Hi! I'm MR (yes, with the capital letters) or Crazy and my pronouns are She/Her, though I don't mind They/Them and Very Much Do Mind He/Him! This is my Mandalorian Focused side blog, the main being @mrfandomwars, that was made because I wanted to have a place focused on the Mandalorians alone.
Some random facts:
- I'm Pro New Mandalorians
- I'm Pro Jedi
- I do not believe in the Korkie Kenobi Theory
- My main Mando Blorbo is Tarre Vizsla
- I tend to go with Canon and not Legends, that last one sure gave me a headache when it comes to my faves being mistreated by fans
(Daily Reminder that Feen Rau was a new mandalorian!)
If you have any questions, I have my inbox open!
EDIT: I just made a Pro-New Mandos and Pro-Satine Community, feel free to join here!
Below is my Masterpost, including posts from my main blog!
Canon Information:
History of Mandalore (Transcription Here)
Jango Fett In Canon (No Legends) - Brief Summary
Star Wars The Fact File Part 98 - Planet Mandalore
Star Wars: Build The Millennium Falcon - #68
Plus some interpretations here
Star Wars Roleplaying Game - Age Of Rebellion: Friends Like This - Mandalorian Bits And Pieces
Metas:
Mandalorian Cubism and it's commentary on War
Jaster is a Strong, Independent Man and he needs no Darksaber to be Mando'alor!
Of Death Cults And Exile
The Traditionalists were Assholes, probably
Of Duchesses and Presidents <- Old Post
What Dukes are in the Mandalorian Government and their role prior to the Civil War
(HEADCANON) How I think the Nobility in Mando'ade works
*Beats Mando Jedi Knight Grogu Away With A Broom*
Mandalorian Jedi Their Hardships
The Resol'nare
The Way Of Mandalore
True Mandalorians and New Mandalorians Got Along
Fanon True Mandalorians = Canon New Mandalorians
"Satine enforced her pacifism in the Mandalorians" makes No Sense
Minority VS Majority
Mandalorians WERE happy with the change Satine bought
The Old Mandalorians were part of the Extremist Warrior Minority
Mandalorian Diversity
Satine Kicked Out Mando Elon Musk, more at seven
About that Almec's line...
New Mandalorians Did actually wear armour
1. And have a list of reasons why they probably didn't wear the full suits
The Traditionalists were NOT repressed for being in concordia
2.Aaaaand more examples of them wearing armour and other similarties (that both have and don't have to do with armour)
And another post about this with me being more annoyed this time
-Tarre Focused
New Canon Timeline Of Tarre Vizsla
Thoughts On His Position As A Jedi and Mando'alor
LET HIM BE BITTER
Funeral Rites and Possible Lack of there of
Analysing his statue
A Mixture of two cultural styles
He Possibly didn't die in battle
What the kark happened to your armour, buddy
-Darksaber Focused
It's Current Uses
Independent Saber With No Master
It's only used as a symbol of leadership in the Death Watch/House of Vizsla
Stop using 'it's Mandalorian!' to excuse it being stolen
Lightsabers and souls, a thought about the Darksaber
It's Curse and how Mandalorians are falling for it
Headcanons:
Beskar Padawan Beads (bc Mando Jedi)
Tarre with them :3
Please Consider this alternate interpretation for when mixing Legends and Canon together
Tarre Has A Jedi Order Symbol, not a Shriek-Hawk
Jedi Temple Guard Tarre
Tarre's essays
Mango Thoughts
Jango's Terrible Jokes
My Favourite Mandalorian Headcanon
Kage Heritage Tarre!!!
Aran Tal Is A New Mandalorian
Royal Academy Armour
Are the Journeyman Protectors... well, journeymen?
Sabine's canonical age means that she was born during the time Ursa was with Death Watch, so @blueberry-ry and I have gotten really into the idea of Ursa having Sabine with her during that time and Bo helping raise her :[ toxic yuri ursabo and their baby 'bine....
Every time Korkie is called a Kenobi an angel loses its wings đ
Even if his father was actually Obi-Wan, why would he magically become a Kenobi?
You don't see people going around calling Luke and Leia "Naberrie" after discovering about Padme, so why is "Kenobi" used as Korkie's "true identity" and his name as a "Kryze" is a "lie"?
