one thing that annoys me is people going but team rwby are traumatizied when the same thing could be said about ozpin ozpin was a like an old war vet who had ptsd and trauma . ozpin had every right to keep secrets I am sick of people trying to paint ozpin as a bad person or manipulative because he kept some secrets which needed to be kept secret due to many betrayals and if they go out it will only help salem like the relic if info is leaked to salem it will help her. ( lionheart 1/2
“Anonymous said to yangingaround:
was his friend and he just betrayed him to salem a short time ago and he has been betrayed many times in the past so why should he immediately trust team rwby who he doesnt know as well ( and given how they reacted to salem being immortal saying it was pointless it shows ozpin was right in keeping salems immortality a secret the entire reason they kept salem a secret was to prevent the loss of morale ,feeling it was pointless etc )(not to mention yangs hypocrisy 2/2
Anonymous said to yangingaround:
I am sick of the whole oz kept secrets so we cant trust anything he says ignoring that team rwby have kept secrets and told lies many times and they like to pretend its different when its not . ozpin isnt at fault for summers death her dying on a mission is not oz’s fault . ( oz protected humanity this attempt to paint oz as a manipulator or like dumbledore or taking away peoples choices ( check itsclydebitches tumblr she made a post on that ) is bs ( and salem always blames other people ½
Anonymous said to yangingaround:
for her actions like going the deaths of the people who fought against her are somehow oz’s fault or claiming ozpin is a coward for going away after just seeing the worst moments of his life and his friends turning on him and what qrow did to him he was stressed out and needed to go back inside giving qrow what he wanted he was crying and the claim that this was cowardice is utter nonsense he needed to escape from the abuse so he left the only way he could 2/2
Anonymous said to yangingaround:
also the claim that ozpin never tried to unite humanity is complete and utter bullshit his entire plan was to unite humanity and by rwby v1 he was close to achieving that goal the closest he had ever been ( ozpin was the king of vale)
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okay, briefly coming out of semi-retirement on here because this just dropped in
this was kinda the wrong blog to send this to, because none of the mods are on Oz’s side
but let’s start from the top:
Oz had no right to keep secrets when those secrets were endangering lives (keeping the fact that the relics attract Grimm put hundreds of innocent civilians in danger for no reason because the heroes weren’t prepared), and he was purposely leading the heroes to on a pointless suicide mission rather than be straight with them that he had no plan
on top of that, he’s millennia old, so the fact that he can’t get over his thousand year old hurt feelings is literally not anyone else’s fault but his own, and he’s endangering lives over it - he’s had multiple lifetimes to get over it, and it’s made clear from Jinn’s description of things that for the most part he just moped and did nothing
second, Ozpin is manipulative, we see that in how he interacts with Pyrrha, coercing her into becoming the Fall Maiden by taking advantage of her nature and ensuring it by presenting it as an ultimatum - “become the Fall Maiden or the bad guys win” isn’t a choice, no matter how many times Qrow and Ozpin insist otherwise
it’s not just the keeping secrets thing, though that is part of it (oh, and FYI, his claim that he only keeps secrets and lies because he’s been betrayed in the past? was a lie, the first thing he did when meeting Salem again after reincarnating was lie to her, and he had far less sympathetic reasons to lie to her than she did to him - she was afraid of being judged by the one good thing her life ever had, he was lying to her because the God of Light told him she couldn’t be trusted. and we have confirmation from the writers that the gods are heavily based on Greek mythology, and those gods were assholes), he’s manipulative for far more than that
(oh and maybe Lionheart betrayed Ozpin…. because Ozpin lied about the mission… and Lionheart got scared because he couldn’t trust Ozpin… wild concept but maybe Ozpin is the mastermind behind his own destruction)
and no, Ozpin wasn’t right to keep it secret, because they still found morale after that initial despair, but here’s the thing, if they’d known from the start, shit wouldn’t have hit the fan that hard - knowing how bad things are from the start is a lot better than thinking you’re in a better position than you really are; because when that truth comes out it’s a lot further to fall
