AO3: Jiaska
Pronouns: he/him
Screaming into the void while trying to overcome a years long burnout.
Current Focus: CotL Fanfic, Trying to get back into game design as a hobby.
Feel free to ask me stuff, I guess...
I hate that you have no choice but to betray Kieran's trust in the Pokemon Violet/Scarlet DLC. It infuriates me. And his sister, don't get me started on that egotistical brat.
Kieran is such a damn sweetheart. An innocent kid with a great love/passion for Ogerpon. I wish the story could have left Ogerpon in the village rather than be caught by you to live in a damn pokeball. Then she could have visited Kieran and I when she wanted and kept free to roam her new home amongst the villagers.
I just dislike how the storyline progressed. The lying, the sneaking around behind Kieran's back after all the kindness he showed, breaking his lil heart. I get why he changed. Poor kid. 😩
It's a foregone conclusion in the games that the protagonist will beat Kieran during Indigo Disk; that's just how these games work. But losing to the player didn't solve the underlying issue with him.
What do you think would have happened if Kieran actually won the battle? Elation? Disappointment? Emptiness?
Maybe it's supposed to be self evident, but after reading a lot of fics that retell Indigo Disk, I've noticed that there usually isn't a reason given for why Kieran lost; like, what is the difference between the protagonist and Kieran in terms of skill? (I know this part might not apply to your fic, since Kieran's basically trying to fight reality to beat Lilac).
These are two really interesting questions, Anon!
Thank you so much for asking them. 💖
Disclaimer: long, nerdy response ahead, you’ve been warned! 🤓
It’s so true, that’s actually something I notice a lot too—the fact that Kieran often loses in fanfics without any real justification. I think what’s usually missing is showing the protagonist's actual skill. For example, even though Lilac has to win because the Player is canon in my AU (as you pointed out), that’s still not a valid enough excuse for me. It would be way too easy to just shrug it off and say 'the Player made her win.' Because of that, in the chapters leading up to Lilac and Kieran's battle, I’m going to show that there is much more to Lilac than just the Player's influence (though, minor spoiler, it won't happen in the very next chapter since I want to start with something a bit more low-key first) 😉.
But you could argue that, at the very least, the meta-narrative is already a sufficient justification on its own!
Personally, I believe an author should provide a justification based on the specific story they are telling. A fic heavily focused on battles or the competitive scene obviously can't rely on the same explanations as a more character-driven, emotional fic. Mine might be somewhere in the middle, though I’m not entirely sure since I never know if my battles are actually exciting, even if I try my best! 😅
I don't think it's just a matter of raw skill. If it were, from my very personal point of view, very few fics would actually have the protagonist winning in a realistic way. I think besides skill, you really have to look at the characters' mental states. People often write Pokémon battles as a simple series of commands because they are used to the turn-based system of the games—which is totally normal! But I’ve always made an effort to weave the emotions of both humans and Pokémon into my battles, because I feel like their mental state deeply affects the outcome.
For instance, you could say that Kieran was so incredibly stressed and exhausted by the end of the match that he was just throwing out powerful moves without any actual endgame strategy. To use a meta-narrative example: the bro was basically button-mashing. 💀
If you think about it, that’s actually what happens in canon, like how Kieran blindly targets Ogerpon if you send her out during that battle, completely throwing away any strategy out of pure rage (or whatever emotion he was feeling in that moment, depending on your interpretation). Another justification could be his romantic feelings distracting him during the battle, if it's a very ship-heavy fic! 💕
If you want to focus on raw skill instead, like I said, you should showcase what the protagonist's specific skills actually are. This doesn't just mean making them the classic, flawless strategist who wins by barely lifting a finger (that’s the Player's role). Instead, they could have unique skills that allow them to do things during battles that put them a step ahead of Kieran in some way. Is that unfair? Yes, but that’s exactly the point! The universe is always unfair to Kieran. It’s a core trait of his character, and in my opinion, one of the most fascinating things about him.
Even when he knows he’s going to lose, he is still determined to fight anyway (in one of his Teal Mask dialogues after the Ogerpon battle, he literally admits he knew he couldn’t win but wanted to try anyway) 🥺.
I guess people avoid giving special traits to their protagonists because they’re terrified of the “Mary Sue” (or “Gary Stu”) label. In a way, I decided to challenge that label myself (even though I had a ton of anxiety about it at first!), and I really wish more people would challenge those tropes. From personal experience, it’s honestly so worth it!
Anyway, to answer your question: I think the main difference in skill between a standard protagonist (not Lilac, who is a whole separate case) and Kieran comes down to their experience. I mean, the protagonist literally defeated a super-intelligent Professor AI that had the data of every single Paldean Champion downloaded into it.
My interpretation is that Juliana/Florian are basically little geniuses—though that’s just my personal headcanon because of the whole school academy aspect and how incredibly fast they earn the respect of top-ranking officials.