Why is the man's surname more true than the woman's? Why does hers become invalid when his is "discovered"?
The new Mandalorian Visual Guide book is out, so letâs see what it says about the Sisters Kryze.
Iâm actually appreciative of what was established. It doesnât fix the fracked up canonical timeline, but it also doesnât add to it either. Whether it was intentional or not, it also seems to suggest that Bo-Katan is not that much younger than Satine. (Everyone, rejoice!)
We FINALLY have a Satine mention. This is the first time that Bo-Katan has been said to have a sister (not just a father) since she was brought into live action.
This is also the first time weâve had an âauthoritativeâ (for better and worse) source that has canonized the idea that Bo-Katan felt overshadowed by Satine.
But keep that in mind. Weâll come back to it.
Iâm grateful that theyâre pushing against the idea that Satine somehow imposed pacifism on the Mandalorians. Itâs already been canon for years that Satine was confirmed as leader by the Mandalorian clans, who were exhausted from endless wars and longing for peace.
I do not like the fact that Star Wars is leaning into the idea that Bo-Katanâs participation in Death Watch was âimpulsive.â Itâs such a cop-out to say that Bo joined a terrorist cult by accident instead of that she was once convinced by their violent, traditionalist rhetoric and later saw the error of her ways.
(But Iâm not surprised given the fact that The Mandalorian has also ceased portraying Children of the Watch as a cut that Din needs to evolve beyond.)
The way Dave Filoni used to talk about Boâs decision to join Death Watch seems to me to imply a measured and resolute decision, not a decision made by someone young and impetuous.
I have a rather lengthy backstory that even explains how [Bo] became a Death Watch soldier that goes all the way back to the time she and Satine are six. Because to figure out how she got to that point, and yet Satine is a duchess... I have a whole story about who their father was and what their relationships were and everything with Vizsla, going back for a very long time and how that intersects with Obi-Wan Kenobi. (2013)
(TBH, itâs a little strange and disconcerting that they are overemphasizing the fact that Satineâs death was caused by Maul, who *betrayed* Death Watch, as if Pre Vizsla wasnât already planning to kill Satine himself. It suggests to me that theyâre doing their best to explain away Bo-Katanâs time in Death Watch and likely have no plans to address that issue with any kind of weight.)
However, Iâm actually surprised and pleased that they did not canonize that Bo-Katan was a teenager in TCW.
I was scared by the line âexposure to conflict since her teenage yearsâ but that actually makes more sense if you assume her teenage years were during the Great Clan Wars (the same as Satine) as opposed to during Satineâs reign.
Which, as Iâve elucidated before, is also established by The Mandalorian itself by the fact that Bo-Katan says her father was present at her Creed Swearing ceremony, which seems to happen when Mandalorians are about 13.
Based on Adoniram Kryzeâs death date, Bo cannot be more than four or so years younger than Satine.
To me, the line about Bo âin her youthâ being overshadowed by Satine also suggests that they cannot be more than a couple years apart in age.
If Bo was in fact a teenager during The Clone Wars, then she would have been 15+ years younger than Satine. Both of her parents would have died shortly after Boâs birth because they are dead before Satine meets Obi-Wan, and Satine would have raised her younger sister AND her nephew-son together.
Under that circumstance, it would be so ridiculous to say that Bo-Katan felt âovershadowedâ by her sister, who was functioning as her mother.
Beyond that, the book established that Bo is proficient in the same style of jet pack combat that Din Djarin was trained in. It continues to be a mystery how Children of the Watch is connected to Death Watch, which discovered Din in the first place.
Itâs interesting that they still listed Bo-Katanâs homeworld as Kalevala even though she says that she was âborn onâ Mandalore. Maybe Mandalore just has better hospitals than Kalevala.
I donât think this is new, but Bo-Katan is also four inches shorter than Satine, which is strange to me, but it reflects the real life heights of Katee Sackhoff and Cate Blanchett.
See, whatâs so funny about this is that they clearly want Bo-Katan to both be young enough to have a childhood with Satine but not be in her 60s in The Mandalorian.
I donât like the idea that Bo-Katan joining Death Watch was an impulsive decision, buuuuuut ⊠if thatâs how they want to describe it to give her the appearance of being âyoungerâ (to essentially downplay the idea of her being a true terrorist), then I guess Iâll accept it.
