Again, this is why the two are COMPARED. Just because someone exhibits the beliefs of one group doesn’t mean they automatically belong to the other. Nor is anyone saying that anyone is both by default, because that’s not how this works.
Which, I know that for nearly all sysmeds and nearly all transmeds, this will go out one ear and out the other, but this is an educational post for anyone who isn’t aware of why sysmeds are compared to transmeds. It’s also an educational post for those who have asked why they are compared and didn’t get that adequate of an answer or just got the answer of: “it’s a slur that endos throw around!!!111!!!”
Just like all gatekeepers within any community, there are levels to how much a person within these groups will gatekeep. Often, it’s determined by how “hardcore” their beliefs are, how aggressive the person is willing to be for their beliefs, and how much they agree with all the different things within these groups.
On the topic of system inclusionists being “ableist.” This is what the Urban Disctionary defines as Ableist:
A PERSON or People who discriminate or social prejudice against people with disabilities. It can also be someone who judges or makes fun of someone with a disability or handicap.
And this is the definition of Discrimination / Discriminate according to the Cambridge English Dictionary:
To treat a person or particular group of people differently, especially in a worse way from the way in which you treat other people, because of their skin colour, sex, sexuality, etc.
(Basically someone viewing or treating someone else with a handicap or disability differently or poorly specifically because of their handicap and/or disability).
Yes, system exclusionists and system inclusionists have a rocky history because of their vastly differing beliefs on systems and the basis which systems can form. However, when sysmeds or system exclusionists bring up system inclusionists and call them “ableist,” it’s always about the fact that they are pro-endo, are endogenic themselves, etc. In this case, they are claiming that just because someone is an endogenic system or inclusive of them that they are discriminating against DID and OSDD systems. Often times, they (sysmeds) are the ones attacking others first without any provoction. How is someone making a validity or positivity post for endogenic systems “ableist?” By that logic, anyone who makes a validity or positive post about anyone else would be classified as ableist to them. It would be one thing if they were only saying that to people who think endogenic systems were the only real systems and who claim DID and OSDD systems were fake. Then yes, that would definitely qualify as ableism. However, I don’t know nor have I ever seen any endogenic systems or otherwise claim anything of the sort. Likely, if a group like that started to pop up and gain traction, it would certainly be filled with and started by trolls. Not to mention, no system inclusionist that I’ve met or seen has ever argued with or attacked another system on the basis of being a DID or OSDD system. A system inclusionist arguing with a system exclusionist on the basis of their beliefs has nothing to do with the fact that the system exclusionist may or may not be a DID or OSDD system. It is all based around their beliefs that are harmful to the community as a whole.
In addition, traumagenic system =/= sysmed. DID/OSDD system =/= sysmed. There are endogenic and other types of systems that do hold some sysmed ideology. It’s not exclusive to just traumagenic and DID/OSDD systems, though they are the primary sysmeds that you see around. On the flip side, there are plenty of traumagenic systems and DID/OSDD systems that are very inclusionary!
tldr; Sysmed is just another term for a system exclusionist / gatekeeper that is just shorter and quicker to say than system exclusionist / gatekeeper. Being called a sysmed doesn’t mean that they are transmed or that they’re being called a transmed. You can be one without being the other. They are not mutually exclusive. While transmeds are transphobic to a degree, they also identify as trans themselves. Calling someone a sysmed isn’t a slur and isn’t the same as calling them transphobic.
Systemtime - Why You Shouldn’t Add It To Your Inclusive System Servers.
This is NOT a Call-out post! I repeat, this is NOT a call-out post. This is an informational post for singlets and slightly uneducated / misinformed systems for when they are deciding which system bots to add to a system inclusive discord server. DO NOT use this post to hunt down, harass, attack, or otherwise bully the Systemtime Devs or their friends!!
Okay, to start off, Systemtime is just a poorly run bot. It’s consistently down and no longer offers anything that Pluralkit doesn’t. You don’t get any cool things from using this bot over Pluralkit that are system related. Anything like their reminders or dice can be found with other bots if you really need those things.
They specifically say on their carrd that non-Traumagenic systems shouldn’t use their bot; so if you plan to only add one system bot and your server is endogenic friendly, at least some members won’t be technically allowed to use the bot you’ve added for systems.
