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lesjouetsdudestin reblogged your post AU: Where the Shameless fandom is posi... and added:

AU: Where the Shameless fandom stops telling the Shameless fandom to be positive about stuff they can’t logically...

There was absolutely no reason for you to respond to this post, especially not in the way you have. I didn't attack you, so why are you attacking me? 

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AU: Where the Shameless fandom is positive.

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I think Ian and Mickey should have quiet moments this season, and domestic moments, and actually talk about what has/is going on between them (because they don't communicate enough with each other), and sweet moments, and intense moments, and after all of that they should have sex too.

And I think we'll probably get all of it. 

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I have noticed that recent casting news, the character Soldier Price who is due to appear in episode 11 of season 5, has, understandably, caused a lot of apprehension. 

While I am still rather weary about this as well, I would like to point some things out.

1. I have noticed the conclusion everyone seems to be jumping to is that this soldier is there to arrest Ian for his crimes he committed in the Army. However, It's rather unlikely that Ian would be arrested by a soldier, It more likely be the actual Military Police.

2. I truly doubt they will end this season with Ian in another bad position. They have ended the last two with Ian-related cliffhangers, it would be rather excessive to end a third that way. I think the season will end pretty good for Ian and Mickey, not perfect obviously, it's Shameless, but significantly better than the last two. 

3. Lastly, don't forget that this is all speculation! We won't know what happens until the season airs, so It's best not to get too terribly worked up over little spoilers like this that could mean any number of things. 

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A lot of this fandom is pretty lousy at the fan part. 

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HTGAWM vs Shameless (US)

I have noticed a lot of comparisons between How To Get Away With Murder and Shameless, and the sexual encounters between the gay relationships on each show. 

Although a post was already made about this earlier this week here, I would like to narrow this down to these two shows, and why they do or do not show sex scenes between the gay couples on each show.

Firstly, It's important to remember that these are two completely different shows, no show is going to depict a type of relationship- or anything for that matter- the same way. Shameless and HTGAWM are significantly different, and they have very little in common.  However, they do both have a gay relationship which is why I believe so many comparisons are being made. 

Wouldn't it be really boring to have representation that's all the same? It's nice to have diversity, and to show that not every relationship is purely sexual, or going to end in love and romance. If you think about it, not every heterosexual relationship is depicted the same way either. Some show more sex, others show more romance and emotional growth.

With Ian and Mickey, the focus of their relationship is on the emotional aspect. We know that their relationship is sexual, that was established from the very beginning and is constantly reinforced through their conversations and meetings. With Ian and Mickey, we are watching them fall in love and experience different emotions regarding their relationship, so those moments are what we see. We see them grow from two boys who are having casual sex, through to two boys who love each other. Along that journey we witness breakthroughs, such as hanging out, kissing, staying over and making choices based around the other’s feelings or current state of being. We also see the painful moments, the heartbreak, the frustration, the reluctant desire.

 We don’t see much of the sex, however, because we know it’s happening, in a narrative sense. Ian and Mickey’s relationship is forbidden, and it’s through their sexual relationship that this is conveyed. We have three scenes between them that qualify as being sex scenes, even if just in part, and all three of them end abruptly when someone walks in on them, and what follows is chaos, the development of their relationship is stuttered and even backtracked a little. This pulls on more than just the outside opinion and perspective of their relationship, but also Mickey’s own feelings, acts as a catalyst for exploration of his issues with being in a relationship with another boy and allows for development, as all three end with something especially bad for Mickey, however he keeps coming back which draws into the emotional aspect of their relationship further; and as their emotional relationship develops, and each boy wants more, doesn’t want to stay a secret, doesn’t want to lose the other, etc.