Especially if, like you said, thereâs an element here where itâs Bo-Katanâs jealousy of Satine and desire to essentially establish herself as her own person that drives her down that path.
Now, at some point, the âimpulsivityâ canât be used as an excuse anymore. If the implication is that Satine and Bo had a childhood together, then you also have to accept that by TCW, she is a grown-ass woman doing grown-ass terrorism.
But I guess what Iâm saying is that the two ideas are not mutually exclusive. I can definitely see Bo-Katan becoming enamored by the rhetoric of Death Watch and the kind of romantic nostalgia that their warrior ethos probably represented to her because she wanted to eschew the pacifism of Satine (and their father) as fully as possible.
"If the implication is that Satine and Bo had a childhood together, then you also have to accept that by TCW, she is a grown-ass woman doing grown-ass terrorism."
"Why doesn't Jocasta let Jaster enter the Jedi Archives, he is an Academic he should be allowed to!" well you see, I think his little "I kill indiscriminately for the right amount of money" job might be something that Master Nu, a Jedi, does not like that much.
Duchess Satine forbade the people of Mandalore from speaking Mandoâa, their native language, and forced them to speak only Galactic Basic, the language of the Republic. Hereâs all of the evidence to prove it!
First off, we have ⊠Oh, wait. Satineâs the only named character in The Clone Wars who speaks Mandoâa, and she even uses the warrior dialect of the Concordians.
And hmm ⊠thereâs Mandoâa on the police speeders.
(Also note that the police carry and use blasters and flame throwers, so she hasnât outlawed weapons either. Mandalorians are also not forbidden from carrying weapons within the city, which is why the Death Watch terrorist pictured above was carrying a blaster. The only people forbidden from carrying weapons are outsiders ... and that was only a rule solidified in The Clone Wars Season 3.)
But surely the children are only taught Basic âŠ
Nope! The children of Mandalore are taught both Basic and Mandoâa, but you can see that Mandoâa is what Korkie is using on his tablet.
Itâs clear the children are bilingual. They use Mandoâa for their studies, but Ahsokaâs presentation is in Basic. It's likely that they are using Basic to converse with her but speak Mando'a amongst themselves.
In fact, the only place in Sundari where we see Basic is on the domeâs exits (this says âHangar 1â), with the implication that they are accommodating travelers.
"Bo-Katan could still be Mand'alor if she just married Din!" if somebody proposed that to Bo-Katan she would kill them, then everyone in that room, hunt Din down and kill him, and then kill herself for good measure
@nasa please make the full 9 day livestream footage available from (https://www.youtube.com/live/m3kR2KK8TEs) and/or (https://www.youtube.com/live/6RwfNBtepa4). I know it'll probably take a minute, and it'll probably be chopped up into several videos, but I'd watch that playlist on repeat. I need a recurring source of moon joy. I want all the informative commentary between comms. I want the small moments of playing with Rise, and the floating Nutella, and fixing the toilet. I want to internalize this phenomenal mission the way it deserves.
Dave Filoni designed Satine and Bo-Katan to be twins or very close in age. His backstory for them includes an event that happened when they were both six years old that shaped both of their lives as a pacifist and a warrior.
Copying this from my conversation in the notes because apparently a lot of people don't know that the whole "Mandalorians love kids" thing is uhhhh fascist rhetoric.
This is greatly oversimplified because I'm supposed to be at work and I'm not actually an expert in this topic but hopefully it's a decent overview of the more political side of why I dislike this fanon:
---
A lot of the rhetoric that surrounds the Mandalorian fandom is very military by nature, and 'this military/warrior society, which yearns for an imperial past, holds up their children and the protection/care of those children as a symbol of how they are better than others' is classic far-right/fascist propaganda. It simultaneously has them positioning themselves as 'better than other cultures' by implying those others have lesser standards for childcare, smokescreens actual abuse (what do you mean I'm hurting my child? no, my culture CARES for children, unlike yours. and it's for their own good, anyway), and is used as justification/fuel for high-control policies that invade privacy (surveillance state, current IRL online ID age verification laws) and stamp out minorities (anti-trans laws).
Death Watch can justify their high militarism with 'we can't protect Mandalorian children unless we can bring guns everywhere we go.'