Their carrd (which can be found here) doesn’t even outline their TOS or what they use your data for. Along these lines, plenty of endo-friendly people have reported being banned from using their bot. Some who have been in servers with the bot and never even touched it until they found out they were banned. Overall, it makes many endogenic and pro-endo systems feel unsafe.
Reportedly, their support server requires you to answer a question about your stance on discourse and don’t allow for you to say you’re “neutral” on the matter. So, if something goes wrong with systemtime and you’re pro-endo or neutral on syscourse, you won’t be allowed the support needed to fix the bot or gain information on what the problem is.
They also used to have (or still do, just secretly) commands like the ones in the image. Basically spreading invalidity towards endogenic systems, tulpas, and even singlets! Likely they either removed these commands or made them secret so people would stop using it against them, but it was still kind of a shitty thing to have in the first place. It’s also another reason why many pro-endos and endogenic systems feel unsafe using the bot. The devs don’t even want these people using their bot anyways! As outlined on their carrd for the bot. (That “today” on the image isn’t actually from today. It just was when the person took the screenshot.)
All in all, it’s a bot that’s poorly run and makes many systems feel unsafe. If you’re unsure or know a server owner who’s server is meant to be safe for all systems, I suggest Pluralkit over Systemtime any day. In fact, I refuse to touch it with a billion mile pole. Even though I would find it an achievement to get banned from it lol. Anyways! For the safety of your server, Tupperbox or Pluralkit is definitely the way to go! ^^
Obviously, if your server is anti-endo then I don’t give a damn if you add systemtime. In fact, please do. We’ll keep Pluralkit to ourselves.
Polyamorous Systems is an all-inclusive 18+ system server for systems and system members who identify as Polyamorous!
We don’t tolerate hate or discrimination based on sex, age, religion, sexuality, gender, other orientations, -tives or kins, -tive or kin sources, -tive or kin memories/timelines, or current relationship status!
We have: Pluralkit! Carl-bot! Blossom!
We have: A wide range of channels for all your needs! See something we don’t have that you’d like to see? We have suggestion channels!
Our Blacklist is primarily static and won’t be added to often, if at all, but it does cover a wide range of things!
Need relationship advice? We have you covered!
Want to make friends? Well, you’ll never know if you can unless you join and chat (but it’s totally okay if you don’t).
No system members have to currently be in a relationship to join! As long as at least one system member identifies as polyamorous and the body is at least 18, you’re welcome here!
Come on down! Joining is free! You don’t even have to pay shipping or handling!
Link to Apply!
Since our discord server is discriminatory free and meant to be safe for our members, we don’t allow the following people to join: (NO)MAPS/Pedos, Transmeds/Truscum, Sysmedicalists/System Exclusionists, LGBTQIA+phobes, Anti-Mogai people, Aspec exclusionists, TERFs, SWERFs, or any other kind of discriminatory or exclusionary people!
Y’know what we hate as much as purity culture? Politcs culture!
Like,, communities having fucking leaders and shit? We don’t vibe with that. Especially when they’re allowed to get away with really shitty things because they’re “popular” and own all the good shit. Like fuck that! They should be called out on their bullshit! If a country just let that shit slide, y’know what they get? Dictators.
We don’t want to say some people need to grow a spine, but sometimes it’s a necessary part of life so you don’t end up ostracised from a community you love or identify very strongly with because the leaders don’t like you. The leaders that shouldn’t be leaders! A community should be for everyone and not owned by some higher fucking power!
That just leads to people who don’t agree with the leaders to the need to make their own smaller community in the bigger one that they shouldn’t have to!
It literally feels like a dictatorship! There was no vote, they just are the leaders and you have ti deal with it.
Like you often can’t even do things in your own servers or groups sometimes because one of those shitty leaders is there and they could ruin you for doing something that betters everyone except them and their friends and it’s stupid! It’s uncalled for! It shouldn’t be happening! Why is it happening? Why are we allowing it to happen? Because we don’t want to be ostracised but something has to be done. This can’t keep going on. It’s ridiculous. A community is for all who identify with it; there should be a fucking hierarchy! Anywhere, on any platform, at anytime!
