Not gonna lie, it feels very weird knowing that there's gonna be a new Avengers with RDJ in it but not as Iron Man. That straight up feels wrong. It feels like an arrow to the stomach.
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@indominusavenger
Not gonna lie, it feels very weird knowing that there's gonna be a new Avengers with RDJ in it but not as Iron Man. That straight up feels wrong. It feels like an arrow to the stomach.
I'm gonna come out and say it; No Way Home sucked. Sure, it had some good moments but in my opinion, it does not live up to the first two instalments of the trilogy. I liked the first part of the movie but as soon as I knew where the second part was going, I fell off that train pretty quickly.
Not only did it make MCU Spidey end up with the same tale as his two predecessors but it also undoes Peter's entire establishment in Marvel's overall franchise. What was the point of the last four movies putting him on the roster with Earth's MIGHTIEST Heroes if you were just going to take all that away and make it like he exists in a completely separate world from them? What was the point of the three cameos we had from RDJ, Samuel L. Jackson, and Benedict Cumberbatch in their iconic roles to show that interconnected universe as with every other MCU movie, only for that to be stripped away at the very last second? Might as well have been another one of Sony's solo ventures at making a series after TASM but it's not and that's why I HATE the uncertainty of Peter Parker's future in the MCU. However, given the current failing reality of the MCU with every new movie that comes out, I can already confirm it's nothing good. In fact, it probably would be best if progress stops altogether before Marvel really is stuck in the dust and just a part of a magnificent past with no legacy to carry on. (This is a side note but that is still a big issue for me anyways that I may expand upon later in another post. In the meantime, go watch all the video essays on YouTube, I'm sure you'll find many good ones.)
He had a unique story that fit into the overarching plot of the MCU and the premise he had was different from the previous Spideys which is what was so interesting about his character development. This Peter Parker had friends that weren't introduced before, or at least, they were more developed than in other series; he had a superhero as a mentor, not a scientist turned villain due to unfortunate circumstances; he had a guy in the chair who wasn't after him or turned villain because his father was one, he had two crushes that were friends, he was part of clubs and acted more teenage-like than the last two. He interacts with other heroes, joins the Avengers, fights THE villain, perishes, comes back, loses his mentor, and is still expected to keep on going.
For crying out loud, he was asked if he was going to be the next Iron Man but he knew he wasn't which is what Far From Home set out to show us. And to all those who called him Iron Man Jr. in Homecoming, I hope you know that you make no sense and I think Marvel did a wonderful job making him stand apart. He was a kid admiring one of his role models and now that he actually had a connection to him, of course he was going to want to be like his mentor but even Tony recognized that he wanted him to be more, not like him. This shows Iron Man himself had great respect for the young hero.
Now, moving onto No Way Home, two main things that annoy the heck out of me; Peter being forgotten (obviously) and Aunt May dying. I'll start with Aunt May's death. To be honest, it was a completely unnecessary death and it actually doesn't make sense for the purpose it had in the movie. The punchline "With great power comes great responsibility." loses its premise as soon as you recall Civil War's intro to Peter in the first place. Uncle Ben had already died, Peter was Spider-Man at this point, and remember what Peter told Tony when they met, why the older hero related to him so much? "When you can do the things that I can, but you don't... and then the bad things happen... they happen because of you." So he already learned that lesson on responsibility and by the time we get to No Way Home, this kid had learned lessons also involving the universe at large. Why are we rehashing Uncle Ben's offscreen death with Aunt May if Marvel literally stated that was overdone? Make that make sense. But oh, it was to make something big and dramatic happen in the movie because we needed to mOve aLoNg. Peter lost his parents, his uncle, and mentor; can you come up with something new other than parental figure losses? Why do TASM Peter and OG Peter still have their Aunt Mays and even if it was just a deleted scene, technically TASM Peter's dad? Huh, then what do you say there? Why did MCU Peter Parker have to lose ALL his parental figures?
Finally, the thing that probably broke most of us; Peter being wiped from everyone's memory. As I stated earlier, his entire existence within the MCU just vanishes, like that, in seconds. So......... what was the point of his existence up till now in the MCU? What was the point of his specific development and growth if he was just going to get forgotten? Why was he meticulously introduced at the height of the Avengers' conflict and then constantly involved with some other MCU hero/important character if he was going to be removed from that? If the Avengers were never a big deal, why make him a part of that at all and why were we still bringing them up at the climax of the film? For those who bring up the argument that he's supposed to be a solitary hero, well that was the worst way to have introduced him then, right? But Marvel chose that route, not any other. Which is why that decision still makes no sense to me. You put him in a world where he wasn't the only superhero and he was going to interact with other heroes which none of the other Spider-Men had and that already put him in a unique position. Why give him a background that was going to get swiped?
