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ARTEMIS | Marble Head of: "The goddess wears a wreath. The holes that can be seen at the ears and temples will have been used to attach metal jewellery. The eyes were inlaid. The torso and parts of the limbs are kept in the Lykosoura Museum." [txt ©NAMAthens] From the sanctuary of Demeter and Despoina at Lykosoura, Arcadia, Peloponnese 190-180 BC https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lycosura

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Twin-tailed tritoness trio, from the Temple of Despoina at Lykosoura. Photos taken at the National Museum of Archeology in Athens.

These figures look similar to Starbuck’s siren: two fish tails, similar pose, leaf skirt concealing their genitals. However, their tails aren’t symmetrical, making them look more like snake-legged Giants in ancient Greek art.

These figures were made in 190-180 BCE, and they originally adorned the goddess Despoina’s throne as supports. Originally, Despoina and Demeter were shown seated on a shared throne. Despoina is a daughter of Demeter. In the National Museum of Archeology in Athens, they’re identified as “A group of cult statues in the Temple of Despoina at Lykosoura.” The temple was located modern-day Arcadia, Greece.

FYI: “tritoness” is a modern word, not an ancient name. Triton is the proper name of a Greek sea god, and nereids are the common water spirit in Greek myths. “Tritoness” is a modern word to describe women in ancient Greek art with fish tails, that aren’t Scylla. The first use of tritoness is around 1600. So, like mixoparthenos, tritoness isn’t a name that will help with twin-tailed siren research.

There's one other example of an ancient women with two mermaid tails in ancient art that doesn't have a proper name, in the Sebastian reliefs in the ancient city of Aphrodisias. In addition, here is an example of the two tailed goddess on a temple to Artemis.

Sources:

Dickins, Guy. "The Sandal in the Palazzo dei Conservatori." The Journal of Hellenic Studies 31 (1911): 308-314.

Themelis, Petros. “Hellenistic Architectural Terracottas from Messene.” Hesperia Supplements, vol. 27, 1994, pp. 141–398.

Images 588-591: Kaltas, Nikolaos. Sculpture in the National Archaeological Museum, Athens. Translated by David Hardy. Los Angeles: The J. Paul Getty Museum Publications, 2003.

#twin-tailed siren #two tailed siren #tritoness #twin-tailed tritoness #two tailed tritoness #Lykosoura #athens #ancient greek art #anguiped goddess

Omg thank you for responding to my question and not only that but being so thorough and educative in your answer! First I have to address my mistakes, funnily enough I did write "almost undeniable" at first, but later scratched that as I've found myself repeating words over and over again. We know barely anything about the Minoans and to say anything definitive is just incorrect in on itself.

So while my approach as a layman mainly relies on my great love for Greek mythology, I'm well-aware of the fact that attempting to reconstruct quasi-"plausible" variants that May provide a basis for some of the possible derivations, that MAY point towards a Minoan origin IS incredibly flawed and unreliable. But fun! Neverthless, I have no way to prove anything (only) relying on this method, but nor do I wish to prove anything, I acknowledge that these beliefs of mine are only wild theories and speculations that do not really have a foundation to stand on and will change according to new studies and finds.

It is only ever more evident that not only is this method flawed by using centuries younger texts, but by also relying on a rather small sample of surviving clues and evidences, which greatly limits our scope of view about the overall complexity and intricate nature of these myths in a lot of cases, so saying anything concrete about that which we don't have is all the more unwise. In most instances it is like trying to reconstruct the teachings of the Bible from Battlestar Galactica, or trying to deduce how Alice in Wonderland might have lead to the Lord of the Rings series, having lost almost everything inbetween and before.

By trying to prove a point with a Great Mother Goddess and a Vegetation God I did not wish to associate my line of thinking with that of Frazer or Burkert, as to be honest I'm not that familiar with either of their works. The point I tried to make was a looser one than categorizing the Gods into archetypes, and that being that in my belief no great culture, myth, story will ever be truly lost, yes it will go through immesurable transformation, but fragments, influences, ideas, parts and elements will be passed on through generations and cultures. I originally wanted to prove that if the Hades & Persephone myth was as old and as important as some have suggested, then it should have made a mark on the mythological landscape, mainly in the form of derivations, variants and inspirations merged, mutilated and mixed together again and again. Not continuation, echoes.