Fuck Politcs Culture. Fuck Communities Having Leaders. Fuck Them Getting Away With Bad Stuff Because They’re Popular. Mic drop.
As a medical professional, who primarily works with DID patients, I can safely safe that you do not have DID.
And I can safely say that this isn’t how this works. Tbh, if you even are a “professional” you aren’t being very professional with people you haven’t even met before. Especially considering the fact you’re on anon and can’t even show me any proof. Like wtf. Besides, check your damage. Last I checked, OSDD is also a thing and we’ve never claimed to have either. So really you’re just telling us something we already suspected. Like you don’t even know what we look like or anything. You probably don’t even live and work near us. Find something better to do with your life, please. -Tom
Like, I didn’t know “professionals” were going to make a pseudo house visit, anonymously, to our account and spout shit without even knowing us at all. We hardly ever post anything personal on this account that has to do with daily life or anything and, yet, you feel inclined to think you know us? Inclined to tell us a non-diagnosis we probably would never see a real professional about anyways? Either you had some really bad teachers before becoming a so called professional or you aren’t one at all cause this is not how this works. -Nixe
Since that blog is *not* for any kind of discourse, I’m putting this here on this blog. The ask has been deleted. This will be the first and last time any of us address the fact that sysmed Is Not another term for a traumagenic, DID, or OSDD system from an ask sent into that sideblog. It’s one thing to believe in modern psychology or medicine, it’s another to attack people who have different beliefs which both Transmeds and Sysmeds (system exclusionists) both do. We have outlined on that blog what tags to filter if you don’t want to see the terms “Sysmed,” “Kinnie,” or “Queer.” We won’t be changing how we refer to System Exclusionists and have outlined why on this blog quite a few times.
Tldr; Don’t want to be called out as a sysmed? Don’t want to be compared to transmeds? Don’t exclude systems that don’t fit the DID or OSDD “mold,” Don’t exclude non-traumagenic systems and we won’t call you that. We won’t compare you to transmeds. Holding a different belief to someone isn’t the issue, the issue is sysmeds (and obviously transmeds in the lgbt community) attacking, harassing, insulting, making cringe compilations, and fakeclaiming anyone who doesn’t fit into their “mold” or beliefs of what it means to be a system (or transgender). That’s all I have to say on that.
did/osdd-1 and endogenic plurals are inherently different though? did/osdd-1 is a disorder caused by trauma where the brain is split into dissociated parts; from what i've seen, endo beliefs tend to lean towards spiritual/the belief of more than one person in a body. the communities also need different things- did/osdd-1, as a traumagenic disorder, needs resources for coping with being disordered primarily. a medical issue shouldn't be correlated with personal beliefs (1/2)
They are inherently different, but my points were solely on the fact sysmeds gatekeep or “police” who can be in the plural community. Saying that spiritual systems or spiritual plurality doesn’t exist. When the beliefs of many souls living inside of one body is in no way a new thing and many cultures to this day still wholeheartedly believe in it and it’s still very much apart of their culture. Along with other types of spiritual plurality.
Case in point a system exclusionist from our PMs:
(Which I should have phrased it as “spiritual systems have been around a long time” and not “much longer.” I would have corrected myself in PMs if the conversation wasn’t as heated as it was. Heated as in they were quick to respond and I only had small windows to respond to what they said. No, I will not be sharing who this was because I will not be starting a witch-hunt.)
[Second half of anon]
While I get that gender dysphoria isn’t seen as a disorder (and I agree that, while it can cause things like depression and can greatly harm mental health, it is not a disorder), many transmeds will claim it is in some way or insinuate it. It also doesn’t change how similarly these two groups of gatekeepers / exclusionists act.
@neiviele has a lot of helpful posts on their blog about how being endogenic doesn’t mean you can’t have DID/OSDD, how it doesn’t mean you can’t have experienced trauma, and how some terms (like the term “system”) isn’t DID or OSDD specific.
Hi! Just wanted to let you know that in your latest MultiplicityMay post, you wrote "Day 4" instead of "Day 5". Also, thank you for putting it together and putting it out there! It's really nice. - Jamie
Oh damn, I’ll go fix that! Thanks for letting me know!