Imagine that, making five blockbuster films that gave him a firm standing in the MCU at the peak of Phase 3 and then in his sixth film, his last standalone which is supposed to be his most shining moment, he gets the rug pulled out from underneath him to give him a blank slate? You might as well have thrown every script out from 2015 to 2019 including him before they were ever written or considered. It's the equivalent of undoing everything you just worked on in a school project that's worth 40% of your final grade. Think about that for a second. Marvel just undid 6 years of work and investment in a single character for them to go back to the beginning. Why didn't you just do that then from the start? You could have had more classic Spidey a long time ago by that train of thought (which I really didn't want because we already saw that twice and this Spidey was something fresh).
Anyways, thanks for reading. This is 2 years worth of disappointment and frustration put on the page.
Remember when Jameson came every single day to see Avery during her coma in THL and Avery told him she'd bet everything on them against the world because she loves him in TFG and about so many other wholesome things that didn't revolve around them being horny or freaky? Cuz I do.
As a recent fan of the series and having just read Games Untold, this fandom's obsession with Avery needing to be horny is just straight up weird and concerning.
I don't believe anyone on here has an obsession with her "being horny"
It's more of her being hated on for having normal teenage/early twenties thoughts about her boyfriend and getting hated on for them. Considering jameson had similar thoughts and nobody said anything
I personally didn't like the way their relationship was portrayed in tnip which could be what the people you're referring to were talking about, but avery has every right to be attracted to her boyfriend
Tbh i don't see the problem with her acting how a lot of people her age who are in serious relationships act like. Especially if the focus of the story is romantic anyway (if you're talking about tnip)
Thank you for your thoughts @two-braincells-in-total.
From what I've seen, they do. They were straight up celebrating it and saying OMG, they're so horny. Hehehe. I have eyes like you but I guess you interpreted that differently.
Nobody said it wasn't allowed for Avery to have thoughts about Jameson being attractive or for him to be criticized either. And contrary to you saying that Jameson never got criticized, I guess you just never saw the posts or comments about it but that's ok.
Avery is in her first relationship here and given her way of maneuvering through those thoughts was very different back in the trilogy, I don't get where she suddenly started talking in innuendos and coming from, it was painfully awkward. If this was romantic as some keep claiming, others wouldn't have pointed out that Avery and Jameson's story stuck out like a sore thumb compared to the rest.
And I saw the post that said Jennifer has written the most romance she ever had in this book. Yes, she did. It was present in Toby and Hannah's story and Libby and Nash's. Not in Avery and Jameson's. I think romance was present in The Hawthorne Legacy but it was certainly NOT as present here. Instead of opting for what she wrote so well, the author's attempts for something new comes across amateurly. And plus, their arc is over. Why would you change something in a last ditch effort before waving goodbye to your old mains?
Let's say it together: Avery 👏 is 👏 allowed 👏 to 👏 be 👏 attracted 👏 to 👏 her 👏 boyfriend 👏 but 👏 also 👏 deserves 👏 to 👏 sound 👏 like 👏 herself 👏!
I agree that the story is out of place and that it's not as good as her usual writing
And i have seen people "celebrate" it but i believe it's not as deep as you're making it out to be, due all my respect. Most of this fandom is made of teenagers, a lot of which might either be joking about it or agreeing with avery that jameson is attractive. I just think you might be seeing it as more than it is, not to say that's bad, but just so you know, it's not that serious at all
And yes, jameson was criticised to a point. And a lot of people fought against it like how we're fighting against criticism of avery. The situation is no different
I agree tnip could've been avoided and im not a fan of it. They lacked the usual emotional connection they had in the og trilogy. However the problem with it, at least to me, isn't their attraction but more of the way they focused so much on the games in expense of the emotional and romantic connection
As to where it's coming from, well, they've developed as a relationship for sure. They've been through a lot together and have been dating for quite a while so it's no wonder their relationship matures faster this way. And it's not like TFG didn't have a suggestion that they've already slept together on her birthday AND they were making out a noticeable amount of times. So, no, it's no surprise they're more active in this aspect of their relationship. Did it need so much place in tnip? No. Could've the innuendos been more appropriate and less awkward? Absolutely. However the problem of the novella isn't the attraction between them, but the writing insead. Which is a separate conversation from what the original post was about, but one I'm also happy to have 😊
I appreciate your thoughts on this and I'd like to see more of what you have to say. I believe this could be a misunderstanding between different sides of this fandom and that all of us might be taking it as something more serious than it is. At the end of the day, sometimes you just need to say agree to disagree and move on, because it's just a book after all
Yeah, no for sure. I don't have a problem with their attraction to each other. That's always an important aspect in relationships. But in part it is the writing and in that way, it affects how the character's POV comes across. It sounded more like Jameson than Avery and I don't think it's fair for Jennifer to just throw that onto her when she has her own way of showing attraction to him. I get they influenced each other, quite frankly I'd be surprised if they didn't and that would have suggested a heavy imbalance in the relationship.
