#op meta

[trinityalps]

big mom was basically groomed by charlotte streusen

doflamingo was basically groomed by trebol

... does this pattern hold for other villians ? maybe rocks & blackbeard??

[trinityalps]

undiscussed thing about big mom is that shes sort of written to be .. cognitively disabled in some way? like she routinely (especially in flashback) fails to comprehend what is going on around her in a very particular and innocent way. its also a commonly talked about issue in special ed / support for families with special needs children that high-needs autism often presents as unusually large/strong children with lower-than-typical emotional regulation skills. and this can be a real issue as kids get older and become a safety issue. i wonder if oda knows about that issue in some way bc linlin's childhood feels Soooo inspired by it

[battlefrankies]

I don't know enough about gram to actually write him yet but I'm rotating him in my mind...... we can at least assume that he's a decent guy, or newgate wouldn't stick around with him much less agree to be partners. but we also don't know how he died or why pops brought marco into his ship.... in a sense I'm counting on the lack of specific information to mean we might see some of it in the series (WHEN WE GO TO SPHINX AFTER ELBAPH RIGHT???) and there was just such an overwhelming interest in him that oda had to address it in an sbs, and that if he was really just gonna offscreen it we would've gotten more information, like how we got kidkiller's backstory or zoro's family tree

but it's taking soooooooooo long 😭😭😭 I want a whitebeard spinoff so fucking bad

[moongothic]

Chapter 1188 making that very obvious callback to Crocodile impaling Luffy got my brain running on overdrive now.

Like yes the obvious surface level implication is that despite everything, despite reaching the peak of his power (as far as his Devil Fruit is considdered at least), despite how far he has come, Luffy is still so far from reaching the level required for him to become Pirate King, that he's not going to be able to beat Imu. He's not going to be able to beat any of the Elders either, not yet.

The situation feels so 50/50 now-- we know Imu is on a time limit and can't stay on Elbaf too long, so he and potentially the other God Knights will have to retreat sooner than later.

I am just concerned if they're going to get away with the kids, that's all.

So two story directions we could be heading are A) The Strawhats somehow manage to force the rest of the God Knights out after Imu runs out of time, saving the kids B) Imu and co manage to snatch the kids and flee

Scenario B) makes me wonder if THAT could be like, the Inciting Incident for the Final War; Luffy feeling like he can't go forward with trying to find One Piece without rescuing the kids from Marijoa, 'cause I don't see why Luffy would go to direct war with the WG without a more personal motivation like that. Like yeah the WG sucks but he's not a hero, he's not a Rev, he's a stinky lil pirate so without a personal motivation (like helping friends) he wouldn't go pick up a fight or join a war against the WG, would he?

At the same time, there's a part of me that's still wondering if Elbaf could go down the Sabaody Route. That the only way to save everyone on Elbaf, including the kids, is by everyone fleeing the island, probably with the help of Kuma's power (if he's in a state where he has just enough brain power to let his DF do it's thing as long as somebody's just holding his hand up to boop people/ships away) I talked about this just like two months ago though so I'm not gonna repeat myself too much, but would the crew still stick together through this? Probably? Bare minimum I'd imagine they could get split into 2-4 groups (Luffy potentially being one group by himself), maybe the crew all managed to stick together on the Sunny and it'd be just Luffy who could get flewn away somewhere by himself. (Curious what'd even happen to Loki...) Thing is, if this happened and Luffy did get yeeted somewhere by himself, that could give him another opportunity to maybe train and get stronger-- not strong enough to face Imu just yet, but maybe strong enough to face one of the Elders (the Elder acting as a warm-up the same way Blueno was a warm-up before Lucci, y'know)

IDK man...

I think what is really getting to me about the parallel of those panels is that... Like I wonder if there's more to it than Luffy not being ready yet... Like there's a part of me that believes so hard that there's More To That Parallel Than That but I can't figure out what on earth that could even be. (It could be just sleep deprativation making me delulu because the Husbandile was mentioned lmao)

Also, just... God this is reminding me of how many subplots OP has going right now...

