"I'd put you through it again unstoppable force" vs "Oh hell nah immovable object"
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@gameshunger
"I'd put you through it again unstoppable force" vs "Oh hell nah immovable object"
An interpretation Iâve seen of this passage that really reduces both Katniss and Peetaâs characters down is using it as evidence that Peeta is solely hope while Katniss is solely fire. That Peeta doesnât have fire of his own, that Katniss canât be a source of hope. That Peeta came in and fixed Katniss.
Peeta has been shown to have inner worlds and an intensity of his own. Heâs the one who heatedly said on the roof that he didnât have much he was allowed to care about except his own identity. Heâs the one who told Katniss to make sure everyone saw the berries. Heâs the one who made a pointed comment about rebellion during the Victory Tour, and heâs been shown to be angry countless times. A boy who is a whiz with fire has to carry some heat and fire within himself.
Likewise, Katniss has this perseverance to her that is hopeful. This stubborn need to keep those close to her protected and loved. There were a lot of embellishments surrounding her actions through the series, but the core part of her that inspired a nation was her ability to care and protect. Volunteering for Prim, the flowers for Rue, the medicine and berries for Peeta. These are actions that inspire hope.
How can we look at a girl who was having the worst time of her life, who was even planning her own death in Mockingjay, yet still found the time to give Johanna pine needles, and not see her as a beacon of hope?
And Peeta needs that hope. This is a boy who grew up in an abusive household where his mother clearly doesnât think highly of him. It doesnât seem like protection of him is a big priority. We see how this impacts him when he tells Katniss he doesnât have a shot at winning the Games. To which Katniss tells him thatâs not a way to think. How would he not find hope in a girl that protected her little sister and family fiercely? The same girl who he gets to know and see just how caring she is to the point of remembering all his little details and always choosing him and encouraging him?
The color theory surrounding Katnissâs and Peetaâs favorite colors has always been symbolically fascinating. Katnissâs favorite color is a mix of blue and yellow, while Peetaâs is a mix of red and yellow. Katniss comes from a family shaped by sadness and needs that yellowâhope. Peeta comes from a house marked by anger and also needs that yellowâhope. And neither of them would be able to find it if they werenât both embodiments of hope and fire for each other.
Boggs did all the things for Katniss the fandom praises Haymitch for.
I think there is probably more interest in romantic everthorne but people are too scared to admit it because they get attacked. the majority of the fandom is everlark shippers obviously, I mean they are the endgame ship but fans get so gatekeepy with different fan opinions its weird. Ive seen comments on innocuous gale and katniss posts or tiktok edits saying "you better not be shipping them" "gale and katniss would be terrible" "you lack media literacy if you ship them" , fans can understand that everlark is canon endgame and also find interest in romantic gale/katniss, ppl will ship characters who never interact but when it comes to everthorne suddenly you aren't "allowed", its annoying
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I donât understand certain peopleâs fixation around potatoes in SOTR. âKatnissâ is a plant know as âswamp potatoâ so really every Katniss mention in the trilogy is a potato mention making SOtR total potato count insignificant in comparison.
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it kinda bugs me that THG is labeled as "sci-fi". Like what is sci-fi about it? The potato batteries?
Insane news for those who like me hold details in their brains like a fine mesh siv: The Hunger Games has LASER GUNS
Shout to @justafewberries for bringing this to my attention. I am befuddled
In your headcanon which Panemian politician is most fascist: Ravinstille, Coin or Snow?
I like to think about them all for different reasons, as they're all unique. Snow's is fun because it's the one we know best. He deals in underhanded, strategic moves. Ravinstille's is interesting because it's a point of identity cultivation of Panem. Coin's is interesting because she doesn't hide her power, but no one seems to object to it, giving her unchecked power in all realms. If I had to choose one, I would say I think about Snow's reign the most.
cant it be argued that haymitch's trauma changed him, and not the alcoholism? i mean, to me the haymitch we know and grew to love was always there from sotr, although hidden within the love he had for everyone he knew and lost.
and i agree with you on most of your takes about sotr, dont get me wrong. collins definitely didnt have sotr planned from the start, and im sure the reception of tbosas impacted how she wrote it (which pisses me off ngl), but i just dont think i'd say thg haymitch and sotr haymitch are completely different characters. would love to know your thoughts!!
can it be argued? sure. But I don't think SOTR itself leaves Haymitch on a note to develop such traits via the invocation of The Raven and his own recount of what he does.