The thing is, the bed scene in TFG isn't something that necessarily even suggests s*x. I mean, would you want to sleep in a ballgown? I certainly wouldn't. It's times like those that I think the fandom also shows how serious they take that stuff and always throw it into the most extreme suggestion. Of course, that is still up to anyone's opinion but that's also something that I've noticed about people taking seriously.
Anyways, have a great day! Enjoy Christmas.
As a recent fan of the series and having just read Games Untold, this fandom's obsession with Avery needing to be horny is just straight up weird and concerning.
I don't believe anyone on here has an obsession with her "being horny"
It's more of her being hated on for having normal teenage/early twenties thoughts about her boyfriend and getting hated on for them. Considering jameson had similar thoughts and nobody said anything
I personally didn't like the way their relationship was portrayed in tnip which could be what the people you're referring to were talking about, but avery has every right to be attracted to her boyfriend
Tbh i don't see the problem with her acting how a lot of people her age who are in serious relationships act like. Especially if the focus of the story is romantic anyway (if you're talking about tnip)
Thank you for your thoughts @two-braincells-in-total.
From what I've seen, they do. They were straight up celebrating it and saying OMG, they're so horny. Hehehe. I have eyes like you but I guess you interpreted that differently.
Nobody said it wasn't allowed for Avery to have thoughts about Jameson being attractive or for him to be criticized either. And contrary to you saying that Jameson never got criticized, I guess you just never saw the posts or comments about it but that's ok.
Avery is in her first relationship here and given her way of maneuvering through those thoughts was very different back in the trilogy, I don't get where she suddenly started talking in innuendos and coming from TIG to here, it was painfully awkward. If this was romantic as some keep claiming, others wouldn't have pointed out that Avery and Jameson's story stuck out like a sore thumb compared to the rest.
And I saw the post that said Jennifer has written the most romance she ever had in this book. Yes, she did. It was present in Toby and Hannah's story and Libby and Nash's. Not in Avery and Jameson's. I think romance was present in The Hawthorne Legacy but it was certainly NOT as present here. Instead of opting for what she wrote so well, the author's attempts for something new comes across amateurly. And plus, their arc is over. Why would you change something in a last ditch effort before waving goodbye to your old mains?
Let's say it together: Avery 👏 is 👏 allowed 👏 to 👏 be 👏 attracted 👏 to 👏 her 👏 boyfriend 👏 but 👏 also 👏 deserves 👏 to 👏 sound 👏 like 👏 herself 👏!
As a recent fan of the series and having just read Games Untold, this fandom's obsession with Avery needing to be horny is just straight up weird and concerning.
Me reading Irondad and Spiderson fics after being depressed about the MCU becoming sh*t post pandemic.
I'm calling it now; Peter Parker is secretly a skin care guru. Don't be so surprised, I mean, how else do you think this boy shows up with flawless skin every time he's fighting someone? Even in the hardest battles against the worst villains, he's glowing from a mile away that it even shines through his mask that it distracts the enemy and literally burns their eyes.
Remember that Sony-Disney fight a few months post release of Far From Home in 2019 and everyone in the fandom was having a crisis over Spider-Man's future in the MCU? I feel like that argument was never fully resolved because just look at the plot we got in No Way Home. It feels like Spider-Man is no longer part of Marvel once again. So, either way, we as the fans seem to have lost our MCU Peter Parker.
I'm gonna come out and say it; No Way Home sucked. Sure, it had some good moments but in my opinion, it does not live up to the first two instalments of the trilogy. I liked the first part of the movie but as soon as I knew where the second part was going, I fell off that train pretty quickly.