Vivi is hiding with Morgans, trying to reach Luffy

Garp is being held by Blackbeard with a bounty from CG

Swamp Guy is on his way to Blackbeard to spill the beans about Pluton and Poseidon

Loki's bestie on the phone is probably Shirahoshi

Pluton is in Wano and Crocodile is plot relevant again

Cross Guild as a whole

Moria escaped BB, Hancock had to leave Amazon Lily, Pudding got kidnapped

Shanks wants to get the One Piece

The current status of Law, Kidd and Barto, etc etc etc

Like a lot of these we can easily connect with various dots (Moria and Hancock could end up in Cross Guild for various reasons; Swamp Guy connects the Ancient Weapon subplots through BB, really the only subplot here that's just giant free-floating here is Vivi where whatever is happening to her can't really be connected to any of the other happenenings beyond her past beef with Croc due to Pluton, but like I said, irrelevant to her current situation, only relevant if she ended up hiding with like CG for some god forsaken reason and I don't know how or why either), but I just... Like I can't figure out where the fuck we are going here

And I feel like a lot of that does just kinda rely on whatever the fuck is going to happen in the next 2-20 chapters? We're at 62 chapters so far this arc, and while a lot of that went into just flashbacks I can't imagine the arc being that much longer. Like for comparison's sake, Egghead was 68 chapters, while Wano holds the record for the longest arc/saga with 149 chapters. So yeah, depending on the plot direction I can't imagine this arc going past the 100 chapters mark, I'd kinda expect it to stay somewhere around 80 chapters mark. So, uh, yeah, just gotta wait and see what the fuck is gonna go down in the next few chapters especially

[trinityalps]

one piece rule of three

wedding crashing :: nami & absolom + sanji & pudding -> vivi & imu

[battlefrankies]

Have you read sbs 115?

I HAVE!! so many thoughts

1. um. partners?? I see u oda. you're finally giving me the old man yaoi

2. objectively also kind of throwing out a lot of the potential with marco's fruit being that of a regenerating and infinitely reincarnating bird, so i think dad!gram is the most boring option but okay. it could've been really juicy and emotionally complicated but OKAY!! WHATEVER!! IT'S FINE!!

3. I am rotating polo gram in my mind he's so cute

4. my baby marco fic has been completely jossed huh.... sad....

[rumbar-records]

a quick something because i recently realized Usopp and Vivi are just as important as Zoro and Sanji re: Luffy's aspirations to become Pirate King

like..... they're opposites in a way that parallels Zoro and Sanji, but also still places Luffy as their midpoint! and when put together they represent the four quadrants of captainship Luffy has to learn and maintain in order to become pirate king!! it's gotten to a point where i can't look at the monster trio without also seeing the mark Usopp and Vivi left behind on their dynamic (because it's all right there in the text!)

[megashadowdragon]

Posted in r/Piratefolk by u/InformationHanderler • 58 points and 32 comments

NOTE: This is not a post to get you to “Like” Eustass kid. You do NOT have to like him and still agree with what your about to read, if your not bias. Do NOT engage if you don’t plan to read full

Eustass Kid discourse honestly exposes a massive mindset problem within parts of the One Piece fandom because people not only claim to respect, but they flat out praise ambition, conqueror mentality, and “betting it all” until the character doing it is not their favorite and the gamble fails. Then suddenly the exact same qualities they praise in other characters become “stupid,” “arrogant,” “cocky,” or “braindead.” That is why Kid gets treated so differently despite embodying one of the core themes of the series.

One Piece constantly pushes the idea that the people who shake the world are the ones willing to challenge impossible odds, force their way forward, and risk everything for their dreams. Luffy does this constantly. Roger did it. Whitebeard did it. Blackbeard does it. The difference is that when those characters succeed or are framed more favorably, fans romanticize the behavior afterward and call it determination or greatness.

