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Reverse unpopular opinion: James Ironwood?

I absolutely love Ironwood’s character, precisely because I despise everything about him.

I’ve mentioned this a day or two ago, but when I first saw Ironwood, well - I was already a skeptic, because military man is military man and that’s enough reason to question everything about him. He’s tall, imposing, somewhat good-looking (although that original army haircut, ugh...), certainly strong.

And then he fucking speaks, and he’s the nicest person around. He’s soft-spoken, he’s trying to get a word in while the rest of Ozpin’s gang talks all over him, Glynda cuts him off to reprimand him. Honestly you want to feel bad about him, he’s only trying to do the right thing and everyone treats him like a child. His history with Glynda makes you think of a fleeing romance, lovers separated by duty. He’s shy, he’s awkward to be around, he can’t give speeches for shit.

And there’s something so charming about that in a person, you know? He’s not perfect, he’s not trying to be a god among man, he acknowledges his problems communicating with others. You feel sorry for him because maybe you were just like him too.

But here’s the scary part; he’s always been the most dangerous of Ozpin’s gang. He was ready to call for an invasion on Mount Glenn, he brought an army to peace talks, he saw his force as safety. He brought the most terrible ideas to the table, and never seems aware of their danger.

And there’s a duality to this, because his character isn’t military macho man, walking charisma and suggesting you serve justice in violence. He’s not impervious to judgement of his character, he doesn’t only show his strong front. He’s not nationalist radio 24/7, he’s not ancient general offering his wisdom.

His character is the military man, stripped down to its very core - the authoritarian view of “I know exactly what needs to be done and I know better than you”, the sweet poison in offering you to make a better person out of yourselves in enlistment, the insidiousness of taking those who were abused and molding them into soldiers, the very idea that with enough force, with enough violence, I can solve everything, I can bring peace!

It’s a new kind of danger, because he doesn’t want you to join him on his pedestal. He lowers it down and offers you a step with some kind words.

And it blew my mind when I first saw that! Like, how easy would it have been to make him a walking caricature of general, with the exact same plot beats? Everyone would’ve known he’s full of shit, we’re past the point of falling for that kind of character. But you can’t look at Ironwood’s character at first and realize he’s dangerous because he looks bad like you’d expect, he’s dangerous because his actions and words make him dangerous.

And here’s the actual scary part; it’s real. If one mask doesn’t work, we change it for another. If people can see the veneer for what it is, we can fix it. Dangerous people will always find a way to be appealing, and that’s true for the army just as well. Danger is always in actions, not appearances.

Thanks for the ask!

#James Ironwood #tsundere-bellwether #fishy.ask #fishy.analysis #RWBY #RWBY Analysis #RWBY8 #long post #my posts

Thoughts on how well Winter recognized the warning signs of abusive behavior in Ironwood in time to save Marrow Amin's life?

Winter is perceptive of her surroundings and alert to other people’s behaviors, maintaining constant vigilance in case of danger. Part of it is ingrained in her because of her time in the army, but she also learned this in home so she could protect herself from Jacques. This protection extends mostly to other’s well-being rather than herself - she is the elder sister, so she believes it’s her duty to shield her siblings from Jacques, and Winter enlisted in the army for ideological reasons. The moment Ironwood began posing a threat Winter was already watching him, already prepared to act if it was necessary. It was a foregone conclusion Winter would jump to save Marrow. So when did Winter decide Ironwood was a threat? I don’t think there’s a singular moment you could point to to answer that.

In her adolescence Winter probably idolized Ironwood as the key to escape her father and the pressure of the Schnee name. Imagine young Winter stuck in a ball her father forced her to attend like Weiss in V4, seeing how uncomfortable Ironwood is as well - he doesn’t want to participate, he wants to do real service, not like these elites (read: Jacques) - imagine how enticing Ironwood is to Winter in that moment. And it’s only natural for her to want to enlist the army, Atlas is already so militaristic. Yes, in the process she essentially gave up one controlling father to a different controlling father figure, but Ironwood isn’t controlling because he is abusive, that’s just how the army works. It won’t seem odd to Winter or most Atlesians for Ironwood to be controlling, that’s his job. Winter is aware of the power he poses and the implicit threat of every command, she is not blind to his danger, but she perceives it as natural, as what it should be. What is a military commander if he is not threatening, powerful and dangerous? A bad one.