Not only did it make MCU Spidey end up with the same tale as his two predecessors but it also undoes Peter's entire establishment in Marvel's overall franchise. What was the point of the last four movies putting him on the roster with Earth's MIGHTIEST Heroes if you were just going to take all that away and make it like he exists in a completely separate world from them? What was the point of the three cameos we had from RDJ, Samuel L. Jackson, and Benedict Cumberbatch in their iconic roles to show that interconnected universe as with every other MCU movie, only for that to be stripped away at the very last second? Might as well have been another one of Sony's solo ventures at making a series after TASM but it's not and that's why I HATE the uncertainty of Peter Parker's future in the MCU. However, given the current failing reality of the MCU with every new movie that comes out, I can already confirm it's nothing good. In fact, it probably would be best if progress stops altogether before Marvel really is stuck in the dust and just a part of a magnificent past with no legacy to carry on. (This is a side note but that is still a big issue for me anyways that I may expand upon later in another post. In the meantime, go watch all the video essays on YouTube, I'm sure you'll find many good ones.)
He had a unique story that fit into the overarching plot of the MCU and the premise he had was different from the previous Spideys which is what was so interesting about his character development. This Peter Parker had friends that weren't introduced before, or at least, they were more developed than in other series; he had a superhero as a mentor, not a scientist turned villain due to unfortunate circumstances; he had a guy in the chair who wasn't after him or turned villain because his father was one, he had two crushes that were friends, he was part of clubs and acted more teenage-like than the last two. He interacts with other heroes, joins the Avengers, fights THE villain, perishes, comes back, loses his mentor, and is still expected to keep on going.
For crying out loud, he was asked if he was going to be the next Iron Man but he knew he wasn't which is what Far From Home set out to show us. And to all those who called him Iron Man Jr. in Homecoming, I hope you know that you make no sense and I think Marvel did a wonderful job making him stand apart. He was a kid admiring one of his role models and now that he actually had a connection to him, of course he was going to want to be like his mentor but even Tony recognized that he wanted him to be more, not like him. This shows Iron Man himself had great respect for the young hero.
Now, moving onto No Way Home, two main things that annoy the heck out of me; Peter being forgotten (obviously) and Aunt May dying. I'll start with Aunt May's death. To be honest, it was a completely unnecessary death and it actually doesn't make sense for the purpose it had in the movie. The punchline "With great power comes great responsibility." loses its premise as soon as you recall Civil War's intro to Peter in the first place. Uncle Ben had already died, Peter was Spider-Man at this point, and remember what Peter told Tony when they met, why the older hero related to him so much? "When you can do the things that I can, but you don't... and then the bad things happen... they happen because of you." So he already learned that lesson on responsibility and by the time we get to No Way Home, this kid had learned lessons also involving the universe at large. Why are we rehashing Uncle Ben's offscreen death with Aunt May if Marvel literally stated that was overdone? Make that make sense. But oh, it was to make something big and dramatic happen in the movie because we needed to mOve aLoNg. Peter lost his parents, his uncle, and mentor; can you come up with something new other than parental figure losses? Why do TASM Peter and OG Peter still have their Aunt Mays and even if it was just a deleted scene, technically TASM Peter's dad? Huh, then what do you say there? Why did MCU Peter Parker have to lose ALL his parental figures?
Finally, the thing that probably broke most of us; Peter being wiped from everyone's memory. As I stated earlier, his entire existence within the MCU just vanishes, like that, in seconds. So......... what was the point of his existence up till now in the MCU? What was the point of his specific development and growth if he was just going to get forgotten? Why was he meticulously introduced at the height of the Avengers' conflict and then constantly involved with some other MCU hero/important character if he was going to be removed from that? If the Avengers were never a big deal, why make him a part of that at all and why were we still bringing them up at the climax of the film? For those who bring up the argument that he's supposed to be a solitary hero, well that was the worst way to have introduced him then, right? But Marvel chose that route, not any other. Which is why that decision still makes no sense to me. You put him in a world where he wasn't the only superhero and he was going to interact with other heroes which none of the other Spider-Men had and that already put him in a unique position. Why give him a background that was going to get swiped?
Imagine that, making five blockbuster films that gave him a firm standing in the MCU at the peak of Phase 3 and then in his sixth film, his last standalone which is supposed to be his most shining moment, he gets the rug pulled out from underneath him to give him a blank slate? You might as well have thrown every script out from 2015 to 2019 including him before they were ever written or considered. It's the equivalent of undoing everything you just worked on in a school project that's worth 40% of your final grade. Think about that for a second. Marvel just undid 6 years of work and investment in a single character for them to go back to the beginning. Why didn't you just do that then from the start? You could have had more classic Spidey a long time ago by that train of thought (which I really didn't want because we already saw that twice and this Spidey was something fresh).
Anyways, thanks for reading. This is 2 years worth of disappointment and frustration put on the page.
Tony's First Child
Steve: Is Pepper pregnant?
Tony: Oh goodness, no! I couldn't handle a kid.