Does every fic follow through with the IMPLICATIONS of a highly militarized group like the True Mandalorians (specifically those at Galidraan) espousing a rhetoric about caring more for children than other cultures? No, of course not, most people are just jumping on a bandwagon of fanon about Mandos being really gung-ho about caring for kids.
But unfortunately, it has the mix of 'there's nothing in canon that actually supports this,' 'this is fascist rhetoric,' and 'this is logically inconsistent with the rest of the galaxy.'
Copying this from my conversation in the notes because apparently a lot of people don't know that the whole "Mandalorians love kids" thing is uhhhh fascist rhetoric.
This is greatly oversimplified because I'm supposed to be at work and I'm not actually an expert in this topic but hopefully it's a decent overview of the more political side of why I dislike this fanon:
---
A lot of the rhetoric that surrounds the Mandalorian fandom is very military by nature, and 'this military/warrior society, which yearns for an imperial past, holds up their children and the protection/care of those children as a symbol of how they are better than others' is classic far-right/fascist propaganda. It simultaneously has them positioning themselves as 'better than other cultures' by implying those others have lesser standards for childcare, smokescreens actual abuse (what do you mean I'm hurting my child? no, my culture CARES for children, unlike yours. and it's for their own good, anyway), and is used as justification/fuel for high-control policies that invade privacy (surveillance state, current IRL online ID age verification laws) and stamp out minorities (anti-trans laws).
Death Watch can justify their high militarism with 'we can't protect Mandalorian children unless we can bring guns everywhere we go.'
Does every fic follow through with the IMPLICATIONS of a highly militarized group like the True Mandalorians (specifically those at Galidraan) espousing a rhetoric about caring more for children than other cultures? No, of course not, most people are just jumping on a bandwagon of fanon about Mandos being really gung-ho about caring for kids.
But unfortunately, it has the mix of 'there's nothing in canon that actually supports this,' 'this is fascist rhetoric,' and 'this is logically inconsistent with the rest of the galaxy.'
Time for my obligatory mention of how warrior cultures are often not overly protective of children and also are rather permissive towards abuse in the name of "toughening them up/making them a warrior/etc"
The Basiliskans were an intelligent reptilian species native to the planet Basilisk, who later, after millennia of enslavement to the Mandal
âTis so!
I have a pet headcanonâcompletely unfounded you see, yes I understand this is in all likelihood not what the original authors intended but the coincidence amuses me neverthelessâthat Mandoâa besâuliik âbasilisk war droid,â despite appearing to be derived from bes âmetalâ + uliik âbeast of burden, draft animal,â actually comes from a corruption of *basuliik > besuliik, which got re-analysed as bes-uliik. And perhaps uliik as a stand-alone word actually derives from the reanalysis or perhaps *basuliik was coined as a compound word *bas-uliik âbasiliskan beast.â But in either case besâuliik derives from a derogatory term for the Basiliskans⊠and that, furthermore, thatâs where the word bas âanimalâ also comes from.
tl;dr: The original Mandalorians were hot garbage and I find it unrealistic that they left zero problematic linguistic heritage.
During their conflict with the Mandalorians in 4017 BBY, the Basiliskans chemically poisoned their own planet to deny it to their conquerors.[1] âWookieepedia
[1] "The History of the Mandalorians: Exploring the Evolution of a Mighty Race of Warriors" â Star Wars Insider 80
And furthermore, I think we should have a word like basnarir âto do a Basiliskanâ to describe either using scorched earth tactics in general⊠or maybe even using any stratagem that fucks you over at least as severely as your enemy, if that meaning has deprecation over the years as well.
Yes, you get it! Thatâs the vibe Iâm going for. You scratch the surface and itâs like, ooh how poetic! The aayâhan! Then you scratch that and itâs the ghosts of ancient enemies and friends and battlefields and exiles and horrors.
@glimjack Fair point. Tbh Star Wars has so may things that are problematic on a Doylist level that Iâve apparently gotten so used to doing some mental gymnastics to work around them itâs become entirely unremarkable nowâwhich is not necessarily a great habit to get to, hmmâbut what I immediately reached for here is that this is something people say rather than something that is factually true. Part of the slaversâ propaganda justifying the slavery, that is.