Ozpin demands trust but never reciprocates and then acts hurt when he’s inevitably betrayed over it, that’s his fault, no one elses
and funny you should mention Yang’s ‘hypocrisy’ because that’s a brilliant sticking point that would have entirely made your argument if it wasn’t top of the line, absolute Grade A horseshit
Yang keeping a single secret about Raven over a very personal issue when that secret no longer has any value to the rest of the group (they already have the Relic and the Vault is already dead, the Spring Maiden no longer holds any value to Ozpin as Relic’s already out and Salem doesn’t have much reason to pursue Spring knowing that the Relic is out of the box) is not the same thing as Ozpin lying to the group by keeping information from them that could get them killed. so show me where the hypocrisy lies here because i’m not seeing it. acting like one small, harmless act is comparable to thousands of constant lies
when RWBY keep secrets, it’s because they have to, they never do it simply because and have never done anything to intentionally endanger lives while Ozpin does it without a thought
oh and here’s a shocker, by being the person sending Summer on mission, Ozpin was knowingly endangering her, so yes, he actually does hold some responsibility for her death - that’s how the chain of command works
and ‘Oz protected humanity’, interesting. did he? let’s see what Jinn has to say:
“Thus began a long and painful cycle of death and rebirth for Ozma.Some lives were spent in mourning, many were spent attempting to forget it all.”
yeah, sounds like to me, he spent most of his time running away from the problem, so his current behaviour is on brand, at least (also this scene reveals that he lied about the whole “i merge with the next guy i reincarnate into” thing because it’s made clear that until very recently he just suppressed them; and drank at least a couple to death, so add everyone he’s ever possessed to his body count - and the people he jumps into don’t have a choice but to get involved because he can take over whenever he likes)
and i’ve already addressed that he did take away people’s choices, because he doesn’t give them choices, don’t tell me to read someone else’s post and not argue the point yourself, i pay attention to the show, okay? i can understand what’s happening in it - Pyrrha, ultimatum. the rest of the gang after Yang and Weiss arrive, ultimatum (by not so subtly hinting at Raven’s cowardice as a negative quality they should shy away from). all the people he’s ever possessed, only recently did they even get autonomy and that’s only because he lets them have that. every student who has ever attended the four main combat academies - the entire premise of the schools is a false pretense. it’s not to train warriors to protect the world (hell, the very concept of Huntsmen and Huntresses being the sole defenders of the world is almost propaganda in quality because they’ve only been around for less than a century - humanity got on just fine without them before that), it’s so there’s an ever-rotating array of meatshields to protect his god-summoning paperweights. which puts the deaths of the likes of Gretchen Rainart on him too (as well as the fact that as Headmaster he has a duty of care and he tries brushing those deaths off like “they made their choice” which is a disturbing detachment from responsibility)
and yes, Ozpin is a coward for running away, because this is his fault, and he decides to hide himself away than deal with the consequences of his actions - he’s not a child, he’s not some scared little boy who needs his mommy to hold his hand - he is a millennia old asshole who is very much responsible for the mess everyone is in right now, or did you miss the part where Salem was peacefully holing herself away where no one could bother her? or that he was the only good thing in her life and by stabbing her in the back first by running away with the kids instead of talking to his wife when she got a liittle too edgy (which, by the way, wasn’t even her fault because the only reason she was like that by that point was because she’d tried to kill herself and didn’t know this result was a possibility, and that’s one slip after a near decade of happy marriage) and taking the first hope she’d had in so long away; of course she’d snap
that’s what Ozpin does, he builds people up on lies so they don’t know how far the drop really is - just because his goal is ostensibly noble doesn’t mean he is, especially when his actions are anything but
“needed to escape the abuse” holy shit. okay, this is a joke right? it’s a joke?
being called out on your bullshit is not abuse. people getting angry at you because you lied to them, manipulated them and were planning on letting them die for a cause that you know to be pointless is. not. abuse.