LATER:
Also Tony: I've just adopted my first teenager. Peter say hi.
Peter: ...Hi?
Avengers: ...
Tony: *beaming at his son*
Headcanon (but feel free to use as a prompt): When Peter goes on the inevitable Stark Industries field trip, he gets so flustered when Mr. Stark finds him and his tour group that he activates another previously unknown spider power and literally turns invisible.
I will never not find this funny: even though Steve and Tony are each their own person and have distinct personalities, they share some pretty funny circumstances that make for great ironies. Outside the obvious that they're superheroes and teammates that butt heads often, they both have best friends that are named James but go by nicknames and the women they love also have nicknames starting with P.
Looking back at Civil War and Homecoming, I found intriguing parallels at their endings. When Tony arrives back at the Avengers Compound, he looks at the Avengers symbol with what I'd describe as disdain but I think it's mostly regret and pain. Then, fast forward to Homecoming's finale at the Compound and when Peter sees it, his face lights up. He looks hopeful, happy, excited. I find these as interesting comparisons. Here they are side by side for you to see what I'm talking about.
Captain America: Civil War (2016)
Spider-Man: Homecoming (2017)
Do you see what I mean? I want to believe these are intentional because we end Civil War on a somber note-the Avengers are divided, Tony comes home defeated after being stranded in Siberia and he found out the truth about his parents' deaths. What's there to believe in anymore of Earth's Mightiest Heroes? And then, we get to Homecoming. At this point, several months have passed and Spider-Man has just taken down his first major supervillain and saved Iron Man's tech. Tony Stark requested Peter's presence at the Compound and this is the first time he gets to see the place. There's a hope of rekindling of sorts with his mentor. So now, we're embracing a more hopeful tone once we see the Avengers symbol again. To me, that's an important contrast.
The resentment, hurt, and defeat we see from Tony's view reflects that lost hope in the Avengers, in a way. From the veteran Avenger who is tired and tried his best to keep the team together, we feel his shame and suffering at the downfall of his best laid plans. Now, moving onto Peter, we regain that hope and enthusiasm in the Avengers because that's how he sees this team of heroes as an outsider. He's a new recruit, a young aspiring superhero that wants to fit into that world and where better than in the Avengers by Iron Man's side? He's the most relatable of the main characters because his perspective matches that of the audience; we see the Avengers with that same hope, reverence, etc. They feel untouchable, other-worldly in a sense. I think it's also supposed to be a hint from Marvel that just because of the current conditions with the Avengers at that time, they would be back together soon and not all hope is lost, hence Infinity War. But at the moment, it's simply a subtle nod to that. Notice how hope keeps coming up as the key word in this post? I conclude that this theme of hope is supposed to reflect the way we as humans work; we may lose hope due to unfortunate circumstances, however, deep inside, that feeling of hope still lingers and stirs within us. That's why it was the last thing in Pandora's Box and I think it serves to remind us that it's always there, no matter what happens. It's so integral to us, even superheroes.
Band Practice
What actually happened on the ferry:
Tony: Hi, Spider-Man. Band practice, was it?
Peter: *pulling a clarinet from behind him
Peter: Uh, duh? Hit it!
Peter: *starts playing sick beat
Vulture: *activating hidden boombox in wingsuit
Shocker: *pulls out DJ table midair and spins tunes
Criminals: *jangling keys, beeping car horns, blasting alien weapons in sync
FBI: *banging handcuffs on support beams, guns shooting rhythmically
Other passengers: *clapping, singing, humming, dancing
Karen: *random animal noises
FRIDAY: *Led Zeppelin (traitor)
Peter's phone: *May calling (internal screaming), Ned calling (yodelling)
Ferry captain: *plays ferry horn
Tony: What the f-
Somewhere in Wakanda at the same time:
Steve: Language!
Bonus Scene:
At Midtown:
Band teacher: Hey, you hear that?
Band students: *Nodding slowly
Flash: *Starts playing Spider-Man theme
That moment when you're reading irondad and spiderson fanfics and then you remember No Way Home and Endgame exist which make you feel depressed about the current MCU so you have to listen to the Homecoming soundtrack to comfort yourself and pretend it's 2017 when all was right with the world. I’m not crying, I’m not; you are.
So minor spoiler warning for SM: NWH, but, you know how after Doc Ock is cured, he says something about voices and it being quiet? Imagine now if that were Tony Stark, stuck in his head with his AIs as voices. With the combined forces of Jarvis, Friday, Ultron, and maybe Karen, imagine the sass. The sass and sarcasm of the man himself are already unparalleled, but Tony and AIs combined? The world would collapse under the weight of sassing.