Which itself would probably be based on something in the Mandalorian philosophy that gives such an idea credence (or whoeverâs philosophy depending on where this statement originated from). Might even be related to the thing where the Mandalorians of old only considered themselves to have (Mandalorian) souls, and eventually other peoples too who put up good enough a fight against them (but not those who failed to do so). Maybe other peoples had different types of souls, maybe not; clearly theyâre inferior to proper mando souls⊠you see how ideas like âtheyâre not really peopleâ and âtheyâre not really sentientânot capable of forging their own glories and destiniesâ might follow.
Given the millennia since this happened, there might even be some mistranslation and/or misunderstanding happening regarding what exactly degeneration means. Is it the âlook at what theyâve become: mere beasts of burden for their conquerorsâ circumstantial type that considers the social/political/economic status as a part of a peopleâs fate/destiny/esprit that can (de)evolve, or the purely biological sense that the modern audience would understand the word to mean?
But yeah. If I were to pick up this thread in a transformative work, I would definitely not take it at a face value. Just look at how irl slave owners justified the enslavement of peoples of different racesâdoesnât something about this argument sound rather familiar?
yeah, I have a huge problem trying to believe that devolution happened ever, let alone so often in the gffa as legends would have it, but I also decided long ago that itâs very believably a propaganda/philosophical tool that occupation forces, and colonial mindsets would use to break a population who was refusing to submit or fight to their so called glorious standards
I made the original post as a joke, but this is straight up slaver shit and just another example of the depersonalisation in the star wars galaxy that is ugly as hell. legends writers really played the âyes, andâ game hard and took it to places I would never have gone but it makes for a crazy story.
the way that mandosâ beliefs (even after they distanced themselves from their deities) un-person auretti is really fascinating, because it leads to an incredibly fucked up level of nationalism that meant parties like death watch had a lot of historical and spiritual precedence for their extremist shit
anyway, you said it really well
(tagging @glimjack so you get a notification too!)
I am frankly unaware of how many other instances of devolution there are in the Legends, but considering the rampant slavery in the Galaxy far far away, it wouldnât surprise me. They would have many, probably varied, attitudes both against and for slavery floating around, including the propaganda that is necessary for justifying and supporting slavery. And while there are probably varied justifications for slavery given the vastness of the galaxy, a core one is probably dehumanisation (or depersonalisation given many of them are aliens and not humans).
Doylist, some of the Legends writing has aged⊠interestingly⊠because we consider things like slavery and dehumanisation and genocide a lot more taboo now than fifty years ago. Not that those topics shouldnât be addressed in fiction, but I think they used to be addressed in a much more cavalier fashion than is acceptable by todayâs standards.
Regarding Mandalorians, imo theyâre a comparatively interesting and three-dimensional fictional culture precisely because so many different writers had so many different ideas for them. And I feel like the best kind of mando culture comes from accepting that all of those ideas are simultaneously true, or at least that all of them were true at some point in their lengthy history. Yes, they were conquers who thought genocide and slavery were their god-given right. Yes, they themselves went through a genocide. Yes, now some of them are pacifists. Yes, some of them are extremists. In a way, all of the modern Mandalorian movements are reactions to their fucked up past: trying to recapture the glory; creating codes for how they can be honourable warriors instead of genocidal maniacs; or rejecting the military parts or at least the expansionary parts.
Didn't galidraan happen two years before TPM in the comic? The timeline is stupid but i remember that from my latest reread
Ehhhhhhhh complicated. I use the 44BBY date because it makes more sense, given that Jango spent time in slavery, then escaped, then had time to recover, then had time to build a name for himself, then had time for the clones to be grown in vats, then somehow had time for the whole situation with the Nulls AND the Alphas, and only then were the earliest "standard" clone batches decanted in 32 BBY circa TPM... but there are conflicting canons. Wookieepedia explains it like this:
Okay so i don't know what preceeded what but I'm amused that everyone who read the comic promptly retconned this panel
I can see why you'd prefer the alternate timeline BUT if you ever want to delve into the version of things where galidraan happens years after the year on the run and Satine's rise. I'd love to think about the implications of that possible version.
I will say that I don't think there needs to much a time jump between galidraan and taking on the clone job. His name could have already been made from being the leader of the tru mandos. But my preference for the clone project is also to stretch the timeline of it so
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