#barsine

[herpsandbirds]

Tiger Moth (Barsine rubricostata), family Erebidae, Sabah, Borneo

photograph by Ollie Meidinger

[llitchilitchi]

Hii <3 I love your art style and I was wondering if you can draw Barsine 🙇🏻

thank you anonnie! sorry for the long wait on this one, I hope going into colour will compensate a little bit

I wasn't sure if you meant Barsine widow of Memnon or Barsine-Stateira II as in Alexander's second wife. this is my take on Barsine widow of Memnon/Alexander's mistress.

she's a really interesting person and it's honestly a shame that we know so little about her, but here are some of my thoughts behind the design

I wanted her to be in her 30s, she was probably some 10 years older than Alexander, so this would be her in her prime time at his court. the hairstyle is referenced from Athenian statues, but the veil hides it for the most part. she had a net over her hair but it got lost in the dark of her hair

her father was a Persian satrap, but her mother was Greek - while, by custom, that makes her Persian rather than Greek, I leaned more into the Greek because her husbands were Greek, and she later spent her time with Alexander, so she would likely lean more into her Greekness there.

still I tried to give her some Persian elements, like the kohl around her eyes, or the bracelets (and while it's hard to tell, I referenced some of the artifacts I saw at the British museum in the Iranian exhibit) - one of her rings is actually a reference to another ring I sawthere, it was a cute one with Aphrodite with a matching Eros one.

her peplos is mostly just me enjoying myself with draping, I love draped fabric and Greek clothing allows me to indulge quite a bit. the overlay somewhat dims the effect but it was shaded to fade to purple and highlight to a golden orange, so it has a bit of a colour shift effect. not sure if entirely historically correct (as far as I know, shot silk became a thing only in Roman times, but maybe the technique is older?) but the whole of the dress isn't supposed to be. the pattern isn't a real historical pattern either, instead I referenced this particular moth because first, I love moths, and second, barsine genus?? that's just too perfect! maybe next time I draw her I will lean even heavier into the patterns, barsine moths are really beautiful and their bright coloration lends itself to fabrics worn by nobility

anyways, um, yeah. I love her a whole lot.

[jeannereames]

Hello Dr. Reames

This question might seem odd, but it occurred to me.

When a king took a mistress for political reasons, was it expected that he would be in her company regularly?

In Alexander's case, I suppose his affair with Stateira (Darius's wife) wasn't public, which is why no source directly tells us it happened, but there were suspicions. So I'm not talking much about her; I'm referring more to Barsine.

The relationship between Barsine and Alexander was public, and we're told (except for Justin, who says Alexander "fell in love") that it was for political reasons.

So, in Barsine's case, would Alexander have spent time with her regularly? Would he have had sex with her regularly? Or would he have spent time with her not necessarily in sexual encounters?

But also, would the rest of the people, those outside of Alexander's circle, have expected him to spend time with Barsine regularly?

If a king has a mistress not for political reasons, but rather out of attraction, it's obvious he would spend time with her regularly because he likes the woman in question, an example that comes to mind is Demetrius and Lamia, but if it's a mistress chosen for political reasons, I suppose it's different.

Returning to Alexander and Barsine, I suppose the people around them did think they had regular sexual encounters because of the birth of Heracles. Regardless of whether Heracles was Alexander's son or not, according to the sources, that's what people at the time thought/believed.

And if not all the encounters between Alexander and Barsine were sexual, there were surely meetings where they discussed some political matter. But leaving politics aside, could there have been times when they simply spent time together without it being sexual or talking about politics?

I think a lot would depend on the individual situation, but for Barsine in particular, I'm relatively sure Alexander would have spent time with her outside of bed, given that she was a high-ranking Persian woman with a Greek mother (so she was fluent in the language), and daughter of a satrap. In fact, I suspect he picked her precisely because she would be able to advise him well, not just because he may have known her when they were both a lot younger. :-)

If you're interested in Barsine, you really want to run down this particular chapter in the recent book I edited with Graham. It's an excellent piece, although I realize the cost of the book is quite prohibitive. But you should be able to get a copy via interlibrary loan.

Monica D'Agostini, "Alexander's Polygamy: Some Remarks on Alexander the Great's Relationship(s) with Women." In Macedon and its Influences: Narratives of Politics and War in Honor of Edward M. Anson, Jeanne Reames and Graham Wrightson, eds. Colloquia Antiqua 44, Peeters, 2024: 157-92.

[inc0rrectmyths]

Alexander: GUYS BACON IS CALLED BACON CUZ YOU BAKE THE ON!

Hephaestion: The what.

Craterus: What.

Barsine: Roxanne please do something, he's out again.

[bugsfromtokyo]

Beautiful moth on my finger.

[er-cryptid]

Macedonian Royal Family

[traumdancer]

One thing that stuck with me after today's lecture is how historians word things. We just briefly talked about it had an impact on me.

It cam up in context of Alexander the great an the Persians.

So in books an so you'll always find the wording like "She was his lover" in this case Barsine was the lover of Alexander. Yk I always think of lover as a normal relationship. They did not marry they just had an "affair". But this is totally not the case. He straight up raped her. He used her as an object of showcasing that he had just conqored the land and now he can do as he pleases (women and children included). That realization really struck me. Alexander suddenly wasn't so great anymore.

The Professor also added that for her dying would've been a better option than beeing his lover. And I 100%% get that.

There probably so many phrasing that don't actually show you the harsh reality.

[deerheadlights]

Christmas is over so it's time for a new historical lady. Barsine, when she first arrived in Macedon and when she left. Alexander the Great's first real girlfriend.

Barsine (clover). Daughter of Artabanus, a satrap who was exiled from Persia (for rebelling against Parysatis’ dad) and sought refuge in the court of Macedon. I didn’t really give Barsine that much thought until I read somewhere that since Artabanus brought his whole family into exile with him, Barsine probably met or at least saw Alexander when they were children and then I was like OMG that makes her being his mistress so much more sense than ‘Yeah look at me I stole Mentor/Memnon’s wife.’ Also it’s like… wow didn’t expect to see the girl I knew as a kid 10 years later in Damascus but okay.

So when she was like 9 years old (and already betrothed/married to her stepmom’s brother so that’s weird) and Alexander was 2 she arrived in Macedon and lived there until she was 20 and he was 13 (she left a little after Aristotle arrived). Yeah, in an odd stroke of fate she was married to a Greek mercenary general who was one of Alexander’s biggest opponents when he was in the beginning of his invasion of Persia. Since she grew up in Macedon and had a Rhodian step-mother she was definitely more “Hellenized” than the rest of the ladies I’ve been drawing. Shortly before Alexander married Roxana, Barsine’s father “retired” from being satrap of Bactria (a role Alexander had given him). It’s possible that he was just old, but it’s also possible Barsine and her family were falling out of favor…

It’s said that she and Alexander had a son named Heracles but it would just be really weird for Alexander to give 0 fucks about his firstborn son, illegitimate or not, and not have him be mentioned ANYWHERE except after he died… however Heracles was born around the time Alexander married Roxana, so maybe she just got mad at him or ~the despot he was becoming~ and kept the baby a secret when she retired to Pergamum?