i don’t care if he was crying, that doesn’t mean anything - “oh look at the poor sad millennia old wizard, he’s upset that people are angry at him for the blood on his hands which he has no problem sticking his hands back into”
and i wouldn’t call what Oz did in the Great War ‘uniting’ humanity. considering what that amounted to was forcing the other reining monarchs to kneel to him after he beat them up (as well as the Queen of Vacuo, who was his ally), dismantled their power structures to replace it with the council system (and destroying any remaining semblance of real governance that Vacuo had, leaving it a chaotic hell-pit wasteland) and built the schools (which were meant to not answer to any of the Kingdoms) as a front so he could stay in power and control across reincarnations
yeah, some unity - all that demonstrates was that he never really had a problem with the “beat people up to make them do what you want” plan he and Salem had the first time
Ozpin is a very old, very pathetic coward - he doesn’t learn from his mistakes, he repeats them over and over again then acts like it’s someone else’s fault. he refuses to trust people yet gets angry when they refuse to trust him, he lies to people constantly but tries to dodge out of it than take responsibility, when his secrets endanger the lives of others, instead of acting like a fucking adult and facing the consequences for his actions, for the god knows how many lives he has damaged, ruined, destroyed, how he willingly endangers lives rather than tell the truth for no good reason, he runs away and leaves everyone else to pick up his mess
he’s a coward and RWBY and the others have every right to call him on his bullshit. they’re a lot younger than him, they have more room for mistakes and growth
he’s had literally all the time in the world to be a better person, and all he’s become is a lying, weaselly coward
I was listening to the Rwby soundtrack today (ha, when am I not listening to the Rwby soundtrack) and I just was blown away by how much Casey's voice has matured. Obviously she sounds older but even her diction has gotten a lot better. Listening to how some of the lyrics have evolved has been a treat too.
on my rewatch of volume 5, i noticed that ‘Strength’ comes up quite a bit
in Dread in the Air, Adam makes it clear that he sees his actions at Beacon to be following Sienna’s example, of “strength, and unwavering conviction”. Sienna refutes him moments later, after giving him a short speech on the reasons he sucks and why the Fall of Beacon wasn’t the grand victory he sees it as, capping it off with “These are not examples of strength, Adam. They are examples of your talents being diminished by shortsightedness!”
it next comes up in Necessary Sacrifice, when Blake is talking about people being the personifications of certain words, the one she sees in Yang is strength
in True Colors, Ghira expresses pride in Blake’s forgiveness of Ilia. “She’s learned a lesson that evaded me until I was much older: That there is strength in forgiveness.”
finally, in Haven’s Fate, there’s Yang’s callout of Raven: “Oh, shut up!! You don't know the first thing about strength! You turn your back on people, you run away when things get too hard, you put others in harm's way instead of yourself!! You might be powerful, but that doesn't make you strong.”
what’s interesting is the four characters involved
Adam and Raven have both been notably paralleled but ultimately contrasted against Yang and Blake respectively in earlier volumes - Adam sees his actions as proof of his strength (but is called out on it for being short-sighted arrogance) while Blake sees Yang as the embodiment of strength. Raven sees her continued survival as proof of her strength (and is called out on it for just being bluster she hides behind) while Blake’s forgiveness is seen by Ghira as an example of her strength
in previous volumes, focus was put on how Yang contrasts with Adam (most notably in volume 3), and this volume put focus on Blake contrasting Raven; she actually works on her flaw of running away and in the end, chooses to return to her team now that she’s bumped into them, while Raven chose to run away again
additionally, while full forgiveness is probably some ways off (though pretty much a guarantee, as they need to repair things before the team can truly be back together again), Yang is willing to accept Blake back - and as mentioned, “there is strength in forgiveness” - while it’s pretty much a given that Adam will never forgive Blake
while these parallels and contrasts have been set up throughout the show (but really came into force in volume 3), this recurring use of the word ‘strength’ ties the Adam-Yang contrast and the Raven-Blake contrast together
Cinder really thinks she can get away with using a technicality to try and kill Ruby doesn't she? I'm looking forward to seeing how it'll backfire
oh yeah
like, first off, either she’s gotten worse at manipulating people or she’s projecting hardcore because she keeps insisting Neo has a grudge against Ruby, as if the repetition makes it more true, when Neo shows no actual indication of wanting to go after Ruby
like she’s just getting herself setup for being stabbed in the back here by Neo
second - trying to rules lawyer Salem’s commands isn’t gonna work because Salem knows where she is and what she’s doing (she knew Cinder was alive and knew specifically that it was Cinder’s own ego that screwed up what should’ve been the easiest mission ever, so that arm she gave Cinder likely gives her a direct connection to her mind). she’ll know that Cinder trying to pull “well i was going to capture Ruby but then this halfpint came out of nowhere and murderised her. shame that” is a load of crap and that she deliberately engineered it
Cinder’s doing exactly what Salem warned against in episode 4, putting her desires above Salem’s own
so she’s not getting out of this without severe punishment
I saw a post on the search tag about how the Apathy was a representation of depression and self-medication. Any thoughts on the subject?
