#echoesinbox

[mofffun]

Pardon, but when will we hear the english translation of chapter 20 of rita of goukkan?

yeah... let me get around to it, expect nothing for wednesday or thursday

here's the summary if you'd like to read it first on booklive

[meandmyechoes]

It's been awhile since I've seen the costumes in Star Wars designed by Asian culture since the prequels. As an Asian, I'm glad that they've brought the designs back, even if the arranged marriage scene was supposed to be depicted as uncomfortable.

yeah it's been a while! Andor did a wonderful job with it.

The arranged marriage scene speaks so much through the costumes. I love the layers that wrap around each other and eat them up with how restrictive the belts and the emphasis of formality with an obijime, like the grip "tradition" has on the charaters, and the secrets and ulterior motives they conceal.

The boy's mother probably dressed him but likely Leida dressed herself. She's the only one off-shade and has a clear bisection of the colours. It looks as if she's the only one who's actually sincere in the meeting, the one who's less 'wordly' with ulterior motives and thus less 'tainted'. Again, her belt is a free-tying one as opposed to the formal ones on the mothers.

I think it's the first time we see Mon wears a cross-collar top that's more traditional and similar to Perrin's? Both mothers share a similar style but in reverse palettes. Only Mon has Gold wrapping Blue instead of the other way round instead of the other way round. The collar-crossing is a mess but what if it signals how out of touch Mon and Leida are with 'tradition' they got even that wrong?

[meandmyechoes]

I love Andor. But out of curiosity, do you think Andor has a Westernized feel to it or does it have a combination of both Eastern and Western elements just like the PT and OT?

hmm interesting. (I wouldn neither describe Andor as 'westernized' nor the PT and OT as a combination of East and West.)

short answer:

No, it didn't really cross my mind, if anything, I think Andor is more British than American anything, from its cast and crew to the filming locations.

From a design point of view, the way production designer Luke Hall and costume deisnger Michael Wilkinson puts it, they would first think of the planet's climate, envoriment, raw materials, then build the culture form there. and they draw inspirations from all over the world. (so it's not just clear-cut 'east' or 'west')

The most notable Eastern influecne comes in Mon Mothma's apartmet, however, that's just one of the tnes of locations the show explored. What I see as kimono-inspired, another could see cross-collars already ingrained in Star Wars' costume language as folk costumes or on the Jedi. What I see as a twist on the "stable" octagonal arch doors or elaborately carved screens, could read as art deco to another.

There maybe some contention about the use of eastern aesthetics in its stereotype to represent Chandrilan orthodoxy, and I’m not sure how I stand on it. I would raise my eyebrow and smell something, but it’s doesn’t constitute as harmful in my eyes? More like the same mistakes hollywood always make dealing with eastern elements. (In other words, the design could’ve originated from eastern tradition but they’ve changed enough i don’t recgonize them as eastern anymore? because I know the details don’t go like that? but it’d still register as eastern to a western audience?)

Also, what do we consider 'eastern' influence? Is Coruscant taking inspirations from a mega-city like Tokyo not Eastern but Leida's hakama is? Then are we not walking into the same trap of East = conservative & West = progressive?

I sound inconclusive. What I mean is, maybe I'm already too familiar with Hollywood's wonky portrayal of "the East" it's becoming a blind spot to me. It feels like I'm describing all the ways Andor "westernized" eastern elements while denying that statement simply because I love the outcome.

But if you're referring to plot elements like "an energy field created by all living things" or warrior monks, do I think Andor incoporate "Eastern" tropes in that sense?

No, I think the answer is still no. To me, Andor tells a modern story, but also an age-old one about the struggles to freedom and one there's still hope. I don't know how much the showrunners are inspired by current events, or even history of uprisings, but to me, as a hker in these times, it hits close to home, and i've seen comments in the tags about it reminding them of their own histories. So I think Andor is more than that, more than limited to either "East" or "West" but strives to tell, a human story.

but if you go into comparison, if Andor gives me a "lol this is just an American remake of that Buddhist cautionary tale on attachment", no, that belongs to the original Star Wars.

Anyway, I’ve definitely overthought your question! but it’s good exercise, thank you!

[meandmyechoes]

So I've been trying to make sense of Ahsokas timeline in s7 considering the growth of her lekku when we first see her again in Coruscants underworld and I thought you'd be the best person to ask😂

Do you think her design is a design error that animators didn't think through as they like to do or do you think it actually indicates she's been away from the order for idk 3 months or something before she stumbles into the sisters? Also how much time do you think she spent with Bo-Katan (lekku growth again, new armor, they are kinda familiar with each other too) I have some thoughts but I'm not aware of any canon info on this. :')

okay let's break this down.