First, let's unpack what he tells us he does:
I am so desperate to forget. To escape the grief, the aching loneliness, the loss of those I love. There are no mementos of them; all are burned or buried. I work on forgetting their voices, their faces, their laughs. Even in my head, my language becomes dull and flat, stripped of the color and music of yesterday. The only human contact I allow myself arrives by way of Capitol News, which I play on my television set 24/7. That way, if Lenore Doveâs ghost ever comes to me, I can tell her Iâm working on a strategy to keep that sun from rising.
There are a few key pieces here. He's working on forgetting, on drinking himself into oblivion. Perhaps this is steady for the first year, but we know Haymitch doesn't forget via his input to the memory book Katniss and Peeta create at the end of Mockingjay. Haymitch is highly perceptive and knows memory is all he has, and yet his goal at the end of sotr is to forget, not try to remember. In fact, he remembers so much that he knows it's not how his games went down when they're all on the train in CF, and then apparently tries to deceive katniss at her most vulnerable in Mockingjay by telling her:
"No. My mother and younger brother. My girl. They were all dead two weeks after Iwas crowned victor. Because of that stunt I pulled with the force field," he answers. "Snow had no one to use against me."
The second piece is his characterization of his language. His language is some of the most colorful in the original trilogy. Not in the sappy romantic way, but in a keen, mischievous, and sardonic way. Can trauma contribute to that? Absolutely! Does drinking until you're blacked out in the dark alone in front of a capital propaganda machine give you the opportunity to develop the underlying sense of humor he has? No. The ending of SOTR gives him no breathing room to develop the key undertones of his language in the trilogy.
Finally, the television. The point isn't that the television physically prevents Haymitch from becoming strategic. The point is what the habit represents. He's not studying the Capitol because he has a long-term plan. He's not gathering information. He's not building toward resistance. The text tells us exactly why he's doing it: "That way, if Lenore Dove's ghost ever comes to me, I can tell her I'm working on a strategy."
It's passive and avoidant language, not language with a larger goal in mind. He's constructing a ritual to soothe himself while he's most vulnerable to tampering with his memory. The television isn't presented as a tool. It's presented as an anesthetic. And that's important because the ending doesn't frame Haymitch as a man adapting to his circumstances, it frames him as a man giving in to them.
An alcoholic hermit stuck watching capitol propaganda 24/7 with absolutely no human interaction aside from his asshole moonshine dealer does not become a witty, strategic, sarcastic chess-master. He becomes an asshole. There's no pulse here for the undertones of haymitch's character.
Finally, the most damning point is The Raven. The character in the raven succumbs to his fate. He waits, just as Haymitch does, for a savior or the return of the source of his loss- origined grief, claiming others have returned and therefore once the person he lost returns, he'll be fine again:
Till I scarcely more than muttered âOther friends have flown beforeâ On the morrow he will leave me, as my Hopes have flown before.â             Then the bird said âNevermore.â
He commands the Raven to leave:
Leave my loneliness unbroken!âquit the bust above my door! Take thy beak from out my heart, and take thy form from off my door!â Quoth the Raven âNevermore.â
Then finally resigns to the fact the raven will be a permanent fixture in his life and chooses to slouch:
And the Raven, never flitting, still is sitting, still is sitting On the pallid bust of Pallas just above my chamber door;    And his eyes have all the seeming of a demonâs that is dreaming,    And the lamp-light oâer him streaming throws his shadow on the floor; And my soul from out that shadow that lies floating on the floor             Shall be liftedânevermore!
His soul becomes trapped under the shadow of the raven forever. Through associating the raven with haymitch, collins has condemned him to a life of nasty, brooding solitude where he has no room to actually develop the beloved trilogy traits under the boot of his trauma. She chose to end on imagery that emphasizes despair, withdrawal, and surrender rather than the qualities we later associate with Haymitch.
Further, under the covey formula, where they all seem to be magically condemned to the violent ends of their namesake, attaching a poem to a character is a permanent decision in the hunger games universe. So when she closes Haymitch's story by invoking a character who ends the poem completely constrained by his loss, she's emphasizing the very traits that sit furthest away from the mentor we meet in the trilogy.
So can trauma be a factor in developing a somewhat different personality? Yes, normally. However the ending text doesn't allow for it in sotr.