well i preface this by stating i am by no means educated on the subject of depression or self-medication so my understanding is limited and very likely incorrect in places
now, from what i do understand, the Apathy basically sap the will to keep going out of you, it’s very difficult to feel anything, you’re just tired, working up the energy to do anything is a pain and you’re, well, apathetic
all of which are apparently reflective of symptoms of depression
(and so might well explain why Yang was so shaken up by it, she’s been there - we saw her post-Beacon, she was very numb to it all and we see her just trudging through the day to day, and it’s almost certain she’s still dealing with it even after pushing herself to get going for Ruby’s sake. she’s just been forced back into that state - a worse version of it even - and it’s not a place she wants to be. add onto that she’d just been forced to watch Blake almost die and she literally couldn’t care and of course she’d want to get out of there as quickly as possible - especially when you factor in how broken up she was about Blake leaving in 3x12 and even lied about not caring why she left. now she’s been put in a situation where she couldn’t care about Blake, and that terrified her)
as for self-medication:
Qrow’s response to the Apathy’s influence is to self-medicate, he starts drinking himself into oblivion and numbs himself to everything. from what i’ve just read up on, alcohol isn’t an effective antidepressant but it provides mild relief from depressive effect. Qrow’s an addict, so the more the Apathy effects him, the more he’s gonna drink and it’d just keep cycling til he drank himself to death
another thing on the subject of drugs; we learn from Bartleby’s journal that he’d lured the Grimm in to effectively drug his settlement. keep them compliant and calm so he could save money, all without their knowledge (influencing and manipulating how people feel is... kind of a hugely messed up thing to do), and of course it all went horribly wrong to the point that an entire settlement no longer had the willpower to take care of themselves or even wake up, they just laid down and waited for the inevitable
but yeah honestly as Grimm go this is one of the more frightening ones because it can just
force this very real thing on you - like it has the paralytic screaming which speeds up the process but just being in the area of it messes with your head and drains you to the point where it’s difficult to care about anything, but pushes the effect so far up to eleven that you eventually just give up and die
Something that struck me last night: In v4, Salem is very insistent on hearing Cinder say that she killed Ozpin. She then asks 'what are you planning'? She knows Oz can reincarnate, so maybe she thinks Cinder couldn't have beaten Ozpin unless Ozpin let her for some reason?
yeah, and given her reaction to Ozpin turning up in his new body less than a year after his ‘death’, she wasn’t expecting him to be an issue this soon
so she wants Cinder to verbally confirm she killed Ozpin, and her response implies she thinks that Ozpin likely would have survived a regular duel with a Maiden, so if he did let her win, why? what’s to be gained from being out of action for an extended period of time while she can still put things in motion?
apparently from her perspective, maybe she thinks it was reincarnate faster and be able to operate under her radar because she doesn’t know who the new body is or where?
All that matters & yang talking to weiss about Blake vs Adam is also interesting. I’ve seen people try to say su* is the foil to Adam why? He’s not as bad as Adam but we saw how they work the last two volumes & it’s very concerning cause they just argue & it’ll be another toxic relationship.
While I disagree that Blake and Sun would be toxic relationship (I don’t personally feel they’d make a good fit but I wouldn’t call them toxic by any means) I’m also stumped why people say Sun is a foil to Adam.
First of all though, being a foil isn’t a bad thing: foils are similar but ultimately different in very important ways. When we look at the foil to Adam we’re looking at a character with some similarities on the surface but who ultimately proves themselves to be very different and in this case better.