However, this side of them is rarely shown in fanfics. In fact, it's often the exact opposite: we get a naive protagonist who wins purely by luck (even though luck doesn't really work that way). And people might counter with, “Well, they win because they bond with their Pokémon!🤓☝🏻”
But I’d like to remind everyone that at the end of Mochi Mayhem, some of Kieran's dialogues in the League Club Room show that he was friends with his Pokémon during Indigo Disk too! He was just pushing them to their absolute limits in training, but he was pushing himself to the limit as well (in his Japanese dialogue, he mentions throwing up and fainting). So, his Pokémon actually felt compassion and genuine affection for him, just as he did for them, because Kieran TRULY LOVES Pokémon ❤️.
And if anyone wants to bring up the argument of “Yeah, but he tried to force Ogerpon,” he knew that was wrong. He said so himself. But he loved the idealized image of the ogre he had built up in his head way too much to let it go, and at that moment, he was just incredibly angry at the protagonist. Plus, back in the League Club, he's genuinely happy to see Ogerpon together with the protagonist later on!
So, now that the first question is answered, let’s move on to the next one!
If Kieran had actually won, he definitely would have been euphoric and happy in those first few moments, because he’d finally beaten his rival. He’d probably say something like, “I finally beat you! See? I'm the strongest one now!” 🏆 But at the end of the day, it still wouldn't solve his underlying issue: his loneliness.
He would still be isolated. He wouldn’t accept the protagonist’s help because he’d realize he’d been acting like an idiot the whole time, so he’d just keep pushing people away. He'd be sitting on his throne completely alone, now forced to constantly prove that his victory was actually deserved. It would trap him in a vicious cycle of stress just to maintain his image—so basically, not much would change.
Honestly, the only real way to help Kieran is to defeat him, because that is his first major reality check (the second one being Terapagos's beam in Area Zero). Without that defeat, he would just keep going down that dark path, because beating the protagonist would be proof to him that his obsession pays off, when in reality, it’s destroying him.
Maybe he would try to become friends with the protagonist again, but it wouldn't be an equal relationship. Kieran would feel immense pressure to maintain his status because he'd think the protagonist only stays with him for that reason. Plus, the protagonist eventually has to go back to Paldea anyway, so Kieran would end up alone regardless. On top of that, this constant urge to prove he's superior might eventually annoy the protagonist, who would get tired of being treated as someone to subdue. (This is something I rarely see in fanfics, unfortunately! In my personal opinion, a healthy ship should aim for equality, not submission. There’s obviously nothing wrong with one of them being slightly stronger, but submitting to Indigo Disk Kieran is a mistake. Lilac is a shy protagonist and has shown her vulnerability, but she’s also had her moments of standing tall and facing Kieran with strength. She just has her own balance.) ⚖️
But yeah, to put it briefly: if Kieran had won, his mental state would have gotten worse. Any sort of improvement would have been incredibly fragile and bittersweet. It would be a conclusion somewhere between a Bad ending and a... Weird ending? Strange ending? I’m not even sure what to call it! 🌀 But ultimately, it would end with Kieran feeling completely empty. With no one left to surpass, he’d just have to maintain his facade, but the fire that was fueling him would be entirely gone.
I know, I know—this was a VERY long response, but you can tell just how much I love analyzing Kieran! 😂 At the end of the day, the real answers always depend on the kind of story and protagonist you are writing.
Thank you so much for reading my massive reply if you made it this far! 🫶🏻
So I did say I was going to do an analysis on Kieran and Hop in their similarities....Just not yet! Because there's something I'm pondering about Kieran's character arc.
So when we first meet the Kitikami siblings we essentially get shown their relationship and who they are pretty quickly.
Carmine's kind of a bully who doesn't like outsiders, and Kieran's her shy brother who has a hard time speaking up. As the story goes on, I feel like the story was essentially telling us how Kieran didn't really have any friends outside of his sister. (Who's also kind of a bully to him too let's be real.) Which is part of the reason he quickly latched onto MC so much besides the comparisons to his favorite Pokémon.
Yet once we're introduced to the Indigo Disk DLC, we're given the Elite Four kids who are... supposed to be Carmine and Kieran's friends.
And now I'm curious what route they were going for.
Option 1: The writers might have forgotten about that.
Option 2: Kieran isn't exactly their friend he's just the little sibling they have a soft spot for since Carmine spends time with them.
Option 3: They are Kieran's friends, he's had friends this whole time but... well the relationship is rather complicated. Even more so now after everything that happened. (It's better now though at least in Pokémon Masters Lore so that's good!)
Option 4: They consider themselves Kieran's friends and truly do care about him, but Kieran's self esteem is so low that he essentially mentally tricked himself thinking that he had no friends at all. Basically this Meet the Robinsons Meme:
To be fair I could have totally misread the original DLC narrative but if it's any of the options I've brought up, I kind like the idea of 4 being the case.
Mainly because when you have such low self-esteem like Kieran clearly has, it can be so easy for you to think that the world is against you or no one has your back. If anything how Kieran has his meltdown in Area Zero feels like it further cements this. (Also something I'll talk about more later on)
But those of you that know Kieran's character far better, I beseech thee! Tell me what you think it is because I want to be sure before I do more about my comparisons between him and Hop! Plus I'm curious what everyone else thinks too!
I also got the impression during Teal Mask that Kieran didn't have friends. I haven't played through Indigo Disk yet, so I might be wildly off, but here's how I read it.
