of doing so? You’d need a solid ideological reason.
Post scarcity might have been an overstatement or misuse of the term on my part. Utopia does not have startreky-matter printers (what are those called anyway?), but it does however have a “fair distribution” policy where every citizen are given what resources they need to live a comfortable life by an communally agreed principle. This covers living, food, communication, transportation, and other ammenities, but one can also get resources for personal crafts, business, and arts. Its pretty vague and abstract, seeing as I’m far from educated on economics. But suffice to say, that among the core worlds work culture is all but eliminated, in the close colonies people farm and herd cattle, but all industry and mining are performed by robots and machines, with educated volounteers performing maintenance.
The Conspiracy in question, is out in a fringe sector where the reach of the Core Utopia have not yet reached and lacking communication and antiquated FTL drives have made the Fair Distribution policy unable to reach there yet. The Conspiracy have here planned to abuse the failings of Utopia to provide by setting up their own system based on money. The deal being work for them and they will be able to provide the resources you need the most, giving the colonies out in the fringe agency over what they want most by allowing them to choose how to spend their money. While the conspirators actively work to keep the Fair Distribution at bay by hampering the spread of communication technology and robot workforces, hiring pirates to distrubt transports from the core worlds, and set themselves up as capable and independent were Utopia fails.
The motivation is plain greed really. The forces working to resurect capitalism wants to create a system of control so they can steer the development of the fringe sectors to dance by their rules.
Which is the basics for my thoughts so far...
underthewetmoon said:
Try looking at European countries during and after WWII. Britain, for example, was importing around 70% of its food at the start of the war, and underwent tight rationing. It also rationed clothing, fuel, soap, paper, and other goods experienced shortages. There were some rations that lasted longer than others - clothing, for instance, was ended in 1948 because the government found it difficult to control the black market that had sprung up around it. Food rations, meanwhile, were kept in place until 1954, 9 years after WWII ended.
Then look at the decades that followed: the 50s were filled with attempts to get things “back to normal,” even though a lot of the ideals and household roles were less strict and narrow in the 30s than they ended up being in the 50s. The 60s saw the rise of mainstream entertainment, of television and the idea of a national identity taking place over the local identity. The 70s were all about looking like you had spent a lot of effort while “cheating” whenever you could by using premade mixes and “instant” food.
By the time we hit the 80s, people are spending less time at home (with more and more women working), so-called conveniences are starting to be marketed as necessities, and consumerism suddenly becomes all about having the latest toys, electronics, even food. Despite the UK having a lot of civil unrest in the 80s, primarily caused by Thatcher and her awful anti-union, anti-worker, anti-gay policies, there is a constant air of excess and always obtaining more. This is partially to do with Tories and their tactics to demonise the poor. People react by wanting to prove that they aren’t poor, which means buying more and more.
Thank you, this is all good fuel for thought on how to paint the capitalist rise.
I can defs see the inadequecy of the FD system forcing colonies to pick up rationing to make things work out, and then the new corporations that spring up move in to show things doesn’t have to be that way. That way they wont even look evil or have cruel intentions, it might all be a reaction to the failings of the FD due to lacking interstellar communications and trade routes, following to fast expansion and collonization.