#oasis meta

[irregular-paradise]

I'm having feelings today about "If We Shadows".

The title of course comes from Puck a.k.a. Robin Goodfellow's closing monologue in Shakespeare's play A Midsummer Night's Dream, in which lots of saucy and scandalous stuff goes down (mixed-up relationships due to a liberal and inaccurate application of love potions, some semi-bestiality, men playing women's roles, etc.).

The monologue itself – the final words of the play – goes like this, with Puck turning to the audience and breaking the fourth wall to address them directly:

If we shadows have offended, Think but this, and all is mended, That you have but slumber'd here While these visions did appear. And this weak and idle theme, No more yielding but a dream, Gentles, do not reprehend: if you pardon, we will mend: And, as I am an honest Puck, If we have unearned luck Now to 'scape the serpent's tongue, We will make amends ere long; Else the Puck a liar call; So, good night unto you all. Give me your hands, if we be friends, And Robin shall restore amends.

Basically he's saying, "If seeing all this was too much for you – too edgy or tasteless or disturbing or whatever – I apologize, and I hope you will just tell yourself it was a only a dream, and in that way make it okay."

I'm imagining Noel reflecting on his and Liam's dynamic through the lens of Puck's speech: they've certainly crossed lines, taken it "too far" at times, perhaps even shocked or horrified some people with their relationship that's not quite what a sibling relationship is supposed to be.

But they've always somehow escaped real accountability by cleverly pulling the wool over our eyes, blurring the line between joking and serious, brazening it out, playing up the "sibling rivalry" and supposed mutual hatred... and it's worked.

For decades, they've been able to hide in plain sight. Perhaps thanks to their puckish wit, or perhaps because it's surprisingly easy to convince the rest of us that we have but slumber'd here, while these visions did appear.

Surely it can't be what it looks like... we must be dreaming!

[smashkara]

Re: Thoughts on the existence of a contractual agreement between them that means Liam can't slag him off on twitter.

The thing I keep coming up against is that Noel's ego simply doesn't admit to the emotional existence of incidents where he has been hurt on purpose* by another person attacking him.**

(*People offending him not on purpose is okay > see the Adele situation + Liam saying they were 'back' + hugging him during DOYS mixing which he decided to take offense to because he felt he was 'never gone'. This kind of incident is allowed to be admitted to + talked about because it doesn't give the perceived attacker any power over him.)

(**Being hurt by attacks on his family/friends is allowed. > He'll admit he's upset by Liam having a go at his children/Sara. I think this is alright because it's a noble quality to be protective of others/upset on their behalf and therefore allowed without any loss of face. But he's really relishing the opportunity to fight back w claws extended in that 'Enjoy the summer big tits' message because it's not just a response to the one message Liam sent Anais but to all the smaller jibes Liam's been throwing at him that it would be a loss of face to respond to. )

Getting an agreement from Liam not to bad mouth him on twitter is not worth giving up the lifetime position of 'everything I say and do matters to you and nothing you say and do matters to me.' Noel more or less says outright this is how he sees their public back-and-forth on that ep of Graham Norton. Asking for Liam not to slag him off on twitter would be totally at odds with that position, it would be a loss of face.

HOWEVER

Liam is far more likely to ask for a 'no podcasts where you slag me off to your mates' rule. He's always been bothered by Noel talking disparagingly about him or Oasis in interviews since long before the band broke up and he's never made a secret of that. And if Noel wanted to get petty over it he might then ask for a 'no slagging me off on twitter then' rule but I think even that is unlikely because the Noel position on being slagged off is that you should just be able to take it. But tbh I think if they were at that level of pettiness when sorting out the reunion contract it wouldn't have gone ahead.

Noel's view is if you let people know what they're saying about you upsets you, you're showing weakness. Liam's view is that if you let people talk trash about you and ignore it that's showing weakness. They disagree fundamentally on this issue.