Design

No, the design is definitely intentional, considering Ms. Ahsoka 'D' (7.05-08) and 'E' (7.09-12) exist. They are two different 3D models and the lekku growth is noted on the character sheets. (and no, I have no idea what the Ahsoka C model is. Not mortis adult ver., not youngling ver., not Rebels adult ver., not monkey boots/original walkabout outfit)

Timeline

Actually, this problem is pretty simple, by using Anakin as a benchmark. Ahsoka met Anakin on Coruscant before he leaves for the Outer Rim Sieges in 7.06, and she saw him again during the Siege on Yerbana. So, Ahsoka stayed with Bo-Katan roughly as long as the Outer Rim Sieges has gone on.

ROTS novel states the Sieges to be 'five months' long (Ch 9). That is no longer Disney canon and does not comply with events of TCW really. so I suggest we compress the number to 3, the minimum for Padme's a baby bump to show. With 2021 Character Encyclopedia listing the Lawless arc as the earliest event in 19BBY,

it gives us the feasible timeline of: (month.week)

1.1-2 Lawless arc (5.14-16)

1.3-4 Wrong Jedi arc (5.17-20)

(2-3 Season 6, Utapau arc, Son of Dathomir, Dark Disciple Part 2, Thrawn Alliances)

3.3 Ahsoka's Walkabout (7.05-08)

3-6 Outer Rim Sieges

~5 Bad Batch arc (7.01-04)

6.3-4 ROTS/Siege of Mandalore (7.09-7.12)

In conclusion, after leaving the Order, Ahsoka spent about two months on her own, maximum two weeks with the Martez sisters and a little under three months with Bo-Katan and the Nite Owls. The Siege of Mandalore, as concurrent with Revenge of the Sith, takes about 10 days, as established in the rots timeline by allthingskenobi.

this rough work of course, neglects all hyperspace travel time.

Comments

After solving the problem, I realize it is not an intuitive reading. the lekku growth between models B and D (S5-S7) is greater than D and E (walkabout-siege), logically, then so should the B-D timeskip be longer than D-E. The feasible timeline says otherwise: B-D is 2 months apart while D-E is 3. Now I have to work backwards and suggest B-D is Ahsoka's growth spurt to explain the non-linear increase.

Last year, I initially based Bo-Katan and Ahsoka period together to be a month long based on similar observation: Not just the in-S7 growth is relatively shorter than between S5-S7, it was barely noticeable on the first watch, definitely so to the untrained eye. So I don't assume much time has passed. Especially, since Maul is an elusive target, and Bo-Katan claims, 'every minute we waste here, gives Maul an opportunity to slip away' (7.09) to highlight the urgency of the matter.

What did Ahsoka do in the blank months?

The Walkabout arc is written about an Ahsoka fresh from leaving the Order. Then, there was the Sith Temple arc in the original season 8, that was suppose to fill up the blank months after, and reconnects her back to the GAR for Siege of Mandalore. With the cancellation and revival, the Sith Temple arc is no longer compatible and thus Walkabout is pushed back to the brink of EP III. Therefore, we can only assume she travels across Coruscant, meditating and finding herself in the Force.

(concept art for original walkabout arc, by Tara Rueping)

[meandmyechoes]

I assume you know this, but if you don't apparently The High Republic Book The Rising Storm has some information about the Togruta government in it.

oh, I didn't know that, thanks for telling me! I skimmed through the book just now, it seems pretty close to my imagination. There's even some Togurti!

Here's a passage I found in Chapter 19 (+ my highlighting):

First came guards carrying traditional Shilian weapons, the long, barbed pikes known as kiavene. The soldiers were dressed in long tunics, their faces hidden beneath near-featureless masks that were framed by their montrals, the distinctive horns capped with silver plating. Moving in unison, they marched forward, only to sharply double back, lining up on either side of the ramp. When they had snapped to attention, a vision in long, flowing robes began her descent. Elarec Yovet was simply stunning, her skin flawless orange and her montrals adorned with delicate golden metalwork that glinted in the sunlight, similar but far more ornate than the ear cuffs worn by the Valons. Her long head-tails hung down in front of her shoulders, past the high collar with its fur detailing and the heavy chain that marked her high office. Regasa of Shili, Supreme Huntress of the United Tribes, Ruler of Togrutas far and wide. Time seemed to stand still as she approached the chancellor, her guard falling in beside her. The two women appraised each other, as was the Togruta way, before Soh finally spoke.  