 In addition, it is important to remember that for season one and part of season two, Cameron Monaghan was underage, so they had to cut the sex scenes off before they showed anything. However, episode 2x08 onward they could have shown sex scenes, and they did, each one simply ended badly. But, every one on these sex scenes that ended badly, played a big part in their story line. In season four they could have shown sex scenes yes, but it wasn't necessary. Shameless is a show with quite a few main characters, meaning each only gets a limited amount of time each episode. Clearly, it was more important to depict these big things happening between Ian and Mickey than to focus on showing us the sex we already figured was happening. Isn't it more important to show Mickey saying things like 'Together' and 'Course we are', then a hot sex scene?

These two shows could not be more different, having one aspect that is the same does not warrant comparing these two and claiming one is better than the other. It's about the same as saying Lorf Of The Rings is better than Harry Potter, both are good but they aren't the same thing so therefore you can't make an accurate comparison. 

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Ian/Mickey Sex Scenes on Shameless

I want to address the complaints I occasionally see floating around regarding the visual representation of the sexual relationship between Ian Gallagher and Mickey Milkovich.

Whether the amount of screen time their sexual relations gets is an issue or not, I don’t know. I personally don’t think so, but there seems to be a fundamental misunderstanding which I’d like to address.  Also note that I’ll be using ‘writers’ but I’ll also be referring to directors, editors and other people involved in the technical aspects of production, just to make it less complex.

Firstly, let’s remember that this is a TV show, there are things they can and cannot show, technicalities and layers of various forms of metaphors, subtext, information and other things for a variety of different reasons. This is used to make the show how it is, to create layers and depth to the characters and events, to convey the messages the writers would like to send to the audience and to represent the different characters and relationships the way they would like them to come across in the most effective manner possible, for all audiences watching [not just tumblr fans].

Shameless is a show that deals with relationships. That’s what it is at its most rudimentary level. Each relationship between two characters, whether it’s Jimmyjacksteve and Fiona, Terry and Mickey, Carl and Bonnie, Ian and Mandy or Ian and Lip, they are all different. The different aspects of these relationships will be focused on more than others and at different times, because those are the aspects which the writers feel are most important for the audience to experience.

With Ian and Mickey, the aspect of their relationship that is focused on is the emotional aspect. We know that their relationship is sexual, that was established from the very beginning and is constantly reinforced through their conversations and meetings. We don’t see much of the sex, however, because we know it’s happening, in a narrative sense, it would be a waste of screen time to show what we already understand about a relationship unless the writers want that aspect to be the focus for the audience. With Ian and Mickey, we are watching them fall in love and experience different emotions regarding their relationship, so those moments are what we see, the casual conversation, the friendship, the feelings, [in Mickey’s case] the use of their sexual relations as a buffer or armour. We see them grow from two boys who are having casual sex, through to two boys who love each other. Along that journey we witness breakthroughs, such as hanging out, kissing, staying over and making choices based around the other’s feelings or current state of being. We also see the painful moments, the heartbreak, the frustration, the reluctant desire.

Furthermore, their relationship is not a normal relationship, no matter how normal you insist homosexual relationships are, there are a lot of people who will disagree, and those are the people Ian and Mickey live around (mostly). You cannot compare it to the other romantic/sexual relationships on the show as the majority of them are heterosexual, no two relationships are the same and will never be represented the same, but the difference between homosexual and heterosexual in a place such as South Side Chicago is even more extreme. Ian and Mickey’s relationship is forbidden, and it’s through their sexual relationship that this is conveyed. We have three scenes between them that qualify as being sex scenes, even if just in part, and all three of them end abruptly when someone walks in on them, and what follows is chaos, the development of their relationship is stuttered and even backtracked a little. This pulls on more than just the outside opinion and perspective of their relationship, but also Mickey’s own feelings, acts as a catalyst for exploration of his issues with being in a relationship with another boy and allows for development, as all three end with something especially bad for Mickey, however he keeps coming back which draws into the emotional aspect of their relationship further; and as their emotional relationship develops, and each boy wants more, doesn’t want to stay a secret, doesn’t want to lose the other, etc. The ties involving both the relationship between themselves, as well as other characters and relationships become more tense, and we see that peak in late season three and in season four.