Kid does the exact same thing and people suddenly switch frameworks entirely. They stop evaluating him through the lens the story itself uses and instead evaluate him like he is supposed to be some perfectly rational, risk-averse strategist whose job is to minimize losses at all times.

And the funniest part is that if Kid actually backed down from Shanks, surrendered his poneglyphs, avoided conflict, or “played it safe,” the exact same people clowning him now would call him a coward, fraud, or fake rival. He is put into a lose-lose situation by fandom bias where ambition is only respected if it succeeds immediately or comes from a beloved character.

A lot of the slander also relies on stripping context away from scenes entirely and replacing actual reading with recycled agenda talking points. People repeat things they heard from TikToks, YouTubers, memes, anime filler, or community jokes without even realizing half the information they are using is incomplete, exaggerated, or outright false. The “commoners haki” joke is a perfect example. A huge portion of the fandom unironically used a non-canon filler scene, stripped context of it, then made it proof that Kid’s conqueror haki was weak despite the manga never even showing him consciously using it onscreen.

The same thing happens with the Shanks fight. People flatten the entire situation into “Kid stupidly attacked Shanks” while ignoring the actual context of the One Piece race, the Road Poneglyph stakes, the inevitability of Emperor conflict, the nature of Kid’s mentality, the fact he followed his log pose there, and the abnormal mechanics behind Shanks’ abilities. They look at the outcome first and then work backwards to force the narrative that the decision itself was inherently idiotic. Just purely hindsight bias.

A lot of fans do not actually respect ambition itself. They respect rewarded ambition. They respect plot-protected ambition. They respect ambition when it comes from characters they already emotionally like. But when a character like Kid crashes into the reality of the pirate world without protagonist framing protecting him, suddenly people treat him like an idiot instead of recognizing that he is one of the rawest examples of what chasing the One Piece would realistically look like.

reddit comments

Myveryshelf • 12d ago I would advice against taking anything the fandom says about kidd as "unironic". This is a community where slander is well-valued, and slander by definition is mostly lies. Like, this is a fictional story, so it is not the worst thing if people have fun using its characters for their own mind games.

You say he is not disliked because of his actions, but because people already disliked him and he happened to fail, he is treated unfairly.

Saying people hate on him because he is disliked is fair, but kind of circular. Then we would have to ask why he is so disliked. We have only seen what Oda wanted to showed us of him, and you say characters with similar traits are generally liked.

So then he is unfairly disliked because he happened to fail, but the fact that he took risks means he is not the bum people claim he is. But, like, there are other characters in the story that lose and are respected for trying.

Having that ambition is a choice, a selfish choice even if it is one that requires bravery. I'd say people respect the tennacity to hold on and the capacity to carry out that ambition even more than the ambition itself. Generally, people who "talk a big game", give it a good attempt and fail by no fault of their own are still respected; but people who are absorbed by their ambition and fail because of their own actions are disrespected, moreso if they get other people harmed.

People dislike Kidd more than others because:

A) He lost in a very spectacular fashion after receiving an oversized bounty, so it is funny to dog on him. At this point, I'd say Kidd slander is the intended way to interact with the story, the way discussing endlessly wether Shanks or Mihawk is stronger is the intended way to interact with their story.

B) Even if he was fucked by fate the moment he entered Shanks's island, people still consider his failure to be a result of his bad decision-making. He risked it all on Shanks not being in the area or able to reach him afterwards, he focused his ulti on killing hundreds of fodder head on, and he had already fought this enemy (he should know better). He took more risks than necessary for his situation, then failed because of his choices and took down his crew with him. I'd say it is fair to dislike that

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InformationHanderler OP • 12d ago You’re misunderstanding my point a little. I’m not saying “people hate on Kid because he’s disliked” as some circular argument. I’m saying because people already dislike him, they become far more willing to engage in disingenuous discourse around him, strip context away, exaggerate his flaws, and interpret every situation in the least charitable way possible. That is a very different point.