 Home—specifically the Togruta homeworld of Shili—had been the biggest stumbling point when the Republic had first ventured into Togruta space nearly 150 years earlier. Members of the species were fiercely protective of their world and its surrounding moons, considering the ground beneath their bare feet sacred. Stellan glanced down. Sure enough, the regasa wore no shoes. Most Togrutas wore boots when they were offworld, but the High Huntress always went barefoot wherever she was. He had never met her, of course. Few in the Republic had. Those early encounters hadn’t gone well. The Togrutas had known about the Republic for centuries, just as the Republic had known about the Togrutas. There had been a mutual respect, many such as Jora Malli even leaving the Togrutas’ home planet to become Jedi, but having the Republic on Shili’s doorstep was a different matter. There had been clashes, some unscrupulous pioneers misreading the Togrutas’ apparent pacifism. Lines had been drawn that still remained nearly two centuries later.

I'm not 100% sure it's another monarchy, but not too surprise if it is, as is the case for most planetary governments. A 'royal court' is mentioned, and there was a one-off line in legends comics about Shili 'princess'es. I am pleased to hear there's support wards a matriarchal hypothesis. The head of state holds the title of Supreme Huntress of the United Tribes, which sounds at least a contest, if not a vote is necessary to determine one's competence for office? I wonder how do the genders contribute to the hunt then? Anyway, glad to see the emphasis on community and hunting continued.

The mention of a military and a navy fleet later in the book is, well, that has never occurred to me. But that's more on my narrow focus on their domestic economy. I kind of envisioned Shili to be a more recluse kind of country. But even then, sure they'd have a defense force, as is described as a reactive pacifism.

Another aspect I'm really excited about is a look into their costumes! Love to see my headcanon about the togrutas' manipulation of metalwork and status-implied accessories backed in the description. I'm pumped to expand that further now! I think there's some stories to tell about the length of one's dress and the height of their social rank, but that's a familiar story in human history.

In terms of Shili and Togruta headcanons, after costuming, my next interest is in the social dynamics of skin color and montral shapes. What constitute as 'race' for Togrutas? Also, "Ruler of Togrutas far and wide" hints at diaspora, right? Out of GFFA, I came across this photo of a women that bears a striking resemblance to the togrutas. She is captioned as a member of the Mursi people, an Ethiopian tribe. Along this line, I'd like to investigate more about the Earth cultures that could've inspired or to inspire togurtas. So, these are my three wips in the subject?

After reading this excerpt, I am indeed interested to read more. I think I'll work through the book slowly. Thank you, Anon :)

[meandmyechoes]

I like the idea behind your Ahsoka birthday head canon!!

If you wanted to make it even more tragic, consider her birthday being like a week after she leaves the order and how she’s gone (willingly or unwillingly) basically no contact with them

They’ve all got her departure fresh on their minds and there’s the reminder that she’s only 17

The clones might see it a little differently being technically 12ish, but as for her friends and family in the order…it’s not a exactly a good day

you read my mind, nonnie... (headcanon in reference)

I think it's gonna be tragic whether it happens before or after her birthday, which is why I said 'around'. If it happens before, like you said, it'd be the first birthday she has nobody around. If it's after, she'd be reminded how every ambition she has growing up came crashing down. But I suppose one'd feel sad enough if they left soon after a new year starts.

Ahsoka and the clones... is a very underexplored relationship past the first season. In regard to the wrong jedi arc, I'm fascinated by the angst of Ahsoka leaving without a goodbye. It's not that Ahsoka doesn't trust Rex, not at all, but how come he's always second place? How come she doesn't rely on him like she'd with Anakin? They've been fighting by each other's side from day 1, for fuck's sake, the three of them. How could she say that nobody else would trust her? is Rex placing too much trust in the Jedi then? That seeing she hurt his brothers wasn't enough? What kind of leader does that make him?

[meandmyechoes]

Ik dave filoni dont run the show, but I feel like he'd be the one to ask for it to happen

well, honestly, that would be a welcome sight

(previous ask)

[meandmyechoes]

Ooo, number 5 and 15 for the ask game :)

ask game

5. Name a movie that makes you genuinely laugh

We Bare Bears! The series finale is a roadtrip movie in that familiar brand of positivity and family.

15. Something exciting or good happened to you this year

eh… slow year. I guess I got a lot more confident with my mother tongue? Read more than last year too! So, baby steps.