âSheâs just worried about her boyfriend,â says Peeta gruffly, tossing away a bloody piece of the urn.
Why was there an urn on the 12th floor in the first place? whose ashes did peeta land in
what do you mean when you say the initial reaction to ballad ruined Haymitch's characterization in sotr? I'm genuinely curious.
TBOSAS spent years being criticized for making readers inhabit the perspective of an unpleasant protagonist.
Snow is selfish. Snow is entitled. Snow is manipulative. Above all, heâs perceptive. Heâs strategic. Heâs incredibly similar to trilogy Haymitchâs most obvious traits. The book trusts readers to sit with that discomfort.
Some readers liked that. A lot of (very vocal) readers absolutely did not.
So if you imagine an environment where the dominant conversation around the previous prequel was "people don't like spending 500 pages inside the head of a self-serving protagonist," then SOTR is the perfect example of an overcorrection. The simpler, more blatant writing style also lends itself to the overcorrection.
Instead of a protagonist whose flaws drive the story, we get a protagonist who is nothing but âmorally goodâ. Instead of someone who shapes events through his personality, we get someone to whom events happen. He doesnât steer the ship with his strategy, he doesnât âown itâ, or end up carving his own path like Coriolanus. He frolics, takes care of his âgeeseâ (or was it doves? I forgot), tries to sacrifice himself for a child that randomly appears at the end of the games, and even when heâs even remotely âbadâ by differentiating himself at the interviews, he still apologizes to the other tributes because god forbid he be remotely self-serving like Coriolanusâ a trait people vocally and widely hated.
The irony in the disconnect is that Haymitch became a fan favorite for almost the exact opposite reason. People didn't love Haymitch because he was morally pure. They loved Haymitch because he is an asshole, not the overcorrection that sotr tries to make to account for the criticism ballad received.
Collins did not plan on writing Haymitchâs story. She claims she thought about the premise of Humeâs implicit submission and Haymitchâs story best aligned. We all know thatâs not true. Careers, capitolites, even Finnick alone wouldâve made a better run at it.
After the mixed reviews and criticism of Ballad, Collins seemingly overcorrected, likely to push more books and to redeem herself from the criticism, or to invite those whom ballad âalienatedâ back into the fandom, by making haymitch the antithesis of Snow, in turn pulverizing his character.
Iâd like to add to this by saying that I:
a) wholeheartedly agree with this take, even as someone who enjoyed SOTR
b) think this kind of overcorrection/trying to appeal to critics is the reason all the new characters in SOTR have unnecessary relationships to existing characters from catching fire. iâm guessing itâs because the audiences were so intrigued by the relationships between TBOSAS characters and the original trilogy (e.g. the mentors having the same surnames as a bunch of people from the OG trilogy)
After an entire year Iâve finally placed why Ampertâs death felt so stupidly cartoonish to me.
Itâs an actual cartoon trope. Literally. Itâs in an episode of Arthur, where he and buster get so scared after watching a movie about people-eating squirrels they are terrified of going to the park. Itâs also in an episode of the Powerpuff Girls where swarms take over the city. Itâs in so many early 2000âs cartoons, back when Collins herself was writing childrenâs cartoons.
Just been made aware the official Hunger Games YouTube channel is using AI to make (at least some) thumbnails
âA little. Only⊠no offense, but who cares, Peeta?â I say.
âI do. I mean, what else am I allowed to care about at this point?â He asks angrily.
Interestingly in this scene, Peeta doesnât say âwhat else is there to care about?â Likely because in this instance, heâs facing someone he cares about more than anything who is saying she doesnât care that he doesnât want to be swallowed by the Games.
But he doesnât say that. He knows what else there is to care about, but heâs not allowed to care about Katniss in the context of the Games. So he asks her whatâs left? Whatâs he allowed to care about? Whatâs remaining that his feelings have some semblance of permitted control over? And itâs him. Heâs only permitted to care about himself. According to the Games, and forced by the situation, he canât care about anything but himself. And yet, despite knowing heâs not allowed to care for Katniss, he chooses to anyway.
Katniss & Prim Collage
(I made a lil something đđ)
I saw the og pic and thought it fit so well for Peeta and Katniss, especially with the first interviews! I love her expression
Don't trace/steal/re-upload anywhere!
This piece, paired with D11 having a very large Black population, is such vivid storytelling of how the Capitol just restored slavery outright huh.