And yes, obviously slander culture exists in One Piece. I’m not denying that. The issue is that with Kid specifically, a lot of the fandom stopped separating jokes from actual analysis a long time ago. That is why you genuinely have people using filler scenes, meme rhetoric, and oversimplified summaries as actual arguments. The discourse around him became so dominated by agendas that many people barely engage with the actual text anymore.

regarding your point about people respecting characters who fail honorably, I actually agree to an extent. I think the more interesting question is what exactly makes Kid’s failure “dishonorable” to people in the first place.

Is it because he got one shot? Because if that’s the case then that’s outcome bias more than actual analysis. One Piece has never treated losing to monsters at the top of the world as inherently shameful. Luffy got obliterated by Kaido multiple times. Kid himself already lost to Kaido before. Characters constantly crash into walls stronger than themselves in this series because that is literally how the pirate world works. The only difference is that Kid’s loss was framed more brutally and lacked protagonist cushioning.

Or is it because of his ruthlessness and aggression? Because if that’s the angle, there’s still context there too. Kid is not written as a morally pure adventurer like Luffy. He comes from an extremely violent environment, (granted luffy does too but he has a role model) but operates like an actual pirate, and openly embraces force and intimidation. EVEN THEN he’s more cushy then others who had harsh environments, anyways One Piece has never portrayed ambition at the highest level as clean regardless.

Reckless? Sure, but needed. The Violent? Absolutely. But dishonorable? I don’t really see it.

He stood on his ambition, refused to surrender his progress & kill his dream without trying, challenged a Yonko head on, and lost to experience and unfavorable conditions. It’s not really dishonorable to me. if Kid had run, surrendered his poneglyphs, or avoided confrontation entirely, those same people would immediately call him a coward, fake rival, or fraud anyway. So what standard is actually being applied here? That’s the part I think people don’t fully interrogate.

on point B specifically, I think this is where a lot of the misunderstanding comes from. You are still evaluating Kid primarily through hindsight and outcome rather than through the logic of the One Piece world itself. Rayleigh states that you get stronger in intense pressure. It took luffy getting absolutely clobbered to learn aconq. Kid himself cannot grow unless he faces the wall that is shanks. He cannot go around it, and he had no reason to go around it. The “he focused his attack on fodder” point is also a bit misleading because the attack was directed at Shanks’ fleet as a means of forcing the confrontation and drawing shanks out whom he thought was hiding amongst the fleet. It was destructive, yes, but it was not some random tantrum disconnected from combat strategy. And once Shanks intervened personally, the encounter immediately shifted into something Kid had no real frame of reference for due to the abnormal nature of Shanks’ abilities.

And finally, the “he took his crew down with him” criticism is fair emotionally, but it also reflects a broader truth about One Piece pirates that people selectively ignore depending on the character. Ambition in this series is contagious. Crews willingly follow captains into impossible situations all the time because that is what piracy at the highest level actually entails. The Straw Hats followed Luffy into Enies Lobby, Marineford fallout, Whole Cake, Wano, and countless situations that realistically should have destroyed them. When you have a crew that respects kid that much you gotta acknowledge his leadership, regardless of where they end up, they all knew the price.

So yes it’s fair to dislike him, But a lot of the discourse around him goes beyond that and turns into flattening every aspect of his character into “stupid arrogant bum,” which is where the analysis starts becoming shallow rather than critical. That why I specifically said this post wasn’t to make you like him, I’m simply pointing out the facts

I have no respect for slander culture where they will outright lie about a character the dont like and they know it was a lie ( and will go facts dont matter its agenda when by that logic that applies to charactesr you like someone can spout nonsense equating maes hughes to shou tucker or claiming he likely beats his daughter in secret etc)

especailly since people will start believing theslander they hear adn then they will try to deny blame when they are the ones who spouted it in the first place you dont get to deny blame just because in oyur mind it was a joke sorry but slander isnt funny disrespecting a character isnt funny