It’s all incredibly complex and I’m not touching even a tenth of it here, but this is not about homosexual sexual representation, they weren’t created and included for that reason. It’s about two boys and their story, the development of their feelings and their relationship and the various things that affect it. Is it not just as important, if not more so, to see the very real love between two boys rather than the sex on TV?

We’re likely to see one if not more ‘happy’ sex scenes between these two when their story has developed to that point and other aspects are not the focus (so early or late season five probably, I’m thinking).

Also noting that seasons one and two, Cameron Monaghan was underage and they actually could not have shown sex scenes even if they wanted to.

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akria23 reblogged your post All of these Connor/Oliver and Ian/Mic... and added:

I would have to in part disagree with this. I’ve seen the scene(s) people are comparing and the one with the...

Okay, first off we barely know Connor and Oliver. We don't know how much or little they care for each other. Saying that Oliver is the most important man in the world to Connor is quite a stretch, and it's the same for Ian and Mickey. It's not as simple as 'the most important person' life is far more complex than that. For example, Ian has all of his siblings that he has loved and cared about all of his life, Mickey didn't replace their title as most important, he just joined in. And even think about your own life, I'm sure you have more than just one person you would do anything for.

Furthermore, the amount of time they've been together DOES matter. Passion =/= love. You can't love a person you don't know very well, it doesn't work that way. The more time you spend with a person, the more you get to know them, and potentially love them. So yes, being together for almost 5 years does matter and is much different from being together for a few months. 

What are the similarities in emotionalism? Up to this point I have seen no similarities in emotions between the two couples. So far, Connor and Oliver haven't really even had any emotional scenes beyond the ones in 1x04, when Oliver confronted Connor and proceeded to kick him out, and the flash forward scene you mentioned. Also can you elaborate on 'stuff'? To me, it seems as if you are agreeing that there really isn't anything to compare and then adding that there is 'stuff' to compare as your support. 'Stuff' means nothing.

"Why can't people just let people be." I did not attack anyone for these posts, I did not comment on any of these posts either. I simply made my own post as to why I am bothered by these comparisons. However, it seems to me that you ignored most of what I was saying and took my post as a blow to Coliver, which was not my intention at all. I don't think Coliver is lesser than Gallavich, it has great potential. But we currently only have three episodes with them, meanwhile we have four seasons with Gallavich, in my eyes that doesn't warrant all of these comparisons. 

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So I AM the only one on Planet Earth whom does not see the Ian/Mickey and Connor/Oliver connection.

Okay, so the closest thing that I can rationale to a similarity is Gallavich as a hybrid entity being like a past version of Connor, but there’s no way that Connor grew up poor in a ghetto and being ‘Southside’ is so integral to whom both Ian and Mickey are as people.

… I feel so alone.

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All of these Connor/Oliver and Ian/Mickey comparisons are really bothersome. 

They are very different, the only similarity is that both couples are gay. Connor is in very few- if any -ways like Mickey, just as Oliver is in very ways like Ian.

I have never really been a fan of comparing ships, but especially to the extent these two are getting compared. Big moments for Ian and Mickey are getting compared with random heated moments between Connor and Oliver. Ian and Mickey have been through so many trials and hard times together, Connor and Oliver have known each other for maybe a little over a month (not counting flash forward scenes), and their relationship has just been sexual. Ian and Mickey have been separated and put through the wringer so many times, but it has only made their love for each other stronger, Connor and Oliver have just been having sex. 

It is incredibly undermining to Ian and Mickey’s story when you compare them to Connor and Oliver, who have barely progressed in their relationship. This is not to say that I dislike Connor and Oliver, I don’t! I really like them, and can’t wait to see how they progress during the show. But that doesn’t change the fact that these comparisons are wrong. A few scenes that look kind of similar out of context, are not the same as them being similar. 

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Why are we comparing these two very different couples??