This is the situation up until the end of V7, but then something changes - Winter’s trust in Ironwood is broken. So long as Winter believed Ironwood’s actions are for the greater good, she saw his actions and behavior as necessary and justified. She already had doubts in him, like his decision to isolate Atlas and exploit Mantle further, but there is no place for doubts in Ironwood as her commander - that’s not how the military works. Something drastic needed to occur for Winter to be able to break free from Ironwood, and that something was Weiss renouncing Ironwood in the V7 finale

To Winter, Ironwood is simultaneously two things: he’s the commander of the Atlesian army and her superior, the leader who makes the tough choices she can’t make. He’s also her savior, her ticket to escape Jacques Schnee and her way to prove her worth by servitude in the military, a pseudo-parental figure to replace Jacques. The former and the latter Ironwood cannot be separated in Winter’s mind, and it’s through her relationship with Ironwood that her view of Atlas and morality become intertwined with her view of her family and companionship. When Weiss still is aligned with Ironwood, Winter’s mind is at ease because the military and her family are in harmony. She falls into disarray when Weiss leaves her, her heart and mind in conflict with each other. Weiss did not convince her to betray Ironwood, her betrayal did not make her call Weiss, yet Winter betrays Ironwood and reconciles with her sister at the same time because to Winter they are the same thing, two aspects of her life ever connected because of Ironwood’s dual role in her life.

It is now that her trust in Ironwood is broken, and throughout V8 she lets her doubts fester, seeing Ironwood in a new light. There was no question Ironwood is dangerous and powerful, but now she lets herself see his use of his power as abusive like she couldn’t allow herself before. With every questionable decision he makes she becomes more afraid and she begins to defy him more and more. The moment she jumps to save Marrow is merely the straw that broke the camel’s back.

#Winter Schnee #James Ironwood #RWBY #RWBY Analysis #fishy.ask #fishy.analysis #quixylvre #long post #in which fishy once again rambles about Winter

Yeah I never understood the "Neo's a cautionary tale, she's gonna die on the island" theories. If that's the direction for her story, why take her to the island at all? If that was the story they wanted to tell just have Cinder kill her in the betrayal. Neo got herself way too wrapped up in world-level conflicts and tried a shortsighted blackmail plot all in the name of revenge and died for it, end of the story. There's no reason to extend that into the plot heavy interdimensional stuff. They wouldn't need to bring her along and extend her storyline just for conflict, they could think of plenty of other mind bending stuff for a different plane of existence

Hmhmm, agreed anon. She's not going to that island to have no character development and die pointlessly. It's a good point you brought up that if there was ever a time since her return in V6 a cautionary-tale style death might work for her character it would've been right when Cinder betrayed her. But she fell instead and lived, so why, from a storyteller perspective, would you elongate her death past that point? Unless that wasn't the plan at all.

I find myself distrusting any character analysis or prediction whose basis lies within oversimplifying a character when a more intricate and complex view is readily available. In most cases the real goal of the analysis is provide a hand-waving reason to remove said character from the plot, 'cause they don't particularly care for the character in the first place. Often they just hate the character.

#RWBY #Neopolitan #RWBY Speculation #RWBY9 #fishy.ask #anon

#iactuallytryingtolovemyself #fishy.ask

Who's that in your new pfp?

Loid Forger from Spy x Family, realizing he's so uncool.