Sun just doesn’t have enough in common to be a foil with Adam, especially because any similarities between the two are very shallow: they’re both male Faunus with a connection to Blake. That’s pretty much it without getting into speculation of romantic interest. Sun has no connection to the White Fang so that’s out, the basis of his relationship with Blake is completely different (as in they met by chance as opposed to working together in a more work-type scenario), and the narrative has done nothing to parallel the two even the slightest bit. It’s telling that his brief encounter with Adam is incredibly low stakes and that the two show zero interest in each other specifically.
Now Adam and Yang on the other hand? Both serve as partners to Blake, though Adam is more of a mentor and is in a position of power while Yang and Blake equals. Both have a moment/s where Blake believes they’re going down the wrong path, but where Adam truly was becoming a monster Yang was not (hell, Blake explicitly compares the two so it’s very intentional here), and that’s without getting into seeing how differently they both handle a similar situation: Adam turns it on Blake while Yang is heartfelt and honest and doesn’t question Blake’s distrust once she explains herself. Both have songs talking about their strength, but while Adam’s is intent on making everyone around him out to be weaklings in order to boost his own ego Yang’s are more about saying she’s stronger than her opponents, not her allies. Even their semblances are similar yet different: both use damage done by their opponents to increase their own damage and are represented visually by glowing hair. Adam’s though absorbs the damage through his weapon and he’s shown hiding behind others to charge it while Yang actually takes the damage herself and both can’t and wouldn’t let someone distract her opponent so she can charge (Adam’s also seems to be unleashed in one hit while Yang’s appears to last longer).
Any evidence for why Sun and Adam are foils is either incredibly shallow or working on the assumption that Sun is meant to be Blake’s canon love interest (which is not confirmed at this point), and even then it pales in comparison to the mountain of parallels Yang and Adam have that are important enough for Blake herself to bring up.
So I've noticed that Yang seems to have cried only 3 times in the show, each time about Blake (Blake doubting Yang's innocence in Destiny, Yang attacking Adam for stabbing Blake, and Yang's talk about Blake with Weiss in volume 5). Can I get an analysis of how often the members of Team RWBY have cried and what caused them to? I feel like there could be something there, idk.
okay - here’s a quick run-down of the number of times team RWBY have cried and why
Ruby
- “you’re just three moves away from conquering Remnant!”, 2x02
- cried when she was too late to save Penny, 3x09
- cried when she remembered she was too late to save Pyrrha, 3x12
- cried when reuniting with Yang in 5x06
Weiss
- “i hate this game of emotions we play”, 2x02
- cried when she was disinherited and told she would be essentially kept prisoner for the rest of her life
Blake
- shed a tear while looking at the statue outside Beacon’s entrance hall after running away from her team following the reveal that she’s a Faunus, 1x15
- cries and sobs apologies to an unconscious Yang (while holding the latters hand with her own left hand, which would have likely aggravated her own wound) in 3x12
- not crying, but she sounds about on the edge of it when she says “not again” after Sun gets wounded in 4x09
- cried while begging Sun and Ilia to stop fighting in 5x10
Yang
oh boy - Yang has probably cried, or come close to crying, more than any of the other girls (and though Blake has been the reason more often than not, there are some exceptions)
- cried when she believed Blake didn’t trust her in 3x08
- tears in her eyes when she tried to attack Adam and save Blake in 3x11
- eyes and lip quiver when she says she doesn’t know why Blake left in 3x12 (you can tell she’s on the brink before hiding behind a lie of not caring). she’s seen wiping her eyes after Ruby leaves
- comes close again in 5x06 when things get heated with Raven, she sounds like she’s on the brink of tears again, eyes quivering as they snap back to lilac and she asks ‘why?’
- cries when reuniting with Ruby, 5x06
- breaks down crying over how she needed Blake to be there while she was recovering during her talk with Weiss in 5x08
- eyes quivering again when she sees Blake again in 5x13, first time she’s seen her in months (27 episodes if we don’t count the character shorts)
- breaks down crying in the vault after her confrontation with Raven, 5x14