So it was rather foolish of me to call Demeter a Minoan earth Goddess, because for one, we know almost nothing about the Minoan earth Goddess, for two, which Demeter? Where? Of which era? Of which cult? Of which epithet? And the same could be said about the hypothetical Minoan earth Goddesses and Gods as well, who were probably more vast in number than two or three, who also (probably) went through centuries of change. These are all just incredibly complex questions which I have problems properly putting into words, while also being hyper-aware of the fact that I'm yet again going to bombard your asks with this monstrosity, and all this happened only because I wanted to make a stupid joke, but I got lost trying to provide a basis for it. Anyway, I can't thank you enough for your detailed answer and I will look into your recommendations to broaden my horizons, and sorry for this... rather long ask again. You don't have to answer to this, I just kind of wanted to defend some of my dubious views, by acknowledging them as such, but I probably also made some new mistakes along the way. Truth be told, it is hard to grasp the vastness of the history we have long lost and I'm just fascinated (and grief-stricken) by the endless possibilities that we might never rediscover.

seems like you got the gist of it, anon! you've been a pleasure to have in my askbox!

and yeah the key word here is transformation, and since the core tenet of the persephone myth is that she is abducted (and eats the pomegranate seeds, ig), the variations are quite minor. if there are any older versions of this myth, they must have deviated much more, but so far they seem lost, and all we have is a myth already quite crystallized in hesiod and the homeric hymn.

the only major variation is the aetiological myth tied to Lykosoura, where demeter gets raped by poseidon and causes a famine out of wrath for her own violation. This may reflect an older version from before demeter's cult became part of a coupled mother&daughter team, but since it's so tied to Lykosoura as a local mystery cult even this variation is highly suspect. note however how the bare essentials here are rape and retribution in the form of famine- the rape part transferred to persephone and demeter kept the famine, and so the pomegranate bit seems like a later addition. BUT, AGAIN, HIGHLY SUSPECT MYTH- documentation of it doesn't show up until well after the dark ages. An elaboration and sources here and here by a beloved mutual!

#ty for asking!#eleusis #demeter #lykosoura

heyyy! I wanted to ask you, what do you think about the myth of Poseidon raping Demeter? When I read it it stuck out to me as very odd, I think it’s the only myth where an olympian rapes another olympian- like, why was this story even told? did the ancient greeks just like to watch Demeter suffer?

I need a scholarly opinion on this. Also I love your account!!

Hi! thank you so much, glad you're enjoying my blog!

it's certainly not the only myth of a god molesting another! the lines between sex and assault are generally rather blurred in ancient literature, so honestly any pairing is rather dubious on consent. Violence though is definitely explicit in the following:

hephaestus trying to rape Athena, after which his seed impregnates the earth and conceives Erechtheus

priapus trying to rape Hestia while she is sleeping

and uh, much closer to home, persephone and hades! i know the myth is often modernized as a romance, but i explain here why the earliest extant text depicts it as assault.

zeus rapes persephone in certain (orphic/dionysiac) myths

there is a theme of divine marriages happening with the pursuit of an unwilling goddess, who flees, hides, gets caught and then agrees to marry. you can see how this blurs the lines between consent and force. examples:

the pursuit of hera by zeus: he pursues her in the shape of a cuckoo and 'takes hold of her' when she picks him up

the pursuit of amphitrite by poseidon, thetis by peleus, leto/metis/demeter by zeus

I don't particularly think it's a form of torture porn, as the greeks had a different approach to rape than we did; it's seen as violence, but the idea of dishonour, (societal) shame and crime are prioritized over personal suffering, trauma and pain of the victim. it's about transgressing societal principles of status rather than inflicting pain (in athens, for example, raping a (female) citizen was a heinous crime, but raping any other woman, immigrant of slave, was technically legal).

In the specific case of poseidon/demeter, which is a myth primarily connected to the goddess' cult at Lykosoura, the rape results in Demeter covering herself in dark robes and isolating herself in wrath, a common motif connected to Demeter. Here, she was called Demeter Erinys (furious). Demeter's retreat causes a famine, until she is appeased and purified, becoming Demeter Lousia (washed). It's a story of disrespect, disaster, and appeasement, much like the myth of Demeter's famine after the rape of Persephone (the two myths are likely variations of each other). the central concept here is appeasement of an agricultural deity to ensure the fertility of the land, after an action of disrespect.

You're right that the myth is slightly unique, as the rape actually has an aftermath that acknowledges the woman/goddess' personal reaction to it beyond communal shame. As such, it places much more emphasis on rape as an act of force. But we may wonder whether that's our romantic interpretation of demeter's anger- is demeter actually depicted as traumatised, or is she depicted as fulfilling her political duties by isolating herself and punishing the cosmos through a divine strike? And why is her protest recounted, and not other goddesses'? Likely because of her unique bargaining chip of withholding the grain, since that also forces Zeus' hand in the myth of persephone's rape.

This post by @a-gnosis has her research and some (primary and secondary) sources on the cult at Lykosoura and how its myth informed the cult (and her meticulously researched and written mythological webcomic)! Hope this helps!

#ty for asking!! 💕💕💕#demeter #lykosoura