#Loid Forger #Spy x Family #g0ld-m3d4l-stuff #fishy.ask

I'm sorry can we please talk about how beautifully Yuri flew across the room when Yor slapped him... TWICE

Yor stronk

#g0ld-m3d4l-stuff #fishy.ask #Yor Forger #Yuri Briar #Spy x Family

Please tell me I'm not the only one baffled that people are still trying to make Winter into a villain? I thought last episode made it clear whose side she's on. And even before that it was fairly clear she was on a redemption arc. At this point the evil Winter theories are stretching farther than Cinder's grimm arm

You came to the right place, it’s a-me, fishy-tired-of-Winter-discourse-fod. But for real, from my observation most people are still baffled the villain Winter theories are still ongoing. I’m certainly baffled.

The thing about “Villain Winter” theories is that while they understood where Winter is in the wrong, they always seemed to be confused by what exactly is wrong, and instead they threw in the only other word they could - fascism. And Winter’s military arc has never been about fascism, it’s been about militarism - full stop. Ironwood’s arc was fascism, Clover’s arc was fascism, Winter’s arc has always been about the struggle of “following Ironwood” vs. “following her heart”, which is the most fundamental soldier dilemma.

“Villain Winter” theories never seemed to understand this point, because they always focused on Winter as if she’s struggling to understand wrong and right, and invented theories accordingly - Winter takes over Atlas, Winter joins Salem, Winter calls Blake a slur, Winter fights against Weiss, whatever nonsense is being spouted right now. All of these fundamentally don’t get Winter’s character, because that’s not Winter’s dilemma.

If I had to invent a scenario where Winter is villainous, the way to do it would be to play with the soldier dilemma. For example, have Winter kill Fria at the end of Volume 7 somehow. Now we’re going somewhere, because now the lines of what’s right and Ironwood’s wishes are muddled - killing Fria is right because there is some macabre sense in giving the power to someone more capable like Winter rather than Fria, but killing Fria is wrong because it’s killing an innocent like a lamb to slaughter. Hypothetical Winter is not irredeemable in this case I think, but she certainly has something far more serious to atone for.

But in terms of heinous actions Winter had to commit as a soldier in canon, we have... being the face of a little propaganda, trying to convince the heroes to join Ironwood, and following orders. Which are bad, but ultimately not something all that serious in the grand scale of things, especially when compared to her two foils Ironwood and Clover, who would have to atone more serious crimes if they are to ever be redeemed.

So you have a bunch of relatively minor crimes Winter commits, all of which are related to her status as a soldier. It’s always been a stretch to turn those into whatever nonsense they’re making. Like, I’ve always been confused why in Volume 8, Winter giving orders like a soldier is apparently such a blasphemous thing, that’s pocket change, that observation is not what’s wrong in the military or about Winter’s actions. Which is why I greatly suspect the “Villain Winter” theorists don’t get anti-militarism like they supposedly do, because they’re putting blame on the symptom rather than the root of the problem.

Ultimately, the course of Winter’s struggle either as a villain or hero (or something in between) could only be decided by an action signifying the struggle between adhering to orders or following her conscience. This is why V8C7 was pretty much the point of no return at which her defection was all but guaranteed, because she disobeyed Ironwood’s orders then. Granted, you could elongate it, which is why there was some sense in considering the possibility Winter would’ve blown up Monstra, but RWBY didn’t make that choice.

Now after last week’s episode? That was just the final nail in the coffin. The struggle has ended, she chose her conscience over Ironwood’s once and for all. Trying to make her a villain now is only possible by thinking her character is about “right” vs. “wrong”, except it’s always been about “Ironwood” vs. “her heart”. Now “Villain Winter” theories are more transparent than ever, like “The Queen of Atlas” idea which, again, fails to understand Winter’s character.

Why are they still going? Pride, I guess? Misunderstanding Winter’s dilemma? It doesn’t help that I suspect this is a case of FNDM’s toxic idea that any misunderstanding has to be presented as a choice of morality that’s gone too far. And there’s certainly been a lot of insinuations that disagreeing with “Villain Winter” theories somehow makes us fascist supporters or “woobifying” Winter. I don’t mind people making wrong predictions, but this seems like a hole dug too deep.