1. Kieran and Crispin are in their first year.
2. Lacey is her second.
3. Carmine and Amarys don't have confirmed years, but it's either second or third.
4. Drayton is a second year, but he'd been held back *three* times.
So, Carmine attended Blueberry before Kieran and joined/befriended the League Club. She's confirmed friends with Amarys, and probably Lacey. Which means they understand that Carmine's bark is worse than her bite. (Something that I don't think Kieran is aware of).
Considering their roles in the club, and Amarys being student council president, I can see them being friendly towards Kieran, but because of his self confidence issues, he probably think it's pity based on being Carmine's little brother.
Drayton... I don't think he's the sorta guy with a lot of tact. I can see him trying to banter with Kieran by playfully putting him down, and Kieran taking it at face value.
Crispin is in the same year and class as Kieran, but there's no way to know how close they were before Teal Mask. It's said somewhere that they watch movies together, so maybe they were friends, but that could be something they started doing post Indigo Disk.
Also no way to know when in the school year the field trip took place, or how much time is canonically supposed to be between Teal Mask and Indigo Disk.
What I'm saying is the BB Elite Four might consider themselves Kieran's friends, but from their perspective, Kieran was a quiet little guy that left on a field trip and came back a totally different person, and they're worried about how hard he pushes himself and the club members.
From Kieran's view, their his sister's friends (Amarys and Lacey), the former Champion that doesn't respect him (Drayton), and a classmate (Crispin). Sorry if that wasn't helpful, or too long!
So, onto the main menu. Honestly, I'm only doing this because I feel that I can reuse this code in the future. Because main menus, even when properly planned out, are mind-numbing. I'm not even halfway through, I've just got drawing the options done, and figuring out how to have certain options have text to explain their function. The white squares are actually the space I defined for adding the mouse to the UI, since I felt that that was expected in most games. I'm sure adding that will bring many complications going forward. Link:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ITZOrI2qkA&list=PLSFMekK0JFgx2vmcCnttxxhrNVTjUB8R1&index=1
Video's accidentally in a weird resolution. Not important. The portal mechanic. I first made it two years ago when had a two-week break from college because I was watching too much Stargate. It... was tangled mess of conditional logic, an entire section of code never actually ran, and I used random numbers for UI placement, so it didn't move correctly with different UI sizes. I've been adding this system back into my project, mostly because I like it, and making improvements as I go. I've been coding this thing for 20 hours over the last two days and all I've had to eat is a pizza. I'm on the brink of madness, I'm never jumping back into the deep end of data management ever again. But it works though. So there's that.
Okay, this one really came out of nowhere. I was looking at some tutorials by GameMakerStation, which led me to his water reflect asset on the Yoyo Games Market. So, no, not my programming here. All I did was rewrite some stuff to fit within my syntax rules. Everything isn't seamless, I need to figure out how I want sprites to line up with their reflections, and since this is a shader, it will undoubtedly conflict with my colour swap shader, so I need to figure that one out. GameMakerStation: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCG9UNVaFpL0qCFUvIys1omg/featured The asset: https://marketplace.yoyogames.com/assets/6081/realistic-water-reflection
So, I just found out about the widest monitor available at the moment. It's not designed for video games, and indeed some of the reviews of these monitors have said that it wouldn't be the best way to play long term. But hell, I love wasting my time, so we're going to make sure that the UI works on it too. Also, for some reason, my camera doesn't follow the support player despite the fact that they're the same object. A tad strange, but I'm sure I'll figure it out later.
Okay, so, this is the first vague step towards gameplay. I didn't actually want multiplayer, that wasn't supposed to happen, but the tutorial I was following did what I wanted (to create a framework that would allow me to do gamepad rebinds in the future) while also supporting up to an outrageous 13 controllers at once. So, now I'm thinking about multiplayer. Maybe like a support player, who can do everything the main player can in the overworld, but when they die they're just put on time out for a while? Gotta be careful with local multi player.
So, not a lot of progress in terms of game... anything, really, but some resolution based GUI has been figured out. Okay, so, I was using a mixture of Pixelated Pope's resolution code from GM1 and his camera tutorial. Long story short, I use the camera's view and height multiplied by a window scale for sizing the window, the surface, and the GUI layer. What I ended up doing was having the max window scale be calculated based on the resolution, instead of using a consistent number. The issue there was that on more extreme resolutions the GUI layer would become so large that the text size would vary significantly, which would've let to uses later such as when trying to do a dialogue box. Now I use a window scale of 3, and it helps with text consistency. Another issue was that I separated the above resolution code from the camera object, so when the camera's view and height changed, the camera was left the same, which meant it wouldn't follow the player properly. That has been fixed by checking if the object exists, and accessing it's variables if it does. Basically, I think this might solve some of the potential issues that I was worried about. Resolution logic: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_g1LQ...
Another self-set challenge to keep me interested. Screen resolution is a funny thing, because by default people work towards the standard. I want to make sure that my UI elements work (mostly) regardless of the resolution.
I can already see many situations where I’ll end up banging my head against a wall, but at least it’s challenging.
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